So now when my breastfeeding patients ask for a bottle....

[lillygator]

OP, who is "making" you read this list? Where are these patients in the hospital?

I can tell ya, I would tell you where to go if you came in my room in the middle of the night with a lecture and an agenda.

 

[Colleen27]

Oh, and I know there are breastfeeding nazi's, but there are also people that look at you in disgust if you are nursing in public, and yes, I was ALWAYS discreet. I was young and had my feelings hurt practically everytime I had to go out. What really shocked me is that it was mainly old people giving me the evil eye. I felt like asking them how they were fed when they were babies? Or how do you think Jesus was fed.

It is a social/generational thing. My paternal grandmother was absolutely horrified that I nursed my babies because in her mind nursing was for women who couldn't afford formula. It just wasn't "done" in her social circle, and the fact that so many of their kids and grandkids were choosing breastfeeding over the more "civilized" practice of formula feeding was something that kept the little old ladies' tongues wagging.

 

[Cornhusk]

I could have written your post verbatim. I went through almost exactly the same thing. Difficult ******l birth, lots of blood loss, dd wouldn't nurse, not enough milk to feed her porperly, depression brought on by not being able to nurse when EVERYONE is telling me I absolutely have to or DD will be damaged. My dd also started crying every time I held her and it made things worse. It took me two weeks, and a wonderful ped. who told me it was ok before I finally gave in, and you know what, everything turned out ok. I have a healthy happy six year old! I wish someone had told me sooner that I was nto a failure as a mom because I couldn't nurse DD. I sometimes get the "you didn't try hard enough" bit too, and it is really hurtful even now. I simply could not produce enough milk to maintain DD's weiht or get her working effectively to consume what little I was producing, even with help and support. It just wasn't working.

I had the same situation as well. I felt like there was something wrong with me when I couldn't nurse my daughter. My family and the hospital staff was pushing me but guess what, it was like literally trying to get blood out of a stone. I felt horrible and so if the OP came to me by giving me the "list" I would say some choice words. Nursing the baby wasn't happening and when I finally realized I was affecting my baby I threw in the towel and just bottlefed.

 

[Colleen27]

I had no problems with breastfeeding, unless you count the DD's risk of drowning when the floodgates opened However, I regretted not introducing a bottle right away. At that time, they recommended waiting at least 3 weeks before introducing a pumped bottle to decrease nipple confusion. Well, by 3 weeks old, she had developed her preference and would NOT take a bottle at all. My poor husband never once got to feed her and I never once got a break, until she was on solids and a sippy cup. If I were to have another baby, there would be one bottle a day in there somewhere right from the start.

My kids have been all over the map. My oldest got bottles from a week old because I had to go back to work/school, and by about 5 months he had developed a preference for the faster, easier bottle feedings. My middle child didn't have bottles till she was a couple weeks old, took to them just fine but still preferred nursing, and switched back and forth without any problems. And my youngest, even though offered bottles from a couple weeks old, never did accept them. She'd take breastmilk from a sippy cup from about 4 months on, so I didn't have to be with her 24/7, but she flat out refused every bottle we ever tried to give her.

 

[Darsa]

*have not read all previous posts*

I was pretty much threatened/bullied into trying breastfeeding when I was pregnant with my DD, 15 years ago. The nurse I saw told me INCESSANTLY how it was harmful to bottlefeed (ack, I was bottlefed, I'm dooooomed) in ALL kinds of ways... I have one completely and one partially inverted nipple (sorry, TMI I know) and the pain of attempting to feed, as well as knowing my little baby was HUNGRY and unable to get any nourishment caused me to ask, after a week of agony and DD's weight going DOWN, if I could switch to the bottle, and was read the riot-act once again. I'll never forget that; I ended up bottle feeding, and my kid is smart and not fat. Amazing, considering I "ruined her life" by feeding her formula.

EDIT: Oooo, it occurred to me that some people might take offense to this. Please don't think that I would assume all nurses/lactation specialists would act this way. I'm pretty sure that it was just this particular hospital ramping up their "nurse or nothing" program (not the real name, just the one I made up for 'em).

 

[suzanna1066@comcast.]

I bottle-fed my daughter because of medication I have to take. She is five years old and is a gazelle! Long and thin without an ounce of fat.

 

[Mrs.Toad]

I've been on both sides of this one. When my older dd was born, and we were learning to breastfeed, the nurses kept insisting I just give her a bottle, and I kept refusing. They would bring in bottles and say "just sprinkle a little formula on your nipple to give her a taste and she'll latch on". Yea, right! I made the mistake of letting her sleep in the nursery after being told that they would bring her in and wake me up when she was hungry. At one point, I slept a solid 6 or 7 hours, woke up asking where she was, she needs to be fed, and they told me she'd been asleep the whole time. They kept giving me excuses why they hadn't brought her in yet, and it was another two hours or so before they did. They told me she hadn't had a bottle, but give me a break, what newborn can go over 8 hours without eating and not be screaming her head off?!

