Spanking , hitting kids

[Lucky4me]

Our friends spank their children with a paddle or a belt. In their case it's pretty ineffective because it's used as a threat and is rarely followed through..
They don't hit hard enough to leave marks and although we disagree, it's not something that affects our friendship.
One time their daughter told my daughter how lucky she was to only get time outs. My daughter said at least getting spanked only takes a few seconds. Sometimes I have to stand in that corner for 15 minutes! So maybe getting spanked would be preferrable to some kids.

 

[disneymom3]

Originally posted by poohandwendy

.I feel the same way about what I see as a current trend of people giving in to their child's every want and treating them as mini-adults. Others may disagree.

AMEN to that!!!! I personally could see the downfall of our civilzation happening because parents are too scared and too worried about being their kids' friends to do their job of PARENTING. (Not that I think you have to spank to parent. As I stated in my earlier post way back, I think you have to know your child's temperment.)

 

[auntpolly]

Originally posted by poohandwendy

I understand your thinking that 'we' will someday look back on it and think it was wrong...I feel the same way about what I see as a current trend of people giving in to their child's every want and treating them as mini-adults. Others may disagree.

I just disagree with the notion (and I'm not saying that you are even saying this) that people who think spanking is wrong are giving into kids. Nothing could be farther from the truth in my family and we were definitely strict parents with firm rules - we just never hit.

In my opinion for every overly permissive parent who doesn't spank who there are 10 parents who are hitting their kids out of frustration and just making things worse.

 

[poohandwendy]

I just disagree with the notion (and I'm not saying that you are even saying this) that people who think spanking is wrong are giving into kids.

I am not saying that at all, thanks for not assuming I was. I don't think non-spanking parents are overly permissive, I think they just have a different approach. I was not giving that example as the alternative to people who spank, just an example of something I can see being seen in the future as soemthing we shake our heads at.

Please remember, spanking was not the main discipinary action in my family (and probably not in most). I get the feeling sometimes that people just automatically assume that 'spankers' just react rather than think through their disciplinary methods. That couldn't be further from the truth in many families. Not once did I spank without thinking about it first and never because I was just frustrated.

I think any extreme is unhealthy, either way. Probably more parents are in-between than anything.

I think none of us like to be lumped into any category because of preconceived ideas.

In my opinion for every overly permissive parent who doesn't spank who there are 10 parents who are hitting their kids out of frustration and just making things worse.

LOL, I would say it is probably much more evenly matched than 10 to 1. JMHO.

 

[shortbun]

Originally posted by poohandwendy
Hey, I respect your honesty Aunt Polly, I just disagree. I don't think that anyone has the right to decide what is wrong for other parents. I disagree that it is harmful unless excessive.

It is one thing to say that you disagree with it, quite another to think your opinion should dictate what others do.

I understand your thinking that 'we' will someday look back on it and think it was wrong...I feel the same way about what I see as a current trend of people giving in to their child's every want and treating them as mini-adults. Others may disagree.

I maintain that hitting a child is excessive in itself. Excessive is
usually defined as "unnecessary." I rarely "give in" to my child's
every want. He does all his homework on time, he goes to bed on time, he watches a fraction of the TV his friends do, he has
a moderate amount of toys, he plays sports fairly, he gives charitably, he mentors younger children, he has a life with
consequences and logically discipline. He calls me "the mean Mom." with humor and occassionally rancor. I do raise my voice
without yelling(exceptions prove the rule) and I have told
him a few times that "this is where many children might get spanked!" Just last night he crossed the line in his behavior-
he is getting NO screen time today. Sundays are normally his
most relaxed screen day. He is reading right now, just played
chess with his Dad and homework is next-all his plan and he's
9. When he was 3, he was called "spirited" by many other parents and found himself leaving playdates when he did not
want to but was causing a ruckus. I DO NOT hit my child. He is
a human being, not a "mini-adult." He deserves the respect I
give him. When I say I am "too smart" to parent with spanking or
"smart enough", I am contrasting the behavior I have been tempted to display with the behavior I choose to display. I compare myself with no one-simply point out the choices I have
made and am proud of them. I am also extremely proud of my
gifted, wild, funny, good hearted, loving and amazing son. He is
learning to make good choices too and when he doesn't understands the consequences of his choices.

