The Learning Curve

[handicap18]

I'm embarassed to admit that I just yesterday realized that the aperature opening of the lens is actually limited by...the lens itself. Gee, what a novel concept. So, the lens that's currently on my camera is a Nikon 18-135mm 1:3.5-5.6G ED. So does this mean that at 18mm, the aperature is at 3.5, at 135 it's at 5.6 and in between those focal lengths it's somewhere between 3.5 and 5.6??? If this is all true, then can someone explain to me what happened yesterday when I was playing around with both shutter and aperature priority and definitely had the aperature setting on the camera above and below the values on the lens? Does it max out at 5.6? What about when I had it at f9 or f11? I'm so confused.

Along those lines, if one purchases a prime lens (like the 50mm 1.8d that I'm hoping to buy soon), how does that work when the camera tries to set an aperature in shutter priority mode. Will it ALWAYS be 1.8? Can the aperature opening be smaller if you want, but not larger than the value listed on the lens (like if it were 3.5, you could do 5.6 but not 1.8)?

Have I confused you enough with my questions?

aripantaloon, f/stops are fractions. So just like 1/2 is bigger than 1/4th, f/2 is wider than f/4. So at 18mm the widest your lens will go is f/3.5, however it can close to as small as f/22. The small end is also variable in that at 135mm it will close to as small as f/36. People rarely use f/stops this small as it can take away from image quality.

As for your question re: the f/1.8; the camera will always give you a "correct exposure" based on the light that is being read by the meter. So if your in shutter priority at 1/60th and it says that f/5.6 is correct, then thats what it will give you. If you switch to 1/30th then it will change the aperture to f/8, if you switch to 1/125th then it will change to f/4. If f/5.6 is the widest the lens will allow, then it will stay at f/5.6, the reading in the viewfinder and on the LCD will show LO and the meter reading in your view finder will show that the image will be underexposed.

 

[handicap18]

Stories: Why did you buy a dSLR?

I took photography classes in high school and got hooked on slr's. I bought my first slr in the late 80's. In '02 I went digital with a PnS and used it a little less that 4 years. We went to Disney in Nov '05 and I took my film slr along with the digital PnS. I only took 3 rolls of film, but ran into a bunch of people that had the digital rebel. When I got the film back I liked the pics better than those taken with the PnS. When Nikon first came out with the digital slr's I had longed to get one, but those were the $4000 bodies. After going to Disney and then doing some research on Nikon's dSLR's I found they had earlier in the year come out with the D50. Entry level and affordable. I WAS IN!! I turned in some old saving bonds and bought myself a new camera. I haven't put it down since. I'm at around 13,000 shutter clicks in just over 2 years.

I've learned a lot and am always learning. Its a never ending process.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

Good stories, all.

I hope nobody feels too embarrassed to share their "dumb newbie" stories. God knows I have lots. It'd be fun to hear them, so do share.

I never took a photography class, and I didn't know anyone who used an SLR. In 1991 I began to learn basic photography principles and considered buying an SLR, but didn't think I could learn it on my own. I was happy for many years with an automatic 35mm, followed by two point and shoot digitals. I started hanging out here and bought a bridge camera in 2006 as I was still too intimidated to go for the dSLR. In the meantime, I began to learn once and for all what photography was all about.

Once I became confident enough that it was something I could do, I decided to finally buy a dSLR. One thing that concerned me, though, was carrying it around, as I'm someone who keeps my camera in my pocketbook. It made sense to go for a Canon since I was accustomed to the S3 IS, but I really liked the smaller/lighter feel, and the features and controls of the Olympus, so that's what I bought. I went a lot by instinct and I'm happy with my choice.

What bugged me when I first started using the S3, and is bugging me now, is that annoying Learning Curve. I rode it out on the S3 and finally began getting some great shots, but I'm back where I was in 06, feeling a little overwhelmed as a newbie again. I know it'll get better, but in the meantime it's sometimes difficult, even though I'm beginning to get some shots I'm fairly pleased with. Last night I was at my son's baseball practice and I pulled out my camera and it wouldn't fire except on Auto. I knew it was a focus issue but I couldn't figure out exactly what it was. I was a little embarrassed so I just put it away. Fortunately, that's happened only rarely. Another time when I'd dragged two families down to a nearby lighthouse after dinner to get some sunset pictures and we were freezing our butts off; whatever I was doing wasn't right and it wouldn't fire. I could go on, but you get the picture. I know it's me....

I've bought a bunch of books that I've been reading and I'm getting the idea, absolutely. It's just applying those ideas to the camera and shooting sessions. I also just recently picked up my manual for the first time. I know myself and I know I had to understand basic principles before I could make sense of that. I did learn a few things I didn't realize (and I'm even more impressed with the camera now). So it's coming together, albeit slowly.

 

[aripantaloon]

aripantaloon, f/stops are fractions. So just like 1/2 is bigger than 1/4th, f/2 is wider than f/4. So at 18mm the widest your lens will go is f/3.5, however it can close to as small as f/22. The small end is also variable in that at 135mm it will close to as small as f/36. People rarely use f/stops this small as it can take away from image quality.

