The Conservative - Liberal Debate Thread

[Laura]

I don't think I would be taking his word for gospel (no pun intended). Might have been a bit of paraphrasing going on, and/or a liberal does of editing.

I certainly hope so!

 

[Laura]

again, lack of understand about faith is going on here....you draw you own conclusions based on the introspection acheived during prayer based on your religous teachings...

No lack of understanding here. I was a Christian for many years and never heard God talking to me.

Prayer helps the person who prays, no doubt. It helps the person concentrate on the problem. But I never thought that God would speak directly to the President to tell him to do specific things. Prayer reveals what's already in the person's heart.

 

[TCPluto]

If God's talking to you, you're a prophet or a saint. Bush has shown himself to be neither. I think that little voice telling him to invade Iraq was Cheney, not God.

And I seem to understand Christianity better than many Christians do.

Really?? According to who?

 

[DisneyJosh]

um, based on his own credentials he set forth in his post about judging a politician based on his public belief in God

"You cannot separate church and state when you have leaders who publicly announnce they are getting their guidance from God."

thats exactly what Obama did in his speech today....

"my agenda" yes anyone who is interested can PM me for the StrollPatrolMom takes over the world club admission process....

oh back to the nonsense at hand, anyone who is suggested that Obama being a "devout" Christian and "praying to Jesus" every night is not a public proclamation of his Faith AND an indication he turns to God for guidance...is seriously needing a religion 101 class.

Once again, you just cannot comprehend what someone is saying. I will be happy to clarify it for you! By saying that you have an agenda, I am indicating that you are pushing and interjecting your conservative values into a conversation with the intention of persuading those who are reading this and/or making fun of another candidate. Do I need to clarify myself further?

 

[StrollPatrolMom]

So, if someone "guess[es]" something, it is not an assumption? Her assumption was that said poster was not an Obama supporter based on an earlier post that was completely misunderstood, as evidenced in said post and subsequent posts by the same user.

So, according to you, if you are "guess[ing]" something about someone, you are not telling the person you are addressing what they are and are not. Yeah, O.K. Your intentions are very transparent.

I'm still waiting for some clarification as to why exactly I'm not on point according to you...do I need to cite the quotes AGAIN? I can read and understand plain English....I think thats why they gave me a degree in said subject matter.

You can "interpret" the semantics behind what being "devout" Christian is and "praying to Jesus" every night means...but I actually think the church to which Obama belongs probably is more familiar with their own dogma than you are...

 

[crazyforgoofy]

again, lack of understand about faith is going on here....you draw you own conclusions based on the introspection acheived during prayer based on your religous teachings...

You've made judgments about where others get their understanding of things. From whence comes your authority? And please don't say God.

 

[SwedishMeatball]

Obama sounds a lot like Bush when it comes to faith. I'm sure some fanatical religious leaders will claim that Obama told them that God told him to pull out of Iraq.

 

[StrollPatrolMom]

Once again, you just cannot comprehend what someone is saying. I will be happy to clarify it for you! By saying that you have an agenda, I am indicating that you are pushing and interjecting your conservative values into a conversation with the intention of persuading those who are reading this and/or making fun of another candidate. Do I need to clarify myself further?

Yes, because you do not have a clue about my "conservative" values...I was making one point about one post based on factual supporting information, thus far I've heard from you gross overgeneralizations mischaracterizing my position...

 

[TCPluto]

Once again, you just cannot comprehend what someone is saying. I will be happy to clarify it for you! By saying that you have an agenda, I am indicating that you are pushing and interjecting your conservative values into a conversation with the intention of persuading those who are reading this and/or making fun of another candidate. Do I need to clarify myself further?

What she did was point out that Obama has said he is guided by the same god and prays to that god every day for guidance.

How is that advancing an agenda, pointing out the facts?

 

[yeartolate]

I don't think I would be taking his word for gospel (no pun intended). Might have been a bit of paraphrasing going on, and/or a liberal does of editing. Or, none of it was true.

I believe the White House comment was that the above quote was a "figure of speech"

Another episode of "what the President meant to say........"

Sorry, but he said God told him to go to war. Ewwwww. Isn't that what the Taliban and Al-Qaeda say?

 

[Laura]

Really?? According to who?

God told me!