 

[phillybeth]

Originally posted by Lucky4me
One time their daughter told my daughter how lucky she was to only get time outs. My daughter said at least getting spanked only takes a few seconds. Sometimes I have to stand in that corner for 15 minutes! So maybe getting spanked would be preferrable to some kids.

Heh. I remember begging my mom at 12 to just spank me and get it over with. Nope, I got the 30 minute lecture followed by 2 weeks of being grounded. Being spanked would have hurt a lot less

I was swatted occasionally when I was young, mostly for mouthing off. It was more an attention-grabber than anything else. The last time one of my parents hit me I was 16, full of teenage attitude, and was being a total witch to my mom. My dad slapped me in the face. It shocked me so much I never mouthed off again.

 

[Disney Doll]

I think there's a huge difference between a pat on the bottom to get a child's attention and a painful, harsh spanking.

I observe quite a few parents, however, who have no idea how to set limits on a child's behavior, which would pretyt much make spanking unnneccessary.

When I was a child, I was probably spanked a total of 5 times. In general, my parents stopped bad behavior early, set limits on my behavior, led by example as to what type of behavior was expected, and my brother and behaved that way. There were no threats, there was no negotiating. If they said no, it was no. If they said stop, you stopped. And if you didn't stop, or kept asking about the "no" thing, then you were removed from the situation. They taught us that actions have consequences.

I can remember being about 9 years old and being out to dinner at a Hojo's near our house. I was acting up in the restaurant, and my mother said "If you act up one more time, you & I are going to sit in the car while Daddy & Bobby finish their dinner and have dessert". Well, in all my 9 year old knowledge, I was convinced that there was no way that my mother would miss dinner in a restaurant, no matter what I did. So I acted up again. And you know what, the 15 or 20 minutes that she and I sat in that car were some of the longest in my life. When you're 9, there's nothing worse than knowing that your brother is getting to finish a restaurant dinner and have dessert while you're sitting in the car. I learned two lessons that day: 1. Actions have consequences 2. My parents meant what they said. After that, if either of my parents said "if you do that, then this will happen"...I believed them.

That doesn't happen much today. I see a lot of negotiating, bribing, 2nd chances, counting to 3, and a lot of other stuff that takes the control from the parent & gives it to the child. Then the parent spanks in frustration.

 

[SueM in MN]

Originally posted by nuke
I've use the 1-2-3 method and it works wonders. When my son was about 3, I would get to two and he would cry "don't say three, don't say three!" We never even had to threaten with taking aways toys or anything.
Every child is different and parents have to make their own decisions what is right for their family.

When my oldest DD was that age, I didn't even have to start counting. All I had to do was start to say her name when she was doing something she knew was wrong and she would say "Don't count. Don't count."
She and her younger sister were never spanked. They both got to a point where they gave themselves Time Outs because they saw it as a way to stop and take a chance to look/think at what you were doing.

The biggest thing I see (no matter what type of discipline people are using) is not being consistent and not having clear consequences.
It sounds like most people in this thread who do spank are using it as an occasinal thing. When I worked in a child and adolescent treatment center (a lot of years ago), one of the biggest problems we saw was with parents who spanked for their main or only means of discipline. Once the child gets big enough to stop you from spanking them, you need to have some other tools up your sleeve. A lot of those parents didn't.

 

[chobie]

I don't believe in spanking, but I am human and have smacked my kids a couple times.

My problem is that I don't feel we as a society should give the okay to spanking as a valid means of discipline because what constitutes a spanking to many people is really a beating. On the other hand I don't think we should vilify people who do spank and have a zero tolerance attitude toward them.

A child in a loving home who received a few swats over the years is not going to be damaged and a child who was raised in a loving home who was not spanked will not be an undisciplined irresponsible adult.

