Social Security should only go to those who NEED it

[Cool-Beans]

Maybe Ted Kennedy and all those other rich politicians will write checks to help everyone. I kill me.

 

[DisneyBamaFan]

...You are putting debt on your own children as much as boomers are by accepting those lower taxes.

In as much as my generation has not been able to overturn these policies and programs because of the strength of the baby boomer voting block, I agree. I suspect that we will have to wait until our economy collapses altogether to force change.

...I don't feel that I created the problem any more than you do... actually, I feel that nobody from any generation, mine, yours, or those who went before us, wanted to hear that we couldn't keep spending without taxing more.

No single person did, but the baby boomer generation is certainly to blame. We have seen enough excess from this generation to have the entire world sickened by our gluttony. A world that adored us only a few decades before for having done so much to protect freedom around the globe at the cost of millions of American lives.

To be clear, I do not point fingers at individuals. There are millions of fine, hardworking people among that generation, but most of them remain among the working poor or lower middle class. Ignored by those among them who "know better" what their needs are than they do themselves.

 

[DisneyBamaFan]

Maybe Ted Kennedy and all those other rich politicians will write checks to help everyone. I kill me.

The sick thing - the Kennedy family came to financial prominence by manipulating financial institutions and stocks before the Great Depression. They opposed the Glass Steagall Act when it was passed, and helped get it repealed.

Things that make you go hmmm...

 

[CPT Tripss]

Hmmmm . . .
Bush family fortune -

 

[shortbun]

Morally, I think they should abstain from collecting. Legally, they have the right. My Dad and all his country club buddies could not wait to get theirs.
They used it as their gambling money in card games. Sickening. My mother no longer collects now that Dad is gone.

 

[Charade]

I don't have a problem with you not wanting to accept social security... that's your right and privilege!

But it's not logical to act as if accepting the money due to you, in social security payments, is any different from accepting the lower taxes you pay because the government runs a deficit instead of forcing taxpayers to pay as they go. You are putting debt on your own children as much as boomers are by accepting those lower taxes.

I'm a late boomer. I know that by the time I'm old the next generation will be so fed up with us that they'll be handing out suicide pills at the clinic! I won't be a burden on the US social security system, though I paid into it for enough years to qualify, because I'll be drawing most of my payments from the Canadian old age payment. I don't feel that I created the problem any more than you do... actually, I feel that nobody from any generation, mine, yours, or those who went before us, wanted to hear that we couldn't keep spending without taxing more.

It is different. Paying taxes is required by law. Collecting an entitlement (yes, I believe SS is an entitlement because it's not a right outlined in the Constitution) is not. Why can't it be law that the government can't spend more than they take in? There is a law that puts a ceiling on the borrowing limit but they just keep raising it when they bump in to it. If your household income drops (lower taxes), you don't go out and spend/borrow more. Do you? If businesses and citizens ran their finances like the government does, they'd be out of business and broke.

 

[trip]

Morally, I think they should abstain from collecting. Legally, they have the right. My Dad and all his country club buddies could not wait to get theirs.
They used it as their gambling money in card games. Sickening. My mother no longer collects now that Dad is gone.

Is that because she doesn't want to? Because she should still be able to collect as a survivor if she is at retirement age.

 

[okeydokey]

Morally, I think they should abstain from collecting. Legally, they have the right. My Dad and all his country club buddies could not wait to get theirs.
They used it as their gambling money in card games. Sickening. My mother no longer collects now that Dad is gone.

Did your Dad's country club buddies pay into SS? If so they have every right to collect it now.

 

[rie'smom]

If you pay into it, you have every right- moral and otherwise to collect it. The gov't should give the people who don't need it options-deduct from income or deduct from total income taxes paid.

 

[DisneyBamaFan]

If you pay into it, you have every right- moral and otherwise to collect it. The gov't should give the people who don't need it options-deduct from income or deduct from total income taxes paid.

If the government starts giving people options, EVERYONE currently paying into the system under tha age of 50 would stop paying, and SS would be bankrupt immediately. Everyone cannot get what they need here, it seems - just those who are retired or almost ready to retire. Everyone else will just have to starve, I guess...

 

[eliza61]

Entitlement, welfare, in the constitution or not. I paid into it, I have every intention of collecting it.

 

[GeorgeG]

Rather than blaming any generation for the dwindling funds in SS, we might agree that the politicians have messed things up, as usual. You take a politician and show him any source of funding and he will salivate over how he can get his hands on it for his own agenda.

For most of us baby boomers, company pensions and SS were what we had to go with for many years. The 401Ks and such didn't become standard until later on. I suspect those personal investment plans will soon replace pensions and SS. Either way, though, the government, investors, or just the economy is going to make most future retirement something only the elite can afford to do.

 

[DisneyBamaFan]

Entitlement, welfare, in the constitution or not. I paid into it, I have every intention of collecting it.

You mean, you have every intention of trying to collect it.

This is like me saying, my 401k had xxx dollars in it last year and I have every intention of collecting that much money. Sounds great, but it might not play out the way I had planned...