As for your question re: the f/1.8; the camera will always give you a "correct exposure" based on the light that is being read by the meter. So if your in shutter priority at 1/60th and it says that f/5.6 is correct, then thats what it will give you. If you switch to 1/30th then it will change the aperture to f/8, if you switch to 1/125th then it will change to f/4. If f/5.6 is the widest the lens will allow, then it will stay at f/5.6, the reading in the viewfinder and on the LCD will show LO and the meter reading in your view finder will show that the image will be underexposed.

I wasn't sure how to reconcile your first paragraph with what I bolded from the second one. The f/3.5 and f/5.6 on my lens - do those show the absolute largest and smallest apertures that the lens will allow - at any focal length? If so, then I understand what you are saying. If not, then how do I find out the upper and lower bounds. I did see LO and Hi a couple of times when I was using the dial to see how the number changed as I would adjust the shutter speed during my little experiment yesterday.

 

[Master Mason]

Last night I was at my son's baseball practice and I pulled out my camera and it wouldn't fire except on Auto. I knew it was a focus issue but I couldn't figure out exactly what it was. I was a little embarrassed so I just put it away. Fortunately, that's happened only rarely. Another time when I'd dragged two families down to a nearby lighthouse after dinner to get some sunset pictures and we were freezing our butts off; whatever I was doing wasn't right and it wouldn't fire. I could go on, but you get the picture. I know it's me....

Pea,

Was it hunting for focus? My camera will not fire if it doesn't have focus lock. One way around that is to switch to manual focus

 

[Pea-n-Me]

Was it hunting for focus? My camera will not fire if it doesn't have focus lock. One way around that is to switch to manual focus

I believe it was. I will give that a try next time, thanks. I need to get better about which focus to use and when.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

MontanaZoo, beautiful horse picture!

danauk, congrats on getting your camera today!

 

[handicap18]

I wasn't sure how to reconcile your first paragraph with what I bolded from the second one. The f/3.5 and f/5.6 on my lens - do those show the absolute largest and smallest apertures that the lens will allow - at any focal length? If so, then I understand what you are saying. If not, then how do I find out the upper and lower bounds. I did see LO and Hi a couple of times when I was using the dial to see how the number changed as I would adjust the shutter speed during my little experiment yesterday.

Try doing this to see for yourself.

Turn the camera on and put it on Aperture Priority. Zoom all the way out to 18mm and set the f/stop to f/3.5. Now adjust the aperture till it stops to see how small it goes, it will go to f/22. Now from there if you zoom out to 135mm it will still say f/22. From here you can continue up to f/36. Now leave it at f/36, but zoom back out to 18mm. The camera will automatically change the f/stops as you zoom out.

The lens only shows the widest possible f/stop at the widest and tightest focal length. You'll see on the lens itself, underneith where it says Nikon DX, AF-S Nikkor 18-135mm 1:3.5-5.6G ED. the 1:3.5-5.6 is the aperture range at the the 18 & 135mm respectively. I wouldn't worry about the the big numbers as (again looking at fractions) they are very small and you wont use them much if at all. Typically f/4 to f/11 are used most as this is usually the "sweet spot" for most lenses (meaning where they are the sharpest).

Another experiment to try. Zoom out to 18mm and in Aperture priority make the f/stop f/3.5. Now slowly zoom in to 135mm. You will see the camera will automatically adjust the f/stop to the widest possible for that focal length. At 70mm it will reach f/5.6. From 70mm to 135mm the widest for this lens.

Hopefully I'm not confusing you any more. If so, keep asking and once you get the understanding of how the lens works, then you can apply that to how it effects the pictures you take.

 

[handicap18]

Pea-n-Me,

if your interested, the next time I do a photo shoot in the Boston area I can let you know and your more than welcome to join us. Sometimes some hands on work with others can help too.

 

[aripantaloon]

Try doing this to see for yourself.

Hopefully I'm not confusing you any more. If so, keep asking and once you get the understanding of how the lens works, then you can apply that to how it effects the pictures you take.

I haven't had time to actually do this yet, but this REALLY helped me!! Definitely didn't confuse me any more. Thank you!!

Pea-n-Me,

if your interested, the next time I do a photo shoot in the Boston area I can let you know and your more than welcome to join us. Sometimes some hands on work with others can help too.

I think I replied to you in another thread, but I'm also in the Boston area. I'm in Arlington. If there's room for one more, I'd love an invite.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

Pea-n-Me,

if your interested, the next time I do a photo shoot in the Boston area I can let you know and your more than welcome to join us. Sometimes some hands on work with others can help too.

Sounds good. Let us know.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

(Thought I'd post these from time to time. People new to the thread, please post yours anytime.)

When you first got your dSLR, how did you go about learning to use it?

Include any tools that you used. Did you just wing it? How many of you read your manuals before shooting? Books/DVDs you found helpful? Did you take a class or have someone help you? Let us know!

