THRILLED Most DVC'ers are renting @ $12/point now

[5infam]

I'm not going to chime in on the "rent points or don't rent points" part of this discussion, but I thought this was interesting. I added on yesterday and when the second person came in and went over my closing paperwork with us, she got to the clause about only being able to own 2000 points at a single resort and 5000 points total DVC. I asked her if anyone really owns 2000 points at any one resort and she said ABSOLUTELY!!!! As a matter of fact, they have a seperate section at DVC that specifically monitors certain members and that many many menbers own the full 5000 points. She then added that they know these people are specifically using these points to rent out!!! Just thought I would throw some more fuel to the fire!!!

 

[wdwphanatic]

... that people get offended when they advertise points and then get offers from people willing to rent them for a certain price that might be below what they'd hoped to rent for. Personally, if your points are that valuable to you, IMO you shouldn't be trying to rent them out in the free market! Not everyone is going to want to pay $10 or $12 per point, especially for a lot of points, when the rack rates are sometimes not that much higher.

I have rented points numerous times before and made offers to DVCers that were below $10/point. I had some who were happy to accept my offer, some who told me they simply wanted/needed more per point and some who were actually fairly rude about it. If DVCers will only accept a certain price per point, they ought to make it very clear in their posts on the rent/trade board -- or they ought to rent their points at ebay!

There are plenty of great people who aren't expecting a handout from DVCers -- just a fair price for their hotel accommodations. It upsets me when people accuse prospective renters of trying to give them a deluxe for the price of an All Star. Never have I paid anywhere near All-Star rates for a DVC property -- and I've always rented for below $10 a point. I think a more accurate comparison would be getting a deluxe for moderate rates... BUT you also have to take into consideration that the renter is taking a gamble whenever he/she rents -- there is a HUGE trust factor in renting from someone you don't know. For some, the disadvantage of not getting daily maid service (except for a fee) is also a consideration.

All this being said, I do realize that renting from DVCers is a wonderful opportunity for my family to stay at a resort we truly love for less than we'd otherwise pay thru Disney. We have considered becoming DVCers ourselves at some point when we can afford it. I just hope that if we do purchase points at a DVC property we won't feel as though people were trying to steal from us -- or get us to subsidize their family's vacation -- just because they made an offer for less than the going rate. Everyone is entitled to make an offer -- whether it's acceptable or not is up to the DVCer to decide. It shouldn't be taken as an insult to the DVCer either... Most prospective renters have no idea what the fees associated with owning at DVC are -- they're only trying to take their family on vacation for a price that they can afford! If the DVCer determines that the price offered isn't acceptable, just say "thanks" and move on!

--Sarah

 

[Doctor P]

A few substantive points:

1) As someone who teaches financial analysis for a living, I find it laughable that anyone would suggest that the COST of DVC points to an owner is anywhere near $12 per point for the typical owner--someone isn't doing very well with their financial decisions if they need to get any where near $12 per point to break even.

2) The VALUE of DVC points is higher than their cost and is a function of supply and demand.

3) Collusive behavior does not require ability to control or influence the market, though the inability to do so might be a pretty viable defense.

4) Given the way DVC is currently set up, one can make quite a good living renting points out at $12 per point. Even at $10 per point, there are people currently making a killing with rentals (it would appear).

 

[doubletrouble_vb]

I have to say if I ever rent again I will rent according to what the market will bear. For example I own a Dec VWL. If the timing is right I'll be more than happy to rent someone time in Dec at VWL at a premium. When I don't use my points I'm losing both a portion of my principal and the years maintenance...then there is pain and suffering from not going to Disney. I absolutely don't see anything wrong with it. And would I rent to DVC members cheaper...sure...the ones I know. I don't see people get their panties in a wad about it. Right now DVC'ers are seriously undercutting Disney with their rentals. Disney would prefer that you used your points and your renters obtained accomodations from them.

But...it'll be a long time before I rent again (I hope).

 

[FDNYOEM]

$12/point, Too much or a bargain?


It seems to me that $12/point is too much because there are many posts for $10/point.

But to be fair, I think I'll compare what a room would cost through Disney with what it would cost using points.

I'll use Old Key West because a previous post references OKW.
On-line reservations cannot book within 4 days, so I asked for a Studio at OKW for Sunday 4/11 thru Friday 4/16.

