*The Dave Ramsey 'Baby Steps' Thread*

[FreeTime]

@WDW_fan_in_TX you mentioned not eating leftovers. This is ringing a bell to me that w have already went around and around about this on this thread. If you refuse to eat leftovers then make less. I believe the suggestion above to make everything on Sunday for the week was mentioned to you also before and you felt that it was like having leftovers and you won’t freeze your food. You have to get the eating out under control. These are the ways to do it.

I think you need to ask yourself are you really ready to tackle your debt and no longer live paycheck to paycheck or do you just want to continue saying why you can’t? I say these things with love. You need to be willing to try.

 

[ThereYouSeeHer]

Thanks. I will check into it. The stuff we buy is like $32 for 32 rolls at Sam's, and that lasts us a month. It's $15 for 12 rolls at Walmart. Just to check, I just checked Walgreens, and it's $18 for 12 rolls there. So seems like Sams is best choice for that. Plus, we bulk buy other stuff too that's cheaper like cases of water. But I am going to start checking into getting some paper products at Walgreens. Kroger and Tom Thumb are too far away to buy cold stuff, as they're about 15 minutes one way away from where we live. So I can't buy the cold stuff there. But for sure can check for paper products, toiletries, etc.

Just some things to consider...

Cases of water when tap water is free? I get it, I like to keep a bottle of water in my purse because a thermos doesn't fit. But, we still use a water filter at home and reusable filtered water bottles on the go.

Also, we live rurally and travel 45 minutes in one direction to our preferred store. 15 minutes is nothing. We pack a cooler with ice packs and survive.

Your situation requires some serious personal reflection and evaluation of how small choices that seem insignificant add up to the place you find yourself today. I know it's hard, I know it takes time, but it seems like there is a disconnect with the reality of the situation and your perception of it. I speak from personal and familial experience--broke people don't buy, pay for, or experience many of the things you are spending your money on. They take calculators into the store to make sure they don't spend more than the few dollars they walked in with. They go without food. They go without YouTube, and Amazon, and entertainment, etc. You are living on a razor's edge with no margin or buffer, but the actions taken don't match the urgency of the situation.

Everyone here is seriously rooting for you! You can do hard things, you can say no to yourself and others, and you can do this!

 

[WDW_fan_in_TX]

Since I made those comments (I think in the meal prep section), we've gotten better about eating food leftover. We made enchladas on Saturday and ate them Sunday night, Monday for lunch and Monday night before finally throwing the little bit that was left away. But we ate 4 meals on just a few bucks (probably $15 total for the entree). So yes, we eat leftovers. And we've really cut down on food waste by just buying every 5 or so days as we need. Yes, ready to make change, and we have. Only eating out basically once as a couple (on Sundays after church with friends) then whatever I had to do for work. As I said, we go out probably 2x-3x per week and have meetings at lunch, but we have to buy our own. Changes have been made, and I've tried to explain why stuff can't happen for whatever reason (we've shopped all of our bills around), and I'm actively looking for a second job. Hopefully can find one by the end of the month. No excuses. Just ready and willing to change.

@WDW_fan_in_TX you mentioned not eating leftovers. This is ringing a bell to me that w have already went around and around about this on this thread. If you refuse to eat leftovers then make less. I believe the suggestion above to make everything on Sunday for the week was mentioned to you also before and you felt that it was like having leftovers and you won’t freeze your food. You have to get the eating out under control. These are the ways to do it.

I think you need to ask yourself are you really ready to tackle your debt and no longer live paycheck to paycheck or do you just want to continue saying why you can’t? I say these things with love. You need to be willing to try.

 

[WDW_fan_in_TX]

Thank you for the confinued support. I'm going to back out of this thread for a bit and see what changes can be made, where we can cut (and still have what we need and want) and just some things we can do differently. Hopefully by the time I come back in and post, I'll have found a second job. Going to put in an app on Lowe's website today as a matter of fact. So thank you for everything you and others have expressed over the last few pages. It's really opened my eyes to some stuff.

