Things not going well with the DDP changes

[kimsuenew]

Sooooooo... has anyone recently (lets say within the last week) came back from WDW, having used the DDP? If so, how did it go? Any better? Any worse? Has the "paying ones own tip" issue settled any? Just curious! Thanks in advance!

 

[FoundMyPrince]

So, has anyone heard how the DDP changes are going this week? Not to change the subject back to the subject we began with or anything...

 

[disneyfav4ever]

Check the publication dates. I think Birnbaum's comes out in July or August - but remember, it's compiled before that. The Passporter usually comes out in December or January.

They shouldn't put out the 2008 guide so early then, if it means the info will be wrong.

 

[disneyfav4ever]

If the reality is that a restaurant can fill its tables at all times and make a smaller profit off each table, vs. not filling to capicity and making a larger profit of the tables it comes out in the wash.

I agree with this.

 

[tloft]

I agree with this.

It just does not work out as simply as people think. Value specials and discounts are the most common ways to bring people into your store. Lets say my Sunday nights are really slow. Let say I do $1000 in food sales at 30% food costs meaning a gross profit of $700. As a special I offer 20% off the entire menu . How much more business do I need to do to BREAK EVEN. I would not even break even unless I do a full 40% more business - and this is only to break even on the cost of food. Obviously to do 40% more business I will need more staff on the floor and in the kitchen. Knocking my profitability back down again. Disney's lower purchasing costs would lower the percentage jump necessary to break even but the discount was well in excess of 20%.

 

[chanty]

Wow... I can't believe what I'm reading... this whole thread to argue/debate/discuss if Disney is making money or not on the DDP??

Come on you guys... let's get back to vacation planning, fun, excitement!
We'll never know if there making money and seriously, we have no control over it! If you don't like the changes, then please don't buy it. Simple as that. The negative energy is draining and ruining your Disney experience...for FOOD! The Castle is still there, they aren't minimizing our Park hoppers or whatever else!

It's DISNEY! So many people can't afford to go.... so please simply be happy that you can still go this year, or next year or the year after!

Life is too short to argue and debate on whether you have more knowledge on Food service than so & so...

The plan has changed, yes. Now let's change our attitude cause that the only thing you ca control!

Have a happy day y'all!

 

[disneyfav4ever]

It just does not work out as simply as people think. Value specials and discounts are the most common ways to bring people into your store. Lets say my Sunday nights are really slow. Let say I do $1000 in food sales at 30% food costs meaning a gross profit of $700. As a special I offer 20% off the entire menu . How much more business do I need to do to BREAK EVEN. I would not even break even unless I do a full 40% more business - and this is only to break even on the cost of food. Obviously to do 40% more business I will need more staff on the floor and in the kitchen. Knocking my profitability back down again. Disney's lower purchasing costs would lower the percentage jump necessary to break even but the discount was well in excess of 20%.

Disney's purchasing costs are lower, and their restaurants are also much busier. No offense, but do you get a lot of people making reservations 180 days out? Disney does.

 

[tloft]

Disney's purchasing costs are lower, and their restaurants are also much busier. No offense, but do you get a lot of people making reservations 180 days out? Disney does.

Of course not - but what does it have to do with the fact that any discount has to be offset by a subsequent increase in volume (at disney or in the real world). My whole point was that the necessary increase is usually much greater than people realize.

 

[disneyfav4ever]

Of course not - but what does it have to do with the fact that any discount has to be offset by a subsequent increase in volume (at disney or in the real world). My whole point was that the necessary increase is usually much greater than people realize.

And my point was that Disney is probably not losing money with the DDP.

 

[tloft]

And my point was that Disney is probably not losing money with the DDP.

and we come full circle. I've given clear and concise explanations of why I feel this isn't true, I've provided mathematical examples to back that hypothesis and still comes back to "your wrong I'm right."

Disney just reported their 8th consecutive quarter of growth both in revenue and in profits. That is hard to sustain but shareholders expect the company to continue to do so. I believe that the DDP severly reduced the profitability of the restaurants at WDW. That made reducing the benefit of the DDP one of the only surefire ways to continue to try and improve margins and grow profits for the 2008 fiscal year.

 

[angelmav]

And my point was that Disney is probably not losing money with the DDP.

And I agree with this........waiting for Tlofts indignant heated reply.

 

[hipchickie]

You're in trouble now angelmav

You are repeatedly ignoring the point that Disney, as one the largest single purchasers of food products in the world (before DDP) is already receiving rock bottom prices. Increased volume does not have an infinite abilitity to reduce cost.

You are repeatedly ignoring that food cost is only part of the equation.
Economies of scale covers many aspects of the manufacturing model - lets say a Disney restaurant is doing twice the covers - Overhead is not going to increase noticably, Food is going to cost less, there is no additional marketing dollars being spent, Due to the increased volume, there is now the ability to increase specializtion so labor cost is not going to double, more units will be produced at a lower long run average cost (here is when Henry and his assembly line come in).

They are not running specials to get people in, these restaurants are booked solid, there is rarely a time when it is not running at full efficiency (which was not the case before DDP)

So if you are running at optimim efficiency, how will you increase profits like the bosses want? You can't fit more tables, so get people out of those tables faster and fit in another seating. Bonus - reduce your costs (app. elimination) and now you are rolling in it!

What is going to happen in 2 more years when profits stagnate again? should be interesting....