No seriously, from some of the ignorant stuff I've seen professed Christians post on the DIS over the years, it's not a difficult conclusion to come to.

 

[eclectics]

" You cannot separate church and state when you have leaders who publicly announnce they are getting their guidance from God."

Most every President we've ever had believed in God and prayed for guidance, yet they still somehow managed to keep their personal beliefs out of the decisions they made for the benefit of all of us, even though the present one is trying his darndest to be the first to violate that. Sorry, but your statement makes no sense whatsoever.

 

[DisneyJosh]

Yes, because you do not have a clue about my "conservative" values...I was making one point about one post based on factual supporting information, thus far I've heard from you gross overgeneralizations mischaracterizing my position...

Oh, let me tell you honey, your conservative values are quite apparent and are evidenced by just about every post you make.

What she did was point out that Obama has said he is guided by the same god and prays to that god every day for guidance.

How is that advancing an agenda, pointing out the facts?

So, you're saying there is no difference in praying to God and professing that you've been "told" by God to do something like go to war? I find that quite funny to be honest.

 

[SwedishMeatball]

So, you're saying there is no difference in praying to God and professing that you've been "told" by God to do something like go to war? I find that quite funny to be honest.

Why did you put the word told in quotes??

 

[Laura]

Most every President we've ever had believed in God and prayed for guidance, yet they still somehow managed to keep their personal beliefs out of the decisions they made for the benefit of all of us, even though the present one is trying his darndest to be the first to violate that. Sorry, but your statement makes no sense whatsoever.

I remember when Reagan died, his son delivered a eulogy. In it he stated that his father did not wear his faith on his sleeve to gain political advantage. People thought he was alluding to Bush in that sentence, chiding him for using his faith to get that advantage. I saw an interview of Ronnie where he said that wasn't his intent during the eulogy, but clearly yes, that applied to Dubya. It's a shame that anyone's religion has to play a part in this election. Obama has been trying to put down that rumor that he's a Muslim. He has to because adhering to Islam is seen by so many in the US as the equivalent to being a terrorist.

 

[DisneyJosh]

Why did you put the word told in quotes??

In the programme Elusive Peace: Israel and the Arabs, which starts on Monday, the former Palestinian foreign minister Nabil Shaath says Mr Bush told him and Mahmoud Abbas, former prime minister and now Palestinian President: "I'm driven with a mission from God. God would tell me, 'George, go and fight those terrorists in Afghanistan.' And I did, and then God would tell me, 'George go and end the tyranny in Iraq,' and I did."

George W. Bush claims he was told by God to fight the terrorists in Afghanistan, and end the tyranny in Iraq.

 

[TCPluto]

So, you're saying there is no difference in praying to God and professing that you've been "told" by God to do something like go to war? I find that quite funny to be honest.

I think whenever a religious person prays to his/her God for guidance on an issue, then come to a conclusion they believe is correct, they beleive it's an answer from God and they may relate that as "God has spoken" to them.

I don't think people mean it in the most literal sense of an actual conversation.

 

[StrollPatrolMom]

Most every President we've ever had believed in God and prayed for guidance, yet they still somehow managed to keep their personal beliefs out of the decisions they made for the benefit of all of us, even though the present one is trying his darndest to be the first to violate that. Sorry, but your statement makes no sense whatsoever.

thats not MY statement

I was quoting your liberal partner in crime.

but thanks for coming here and making my point for me. I appreciate it, i've been having a little trouble doing so myself.

 

[SwedishMeatball]

George W. Bush claims he was told by God to fight the terrorists in Afghanistan, and end the tyranny in Iraq.

I never heard him say that. I read that Palestinian leaders claim he said it to them in private, but they certainly aren't a trustworthy source in my opinion. There are quotes from Bob Woodward's book that I suppose could be attempted to be spun either way, just as some might try to do with Obama.

 

[StrollPatrolMom]

Oh, let me tell you honey, your conservative values are quite apparent and are evidenced by just about every post you make.


So, you're saying there is no difference in praying to God and professing that you've been "told" by God to do something like go to war? I find that quite funny to be honest.

well, my feminist values are offended by YOU calling me "honey".

and furthermore, please elaborate since you're spot on on making gross mischaracterizations of my positions what exactly constitutes "conservative" values...it must be that I'm pro-choice, support civil unions, and had a baby before I was married.