Theme Park attendance estimates released - Record 112 Million Visit Disney Parks

[DancingBear]

The above figures seem to show that Disney is making more money....

I guess that depends what you call "making more money."

 

[MasterShake]

I guess that depends what you call "making more money."

Yes, this can be a difficult concept to grasp.

 

[YoHo]

Do you understand what Operating Income is?

And yes, I misspoke, Revenue rose. Operating Income fell.

Do you understand what:
"missing the forest for the trees means?"

 

[YoHo]

DL opens 1-2 hours earlier then DCA, thus this skews the numbers concerning the two parks more dramatically then anything else.

Operating hours are a function of profitability though. If Disney thought they could get more guests into DCA early, then it would be open early.

And if it did make some sort of appreciable difference, don't you think Corporate brass would say that instead of admitting that DCA is a failure to the stockholders?

I mean come on.

 

[MasterShake]

Do you understand what Operating Income is?

And yes, I misspoke, Revenue rose. Operating Income fell.

Do you understand what:
"missing the forest for the trees means?"

Do you understand what:
"Rude and bitter means?"

You misspoke (seems like you use that excuse a lot) and then you lash out at others.

Disney is spending more money then they did in 2000, but they are making enough money to offset those costs. I'm sure if operating Income was higher you'd be on here bashing Disney for not spending more on the parks.

 

[Peter Pirate 2]

Rude and bitter? Are you a professional clown or just funny by nature. You call me a "yes man" (for agreeing with Yoho, whom I've agreed with twice now in the past 8 years or so) then call him names...Wow.

The facts are there. It took Disney years longer than other vacation destination to return to pre 9/11 figures and even when they do it it's by offering unheard of giveaways (free dining) and discounts (the hotels). If you don't want to discuss don't but don't have a hissy fit when your logic shows no clear path and is pointed out.

 

[YoHo]

Disney is not struggling more then other theme Parks. US/IOA had a million less guests in 2006 then it did in 2001. I would say they are the ones suffering.

Nobody said anything about Theme Parks. Walt Disney World is not a Theme Park. It's resort destination. It's competitors are Hawaii, Las Vegas, etc. etc. etc.

Disney's operating realities have absolutely nothing in common with Universal Florida.

 

[YoHo]

Rude and bitter? Are you a professional clown or just funny by nature. You call me a "yes man" (for agreeing with Yoho, whom I've agreed with twice now in the past 8 years or so) then call him names...Wow.

The facts are there. It took Disney years longer than other vacation destination to return to pre 9/11 figures and even when they do it it's by offering unheard of giveaways (free dining) and discounts (the hotels). If you don't want to discuss don't but don't have a hissy fit when your logic shows no clear path and is pointed out.

I remember we had a knock down drag out fight about something or other many moons ago. Something to do with Eisner I'm sure. I don't remember.

 

[YoHo]

Disney is spending more money then they did in 2000, but they are making enough money to offset those costs. I'm sure if operating Income was higher you'd be on here bashing Disney for not spending more on the parks.

Actually, I'm unhappy with the amount of money they're spending on the Parks, Florida in particular, regardless of what their operating income is. Their park spending has been way off compared to even 10 years ago. And their spending compared to revenues is disgustingly low compared to the 50s, 60s, 70s and even 80s.

Apparently, the Disney decade was code for terrible TV and time shares.

 

[MJMcBride]

Nobody said anything about Theme Parks. Walt Disney World is not a Theme Park. It's resort destination. It's competitors are Hawaii, Las Vegas, etc. etc. etc.

Disney's operating realities have absolutely nothing in common with Universal Florida.

I agree. But they are competing with Universal as well. And kicking their butt apparently

 

[YoHo]

And they've always kicked Universal's butt, so it's not really a competition is it?

Anyway, Universal has their own set of issues.

 

[raidermatt]

I agree. But they are competing with Universal as well. And kicking their butt apparently

Universal is a minor competitor. When the average vacationer sits down and says should we go to WDW, or should we go to "X", "X" is rarely Universal.

But yes, Universal is tanking. They simply aren't investing in their product.

Do you understand what:
"Rude and bitter means?"

For whatever reason, you opened that can this time with the uncalled for "yes man" comment. Besides being rude, if you only knew the history you'd realize how off that statement is.

The above figures seem to show that Disney is making more money and attendance is increasing. I'm sure they have a lot of room for improvement, but I would have to disagree that their current direction is dooming the parks.

You don't make more money if expenses go up more than revenue, and that's actually what the numbers posted by Dancing Bear show. Its also impossible to translate them into attendance because ticket prices have gone up, as have virtually all other prices on-property. Its possible the same number of guests are simply shelling out more money, which could be interpreted as at least a partial positive, if it weren't for expenses going up by a greater amount.

