This doesn’t sound good (EMH going away?)

I guess you missed all the posts about how EMH was reudced in length and amount, and that they have added tons of hotels both on property and nearby to those allowed to be there. Finally they started reducing staffing to inflate wait times at many attractions. Those are the reasons it has been devauled.

It was then that Disney started charging for what was once an onsite perk, and because they had already cheapened it, some onsite also felt the need to pay because they remember what EMH used to be, and now DAH offers that same thing, but for a price.
Not at all. I get that & have experienced that with our trips as well. But the fact remains that b/c of those things, EMH have not been worthwhile so if it’s officially gone now & most ppl (including myself) didn’t like what it has become, why the new outrage? When I saw the news, my first thought was oh well EMH sucks now anyway.
 
Not at all. I get that & have experienced that with our trips as well. But the fact remains that b/c of those things, EMH have not been worthwhile so if it’s officially gone now & most ppl (including myself) didn’t like what it has become, why the new outrage? When I saw the news, my first thought was oh well EMH sucks now anyway.
Why the outrage? Well, is my hotel bill going down because it’ll be gone? Nope. Its another option or perk taken away even though the prices are going up.
 

Not at all. I get that & have experienced that with our trips as well. But the fact remains that b/c of those things, EMH have not been worthwhile so if it’s officially gone now & most ppl (including myself) didn’t like what it has become, why the new outrage? When I saw the news, my first thought was oh well EMH sucks now anyway.
Well you are acting like the proverbial frog in the boiling water just like they hoped you would. Many of us noticed the bubbles coming up and saw the steam rising. It sucks now because of what they did, and THAT is what we are upset about. The current rumor is something many of us saw coming years ago.
 
Why the outrage? Well, is my hotel bill going down because it’ll be gone? Nope. Its another option or perk taken away even though the prices are going up.

You could look at it another way. Now that, in your opinion, the benefits of staying onsite are reduced, there's no reason to do it anymore. And the difference in room prices on and off site probably pay for any of the upcharge events you might want to attend. Moves like this -- assuming they are what is happening and not just a reaction to SWGE or Disney being late in posting EMH hours -- are actually rather egalitarian, allowing everyone a chance to experience what used to the reserved for those able to pay the high resort prices. Disney has been doing a lot of that lately -- they opened up the Good Neighbor hotels to 60 FPs, (or am I remembering that wrong). It seems to me that they are making it easier for people to come to the parks while staying off site by diluting the advantages onsite provides. The message -- if there is a message being sent -- could be that if you want to be in the bubble, they're glad to have you and there will be some benefit to it (this fall, one of those benefits might be actually being able to get into the parks if capacity is approached). But if you don't want to be onsite for whatever reason, now WDW is offering you the chance to have a bit of that previously reserved experience.

Likewise, for the guests onsite, charging money for these events limits attendance. So if you really want the late night WDW experience (because they still are offering the morning one) you can get an enhanced version of it. It'll cost you something, but as someone who's done both, PM EMH pales when compared to DAH. It's not even close in terms of ride availability and crowd levels.

There is no one who likes this if it happens. Not me, not LSU, not anyone else who has jumped into to argue against the pitchforks. But you can make a case that in reality and practicality, it's not as bad as the headline makes it appear. If missing out on one very crowded night at MK is enough to make you change your opinion about the place or staying onsite, then my guess is something else would have pushed you there anyway. It's not the way anyone wants it, but at least from my perspective it's a rather marginal practical but dramatically cosmetic change.
 
If missing out on one very crowded night at MK is enough to make you change your opinion about the place or staying onsite, then my guess is something else would have pushed you there anyway

Nah, i think for a lot of people, this is just one of the things that Disney has done over the past few years.

I think you see people get so upset here sometimes over a topic, it’s usually because things have added up over time.

Magic hours is in fact a major perk for staying onsite.
 
/
Well you are acting like the proverbial frog in the boiling water just like they hoped you would. Many of us noticed the bubbles coming up and saw the steam rising. It sucks now because of what they did, and THAT is what we are upset about. The current rumor is something many of us saw coming years ago.
I’m not naive. I saw it too, but it just doesn’t bother me as much as it does some. Things just can’t stay the same. It’s still something we enjoy. I didn’t love shorter hours when it started, but now it doesn’t matter to us b/c we can’t stay late anyway. I get that it sucks for ppl who still could. But, to be brutally honest, I’m in the camp of wanting to pay for things that mitigate crowds. Before wdw starting creating a crowd problem, it was already crowded. But, I agree it’s worse now. We all are most concerned about how things will affect our own person situations. Personally, for us, the perks that have diminished are not important to us, the cost has not risen that much (IMO) in the last 13 years, & we are willing to & already do pay for other things that help mitigate the crowds.