 

[tloft]

And I agree with this........waiting for Tlofts indignant heated reply.

nice - someone else wants to make it personal. I simply argued (much earlier in this thread at this point) that I could easily believe Disney restaurants were losing money as a part of the original DDP promotion (and before it is said that I am missing the big picture - I said I know that the plan had an overall postive financial impact for the company as a whole). That point of view and the intelligence of the people that hold that opinion was subsequently insulted. I've simply decided not to back down on this one and let the disboard bullies have their way. sorry.

 

[disneyfav4ever]

nice - someone else wants to make it personal. I simply argued (much earlier in this thread at this point) that I could easily believe Disney restaurants were losing money as a part of the original DDP promotion (and before it is said that I am missing the big picture - I said I know that the plan had an overall postive financial impact for the company as a whole). That point of view and the intelligence of the people that hold that opinion was subsequently insulted. I've simply decided not to back down on this one and let the disboard bullies have their way. sorry.

And I'm not going to back down that I don't think they were losing money, they are making more profit with the 2008 plan though. So we're "bullies" because we disagree with you? I wouldn't ever post on the CB then if our opinions offend you.

 

[tloft]

So if you are running at optimim efficiency, how will you increase profits like the bosses want? You can't fit more tables, so get people out of those tables faster and fit in another seating. Bonus - reduce your costs (app. elimination) and now you are rolling in it!

I'm confused - have we been arguing about the profitability of the new plan? I certainly didn't think so. Yes, the new plan was designed to do exactly what you are saying. It also immediately improved margins by 18.5% overnight by eliminating the gratuity. So, how ever much or little they were making before - they are making a lot more now.

I thought the argument all along was whether they were losing money / significantly less profitable in the restaurants as a result of the old dining plan. I have expressed my reasoning as clearly as I can, provided examples and have been met with a litany of insults quoted somewhere about.

The tone of my "what are your restaurant qualifications" may have been a little harsh - but you threw everyone not agreeing with you under the bus first.

 

[JoanneNC]

I personally don't care why Disney changed the plan - it was changed and I still have options - Get it or Don't use it...

Costs for everything is rising and it's only expected that they gambled with lowering the initial cost by $1 and remove some of the value or raise the price and keep it as it.
Either way - there would have been complaints

People are complaining now because they took out value and only lowered it by $1.00 or if they raised it by $5-10 per day and didn't give us anything more for the increase.

A lot of people don't like change - PERIOD.
I guess I am fortunate because I didn't know the 2007 DDP and can only decide what is best based on my current options...

 

[DaParkers]

I know that this board is for Disney fans, but this is ridiculous! A few of you are actually arguing over Disney making or losing money. I mean no disrespect, but, why does it matter to you? Don't you have something going on in your life to focus that energy on? It's not that serious. Until Disney starts paying you to debate their issues, LET IT GO!

 

[tloft]

And I'm not going to back down that I don't think they were losing money, they are making more profit with the 2008 plan though. So we're "bullies" because we disagree with you? I wouldn't ever post on the CB then if our opinions offend you.

having differring points of view is one thing - "waiting for Tlofts indignant heated reply" is clearly not constructive and is intended only to provoke.

good for you for not backing down. I would love to know why you think they were still making money - IN THE RESTAURANTS - when they were offering a dining plan equal to 40% off. I already wrote, long before this got so heated that the plan obviously helped increase revenue for the company as a whole. Speaking specifically in the restaurants themselves how do you think that they were able to offer such large discounts and not have it affect profitability?

I don't think you are a bully for disagreeing with me. I think the people that personalize things and throw insults around - a half dozen or so are quoted further up - are bullies and usually drown out people with something to contribute.

 

[Linus Van Pelt]

I don't know what your issues are, but I think it is pretty obvious to anyone reading this that for some reason you are a little too emotionally invested in this to have a rational debate.

And you're not?

 

[PBader]

It just does not work out as simply as people think. Value specials and discounts are the most common ways to bring people into your store. Lets say my Sunday nights are really slow. Let say I do $1000 in food sales at 30% food costs meaning a gross profit of $700. As a special I offer 20% off the entire menu . How much more business do I need to do to BREAK EVEN. I would not even break even unless I do a full 40% more business - and this is only to break even on the cost of food. Obviously to do 40% more business I will need more staff on the floor and in the kitchen. Knocking my profitability back down again. Disney's lower purchasing costs would lower the percentage jump necessary to break even but the discount was well in excess of 20%.

I have to agree with you here. I own 2 stores (gas stations) and I just can not compete price wise with some of the larger ones. While we do have higher prices, we compensate by better customer service and cleaner stores. I just can not lower my prices in anticipation of more than double sales to make it up so that I make the same amount of gross dollars. It makes my expenses go up with the increased handling of product. The only person who really benefits is the supplier who gets more volume.

Obviously the DDP needed to be revamped to give Disney more money. I know that over the last several years everything has gone up. I don't see how Disney kept the pricing as low as they did for so long. Each person will now just have to figure out what is in the best interest of their family when they plan vacations and not just assume that the DDP will be beneficial to them. We only used the plan 1 time for a 4 night stay--and we did save $$. The price of the plan per day was less or about even to what our bill for dinner would have been--so basically our CS and snack were free. No company no matter how profitable they are can continue to operate like that for an extended period of time.

I hate that it has made so many guests unhappy, but things do change.