From Diney's on-line reservations at

http://wdw.reservations.disney.go.com

I got:

Disney's Old Key West Resort
Arriving on 04/11/04 for 5 nights
2 Adults
Room Type: Deluxe Studio

Resort Stay only
$1,834.20†



For the same dates I would need 75 DVC points.

If I payed $12/point, it would cost me $900.

That is a savings of over 50%, or $934.



$12/point is a bargain!!!



I cannot think of a better bargain anywhere!!!













Unless, of course, you sell me your points for $10/point.

 

[twinmomplus2new]

I have rented Just once to someone from these boards. To assuage my guilt for staying onsite at Universal, (while my DVC was paid for)
I myself was uncomfortable with the trust factor. I got very lucky, my renter paid me by overnight mail cashiers check. And because he was so willing to trust my honesty, He got a very good deal. 72 points for $650. Less than even 10 per point. It was a painless transaction and up to me to take less than they were worth. Because for me the worth was in the dealing between the renter and I. It was never to turn a profit.

Now, If I can charge whatever, I would like to take the cruise, I will sell you 150 points for 4,589. Does that sound reasonable?

 

[pumpkinboy]

Originally posted by doubletrouble_vb
...When I don't use my points I'm losing both a portion of my principal and the years maintenance...then there is pain and suffering from not going to Disney...

Ah the pain of not going to WDW . I feel your pain, doubletrouble_vb, I feel your pain.

 

[KNWVIKING]

Its the way you rent them that creates problems. I don't think anyone objects to an owner renting points that are going to expire or something unexpectedly happens to cause a trip to be canceled. As for price...get what you can.If someone is willing to pay 12-great, have to settle for 6- oh well.

But the problem is created by people like the OP. Renting is a business to them. To all those who have never been involved in a thread like this please understand one important fact: THE OP's ONLY INTEREST IS TO INCREASE HIS PROFIT MARGIN and when YOU rent points for $7.00 it kills HIS chance to sell for $12.00. HE WANTS YOU TO HELP HIM MAKE A LIVING !!!

Next time you try and get into BWV at the 7 month window and you're told all that's availible is the weekends, take a look on the rental boards for all the missing weekdays. THAT's what SCREWS up our points system. THAT's where OWNERS who say "They're MY points and I'll do as I like with them" affect ALL of us.

Don't be fooled by the OP

 

[Nick@ VB+OKW]

Originally posted by KNWVIKING
Its the way you rent them that creates problems. I don't think anyone objects to an owner renting points that are going to expire or something unexpectedly happens to cause a trip to be canceled. As for price...get what you can.If someone is willing to pay 12-great, have to settle for 6- oh well.

But the problem is created by people like the OP. Renting is a business to them.
Don't be fooled by the OP

I agree with KNWVIKING post above and ripleysmom's post on this thread.. ...

I have rented pts to pay cash for an upcoming cruise, to get a better deal than through DVC using pts. But I don't think DVC had in mind............. for some owners to rent pts for peak times(x-mas,Easter,etc) and see how much profit members can make renting.

I bought into DVC to use for myself and family vacations.............not to make $$ from it. The only time I would EVER rent is for cruisng. You get the best value for your money staying and using your pts on WDW and DVC properties.

 

[ripleysmom]

ITA.

As mentioned above my objection is when posters who start a thread trying to rally the DVC owners to increase their per point pricing so that they can increase their profits and maximize their ROI.

Do I care what people rent their points at? No.

Do I care when they start telling other owners to increase their prices so that they themselves can make more money? You bet I do!!

 

[new_yawka]

I'm thrilled too that others might try to get $12/pnt. It makes it easier if one of us needs to rent our points for $10 (or less)!

 

[princess&tig]

One thing that really would rais the value of our points would be if more non-DVC people became aware that they could rent from us. With the current cost of even renting a studio at the BW resort. ($300 per night). It is a much better deal to buy points from us. If more people became aware of this, points would be snatched up quickly and we all would charge more, get rich, buy even more points, and retire at OKW.

 

[TnRobin]

ENOUGH!!!!!!

Everone step away from the keyboard and calm down. I am removing all the post on this thread that are about nothing but attacking another poster and his/her opinion.

Everyone is entitled to thier opinion even if it is not yours. Please refer to the DIS posting guidelines concerning personal attacks.

