teacher myths

[Kath2003]

I tell my kids I live in the cupboard down the hallway (the youngest kids I teach are 6th graders...)!

I work long hours - 7:30am- 6pm M-F. I take work home also. I take 20 minutes for lunch. I can't take vacation at a time of my choosing, so air fares are always sky-high when we can travel. My partner has to travel at these times also because of my choice of career. I have days when I feel like I'm bashing my head against a brick wall. I have days when there's too much work. I have days when a student can drive me bonkers.

BUT: The pay isn't going to make me rich, but it makes me comfortable. I work with great people: adults and kids. I teach a subject I love. I also get 13 weeks vacation time per year, a pension and sick pay. I have more days when the kids are kind to each other, thank me for teaching them and make me laugh.

I would never complain about my job. The above is merely a comparison of the advantages and disadvantages of my job, and you could do this for any career.

I wouldn't want to do anything else right now.

 

[Acklander]

Why not? I am not a teacher (although my sister is). Why shouldn't we pay our educators to educate our children? What price tag or value do you put on the education of your children? We pay athletes millions of dollars a year but we don't want to pay our educators?

For every athlete that makes a million dollars a year, there are a millon athletes playing basketball for free on the corner. We only pay the very best of the best the huge amounts. I guess we do the same with education. The best of the best educators are writing books and wining nobel prizes or something.
In every field you're going to find an exception that will clean up as far as money is concerned, but they are the exception, not the rule.

 

[Scurvy]

The thing that confuses me is teachers get upset when people express negative thoughts about their jobs. But all I hear are negatives from teachers -- low pay, long hours, teaching to a test, hard to handle students and parents, no lunch breaks. Maybe one part of a sentence says "don't get me wrong, I love my job" and then the next three paragraphs go on about how horrible it is. And I'm supposed to feel, as a parent, that my child isn't picking up on all the negativity from their teachers? I'm supposed to assume that even though you're all obviously miserable, you're doing what's in the best interest of my child and giving it your all? Many of these posts come across as being bitter that they actually chose to be teachers. Am I to assume you didn't know about all the negatives before you chose this line of work? And are you telling me that the summers off were not a consideration when you chose teaching? What exactly drove you to teach and what keeps you there if you're so miserable?

I agree teachers' pay may not be what most would like, and I know they put in longer hours than just the classroom hours. I also realize you have your own families who have needs, but then get out and do something else if it's so horrible. If you come into the year with a chip on your shoulder the kids will pick up on that, especially in the upper grades.

The bolded confuses me. Do you hear teachers getting upset when people complain about the same negatives the teachers themselves are talking about? Because that wouldn't make any sense to me, either! (ETA - Never mind - I completely misread. I thought "their" meant the teachers jobs. Do teachers really get upset when other people complain about their own jobs? I haven't seen that, unless the people were complaining their jobs were worse than the teachers'.)

I think it makes sense that you'd hear more of the negatives than the positives, because how often does someone really go around bragging about how great their job is? Especially online, people tend to post about their jobs in order to vent. People wouldn't teach if they didn't want to, but it is a stressful job and sometimes they just have to get it all out somewhere. Better online than at school!

Plus, teachers tend to post these negatives in response to something else, especially on the Disboards. Most of the teachers who have been saying negative things on here in the last few days were responding to other posters who expect teachers to put in longer hours because "they only work 6 hours a day", or the people who think they earn too much, or those who say the job isn't hard. People have these misconceptions about teachers, and when we see them it's difficult not to spew all the negatives to try to make them understand the reality of teaching. No, it isn't all negative, but it isn't all positive, either. Most of the time it does at least all balance out and sometimes the positives do outweigh the negatives, thankfully. Of course explaining it to all the people who think they know all about the the subject rarely works. People have this vision of what they think teaching is, and most of them are never going to believe any differently - despite the fact that they themselves have never taught - even if all the teachers tell them otherwise.