What does bother me, though, are the staff cuts. But, that’s still not my hill to die to reference another thread. I just find it annoying. I’m not one to cut my nose off to spite my face.
 
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You could look at it another way. Now that, in your opinion, the benefits of staying onsite are reduced, there's no reason to do it anymore. And the difference in room prices on and off site probably pay for any of the upcharge events you might want to attend. Moves like this -- assuming they are what is happening and not just a reaction to SWGE or Disney being late in posting EMH hours -- are actually rather egalitarian, allowing everyone a chance to experience what used to the reserved for those able to pay the high resort prices. Disney has been doing a lot of that lately -- they opened up the Good Neighbor hotels to 60 FPs, (or am I remembering that wrong). It seems to me that they are making it easier for people to come to the parks while staying off site by diluting the advantages onsite provides. The message -- if there is a message being sent -- could be that if you want to be in the bubble, they're glad to have you and there will be some benefit to it (this fall, one of those benefits might be actually being able to get into the parks if capacity is approached). But if you don't want to be onsite for whatever reason, now WDW is offering you the chance to have a bit of that previously reserved experience.

Likewise, for the guests onsite, charging money for these events limits attendance. So if you really want the late night WDW experience (because they still are offering the morning one) you can get an enhanced version of it. It'll cost you something, but as someone who's done both, PM EMH pales when compared to DAH. It's not even close in terms of ride availability and crowd levels.

For a family of 4, it will cost $520 to go to DAH. You can’t say that’s Disney trying to be nice and make it so everyone, even those who can’t afford to stay at Pop, can now enjoy an evening at MK. If people can afford to pay $520 for 3 hours at MK then they can certainly pay to stay at a value resort. They may have just not wanted to before.

This move definitely is not Disney trying to even the playing field for off site guests. They wouldn’t be building 4 new hotel towers if they didn’t want people to stay in them.
 
You could look at it another way. Now that, in your opinion, the benefits of staying onsite are reduced, there's no reason to do it anymore. And the difference in room prices on and off site probably pay for any of the upcharge events you might want to attend. Moves like this -- assuming they are what is happening and not just a reaction to SWGE or Disney being late in posting EMH hours -- are actually rather egalitarian, allowing everyone a chance to experience what used to the reserved for those able to pay the high resort prices. Disney has been doing a lot of that lately -- they opened up the Good Neighbor hotels to 60 FPs, (or am I remembering that wrong). It seems to me that they are making it easier for people to come to the parks while staying off site by diluting the advantages onsite provides. The message -- if there is a message being sent -- could be that if you want to be in the bubble, they're glad to have you and there will be some benefit to it (this fall, one of those benefits might be actually being able to get into the parks if capacity is approached). But if you don't want to be onsite for whatever reason, now WDW is offering you the chance to have a bit of that previously reserved experience.

Likewise, for the guests onsite, charging money for these events limits attendance. So if you really want the late night WDW experience (because they still are offering the morning one) you can get an enhanced version of it. It'll cost you something, but as someone who's done both, PM EMH pales when compared to DAH. It's not even close in terms of ride availability and crowd levels.

There is no one who likes this if it happens. Not me, not LSU, not anyone else who has jumped into to argue against the pitchforks. But you can make a case that in reality and practicality, it's not as bad as the headline makes it appear. If missing out on one very crowded night at MK is enough to make you change your opinion about the place or staying onsite, then my guess is something else would have pushed you there anyway. It's not the way anyone wants it, but at least from my perspective it's a rather marginal practical but dramatically cosmetic change.
And DLR does not offer many incentives to stay onsite b/c they don’t have the capacity anyway. Perhaps WDW is anticipating this with SWGE.
 
For a family of 4, it will cost $520 to go to DAH. You can’t say that’s Disney trying to be nice and make it so everyone, even those who can’t afford to stay at Pop, can now enjoy an evening at MK. If people can afford to pay $520 for 3 hours at MK then they can certainly pay to stay at a value resort. They may have just not wanted to before.

This move definitely is not Disney trying to even the playing field for off site guests. They wouldn’t be building 4 new hotel towers if they didn’t want people to stay in them.

Of course it’s not. Most incentives like EMH and Free Dining were put in at times of low occupancy usually Because of the economy at the time. Disney and the economy are at a point where it’s not an issue. They will continue to raise prices and take away incentives until they start seeing diminishing returns. When the recession hits in a couple of years and visits start to drop off, you will see more added back in and better ticket deals. That is just basic economics.
 
And DLR does not offer many incentives to stay onsite b/c they don’t have the capacity anyway. Perhaps WDW is anticipating this with SWGE.
Yeah but does DLR need to offer many incentives? They are completely and utterly landlocked. BUT they know they are a locals park. Does it matter to them to have tons and tons of people onsite when they know they will have locals coming in droves? They have well over 1million AP holders too last I heard. It has been commented a lot on the Boards that AP holders for DLR have better treatment in terms of what they get over the year as part of being an AP than WDW. This is because the main base for the parks is locals.