Geez, looking back, I don't know why I didn't get out of bed and go to the nursery to get her myself. Guess I was too exhausted and at the time, I did believe them when they kept saying they were about to bring her her, or that the doctor was checking her out right then.

It was a very hard first couple of weeks, but we managed a great breastfeeding relationship that lasted until she was about 10 months old. I don't think it would have been nearly as difficult, though, if those darn nurses hadn't given her those bottles. And CaliforniaDreamin, I got those same dirty looks from old prudes who apparantly have an issue with the very thought of breastfeeding, not by anything they actually saw.

On the flip side, we adopted our second dd. I had read about induced lactation and tried. I met with a lactation consultant with experience in adoptive breastfeeding. I took birth control pills for several months to "simulate" a pregnancy. After stopping abruptly, I began taking domperidone and fenugreek and pumping. I pumped twice a day until we were matched, then stepped it up to 4 or 5 times a day for the last couple of months before our baby was born. The LC told me my supply would go up once I had the baby, as they are better at getting milk out than pumps are.

Well, it didn't. I tried for about a month. Dd was not a good sucker. I was struggling, trying to feed her with the Lact-Aid, but my supply was going down, not up, and I was exhausted because she'd eat every 2 hours, each session took about an hour, and then it took another half hour to get that crazy contraption all cleaned out and prepared for the next time, so I finally gave it up. I was fine with moving to formula. Even the LC could see that bf wasn't going to happen with this child. But after all that, I still have had people tell me I didn't try hard enough. (mostly on message boards )

You're damned if you do, and damned if you don't. It seems to often be one extreme or the other. Why can't we support all women in their choice, whichever it may be?

 

[Mrs. Charming]

OP-- that's really crappy that it puts you in such a bad position. Ugh, that's not the time to lecture a woman about BF'ing!

I've had experiences with lactation consultants that still give me the shivers when I think about them. Ugh.

Anywho, I'd invest in some hockey goalie gear, as a preventative measure.

 

[johnsontrio]

This reminds me of the list of questions the dr's at Ft. Bragg were apparently required to ask in response to baby problems. DD had the worst colic. After days of screaming, projectile vomiting, crying until her nose bled, I desperately called the doctor. She asked "Are you holding her at all? Have you shown her a ball?"

I got these same two questions at each check up too.

Good luck, OP. At least you can comfort yourself with the idea that your reading of the list might help the poor parents fall asleep

Don't know why this strikes me as so funny. If we had your experience our family would now be asking that question at every asinine opportunity... Little Susie failed her math test today honey... reply... Did you show her a ball? Johnny wrecked the car today... reply... Did you show him a ball? I'm worried that Robbie is smoking crack... reply... Did you show him a ball? What a bunch of morons...

 

[brockash]

If i was that patient I woudl be totally p***ed off!!! I cannot believe a hospital would require sometihing that assinine!!!! How awful for a tired, fustrated mom to have ot be subjected to that. It is the last thing she needs and would NOT have encouraged me to continue nursing at all.

Exactly, basically they're trying to guilt the mom into it and basically telling her that she's a bad mom if she still chooses formula after she's read the guilt-ridden memo.

 

[princesspumpkin]

OP, who is "making" you read this list? Where are these patients in the hospital?

The "list" showed up on the baby charts, and we were told by our charge nurses that we must inform them of it. A few months ago, we were told that when patients come into the hospital in labor, and we ask them if they're breast or bottle feeding, if they say both, we have to tell them that they have to decide on one or the other while they're here If they say breastfeeding, we then tell them that they shouldn't introduce a bottle for at least two weeks.

Now, I suppose the amount of patients who are still doing both has prompted the lactation consultants to make this list. Having seen hundreds (if not thousands) of patients over my career, I can say that some people who ask for the bottle, do change their minds when encouraged to wait a while. Some people come in with their minds made up and don't care what the nurse says I guess the lactation consultants are banking on more patients taking the nurse's advice. The LCs have said that most people who give up breastfeeding, do so within the first 2-3 weeks.

 

[Mrs. Charming]

I just have to ask, what happens to the moms whose babies end up in the NICU? As if they don't have anything to worry about... I speak from experience. That poor kid was breast-fed, bottle-fed, and tube-fed.

I'm not blaming you or anything, I just don't know why the "powers that be" are enforcing this, and I hope they're not doing this to the NICU mommies.

 

[focusondisney]

You're damned if you do, and damned if you don't. It seems to often be one extreme or the other. Why can't we support all women in their choice, whichever it may be?

As a maternity nurse, I think this applies both to moms & nurses. Even on this thread, there are comments about both feeling pressured to breastfeed & pressured to bottle feed. Bottom line: you are the mom, you decide.