Just some things to consider...

Cases of water when tap water is free? I get it, I like to keep a bottle of water in my purse because a thermos doesn't fit. But, we still use a water filter at home and reusable filtered water bottles on the go.

Also, we live rurally and travel 45 minutes in one direction to our preferred store. 15 minutes is nothing. We pack a cooler with ice packs and survive.

Your situation requires some serious personal reflection and evaluation of how small choices that seem insignificant add up to the place you find yourself today. I know it's hard, I know it takes time, but it seems like there is a disconnect with the reality of the situation and your perception of it. I speak from personal and familial experience--broke people don't buy, pay for, or experience many of the things you are spending your money on. They take calculators into the store to make sure they don't spend more than the few dollars they walked in with. They go without food. They go without YouTube, and Amazon, and entertainment, etc. You are living on a razor's edge with no margin or buffer, but the actions taken don't match the urgency of the situation.

Everyone here is seriously rooting for you! You can do hard things, you can say no to yourself and others, and you can do this!

 

[barkley]

We have produce outlets near me that sell blemished and bruised produce for a fraction of what the big box stores sell.

we have bakery outlets-you can walk in there and pay 1/4 the price of most items identical to what is on the shelf at the stores across the street and it's not 'day old' it's overruns of products. they have their minimum run of each item and the stores order and if there's extra it's put in the outlet. bonus is you get a card and they punch it for every $10 spent. hit 10 punches and you get 10 items free (and we are talking good stuff-it's the company that makes Seattle sourdough products!).

We used to buy $0.22 bags of individual ramen noodles

heck yeah-ramen and we used to dress it up with whatever fresh or frozen veggies we had on hand. bonus if we had some eggs-we would hardboil a slice it on top.

our other 'in case of' we kept on hand was a couple of boxes of (bought on sale) 'tuna helper'-no, we are not fans of tuna casserole but if you leave it out it's basicly pasta alfredo. we were (still are) big fans of black beans so we would keep a bag on hand to let soak overnight and toss into the crockpot before we left for work. no special seasoning needed esp. if you (again on sale) keep a jar of salsa on hand to toss into the crockpot with the beans.

We don't buy much at Sams. We buy toilet paper and a couple of other things that we use more often and is cheaper to buy in bulk.

cray-cray I know BUT I did extensive price comparisons on toilet and other paper products and neither sam's nor bj's nor costco or any of the membership stores ever beat the regular periodic sale prices target does. look at their current ad b/c they are running one now-buy 3 toilet paper (or a combo of different paper or cleaning products) and they give you a $10 gift card. I do purchases when this deal is going (it happens every month or so) and then hang on to the gift card for the next time I purchase under the same offer (or you can hang on to them for groceries when you are out of $$$). the membership places will do their once or twice per year proctor and gamble deal where they do like $6.50 off but since a membership runs $65 a year unless you are buying more than 10 30 roll packs in a year you don't break even let alone save any $$$ (and my further cray-cray calculations shows our household of 3.5 uses right at 182 rolls per year so a household of 2 only buys 3 of those 30 packs annualy).

 

[JAM9842]

Thank you for the confinued support. I'm going to back out of this thread for a bit and see what changes can be made, where we can cut (and still have what we need and want) and just some things we can do differently. Hopefully by the time I come back in and post, I'll have found a second job. Going to put in an app on Lowe's website today as a matter of fact. So thank you for everything you and others have expressed over the last few pages. It's really opened my eyes to some stuff.

You can do this!!!!!!

 

[focusondisney]

The Disney trip is paid off. We used my DN's discounts and got the room for $230 total for 3 nights. Using her gues passes for park entry. We might still consider canceling, though, even though we'd lose $300. But we do have a trip coming up next summer for work. So I might can see if they'll let me extend the credit through then.

But you also just went to Chicago. And didn’t you got to WDW in the spring to visit the same niece? That adds up to a lot of money that could have probably paid off the credit cards. Travel should be totally eliminated until you’re out of debt.