 

[Deb & Bill]

Originally posted by shortbun
I maintain that hitting a child is excessive in itself. Excessive is
usually defined as "unnecessary." I rarely "give in" to my child's
every want. He does all his homework on time, he goes to bed on time, he watches a fraction of the TV his friends do, he has
a moderate amount of toys, he plays sports fairly, he gives charitably, he mentors younger children, he has a life with
consequences and logically discipline. He calls me "the mean Mom." with humor and occassionally rancor. I do raise my voice
without yelling(exceptions prove the rule) and I have told
him a few times that "this is where many children might get spanked!" Just last night he crossed the line in his behavior-
he is getting NO screen time today. Sundays are normally his
most relaxed screen day. He is reading right now, just played
chess with his Dad and homework is next-all his plan and he's
9. When he was 3, he was called "spirited" by many other parents and found himself leaving playdates when he did not
want to but was causing a ruckus. I DO NOT hit my child. He is
a human being, not a "mini-adult." He deserves the respect I
give him. When I say I am "too smart" to parent with spanking or
"smart enough", I am contrasting the behavior I have been tempted to display with the behavior I choose to display. I compare myself with no one-simply point out the choices I have
made and am proud of them. I am also extremely proud of my
gifted, wild, funny, good hearted, loving and amazing son. He is
learning to make good choices too and when he doesn't understands the consequences of his choices.

Here, here!!! Excellent post. I agree with you wholeheartedly.

 

[poohandwendy]

Originally posted by shortbun
I maintain that hitting a child is excessive in itself. Excessive is
usually defined as "unnecessary." I rarely "give in" to my child's
every want. He does all his homework on time, he goes to bed on time, he watches a fraction of the TV his friends do, he has
a moderate amount of toys, he plays sports fairly, he gives charitably, he mentors younger children, he has a life with
consequences and logically discipline. He calls me "the mean Mom." with humor and occassionally rancor. I do raise my voice
without yelling(exceptions prove the rule) and I have told
him a few times that "this is where many children might get spanked!" Just last night he crossed the line in his behavior-
he is getting NO screen time today. Sundays are normally his
most relaxed screen day. He is reading right now, just played
chess with his Dad and homework is next-all his plan and he's
9. When he was 3, he was called "spirited" by many other parents and found himself leaving playdates when he did not
want to but was causing a ruckus. I DO NOT hit my child. He is
a human being, not a "mini-adult." He deserves the respect I
give him. When I say I am "too smart" to parent with spanking or
"smart enough", I am contrasting the behavior I have been tempted to display with the behavior I choose to display. I compare myself with no one-simply point out the choices I have
made and am proud of them. I am also extremely proud of my
gifted, wild, funny, good hearted, loving and amazing son. He is
learning to make good choices too and when he doesn't understands the consequences of his choices.

That is a wonderful, and I respect your right to decide how you raise your child. I also could sing the praises of my 3 children with their accomplishments and how much I cherish them (as I am sure many of us could), but I will spare you all because I think the only real issue here is who has the right to make disciplinary decisions for children.

I believe, barring sufficient reason to believe a child is suffering ill effects of the disciplinary methods of the parents, it is not only the right but the responsibility of the parents alone to make that decision.

We could find positive and negative examples of ALL parenting methods. I disagree that an occasionally spanked child is suffering any ill effects of it. Or that occasional spanking is excessive in any way, JMHO. Unless you are in the position to change the laws, I have the right to parent as I choose...as do you. Hopefully we can respect each others right to make those choices, even if we disagree with them.

 

[jeffemy]

Originally posted by auntpolly
I've been thinking about this and - OK - I'm ready to get blasted for saying this - but I really do think spanking is wrong. I can't help it. I'm not saying this to disrespect anyone's parenting, but if this is a spanking debate, I have to say I think it's wrong.

I tend to think that one day we'll look back and be shocked that we ever hit kids just like we are shocked we ever beat them with canes or sent them to work in grade school. Spanking is just a kind of barbaric idea to me....
.....most of you don't like political correctness on this board. I can't be politically correct and say what I think people want me to say about it. I don't think it's every parents' choice (well it is, but I don't think it should be). I just think it's wrong.

Like I said, I'm just being honest in a debate.

Totally agree!!