The Running Thread - 2016

[RunDisneyDad]

ATTQOTD: I have not used a pace group, but watched at least 3 of them blow past me at this year's WDW Marathon. I agree with others who said they are a great way of staying within yourself early on (assuming you pick the right pace group).

I finished at about the same time as one of the pace groups and I thought it was cool listening to the pace group thank the pacer and then him respond with a few nuggets related to stuff they shared with him. Its pretty obvious they talked quite a bit during the run.

 

[baxter24]

QOTD: Have you ever utilized a pace group and how did it go? Did you stick with it, did it help you or would running solo have benefited you more? Has anyone been a pacer?

I have never technically used a pace group but I have made it my goal to try and finish ahead of a particular pace group during the race. Since most pace groups that I had seen tend to be in 15 minute intervals my goal time never seems to coincide with their expected finish time. I think keeping up with a group or trying to stay ahead is a good motivator though.

 

[Kathymford]

I also got new shoes. I went from Adrenalines (I had been over pronating) to neutral shoes, as I seemed to no longer be pronating.

I've been wondering if the pronating thing could change. I have bunions and my dr told me people with bunions over probate. And then when I did my treadmill test at the running store they showed that I over primate. But that was 3 years ago when I just started running. I've been feeling lately like my shoes are actually pushing my feet too far the other way, like I'm under pronating now. I just wasn't sure if it actually changes over time ...

 

[jhorstma]

I've been wondering if the pronating thing could change. I have bunions and my dr told me people with bunions over probate. And then when I did my treadmill test at the running store they showed that I over primate. But that was 3 years ago when I just started running. I've been feeling lately like my shoes are actually pushing my feet too far the other way, like I'm under pronating now. I just wasn't sure if it actually changes over time ...

Sounds like you got over it - just like they say, where there's a will there's a way...

 

[IamTrike]

Milage for August 214 miles. Was about 4 miles short of my goal.

QOTD: Have you ever utilized a pace group and how did it go? Did you stick with it, did it help you or would running solo have benefited you more? Has anyone been a pacer?

Todays QOTD was suggested by a fellow poster. I appreciate the suggestion! Anyone else with a question they would liked asked, just send me a PM.

ATTQOTD: I have used a pace group a few times. My normal approach is to stay with them for the first half to 3/4 of the race. At that point I usually pick up the pace if I am feeling good or by that point I am struggling I try to hang with them. I find them especially useful for the first few miles to make sure I don't go out to fast and get into a rhythm. I also think it helps to be a part of a group to encourage each other. I have never been a pacer.

I would like to add one other thing about pace groups. At the end of a marathon as the pace groups start coming in, what starts out as a group of 20 or more with the pacer, ends up with the pacer alone or with no more than 5 folks that made it with them. Maybe the speed up towards the end, or they couldn't keep the pace. I have also seen pacers have a "off" day and see them walking. One way I have heard of them limiting this from happening is some races will have a pacer for the first 13.1 and a new person come in and finish the race with or without the original pacer.

I've used them at the Tobacco Road Marathon, Disneyland Half, WDW Marathon.

For:
Tobacco Road I started with the 3:40 pace group. The pacer ran the first two miles about 15 seconds per second per mile ahead of goal pace. It was an off day and I had stomach issues so I dropped away and ran on my own.
Disneyland Half: I ran with the 1:40 pace group We ran pretty close to even splits for the first 11 miles. We were slightly ahead of goal pace but not much. At mile 11 the pace group really sped up. I maintained my pace and finished the race in 1:39 I couldn't even see the pace group when I finished.
WDW Marathon: I think I ran with the 3:40 pace group. The pacer decided he wanted us to get more time on mainstreet. We slowed to about a minute above goal pace while we were in the MK. We then made that time up over the next two miles. It was too much for me and I wound up dropping away from the group about mile 11.

For me running with a pace group has been a mixed bag. At Disneyworld the pace group was really large and tight, it made being in the group stressful. At Disneyland the group was a little smaller and it was a lot more enjoyable. Particular when you are running alone a pace group can be a nice way to meet someone to talk with.

I would definitely ask the pacer what the strategy. I prefer to run pretty close to even splits. Like many people I use a pace group to keep from going out too fast so it really bugs me when a pacer seems to be trying to bank time. It was also really disheartening to watch the pace group at Disneyland pull away from me even though I was running at the pace assigned for the pace group.