I think in terms of that DLR and WDW are just comparing apples to oranges.
 
I wondered if Disney would take away the 60 day neighbor FP after they catch up on their hotels.
I expect it to occur. I don't know when though. They are being smart and doing it year by year. No sense in a long term committment if they don't need to. I have been wondering though if they'll extend it longer than initially thought if the SW crowds are immense and for a long time. On the flip side part of them extending the perk for my understanding was also related to construction on the resorts which take rooms out of the mix. CBR obviously lost some rooms permanently due to the Skyliner. It's at least through 2020 at the moment.
 
You're being snide of course, but yeah, I actually could see WDW (or MK at least) move to multiple tickets per day. At a push, altough the hours don't line up great, they could probably force three tickets into summer days. It's be easy to market: the rise-and-shone ticket is perfect for early risers and people looking to escape the afternoon heat and crowds -- ticket valid 8am - 3pm, must leave park by 4pm; All-day(TM) for guests who want it all -- ticket valid between 11am - 8pm must leave park after night time show; adventurer's ticket -- 3pm-11pm.

Guests who stay on property can bundle the morning and evening tickets into a super ticket for an exciting reduced rate.

I think this is exactly where they are going as the parks get more crowded. Before everyone screams, consider though that you may be able to have a much better experience as a visitor with the crowds divided up.
 
I’m not naive. I saw it too, but it just doesn’t bother me as much as it does some. Things just can’t stay the same. It’s still something we enjoy. I didn’t love shorter hours when it started, but now it doesn’t matter to us b/c we can’t stay late anyway. I get that it sucks for ppl who still could. But, to be brutally honest, I’m in the camp of wanting to pay for things that mitigate crowds. Before wdw starting creating a crowd problem, it was already crowded. But, I agree it’s worse now. We all are most concerned about how things will affect our own person situations. Personally, for us, the perks that have diminished are not important to us, the cost has not risen that much (IMO) in the last 13 years, & we are willing to & already do pay for other things that help mitigate the crowds.

What does bother me, though, are the staff cuts. But, that’s still not my hill to die to reference another thread. I just find it annoying. I’m not one to cut my nose off to spite my face.
By the time something changes in your own personal circumstances such as finances or your kid grows up changing your touring availability, these things that you don't care about will be a distant memory and you will be left wondering why you didn't care.

It is like the parking fees. Many DVC owners were up in arms over it, even though it didn't effect them at all. If we don't stand up together then we have no hope to let them know when they go too far.

We know though, you have enough cash to pave over any issues you run up against and if it doesn't effect you it is of no concern.
 
By the time something changes in your own personal circumstances such as finances or your kid grows up changing your touring availability, these things that you don't care about will be a distant memory and you will be left wondering why you didn't care.

It is like the parking fees. Many DVC owners were up in arms over it, even though it didn't effect them at all. If we don't stand up together then we have no hope to let them know when they go too far.

We know though, you have enough cash to pave over any issues you run up against and if it doesn't effect you it is of no concern.
It’s very subject of when they have “gone too far”. Everyone has a different threshold. You have mentioned that you are a family of 4 so just the added person makes your costs at least a 1/4 more than mine most likely for most things not just WDW. It’s also very arrogant of you to assume you know anything about me to imply that my finances or situation will inevitably change & I’ll be left regretting that I didn’t heed your warnings.

As far as the bolded, with all due respect, who is “we”? This is a luxury vacation not a social justice issue. I’m a social worker so I’m very aware of causes worthy of such advocacy. IMO, this is not one of those.

We are fortunate enough to be financially sound & know others aren’t as lucky. We have also made other choices like keeping our family small & other day-to-day things that allows us to afford things that we may not be able to afford otherwise. I’m sorry if that angers you or makes you feel like you are entitled to decide how ppl should spend their disposable income so that it benefits you.
 
This is all subjective and dependent on your own situation. What one person can afford is of no relevance to others. It seems pointless to argue against the pitchforks (as another poster said) when all you can see and discuss is your own set of circumstances.
 
It’s also very arrogant of you to assume.......

...........that people who have a different opinion than you on a topic are 'whining'.

Let me ask you this. What harm is it for Disney to offer an exclusive event to those that can afford it (DAH), while still offering a much less exclusive event, but still something of value, to those that can't (EEMH)?

And, this is only my own opinion, so it could be wrong. But, my guess is that the number of resort guests who can afford to benefit from DAH is significantly less than those who can benefit from EEMH. So, from my perspective, with all of the cutbacks in 'free' perks, of which this is just one, Disney is negatively impacting a much larger percentage of their customer base than can ever benefit from the new, upcharged, perks.
 












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