 

[Tagrel]

OK, the post is already at the top, so I'll respond.

Um, the OP doesn't HAVE to respond to this thread with all the debate it starts up. His message is loud and clear (however inaccurate) from the title we all read over and over as we look for the latest posts. His job is done.

For each response that moves this post to the top of the list, that many more DVCers that don't even READ it think the going rate is $12. WHY it isn't moved to the debate board like 5 in a one bedroom and reusing that mug I'm not sure.

But while you are all offended by each others language and opinions, you are also resending the OPs message OVER and OVER and OVER.

I'm sure they are quite pleased with all the assistance in spreading their message! I'm thinking you are all being used, AND annoying yourselves at the same time.

But of course thats only my opinion...

ETA: Sorry Robin, cross posted... Hope this opinion was OK...

 

[MelissathePooh]

Originally posted by FDNYOEM
$12/point, Too much or a bargain?

It seems to me that $12/point is too much because there are many posts for $10/point.

But to be fair, I think I'll compare what a room would cost through Disney with what it would cost using points.

I'll use Old Key West because a previous post references OKW.
On-line reservations cannot book within 4 days, so I asked for a Studio at OKW for Sunday 4/11 thru Friday 4/16.

From Diney's on-line reservations at

http://wdw.reservations.disney.go.com

I got:

Disney's Old Key West Resort
Arriving on 04/11/04 for 5 nights
2 Adults
Room Type: Deluxe Studio

Resort Stay only
$1,834.20†

For the same dates I would need 75 DVC points.

If I payed $12/point, it would cost me $900.

That is a savings of over 50%, or $934.

$12/point is a bargain!!!

I cannot think of a better bargain anywhere!!
Unless, of course, you sell me your points for $10/point.

Yes, DVC points can be a good bargain to rent for larger accomodations during the week, or they can be a not so great bargain, as I pointed out earlier, with the example at wlv studio for 8 nights that is 143 points or $1488 cash.

Or use a weekend at okw with your numers right there, the rack rate of $366.88. Instead of starting on 4/11 start on 4/16 for two nights. 36 points per night. Hmmm. That is about 10 per point.

Or use the example I posted of the two bedroom that is less than $5 per point per night.

Yes, $10 a point can be a tremendous value, especially during the week days, especially for a big room. But I really believe that anyone who is going to be able to figure out how to come on here and rent points for a stay is going to be smart enough to find mousesavers.com to not pay rack rates for a room, either. The "market" will bear out what point rentals are worth, but if I was a rentee I would want a substantial discount over what CRO rents a room for when you consider the risk involved, the longer cancellation, no housekeeping, etc.

 

[GAIL HAYDEN]

Originally posted by Lilly's Dad
This commonly accepted "going rate" for point rental is more realistic! Previously, when people undercut the market and rented them for $10 (or less) per point they were actually LOSING money on their investment cost (adjusted for inflation initial investment depreciated plus annual maintenance fees). LETS ALL BE FAIR TO EACH OTHER and continue to "hold the line" at renting points @ $12 per. Thank You!

In your dreams!!!! If I ever rent my points, I will charge no more than 10.00 per point. I did not join DVC to become a profiteer.
I am not losing any money at 10.00, it more than covers any cost.
Charge what you want and let the rest of us do the same.

 

[Cruelladeville]

Personally, I don't care if the renter is a DVC member or not. I am firm on $10.50 per point, which seems fair to both of us: $4 per point in dues and $.50 for PayPal expenses, leaves $6 per point to me. Since I bought my points at $54 and I can sell them for $74 now, it seems to me that the $6 is a nice profit, and nobody was unfairly taken advantage of. This isn't a business to me, I am just helping people out. It's very callous to split hairs between members and non-members, though---I think many of those non-members will become members once they have tried DVC. We aren't a closed group here. Non-members should be welcomed, too, and what better way than trying DVC thru renting?

 

[MikDor]

 

[ford family]

So, by MikDor's logic, you charge $16 per point whist you are still financing those DVC puppies and then what? Just the dues, I suppose, $4 per point? Or were you going to carry on charging $16 AFTER the real cost had gone down to only $4?
Shame on you.

ford family

 

[manning]

If you are lucky to sell your points at or above your purchase price you end up ahead.