 

[DVCFan1994]

I've been wondering if the pronating thing could change. I have bunions and my dr told me people with bunions over probate. And then when I did my treadmill test at the running store they showed that I over primate. But that was 3 years ago when I just started running. I've been feeling lately like my shoes are actually pushing my feet too far the other way, like I'm under pronating now. I just wasn't sure if it actually changes over time ...

Both my PT and the running store I went to told me it can change. I had never run more than to chase down a child or the length of a basketball court prior to taking up running in 2012. I ran for about a year without any issue, then I had a steady stream, peroneal tendinitis, IT Band, Plantar Fascitis. I finally suspected I needed new shoes based on mileage, and asked someone to look, sure enough I was no longer pronating. I changed from stability shoes to neutrals one week out from GSC. I was nervous to change so close to the race, but it worked out ok. Now I actually run neutral to supinate at times. So it absolutely can change. But, I'd be sure you get shoes you can try out and return/exchange after a few weeks to a month (all my LRS have that policy) so that if it takes a while to find the right fit you are good. I was lucky because the Brooks Adrenaline is a shoe for over pronators, but the Brooks Defyance is the same shoe just without a medial post for stability, so it actually felt the same on my foot, it just didn't correct for pronation. That was true at least at the time I made the change, assuming it is now too.

 

[Anisum]

That's my problem. I like the idea of it, but I think a half is all I'll probably ever want to do. It's not so much the race, but the training that kills me. When I get up to 9 or 10 miles in half training, it's brutal for me.

I'm also in this boat. I like the long runs after I do them but when I have them on the calendar it's like "Eww! What if it's raining or hot or snowing? Why would I want to run that long?" which is why I decided when I'm going to do a full I will just do the Dopey and then will have accomplished one of my top five races and never have to do a marathon again if I don't want to.

QOTD: Have you ever utilized a pace group and how did it go? Did you stick with it, did it help you or would running solo have benefited you more? Has anyone been a pacer?

Todays QOTD was suggested by a fellow poster. I appreciate the suggestion! Anyone else with a question they would liked asked, just send me a PM.

I've never gotten to run very far with an official pace group but for Tink I did run the first few miles with one... maybe the 3:00 or 3:15 pacer. They were doing run/walk to get their timing right though and my friend who the rest of our group paces off of did very different intervals so we ended up not sticking too close to them. They were good to ensure we didn't go out to fast but I will admit I would have been annoyed if they were banking time or running far off pace.

I'm kind of bummed my upcoming half (31 days out!) only has pacers for the first 2:30 because that's a bit fast for me. I could really use a 2:45 pacer since that's right around where I'm estimated to finish given my last two 10 miler times. I totally understand not having enough pacers but they have pacers on 5min and 10min intervals between 1:40-2:30 so it seems weird. Maybe it's normal and I'm just spoiled by Disney accepting my slow speed. Anyway, enough about my pacer struggles.

As for being a pacer, I haven't run a marathon but I feel I could probably do it for a half. I am usually pretty solid at maintaining a pace when I need to. I know I've done 10 miles with splits that were +/-5 off of my intended pace. Not sure if that's good enough for being a pacer but that's what I got.

 

[ZellyB]

I first got PF less than a month before my first Glass Slipper Challenge in 2014. I was able to carefully and with guidance from my physical therapist keep training. I did use the Strasbourg sock. I hated it, but I needed it due to the way I slept being constricting for my calf/foot. The sock kept it stretched all night. I did lots of calf rolling, that actually helped more than the foot rolling for me. Stretched before and after runs. And my PT did Graston technique massage weekly on my foot and calf. I also got new shoes. I went from Adrenalines (I had been over pronating) to neutral shoes, as I seemed to no longer be pronating. Wearing the wrong shoes may have been part of the problem.

In my case it did not hurt during runs, but once it did I should have stopped. I made it through GSC ok, but later that spring when my race was done and I slacked off on everything I had learned, the PF returned and I ran through it, even with pain. I tore it, and then ended up in a boot for weeks. So, my suggestion is keep doing what you are doing, and if running doesn't hurt it you may be fine to continue. But if you have pain during the run, stop.

Thank you!