Now, as for whether the current direction is "dooming" the parks, that all depends on what you mean by dooming. You could look at decreased operating income and extrapolate that into the future and it would most certainly end up causing some rather large problems for the company. Expecially when you consider what will happen during the next economic downturn.

Looks like Dancing Bear is stating the opposite, that revenue is up. They are getting more money per guest.

As stated above, more money is comng in, but even more is going out. As we are always reminded, Disney is a business, and declining operating income is not a good thing.

DL opens 1-2 hours earlier then DCA, thus this skews the numbers concerning the two parks more dramatically then anything else.

Sure, it's something in DL's favor, but DL only opens earlier because far fewer people want to enter DCA early. If they did, it would open earlier as well. At the same time, the place empties out late in the day, especially when the EP isn't running. Since most guests don't arrive at DL in the first hour, it's a pretty big stretch to say DL gets significant help to its numbers just because it opens earlier. Besides, its a good bet that most guests who do hit DL early and then shoot over to DCA shoot right back over to DL at some point. They must, looking at what happens to DCA late in the day vs. DL.

Since most guests don't arrive until after 10am anyway, DL's earlier opening has little bearing on which park most people enter first.

 

[DancingBear]

Yes, this can be a difficult concept to grasp.

You posted this, then complain about others being rude?

 

[SoCalKDG]

As stated above, more money is comng in, but even more is going out. As we are always reminded, Disney is a business, and declining operating income is not a good thing.

The key question is what is Disney spending the money on. A common complaint is that Disney doesn't put money back into the parks. Higher expenses could contradict that depending on where the money is going. If in 2000 money wasn't going back into the parks(generally accepted theory on the net) then its operating income was greater but at the expense of long term profitibility. Revenue is now up dramatically and money is being spent.

Sure, it's something in DL's favor, but DL only opens earlier because far fewer people want to enter DCA early. If they did, it would open earlier as well. At the same time, the place empties out late in the day, especially when the EP isn't running. Since most guests don't arrive at DL in the first hour, it's a pretty big stretch to say DL gets significan't help to its numbers just because it opens earlier. Besides, its a good bet that most guests who do hit DL early and then shoot over to DCA shoot right back over to DL at some point. They must, looking at what happens to DCA late in the day vs. DL.

Since most guests don't arrive until after 10am anyway, DL's earlier opening has little bearing on which park most people enter first.

First, I'm all for improving any park. DCA and the money being spent to improve it is a great thing happening. My comments were only based on attendance and the first in first counted comments.

I'm going to disagree with your assumption about arrival time based on my personal experience. I've been there many times between 9:30 and 10:30 am and its already starting to get crowded(10,000+ in the park) at DL. Almost every hotel guest starts their day at DL park with either early entry or the earlier opening time. These people then parkhop to DCA later in the day. This number is greater then the number of people that spend their first hour at DCA then jump to DL.

 

[raidermatt]

I'm going to disagree with your assumption about arrival time based on my personal experience. I've been there many times between 9:30 and 10:30 am and its already starting to get crowded(10,000+ in the park) at DL. Almost every hotel guest starts their day at DL park with either early entry or the earlier opening time. These people then parkhop to DCA later in the day. This number is greater then the number of people that spend their first hour at DCA then jump to DL.

Just for a little perspective, DL averages over 40k per day, so if your 10k+ by 10:30am estimate is correct for an average day, at least 75% of DL's guests would still be arriving after 10am.

Some do take advantage of early entry and openings, but most don't. That's why those who do enter early find the lines so short at that time. Plus, unlike WDW, the majority of guests aren't even staying at the on-property hotels. There's only 2200 total rooms on property.

 

[All Aboard]

YoHo + Peter Pirate 2 = 0

 

[YoHo]

Now now AA, you can't alter the past.

 

[All Aboard]

Hey, I figured I just beat MasterShake to the punch.

 

[YoHo]

This thread would be much better with a Rum Runner, I'll tell you that.

 

[Cannot_Wait_4Disney]

Disney's operating realities have absolutely nothing in common with Universal Florida.

Yeah. Disney doesn't operate any themeparks like Universal does. They have absolutely nothing in common with Universal.

It's competitors are Hawaii, Las Vegas, etc. etc. etc.

Yeah. Disney has much more in common with a gambling destination and a tropical island than it does with Universal. I mean what do these people thing WDW is? Do they think WDW is a bunch of theme parks and the hotels and restaurants to service visitors to them or something? Fools.