 

[NotUrsula]

You are required by law to have a meal break. If you work 8 hours you need to have 2 fifteen minute breaks and one 30 min break. You might have had a "working" lunch but you are supposed to have a meal break.

Perhaps by state law where you are, but not Federal law. There is a widely-believed myth that the Fair Labor Standards Act requires those things, but it actually does not. http://www.dol.gov/elaws/esa/flsa/screen6.asp

Generally, the 30-minute meal break is usually not to be counted within paid time, so in most states if you get the meal break you are still on the clock for the full 8 hours, with your lunch break unpaid. Every place I have ever worked has made it a point to REQUIRE workers to take the unpaid lunch break in the middle of the day, so that they won't use the excuse of skipping lunch to leave early or arrive late. (Exempt, too -- it was always in the handbook that the workday was 8.5 hours including a 30-minute unpaid lunch period, and that if you took a longer lunch you needed to make up the add'l time before day's end.) As I've been exempt for years I take my lunch break whenever I want, but I'm actively working for at least 60 hours every week, so my employer doesn't much care about the lunch issue in my case.

Most teachers here do get their lunch period within paid time, but for those who teach in the elementary grades, it isn't free time, as they eat with their students and are expected to keep them out of trouble during lunch. When I was a kid our primary teachers were even expected to teach us table manners at lunch -- we were graded on it.

Oh, and about that combat pay -- I've known schools where teachers SHOULD get it. A couple of years ago DH was coaching a moot-court team in a urban high school when an alarm went off. The principal herded the guests into an inside room and told them to stay clear of the doors and hallway windows, and that he could not be responsible for their safety if they ventured into the hallways before the police issued an all-clear.

 

[SnowWhite607]

I just checked my district salary schedule....(south Louisiana)

Ranges from 44,000 (BA degree, no experience) up to 66,000 (PhD, 40 yrs experience)

When I started teaching, I made 19,000!! Salaries have certainly gone up for a new teacher since 1994!

 

[DawnM]

When I started teaching (mind you, 1989) I made $29K. Two years later we got pay cuts and my salary went down to $25K.

This was in Los Angeles, CA though and it was fine since I was either sharing an apt or renting a room from someone. If I had had a family to support there would have been no way!

Dawn

I just checked my district salary schedule....(south Louisiana)

Ranges from 44,000 (BA degree, no experience) up to 66,000 (PhD, 40 yrs experience)

When I started teaching, I made 19,000!! Salaries have certainly gone up for a new teacher since 1994!

 

[Michelle and crew]

For every athlete that makes a million dollars a year, there are a millon athletes playing basketball for free on the corner. We only pay the very best of the best the huge amounts. I guess we do the same with education. The best of the best educators are writing books and wining nobel prizes or something.
In every field you're going to find an exception that will clean up as far as money is concerned, but they are the exception, not the rule.

Exactly. Only the very best are paid that money.

 

[kwitcherkicken99]

Teachers get paid an upper middle-class wage.

My mother calculated her "hourly" wage her first year teaching and it came out to $0.13/hour by the time she counted her teaching hours, extra time grading, extra time prepping for the next day, etc. Granted that was 1973 but I can't imagine it's much more now, especially for new teachers.

 

[allison443]

My mother calculated her "hourly" wage her first year teaching and it came out to $0.13/hour by the time she counted her teaching hours, extra time grading, extra time prepping for the next day, etc. Granted that was 1973 but I can't imagine it's much more now, especially for new teachers.

Really? I'm sure it's much more now than .13 an hour.

Did you write that correctly?

 

[MELSMICE]

To lighten the thread a little, the myth that teachers live in closets is not true.

I had a little boy in my class once who thought I lived in the closet, lol.

LOL.......I'm not sure I thought my teachers lived in closets, but I was always surprised to see them outside of school.

Imagine my shock when I was grown with 3 kids & realized that my new neighbor's father was my 7th grade Earth Science teacher that I did not like at all & detested the class even more!