I'll add in calf rolling as well. I have wondered about my shoes since I've never had issues before and I recently changed shoes. I've run in Kinvaras for years but after some runner's knee problems I switched to a Zealot shoe which has more cushioning. Both are neutral shoes, but maybe the fit is different enough to be contributing. I may go back to the Kinvaras for a few runs and see if that seems to help. From everything I read, recovery from PF can be pretty slow, so I know I'll need to be patient. Mainly just hoping to be able to maintain my training schedule. Thanks again!

 

[Jaxasaurous]

ATTQOTD: I have used a pace group for my second half marathon, my first was a Disney race and my second was a local half marathon. I used a 2 hour pace group for the half and stayed with them until about mile 11 when I had to refill my water bottle. After I refilled it I could still see the pacer but I couldn't catch up. I ended up walking the last hill, which was at about mile 12.5 but I didn't know how much farther I had to go. I ended up finishing in 2 hours and 13 seconds, I'm bummed I missed the 2 hour time by a measly 13 seconds!
On the bright side I realized I really could use a GPS watch after that race. Maybe if I knew how close I was to finishing I would've picked up the pace to break the 2 hour mark.

 

[michigandergirl]

ATTQOTD: I have used pacers a few times. Just as many of you have said, I've used them for the first couple of miles to not go out too fast. I've also used them late in a race when a group passes me and I think, Crap, got to keep then in sight!!

 

[Kathymford]

Both my PT and the running store I went to told me it can change. I had never run more than to chase down a child or the length of a basketball court prior to taking up running in 2012. I ran for about a year without any issue, then I had a steady stream, peroneal tendinitis, IT Band, Plantar Fascitis. I finally suspected I needed new shoes based on mileage, and asked someone to look, sure enough I was no longer pronating. I changed from stability shoes to neutrals one week out from GSC. I was nervous to change so close to the race, but it worked out ok. Now I actually run neutral to supinate at times. So it absolutely can change. But, I'd be sure you get shoes you can try out and return/exchange after a few weeks to a month (all my LRS have that policy) so that if it takes a while to find the right fit you are good. I was lucky because the Brooks Adrenaline is a shoe for over pronators, but the Brooks Defyance is the same shoe just without a medial post for stability, so it actually felt the same on my foot, it just didn't correct for pronation. That was true at least at the time I made the change, assuming it is now too.

Thank you!! I was definitely an inexperienced runner when I first got tested. Let alone running in a treadmill which still terrifies me (I fee like I might fall off. Lol).

 

[*DisneyDreamer]

Well, I'm feeling a bit bummed out today. It's officially the first day of school in my area, but I don't have a job for it since the position I've had for the last couple years at my school was cut this year. And I haven't been able to find another position yet. So I got my mind off things by going over to the park for a run. The weather is really nice and the park wasn't too crowded since it's a weekday. So at least I feel good about getting that done.

ATTQOTD: I've never used a pacer for a race, since I've only done one half marathon and I'm not sure if 10Ks really have them that often. I was considering trying to use one for that half marathon, but the weather ended up being so warm that they cut the pacers since they didn't want anyone to worry about time and push too hard. And that's the race when they eventually ended up stopping the official timing too. I may consider using a pacer again though the next time I do a non-Disney half marathon if they have them.

As for yesterday's QOTD, I don't have my August miles logged, since I have been using the treadmill a lot recently. But for September, I think I'm going to start keeping track of all of my runs, outside or inside, since I am curious about my stats.

 

[sourire]

ATTQOTD: Have never used a pacer though that seems like a good idea so as to not go out too fast in the beginning. Has anyone been able to successfully stay with a pace group doing run/walk intervals? Do they have Galloway pace groups at Disney races?

 

[cburnett11]

QOTD: Have you ever utilized a pace group and how did it go? Did you stick with it, did it help you or would running solo have benefited you more? Has anyone been a pacer?

I've never tried a pace group. Here are the 2 times I've even paid attention to a pace group in a race.