Is there any possibility of finding cheaper housing? It sounds like you’re in a single family home, maybe renting an apartment would be a better option.

 

[afan]

Is there any possibility of finding cheaper housing? It sounds like you’re in a single family home, maybe renting an apartment would be a better option

I get the ideas and the points everyone has, most has all been shared on the debt dumpers thread and @WDW_fan_in_TX has made A LOT of changes to get to where they are now.

I know the mindset of DR is quite different from how many in DD does it, but how are they supposed to move when they have zero savings? I get the spending less but you generally need at least first mo and deposit. He's already said they need to work on their credit so I'm also not sure how this all is supposed to work.

Also, unless you can find a non corporate ran apartment, so a private landlord situation, there may not be anything cheaper.

I know the help is well meaning but it needs to be practical.

 

[QueenIsabella]

I get the ideas and the points everyone has, most has all been shared on the debt dumpers thread and @WDW_fan_in_TX has made A LOT of changes to get to where they are now.

I know the mindset of DR is quite different from how many in DD does it, but how are they supposed to move when they have zero savings? I get the spending less but you generally need at least first mo and deposit. He's already said they need to work on their credit so I'm also not sure how this all is supposed to work.

Also, unless you can find a non corporate ran apartment, so a private landlord situation, there may not be anything cheaper.

I know the help is well meaning but it needs to be practical.

You have to forgive some of us for not knowing what's on the Debt Dumpers thread. It's very long, and if I don't have any debt to dump--I don't--I don't feel I have a lot to offer on such a thread, so I don't follow it. I AM sympathetic, though--BTDT, just past it at this point in my life (where were you 30 years ago, when I needed you?)

 

[afan]

You have to forgive some of us for not knowing what's on the Debt Dumpers thread. It's very long, and if I don't have any debt to dump--I don't--I don't feel I have a lot to offer on such a thread, so I don't follow it. I AM sympathetic, though--BTDT, just past it at this point in my life (where were you 30 years ago, when I needed you?)

I don't expect others to know, that's why I said something

I think it's good to examine all possible ways to pay off debt but with that I think it's also helpful to remember that we all do it differently and do things people would have issues with. The end goal is what's important.

People here would have freaked out with things I still did while paying my debt off, but it's gone and my mental health is good because I didn't deprive myself of vacations, I just started making points work for me, but that uses credit cards.

I like reading this this to see what people do. I'll go back to lurking now

 

[ThereYouSeeHer]

most has all been shared on the debt dumpers thread

I know the help is well meaning but it needs to be practical.

I AM sympathetic, though--BTDT, just past it at this point in my life (where were you 30 years ago, when I needed you?)

I completely agree that advice needs to be practical and meet people where they are, and I am also extremely sympathetic. I think some of the frustration is that so many people have tried to help on so many different threads over so many years. At some point, something else needs to happen like marriage counseling and financial guidance from someone in their own personal life. There is something deeper going on here that might not be solved with online advice from internet strangers. For whatever reason, it's not working or it's working so slowly that lasting change isn't accumulating. It's easy to see a way out for others, but everyone has to see it for themself and obtain the knowledge and in-person support to get there.

 

[CoP Luv]

I will see if there's anywhere that offers the DR course, however, we're not switching churches. We absolutely love our church and are happy to go for the first time in probably 15+ years. We don't like missing. We're involved in choir, prayer group, bible study and church. It takes up Tuesday, Wednesday and Sunday, and we absolutely love it. But it also leaves me 3 other days (Monday, Thursday and Friday) to find a part time job for 10-12 hours per week, so that's a really good thing. I will see if we can do the DR thing on Youtube. Maybe it's a free class on there or something.

I know you are stepping out of the thread but if you see this, you do not have to switch churches if another church offers the Financial Peace University (Dave Ramsey course) class. I lead FPU at my home church and we have non-members all the time show up just because their home church didn't offer it. Our church does not require FPU attendees to switch churches or become members. We are just glad they found a local course option that fit their needs. So please, please, please look into this. Your DW would benefit from the community and listening to others that want to make a change.