 

[Hoodie]

My mother calculated her "hourly" wage her first year teaching and it came out to $0.13/hour by the time she counted her teaching hours, extra time grading, extra time prepping for the next day, etc. Granted that was 1973 but I can't imagine it's much more now, especially for new teachers.

I hope your mom wasn't a math teacher.

There are 8760 hours in 1 non-leap year. If she earned $0.13/hour, by working every hour of the entire year, she only made $1,138.80.

I think she may be exaggerating a tad.

 

[MELSMICE]

Exactly. Only the very best are paid that money.

So what do some of you believe would be a fare wage to pay the people that not only educate our children, but also care for them between 180-190 days a year, 6 hours a day?

 

[PrincessMomto2]

The only problem I see with this thread is that some of these are "myths" in one district, but the "truth" in another.

Where I live, the teachers DO have powerful Unions. We call it the contract cycle. In the districts surrounding my house, you can be certain that each year will feature a lengthy contract dispute and/or strike in one of the those districts.

The most recent strike nearby featured the leader of the State Union coming in to run the show. It was obvious the motivation was more political than educational.

In addition the "myth" about salary can vary from place to place. Again, the surrounding districts where I live feature salaries that range from $40,000 all the way to $100,000+. So, why the (seemingly) obligatory work stoppages year-to-year?

Again, I'm only pointing this out, because where I live, I think the taxpayers are more than justified in starting to push for changes. These so-called "myths" are realities in areas where jobs are dwindling and people cannot afford to pay for these salaries and pension funds.

I totally agree with your point. In NJ it is the same thing extremely powerful unions. I think one of the myths stated here said that they do pay for their medical. Well not in our part of Jersey. It is nice to have 100% of your medical benefits covered not only while you are working but also when you retire. The salaries here can also range from 40k to over 100k. Lets not even mention superintendent salaries...

 

[Toad_Passenger]

So what do some of you believe would be a fare wage to pay the people that not only educate our children, but also care for them between 180-190 days a year, 6 hours a day?

A fair wage should be based upon what the tax base can afford. Continuing to watch Unions fight for wage increases in towns/districts where the population is decreasing due to job losses is a recipe for disaster. Where do they think the money is going to come from? The population is not an endless source of income. We're already seeing signs of the public education system starting to break State budgets.

I'm not saying things should be privatized/run like the corporate world, but at some point a cap needs to be set.

 

[Hoodie]

So what do some of you believe would be a fare wage to pay the people that not only educate our children, but also care for them between 180-190 days a year, 6 hours a day?

This is an interesting way to approach teacher salaries.

First, I think 6 hours is a false assumption, so let's go for 8 paid hours to compare it to a more standard non-teaching work day.

At 190 days, a full 8 hours, that's 1,520 hours a year.

So I went to OPM, which has a listing of government salaries, and to the Washington DC area because it has one of the highest adjustment for cost of living. Education level for a grade 9 is a Master's, so a bit above an entry level teaching position would technically be. A grade 14 is PhD+, experience, and usually top of the industry. These are the salaries that were recently reported as being well over the private sector.

Here's what those levels would make at those hours:

Grade 9 (DC) - $37.6k/year Grade 9(base) $30.3k/year

Grade 14 (DC) - $76k/year Grade 14 (base) $61.7 k/year

By these numbers, and the ones being tossed around here, it seems teacher salaries are actually comparable or even better than most other government salaries.

 

[Michelle and crew]

A fair wage should be based upon what the tax base can afford. Continuing to watch Unions fight for wage increases in towns/districts where the population is decreasing due to job losses is a recipe for disaster. Where do they think the money is going to come from? The population is not an endless source of income. We're already seeing signs of the public education system starting to break State budgets.

I'm not saying things should be privatized/run like the corporate world, but at some point a cap needs to be set.

I agree. A fair wage is what a community can afford. I worked for the county too, and my job was paid the same way.

Teachers are important. Are they more important that police officers who protect the children, or social workers who assure that they aren't abused, or fire fighters who save them? None of these jobs in our county pays great. If you want great you go into the private sector.