 

[DebºoºS]

Stories: Why did you buy a dSLR?
Trips to WDW with my Nikon 35mms,assorted lenses, up to 20 rolls of film was getting tiresome. Processing, scanning, printing . As soon as I could I got a digital. My first digital was a Sony Mavica floppy disc. Still takes great pics.Then I got a Nikon digital 3100 then a 3200. Great cameras but I couldn't use all the wonderful lenses I'd collected over the years. DH surprised me with the Nikon D200 and a few new lenses.
When you first got your dSLR, how did you go about learning to use it?
Read everything I could including the manual. I had already done quite a bit of research before and knew what the camera could do. It's a matter of learning how to do it with this camera. Digital isn't too different from 35mm. The basics are the same.
Online resouces
Photocamel
Nikonians.

 

[ukcatfan]

Olympus just came out with a new 25mm f2.8 "pancake lens" on one of their newer models which I'm curious about. (Definitely want "something" before my next Disney trip!)

If you are wanting it for dark rides, then consider something with a wider aperture than f/2.8. IMO f/2 is a bare minimum, but even at f/1.4 there will be challenges.

I have been tinkering with DSLR's for about a year now and can truly say that I am an amature with hopes of progressing into atleast freelance photography. Right now though I am debating on which system to invest into and stick with.

It would depend on what your subject normally is. If you are talking about something fast paced like action sports, then Nikon and Canon are your best bet right now. They have the top end models with the really fast burst rates. If that is not important, then your possibilities are more open. It also depends on how far you want to go as well. If you are never going to go to a top of the line model, then about any brand will do. Then think about the lenses available for the brands to make sure that what you want is covered at the right price.

I have a Canon IS Zoom EF 70-300 and a Canon Lens EF 50mm. Have been thinking about getting the Canon close up lens and/or the Tamron 1.4x Teleconverter. My photos usually are nature photos and the zoo animals so almost exclusively outdoors.

Be sure that the teleconverter will work with your lenses. It should with the 50mm, but if the zoom lens is not f/2.8 throughout the range, it will not likely work. Also, some lenses will not mount properly on teleconverters.

Kevin

 

[mom2mykids]

I'm on board! Just received my Sony A300 yesterday and was out playing today. I'll have to go back a read the other pages. I hope I can find a block of time soon to just sit, play and read the manual! LOL

 

[MontanaZoo]

Be sure that the teleconverter will work with your lenses. It should with the 50mm, but if the zoom lens is not f/2.8 throughout the range, it will not likely work. Also, some lenses will not mount properly on teleconverters.

Kevin

Thanks for the info, I'm glad I mentioned it!

 

[Pea-n-Me]

If you are wanting it for dark rides, then consider something with a wider aperture than f/2.8. IMO f/2 is a bare minimum, but even at f/1.4 there will be challenges.

Shoot, you mean the pancake lens won't work? I was intrigued.

But thanks for the information. I do want to be able to get some decent low light Disney shots. I guess I'm looking at something like this then? (BTW, is a macro lens only for macro photography? Or should I say, what's the difference between a f1.8 macro lens and an f1.8 non-macro lens?)

I'm on board! Just received my Sony A300 yesterday and was out playing today.

Congrats! Let's see some pictures!

You too, Danauk!

 

[handicap18]

I haven't had time to actually do this yet, but this REALLY helped me!! Definitely didn't confuse me any more. Thank you!!

I think I replied to you in another thread, but I'm also in the Boston area. I'm in Arlington. If there's room for one more, I'd love an invite.

I'm glad to read that it helped. I did get a bit long winded.

I'll keep both you and Pea-n-Me in mind the next time we head out for a photo shoot. Not sure when, but usually its on a Sat a little before sunset.

 

[MontanaZoo]

When you first got your dSLR, how did you go about learning to use it?

Photo books, camera manual, a week on the river with no distractions and tons of photo ops.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/juliez_pics/887937784/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/juliez_pics/879481446/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/juliez_pics/828724353/

Here's the whole set.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/juliez_pics/sets/72157600972694600/

 

[MarkBarbieri]

That makes it sound like I do know how to use it. I've had SLRs for 20 years, DSLRs for 6 years, and my current camera for 3 years. I'm still learning all the time.

The approach I take is pretty simple, I read, look, and practice. I read the manual, books, websites, forums, etc. I talk to other shooters. I'm a member of a photography club. I go to workshops. While I'm doing all this, I look for things that I don't know or haven't tried. Then I try them.

So my simple advice to people learning is to pick one thing - aperture, ISO, using a polarizer, shooting a sunrise, shooting your dog, capturing a sense of motion, whatever - then practice that one thing until you feel you understand it. Then move on to something else. Slowly but surely, it will start making sense.

I guess the other important thing is to keep trying to understand why things are the way they are. Read, make personal "theories", test your "theories." It's hard to learn just by reading and hard to learn just by playing. It's the repeated combination of instruction and practice that works.

So how long does it take to master a camera? I couldn't say. Maybe I'm slow, but I haven't done it yet. I don't think that there has been a month where I paid attention and didn't learn something new.