 

[DisneyBamaFan]

Rather than blaming any generation for the dwindling funds in SS, we might agree that the politicians have messed things up, as usual. You take a politician and show him any source of funding and he will salivate over how he can get his hands on it for his own agenda.

For most of us baby boomers, company pensions and SS were what we had to go with for many years. The 401Ks and such didn't become standard until later on. I suspect those personal investment plans will soon replace pensions and SS. Either way, though, the government, investors, or just the economy is going to make most future retirement something only the elite can afford to do.

Agreed, but only to a point. Who elected the politicians? Who supported the spending programs?

The baby boomers have controlled American politics for 40 years now. Once they realized what they could do with their voting block, they became the most politically active group in American history. They deserve credit for many great things, but they deserve blame for many things, too...

 

[eliza61]

You mean, you have every intention of trying to collect it.

This is like me saying, my 401k had xxx dollars in it last year and I have every intention of collecting that much money. Sounds great, but it might not play out the way I had planned...

Every year they keep uping the age. I feel like the provebial donkey with a carrot dangling in front.
I do plan on trying to collect but I never, ever use SS in any of my retirement calculations. so if I can it will be a bonus.

 

[Northstar]

Agreed, but only to a point. Who elected the politicians? Who supported the spending programs?

The baby boomers have controlled American politics for 40 years now. Once they realized what they could do with their voting block, they became the most politically active group in American history. They deserve credit for many great things, but they deserve blame for many things, too...

You know, this is what bugs me... the conspiracy theory that boomers are some sinister monolithic voting block. Boomers are voters like other voters. If I could have gotten all my boomer cohorts to vote with me, the US would not have a massive deficit. People would not have the trappings of conspicuous consumption, true, and there would not be such a gap between rich and poor. But hey, some boomers voted Democrat and some voted Republican. Some were independent and voted for various parties.

40 years of boomer control of politics? You're dreaming. 40 years ago I and many other boomers weren't of voting age. 40 years ago boomers were blaming the mess the US was in... inflation, Vietnam... on the previous generation (I guess some things never change). And were paying into Social Security to take care of their grandparents and then their parents.

Again, I have no argument at all with the idea that Social Security is in deep trouble and that boomers will not be able to rely on the smaller generation after them to fund their retirement richly through Social Security payments like the current generation is getting.

But not accepting Social Security benefits if you qualify for them is not the answer. It would be way better for people to accept those checks, then donate them towards paying off the national debt. Or towards a trust fund for their kids so they will have a retirement fund when the system goes bust. No point in giving the money back to the government... they've already proved they don't know what to do with it!

 

[DisneyBamaFan]

...40 years of boomer control of politics? You're dreaming...

Maybe, but the studies show otherwise. They did not all vote for the same things - but they almost all voted for increased government. In the end, that is what did us in. Not a single program, but thousands upon thousands of programs designed to ensure that every American could live the American dream - even those who don't deserve to take breath.

You are taking this waaay too personally. I am just pointing out facts. If you voted against all of those things, then you should be angry with your "peers". I know that my parents and in laws are. They don't pretend that their generation didn't do this, or that it is all the government's fault. They know who they put in office, and what causes they championed.

In the end, it really doesn't matter. Here we are. The only question that matters it, "What do we do now?" The primary answer that I keep hearing from the baby boomers is, "Make whatever changes you want, as long as I get mine."

 

[wall*e2008]

Maybe, but the studies show otherwise. They did not all vote for the same things - but they almost all voted for increased government. In the end, that is what did us in. Not a single program, but thousands upon thousands of programs designed to ensure that every American could live the American dream - even those who don't deserve to take breath.

You are taking this waaay too personally. I am just pointing out facts. If you voted against all of those things, then you should be angry with your "peers". I know that my parents and in laws are. They don't pretend that their generation didn't do this, or that it is all the government's fault. They know who they put in office, and what causes they championed.

In the end, it really doesn't matter. Here we are. The only question that matters it, "What do we do now?" The primary answer that I keep hearing from the baby boomers is, "Make whatever changes you want, as long as I get mine."

Since I am a smaller government person and my representative always votes against spending I did not cause the government increase so I am taking my SS since I have paid in since I was a teenager.

 

[DisneyBamaFan]

Since I am a smaller government person and my representative always votes against spending I did not cause the government increase so I am taking my SS since I have paid in since I was a teenager.

Let me ask a serious question. If you knew, for a fact, that the continued existence of SS would end up destroying this country, would you still feel this way? Would you still want the money, even at that cost?

Purely a hypothetical question...

 

[ntsammy5]

One of the big problems with SS is that it was expanded to include things that were never intended nor funded - such a Medicare. That and the fact that the money was never invested and was put into the general fund to handle other government obligations is simply criminal.

Those of us retired and nearing retirement have planned on using SS as a part of retirement - if they gave me back everything I invested with a reasonable return, I'd be happy. Don't take money from us for decades (46 years for me), tell us you're investing it for us into a retirement fund, then renege on the whole thing. If they take SS away there’ll be an insurrection. I've fought in 3 wars already, one more makes no difference to me.

Consider this, what would your reaction be if the government took away all of your retirement savings (and other savings too) in order to fund their various and sundry bailouts? It’s what you’re suggestion for SS.