Stressing about next year's placement

[ecki]

A bit of background here, since I'm new.....Kayla's been in an Easter Seals self contained full day/5 day a week preschool class since she was 2 1/2. She has Down syndrome and autism, is completely nonverbal and has very few signs (mostly she just signs "cookie" all day). And it's almost IEP time and I have 1/2 of her teachers and therapists wanting to keep her in the self contained class (10 kids, 1 teacher, 1 classroom aide) with her 1:1 aide. The self contained class she is in is completely nonverbal.

The other half are pushing me to put her in the integrated class (20 kids, about 25% w/disabilities, 1 reg ed teacher, 1 spec ed teacher) with a 1:1 aide because they think she should be around typical talking kids. They think Kayla will eventually talk and a class where all the kids are talking would be better for her.

I'm so stressed out. Although in theory I strongly support inclusion and integration, I can't imagine Kayla being the only one in the class that can't talk. And because of her autism she doesn't imitate behaviors or language, so would it really be beneficial to be around typical kids or would all the noise and activity be just too much for her (she is fairly sensory defensive).

But am I underestimating her abilities if I keep her in the self contained class? Her ABA teacher says she is the highest functioning kid in that classroom, which really blows me away. Kayla functions at about a 12 - 18 month level, so I'm wondering how much worse the other kids are. I have visited the class from time to time and although some of the other kids have behavioral issues, I see Kayla functioning about the same as her classmates.

Ugh. If I'm having this much trouble now, I'm really dreading transitioning to Kindy!

 

[minkydog]

I well remember those days! My son Christian has Pallister-Killian syndrome, which is a lot like really low-functioning Down syndrome. When he entered the special needs preschool I just knew there was more going on inside him than he could tell us. The school system wanted to put him in a basically custodial "class" where there was no lesson plan and the teacher told me she believed in just "letting them do whatever they feel like." Not a good plan for my son! Even though he was nonverbal, didn't walk, couldn't feed himself or go to the restroom, I just knew in my gut that he needed to be around higher functioning kids if he was ever going to have a chance.

So I pretty much threw a tantrum and got my way.

Against their will, and with much kicking & complaining, they put Christian in a mild-moderate class, with mainstreaming into art, music, etc. and he just soared! He learned to walk, he "woke up" to all the action around him. He began to hum and point and communicate. He even began to play the piano! Best thing I ever did was go with my gut on school placement.

I can't tell you which way to go, but if you think that your child would benefit from being around more verbal children, go for it. If after 6wks it's clear that it isn't working or is detrimental, you can always move her back to the other class. She might just surprise them all.

And just so you know, Christian is now almost 13. He functions better *now* in a self-contained class with teachers who are well-trained in teaching severely mentally handicapped/autistic teenagers. He no longer mainstreams in any classes, which is fine with me. As he has gotten older, the chasm between him and normal kids has grown exponentially. But we love him and think he's the nicest kid on the block.

 

[karynnix]

That kid is BEAUTIFUL!!

 

[SandrainNC]

You're not in NC are you? Just asking because there is an Easter Seals daycare here.

Anyway, my son Ryan is 7 and has Down syndrome. He actually attended a daycare/preschool where he was included. When it came time for his IEP before starting kindergarten I was ready to argue with his placement and where I thought he should be. And by the time the meeting was over he was going to a school 30 minutes from our house in a SAC (self contained here is called that) class with approximately 10 students. I left there a little shocked and started educating myself with the federal law. I had other people saying "inclusion inclusion inclusion" and I didn't know what to do. I want what is best for my baby. Long story short, where we are in NC, I could have fought to get him in a regular class, however, he would have been "dumped" in that class. I was told they no longer do aides here unless there is a major physical reason for needing one, so that would have meant no aide for him. So my DH and I had to decide which was more important at school. His education or his socialization. We know he needs both, but he needs an education. He needs to be in an environment where he can learn. And getting dumped in a classroom where he would be lost and the teacher having no time to give extra help, he would not have learned a thing.

Some children are doing great being fully included. But if you are not in a school district that does inclusion correctly, then the child being in a regular class can be even worse than being in a self contained class. They can be really lost and not learning. Also, you know your child best. Maybe visit both types of classrooms and see what you think. You might find out that your district really does inclusion well and like what you see.

Ryan is in 1st grade this year, still in the SAC class and he is doing really really well. He was in a study for a new reading program and he already finished it. He did great! Ryan needs a lot of extra help and he would not have gotten that in a regular classroom where we live. Which is unfortunate. Supposedly things have come a long way but many school districts are not following the laws set out for this type of thing.

Sandra

 

[BeckyScott]

Okay, this is what I'd do...

Put her in the integrated room, BUT set up a meeting about 2-3 weeks after class starts, a follow-up IEP meeting, schedule it now, with the understanding that if things are not headed in a good direction by that time, you will expect her to be moved immediately.

And then just see what happens.

That ought to make both sides happy enough.

Worst-case scenario, it doesn't work, she doesn't like it or they've overestimated her ability to cope, or she needs more assistance than they have available in the integrated room. You'll have "wasted" a couple of weeks but there won't be any wondering What If. It's important to have a precedent set because it will be referred to in her placement over the next couple of years. If she's tried it and it didn't work, you have documentation that it didn't work.