1) Last November I did a half marathon. It was part of a full marathon... in fact the full was just 2 loops of the course. Anyways, this was supposed to be a bit of a test prior to my first marathon (Jan 2016 WDW). I saw that they had a 345 marathon pacer. While I wanted to run a 345 marathon in January (I didn't meet that goal), I figured I'd run the half a little quicker than that pace as my previous halves had been 147 to 149. So I internally "scoffed" at going with them even though the idea of a pace group intrigued me. Well.... I went out too fast on a course riddled with hills the first 6 to 7 miles. Somewhere around mile 9, I noticed this pace group in my rear view mirror. I also could tell they were closing in on me. Somewhere around mile 10 or 11 they caught up to me. They were having a lot of fun. They were encouraging other runners around them. The pacer had a speaker attached to a backpack of some sort playing some fun music. I was not having fun. I was just hanging my head. I told myself I'd regroup, keep them in my sight, and just crush them at the end of my race. That didn't happen.

2) At the WDW marathon in January. One of the pacers passed me at around mile 15. I don't recall which group it was. In fact it wasn't even a group. It was just the pacer. I just remember it was a pace group I didn't want to pass me. I again told myself I'd regroup (on this overpass) and then keep her in my sights for the remainder of the race. LOL... yeah that didn't happen.

I'd consider starting the race with a pace group to keep myself from going out quickly, but other than that I sorta enjoy the running solo thing.

 

[surfde22]

QOTD: Have you ever utilized a pace group and how did it go? Did you stick with it, did it help you or would running solo have benefited you more? Has anyone been a pacer?

I ran a 10k earlier this year with a pace group. I was running with the 8:00/mile pacer. The race was crowded at the start and our first mile was at about 8:12. The pacer then tried to correct all of that last time in the next mile so we ran the second one at 7:44, which was also into the wind and had the one big uphill on the course. This was a bit faster than I was looking to run and took more out of me than expected. I was able to stick with him until about the 5 mile mark. By then I had fallen slightly behind hitting the 5 mile mark at 40:20, before losing it in the last 1.2 miles. I think running solo I would've been better off. My pace would've been more consistent and I would've more gradually recovered any lost time. I ended the day with an 8:20 average, but feel like I could've been better.

 

[CheapRunnerMike]

QOTD: Have you ever utilized a pace group and how did it go? Did you stick with it, did it help you or would running solo have benefited you more? Has anyone been a pacer?

Only time I ever used a pace group was WDW Marathon in 2015 when attempting to BQ. The fastest pace group at WDW is 3:05 and I wanted to shoot for sub-3. They went out pretty fast from the get-go and I let them get out of sight by design. My goal was to catch up to them around 5K in...my wife saw them go through at the Ticket & Transportation Centre and she was worried because I was behind them. I caught them at the tunnel under Seven Seas Lagoon just before the Contempoary and ran with them until 11 miles or so, just a wee bit before heading into Animal Kingdom. Like others have said it really helped me keep my pace in check and it turned out to be the most perfect marathon I have ever run, with the last 5K far and away my fastest (under 20 minutes!). I should probably consider a pace group about 5 minutes slower than my goal next time I try to BQ!

 

[disneydaydreamer33]

ATTQOTD: I have never run with an official pacing group, but one half marathon I ran was with my husband's cousin (who is a much more experienced and better runner than I am). She acted as my pacer and would tell me when a mile was a bit too fast to sustain our goal, or really motivating me to push at the end of the race. That race ended up being my 1:57 something half marathon and my long standing PR I'm fascinated by these answers though. I can see the benefits (not going too fast at the start, having a fun supportive group helping you along). But I can also see the draw backs (if the pacer is inconsistent, or if listening to your body alone will give you the best results). I'm not sure if my half marathon this October has pacing groups, but I may start out with one now.

 

[keahgirl8]

So, question for those of you that have dealt with plantar fasciitis...

I swear this training season is cursed for me, but anyway. I noticed about a week or so ago that my right heel was sore and felt almost bruised. I didn't recall doing anything to hurt it, but mostly wrote it off as some minor injury. The past week the pain has increased some and I've started to notice it some in my left foot as well (though not as bad). After doing some reading about it and really assessing my symptoms (worse in the mornings when I first get up or when I first stand and walk after sitting - pain improves after taking some steps. Doesn't hurt much while running, but kicks in pretty quickly after stopping), I'm pretty sure I'm dealing with plantar fasciitis. It's very tolerable right now, but I'm not in a place to stop training right now, so resting it is out for me at the moment.