 

[enzy65]

I don’t know much about the DR method except what I hear from my son and DIL. He needs a new car, he is driving the one he got at 16, he is now 28. But he can’t buy one because DR says you have to pay cash. Any insight on this would be helpful.

 

[ThereYouSeeHer]

I don’t know much about the DR method except what I hear from my son and DIL. He needs a new car, he is driving the one he got at 16, he is now 28. But he can’t buy one because DR says you have to pay cash. Any insight on this would be helpful.

Yes, so the goal is to stop acquiring new debt, pay off any debt you already have, and then never go into debt again (except for possibly a home).

For any critical issue that cannot wait, it's called Storm Mode where you pause the Baby Steps and stockpile cash. Once the purchase has been made with cash, you would resume whatever step you were on.

If it is urgent, and he is already to Baby Step 3 or beyond (no debt and an emergency fund), he can use the emergency fund.

If it is urgent, and he is only on Baby Step 1 or 2 (debt and virtually no money), it becomes a little harder. In situations where someone has truly run out of time and resources, they will sometimes go back into debt for a car, add the loan to the debt snowball of Baby Step 2, and just start again with the process of clearing debt.

 

[enzy65]

Yes, so the goal is to stop acquiring new debt, pay off any debt you already have, and then never go into debt again (except for possibly a home).

For any critical issue that cannot wait, it's called Storm Mode where you pause the Baby Steps and stockpile cash. Once the purchase has been made with cash, you would resume whatever step you were on.

If it is urgent, and he is already to Baby Step 3 or beyond (no debt and an emergency fund), he can use the emergency fund.

If it is urgent, and he is only on Baby Step 1 or 2 (debt and virtually no money), it becomes a little harder. In situations where someone has truly run out of time and resources, they will sometimes go back into debt for a car, add the loan to the debt snowball of Baby Step 2, and just start again with the process of clearing debt.

Thanks for the info, DR is not for me but my son and DIL are fully embracing it.

 

[barkley]

If it is urgent, and he is already to Baby Step 3 or beyond (no debt and an emergency fund), he can use the emergency fund.

Thanks for the info, DR is not for me but my son and DIL are fully embracing it.

DR is not entirely for us as well. I think some of his methods have merit while others can be short-sighted. with the example of a needed car purchase-we were in this situation just about 1 year ago this next month. I'm a big believer in having a healthy 'emegency fund' (6 months or better of monthly expenses). now, we could have paid cash outright for the new car we were looking at but to do so would have taken our emergency fund well below a single month's expenses. this makes me nervous. I also have our emergency fund in an interest earning account that's making 5.5%. since it was the end of the model year dealers were offering finance deals in the 3% and lower range (and with added price reduction incentives for financing). for us it was a no-brainer, we were not going to pay cash and (1) pay more for the vehicle, and (2) lose out on earning interest. yes (DR gasps) we have a car loan-and despite paying interest on it we are netting over 2 1/2% on that money sitting in the bank. it's going to be paid off VERY quickly (i'm making triple payments if not more each month) but I don't have to worry that if some other large system or appliance or expense comes up i'm sitting with next to nothing in my emergency fund and forced to use a credit card or some obscene in-store financing.

 

[enzy65]

DR is not entirely for us as well. I think some of his methods have merit while others can be short-sighted. with the example of a needed car purchase-we were in this situation just about 1 year ago this next month. I'm a big believer in having a healthy 'emegency fund' (6 months or better of monthly expenses). now, we could have paid cash outright for the new car we were looking at but to do so would have taken our emergency fund well below a single month's expenses. this makes me nervous. I also have our emergency fund in an interest earning account that's making 5.5%. since it was the end of the model year dealers were offering finance deals in the 3% and lower range (and with added price reduction incentives for financing). for us it was a no-brainer, we were not going to pay cash and (1) pay more for the vehicle, and (2) lose out on earning interest. yes (DR gasps) we have a car loan-and despite paying interest on it we are netting over 2 1/2% on that money sitting in the bank. it's going to be paid off VERY quickly (i'm making triple payments if not more each month) but I don't have to worry that if some other large system or appliance or expense comes up i'm sitting with next to nothing in my emergency fund and forced to use a credit card or some obscene in-store financing.