Best-case scenario she steps up to it and thrives, and she'll have hit a major developmental milestone in your eyes.

Sometimes the only way to know for sure, is to try it and see what happens.

My son was in a SpEd preschool, and going into kg they put him in a regular classroom all day (except for therapy and adaptive PE) with a para. That first year, he was supposed to share a para, which I was really concerned about and mentioned it, but he's high-functioning! they said, so I was like Okey-Dokey, you'll see. By Day Three of school he had his own para. (mostly because it took 2 1/2 days to hire someone) It was pretty obvious pretty quick that they'd made a mistake.

Since then though, once he learned the routine (which is so important with autism) he's been doing really well. This year he's only got 1/3 of a para and he has little friends (mostly girls, I am in for so much trouble with him) and I think it's important for him to live in the Real World, too, although it's so hard to take that step.

edited to add: another thing... now I am certainly not one to back a school 100% and am more than happy to throw a fit... but kids act differently at school than at home. I know my son is really bad about expecting more from me than he would expect from other people. I noticed you'd said the teachers said she was the most high-functioning but you're finding that hard to believe. And it just made me wonder if she's doing stuff for them that she won't do for you, just maybe. My son potty-trained at preschool and I could not for the life of me get him to do it at home, they were telling me I didn't need to send him in pull-ups and I just couldn't believe it. I guess he thought I had "sucker" written on my forehead, and I guess he was right. Kids are like that, even typical ones, just the same as our special kids, they instinctively know when they can push and who not to bother. I know my son does it to this day, there's stuff he pulls on me that no way would he try to pull with his para.

 

[ecki]

Thanks everyone for sharing their stories. Right now I'm going to see if they have an integrated class during Extended School Year (our school district is very good at approving ESY) or at the very least a class with some kids who can talk! I'm going to see if they would consider letting Kayla do 1/2 day in the integrated room and 1/2 day in the spec ed room. Apparently there is some funding issue, so they might not go for that, but I think that might be a good solution. And then I can stress about Kindy later, LOL.

BTW, we're in NY, a rural county near the NY/PA/NJ border.

 

[Disneylvr]

I am going through a similar IEP experience right now. We have to reconvene the IEP in the next few weeks to address placement. The team wants my daughter in self contained next year. She is 5, non-verbal autism and is currently in an inclusion class 50% typical kids and 50% with IEP's. She is the only non-verbal child in the class and this year she has made great strides. I truly believe it is because she is with her verbal and typical peers. Last year she was in self contained and made zero progress towards any of IEP goals. Unfortunately for kindergarten there is only 2 choices, self contained OR general ed kindergarten class of 22 with only 1 teacher and no special ed teacher. Regardless of where she is placed next year, she will continue to have a one on one aide.

My advice to you is to do what I am going to do. Observe in all the classroom possibilities and see if it is the right fit your daughter. When we reconvene I am going to push for my daughter's home base to be the self contained room (where she can still benefit from special ed certified teacher) but with so many hours per week in the general ed kindergarten. I hope the team will go for this. Remember our kids have the right to a free and appropriate education in the least restrictive environment.

 

[SandrainNC]

Unfortunately for kindergarten there is only 2 choices, self contained OR general ed kindergarten class of 22 with only 1 teacher and no special ed teacher. Regardless of where she is placed next year, she will continue to have a one on one aide.

That is how it is here, but with no aide. They will do pull outs though.

Sandra

 

[Disneylvr]

That is how it is here, but with no aide. They will do pull outs though.

Sandra

We are lucky to have an aide for Madelyn. She didn't start off with one because the district claimed they needed to do a 30 day observation.... Right! The child was an elopement risk on day one, for safety reasons alone she needs one. I am sorry you can't get an aide.

Madelyn gets pulled out for ABA and Music Therapy. Speech, OT and PT are both push in and pull out. We had that written into her IEP because she was spending more time outside the classroom than in.

 

[bookwormde]

Just a couple of things to offer

first I know idea is complicated but in the end it is very simple, the school must supply what is needed for the child to get an appropriate education.

The best place to understand the real application is in appendix A to part 300 notice of interpretation (i found it on the wrightslaw.com website.

to quote one applicable section if it becomes apparent that the child's IEP can be carried out in a less restrictive setting, with the provision of appropriate supplemental aids and services, if needed, part B would require that the child's placement be changed from the more restrictive setting to the less restrictive setting. In all cases, placement decisions must be individually determination the basis of each child's abilities and needs, not solely on factors such as category of disability, significance of disability,availability of special education and related services, configuration of the services delivery system, availability of space or administrative convenience

basically the availability of services is not considered in the IEP decision about child's needs and placement

second for those who have not heard in 5/07 the supreme court ruled that parents may represent there children in federal district court (no more 20-50k to get your case heard outside the state). This scares the heck out of state administrators because they know it will cost them 10k just to begin to defend what is usually state regulation which does not comply with appendix A

It is always best to work cooperatively with the rest of the IEP team but they need to understand the rules so they do not use invalid state regulation in to over ride federal intent.