So yesterday I started doing some rolling of the heel and arch with a frozen water bottle. Also did some calf stretches and then did a towel stretch at night before bed and this morning before getting up. These all did seem to give me some relief. Also doing some anti-inflammatories. I'm hoping if I get on this quickly enough that I can keep it from worsening while continuing to train.

So, for those of you who have dealt with this, did you keep training while recovering? Aside from the things I mentioned above, did you do anything else to help with it? I was thinking of getting some inserts for my shoes (both running and work shoes - which are often loafers with poor sole support). Did you get any of those socks or boots to sleep in? Did that help? Thanks for any insights.

I did not. I know my experience is probably not typical, but I came back from last year's PHM weekend with PF, ITBS and bursitis. Sounds delightful, right? It was. Obviously, I didn't run at all. I didn't really do anything special other than stretching it, wearing good shoes all the time (even in the house), and Rock Tape. It actually went away in 3-4 weeks. I still feel it sometimes in the morning, but not often. When I do, it goes away while I'm walking around the house getting ready.

ATTQOTD: I've only ever ran with a pace group by accident. During the Chicago Women's half marathon last year I was running the 5k and it had a shared first 2 miles. I found myself with a half marathon pace group for about a one mile+ uphill section on Michigan Ave. before the split off and it was because I was running full out and they happened to be there and I couldn't pass them so I joined them. I yelled thank you to the sign holding lady but who knows if she heard me.

I got an email this week from my big 15k race about pace groups and I thought about it. But I'm wondering if that would go against my "try to run my race pace-blind and go by increasing effort" strategy. I can see the plus side that you have a support group and help staying at a pace, but then I can also see it maybe mentally messing with my head if I'm having a hard time staying with them or if I'm fighting the urge to pass them too early, etc. But maybe a few beginning miles to start out correctly isn't a bad idea though...if any of the groups matched what I'd want to start at.
Hmmm or maybe I should ignore the pace groups for my big A race coming up and maybe try one down the road for a not as important race just a fun experiment?

I had a similar experience! In the 2015 Princess, I sort of ended up near a pace group. I tried staying with them at first, but it was too much of a crowd for me. I really like having room when I run if possible. I kept passing them, then they'd catch up with me. Finally, I lost them around the castle when I was taking pictures. I never caught them again, because I got hurt and REALLY slowed down. That's my only experience with pacers. I can see where people would like them if they need encouragement, or if they are new to racing. The one I was running near was very rah rah and enthusiastic. I just think I'm more of a loner when I run, and that mass of people all going the same speed was making me crazy.

 

[roxymama]

I just think I'm more of a loner when I run, and that mass of people all going the same speed was making me crazy.

This is a great point. I have a natural tendency to want to "get around" or pass groups of people. I'm fine hanging behind one or two people for long stretches but get itchy when I feel "blocked." And I'm not sure I could run with a group without pre-race practice. I never thought about that...but maybe it would drive me crazy? I think one day I'll try it out on a day when I don't care about my final time.

 

[BuckeyeBama]

So, question for those of you that have dealt with plantar fasciitis...

I swear this training season is cursed for me, but anyway. I noticed about a week or so ago that my right heel was sore and felt almost bruised. I didn't recall doing anything to hurt it, but mostly wrote it off as some minor injury. The past week the pain has increased some and I've started to notice it some in my left foot as well (though not as bad). After doing some reading about it and really assessing my symptoms (worse in the mornings when I first get up or when I first stand and walk after sitting - pain improves after taking some steps. Doesn't hurt much while running, but kicks in pretty quickly after stopping), I'm pretty sure I'm dealing with plantar fasciitis. It's very tolerable right now, but I'm not in a place to stop training right now, so resting it is out for me at the moment.

So yesterday I started doing some rolling of the heel and arch with a frozen water bottle. Also did some calf stretches and then did a towel stretch at night before bed and this morning before getting up. These all did seem to give me some relief. Also doing some anti-inflammatories. I'm hoping if I get on this quickly enough that I can keep it from worsening while continuing to train.

So, for those of you who have dealt with this, did you keep training while recovering? Aside from the things I mentioned above, did you do anything else to help with it? I was thinking of getting some inserts for my shoes (both running and work shoes - which are often loafers with poor sole support). Did you get any of those socks or boots to sleep in? Did that help? Thanks for any insights.

I kept training through bad pf last year and ended up with a broken foot.