Do I think that the third grade teacher next door should be paid more than Eli Manning? No. Because I could go into that class and do the same job. I can't go onto that field and do his job.

 

[kwitcherkicken99]

Really? I'm sure it's much more now than .13 an hour.

Did you write that correctly?

She got a salary... that was a number for the hours she put in to work.

I hope your mom wasn't a math teacher.

There are 8760 hours in 1 non-leap year. If she earned $0.13/hour, by working every hour of the entire year, she only made $1,138.80.

I think she may be exaggerating a tad.

Maybe exaggerating a bit, but starting teacher salaries in the 70's was less than $8K/year and that was in CA. This is Indiana - we catch up slow.

 

[emma'smom]

No. Because I could go into that class and do the same job.

Here's the root of the problem, right here! The folks who "think" that anyone can teach! This is why teaching is devalued--- it's the folks who don't understand that teaching is a well-honed craft that requires knowledge of both content, pedagogical practice, and child development.

I value my children....thus I value there teachers. Why on earth would I leave my children (and their futures) in the hands of just anyone? I want well-prepared, highly-educated, thoughtful, dedicated, satisfied people working with my children. I want my children to be prepared to be tomorrow's leaders---that's why I trust them in the hands of good teacher's today.

To the folks who devalue teachers---check to see what your kids are doing in 20 years!

 

[golfgal]

Because the athletes are being paid from the huge amounts of money being generated by their companies.

Teachers are being paid out our pockets. And, at least in our area, the Unions cannot seem to realize that a tax-base can only support salaries at a certain level. If every 3-5 years the salary schedule is adjusted another 4%-5%, where does it end?

The salaries in our area have now hit the 6-figure mark. This is not because the teachers have gotten better, but because politics rule in our district, and we have some large Districts that the State Union uses as "benchmarks" for the rest of the State, so they will stage, basically, a large scale war in that District. Also these higher salaries have not equated to "better education" as the Union would like you to believe. Test scores, graduation rates, % attending colleges, has all stayed stagnant.

The question most people have is, "Where does it end?" We certainly cannot put a value on our childrens' education, but what happens when the taxes required to pay the teachers drops some of those children into the poverty zone? What's more important at that point, food on the table or some political agenda to get all of the teachers in the State a 6-figure income?

And this money comes from the money tree growing in the back yard of the office building . If no one went to the games or bought Nike shoes, athletes would NOT be making these huge salaries.

Schools make money through bonds yet for every "raise" the school needs it is a FIGHT. Look at how much gas has gone up in the past 5 years and how much of a school budget goes to transportation, yet people expect schools just to "make cuts" to handle the ever rising costs for everything. Go look at the post about the mom asking about having 2 sets of textbooks for her DD and pricing out USED textbooks and how much they cost. Have you seen jumps in your gas/electric bills, well so have the schools.

Our district is putting a bond referendum on the ballot this year because of the amount of funding the state cut to our (and every) district in our state. They did a survey to get ideas of preliminary support for this bond and 81.7% said they support the bond. It will work out to be an average of around $250/year/household so not huge but not small either. I am SO glad we live in a district that supports the schools because we have lived in areas that don't and it is night and day difference between the schools.

You keep complaining about a teacher with over 20 years of experience and a masters and possibly a PhD making $100,000-for that level of education that salary is not out of line. I also ask you, what is the average cost of a house in your area? How much does a starting teacher make and can that salary support living in your area?

 

[golfgal]

She got a salary... that was a number for the hours she put in to work.


Maybe exaggerating a bit, but starting teacher salaries in the 70's was less than $8K/year and that was in CA. This is Indiana - we catch up slow.

I looked it up, minimum wage in 1975 was $2.10/hour. Your 13 cents/hour might not be all that far off if you are looking at TAKE HOME pay when you subtract taxes, union dues, pension funding, etc. and then figure an hourly wage (which isn't totally accurate but it makes a point).