Thanks for sharing, we had to get a new roof, gutters and chimney this summer and that was not cheap. Decided to take a low interest loan from our CU. My son and DIL do have 1 nice car that they paid cash for from an inheritance, so that are hurting that bad.

 

[ThereYouSeeHer]

with the example of a needed car purchase-we were in this situation just about 1 year ago this next month.

Yeah, this has happened to us twice. The first time was early on in our Baby Steps, when we had recently gotten out of all debt except a house. However, we didn't have enough savings, and since we couldn't stockpile cash quickly enough, we ended up going back into debt. For us, it was so disappointing, but we were able to pay the car off in less than a year. We vowed to not let it happen again, and now over a dozen or so years later, that was still the last time we acquired new debt.

The second time was during the pandemic. This time, we had a fully funded emergency fund and used it. We've been living frugally the past few years to build the fund back up. Thankfully, no other emergencies happened during that time, so it was good that we drained our savings instead of going into debt. What would have happened if there was an emergency with no savings? I suppose we would have found some 0% APR or balance transfer offer and figured it out.

we are netting over 2 1/2% on that money sitting in the bank.

At least for savings that are kept in a CD or HYSA, they are generally subject to income tax, so that would further reduce any net gains. Everyone's tax situation might be different, though.

And this is where the Ramsey philosophy comes into play and where people disagree. For me personally, I wanted to remove myself from the game. I was done spending my mental energy on hunting down credit card offers and calculating net debt gains. I wanted to live a simple, cash-on-the-barrel existence. I don't want to pay a single dollar of interest to someone else, even if it means I missed out on some opportunity to game the system. As Dave says, the tortoise beats the hare every time. Consistent financial stewardship isn't flashy, but it will get you there!

 

[enzy65]

Interesting story I just remembered. We were at the corvette museum in KY a few years ago on a private tour, so we got to ask a lot of questions. I asked about when celebrities pick up their corvettes do they do it privately or the public museum delivery, the tour guide said a lot do it publicly and are so nice and interact with their fans. So he’s telling us all the recent celebrities he’d got to meet and he mentioned DR. My husband asked me isn’t that the financial guy who says to pay cash for cars. Me just SMH.

 

[QueenIsabella]

I don't expect others to know, that's why I said something

I think it's good to examine all possible ways to pay off debt but with that I think it's also helpful to remember that we all do it differently and do things people would have issues with. The end goal is what's important.

People here would have freaked out with things I still did while paying my debt off, but it's gone and my mental health is good because I didn't deprive myself of vacations, I just started making points work for me, but that uses credit cards.

I like reading this this to see what people do. I'll go back to lurking now

I, too, mostly lurk. I respect people who are trying to manage their finances better, and I like to keep my "frugal tools" sharp, so I'm always looking for ideas.

We're at the point where we have "enough"--not enough to spend like drunken sailors, but enough to live comfortably. I still try to save where I can, so I can spend on what matters TO ME--in my case, my kids' educations, and travel. Others might pick differently.

As a PP said, we also have a low-interest car loan. It made sense FOR US.

Part of what I think WDW_fan_in_TX seems to be missing is, the joy of frugality. Some people find joy in watching those credit card balances melt away. Some sleep well because their house is paid off. Personally, I love a good thrift store find--my son got a Dolce and Gabana bag, retail $160, for $20 NWT. He treasures that bag, and this is how you train up the next generation. I also love re-making leftovers--last night's roast chicken becomes tonight's chicken noodle soup, for pennies a serving, and my kids rave about it! (Bonus points if I make homemade bread to accompany it.)

My point is, there are different ways to achieve financial security. I'm all for supporting each other on the journey.