But my job is to make sure you have the facts. And the fact is breastfeeding doesn't always go smoothly. It takes some work & patience to get going. New moms should be offered help to get started, not a bottle. Unfortunately, many nurses just don't have the time to stay thru the whole feeding. In my hospital, the nurse cares for 4-5 moms & their babies. That's 8- 10 patients. It is a heavy patient load, considering we are a high risk facility & patients are only in hospital for 2-3 days.

I think most hospitals have only 1 lactation consultant on at a time. If they were serious about encouraging breastfeeding, they should have more lactation consultants working. They are the ones who would have time to help. Have them on all shifts, not just days. And arrange follow up visits.

As to the OP & her list, I think it's just another silly thing management came up with to make it seem like they were addressing a problem ( mom's giving up breastfeeding). I'm sure it won't change any mom's mind.

 

[anotherdisneygal]

I breastfed both of my sons. The first one took one bottle of formula every night from his dad so I could get a little sleep (he was a preemie), but the rest came from me. The second wouldn't take a bottle no matter what. My night nurse for my first sonwas the reason that I was able to successfully breastfeed. She was happy, alert and able to discuss the proper way to get the baby to latch (okay, she grabbed my ****, grabbed my baby and squished them together, looked and said, that's right and then pulled him off and had me do it). I probably would have given up if not for her.

That being said, I don't think Formula is the devil. I don't think women should be made to feel bad if they don't breastfeed. I think it's a shame that hospitals and doctors can't think of a better way to educate women about breastfeeding than to force the nurse dealing with an exausted mom & new baby to have to shove it in their faces. I don't blame the nurses, but I'm sure that they will face the wrath of many an unhappy mom.

Good luck! I hope none of the moms are mean to you for doing your job.

 

[mefordis]

I bf'd both of my girls - my first one until she was 8 months but I also HAD to give bottles because of low supply. By the 8th month I was barely eeking out 4 oz when I pumped. My 2nd one is 1 1/2 years old and has never had a bottle, but it was very very difficult to exclusively nurse. The body needs to build up the supply by (what seems like) constant nursing. I no way was able to with my first and if I had to work with my 2nd baby I would not have been able to nurse exclusively -- no way would I have had the supply.

If the mother gives any amount of breast milk I say great!

 

[rie'smom]

Thanks

And I have seen many, many new breastfeeding moms that have difficulty nursing and are exhausted, give formula, finally get rest, and give up nursing all together. Morning comes, they've gotten a good night's sleep, and they choose to continue that routine.

Isn't it the mother's right to change her mind? I would think a well rested mother who is alert and can take care of her child is desirable. Is a woman who hasn't slept but able to pull out a **** a better mother?

If someone had come into my room after those sections and started to read off a list, I would have called the hospital administrator and asked him if he'd like his hospital sued for harassment because frankly it is harassment and may, by the right attorney, be called intimidation. It's my breasts and my babies and keep the heck out of what is a private matter unless I ask you a question.
OP, this is not meant as an outburst against you but against an idiotic policy that you're being asked to follow. Bless your heart because if you haven't been yet, you more than likely will catch hell one day from an irate patient.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Isn't it the mother's right to change her mind? I would think a well rested mother who is alert and can take care of her child is desirable. Is a woman who hasn't slept but able to pull out a **** a better mother?

If someone had come into my room after those sections and started to read off a list, I would have called the hospital administrator and asked him if he'd like his hospital sued for harassment because frankly it is harassment and may, by the right attorney, be called intimidation. It's my breasts and my babies and keep the heck out of what is a private matter unless I ask you a question.
OP, this is not meant as an outburst against you but against an idiotic policy that you're being asked to follow. Bless your heart because if you haven't been yet, you more than likely will catch hell one day from an irate patient.

Actually it is not harrassment for you to be properly notified--what is harrassment is the lecture before surrending the dang bottle. The information can be provided without holding the baby hostage from getting nourishment.

 

[rie'smom]

Actually it is not harrassment for you to be properly notified--what is harrassment is the lecture before surrending the dang bottle. The information can be provided without holding the baby hostage from getting nourishment.

That's what I meant. I started and stopped writing the post a couple of times.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

That's what I meant. I started and stopped writing the post a couple of times.

That's okay--it happens.

 

[princessmom29]

I'm so sorry for that last bit.

The ONE good thing I can say about the house of horrors where I ended up having my son is that they had great lactation nurses. And the nurses stayed the hades away from me after a few interactions.

And then they kicked me out 42 hours post-op (no bathroom trips, no gasses expelled, and 2 millieconds of stethoscope on the belly to declare "bowel sounds"), which is what SAVED our nursing relationship, as my milk didn't come in until the 5th day. Even my LLL aunt was getting snippy with me, but I knew what I was doing. Heck, I didn't even need LLL, as I still remember nursing, and watched my mom and stepmom nurse my sibs a total of 10 years! But if I'd been in that hospital with people breathing down my neck, it would have been destroyed.



Because very very very many women don't think things through AT ALL. So they DO need educating.

One of the two friends who truly supported me in a time of need, who was so loving and caring with me...she always wanted to bottle-feed a baby. And she did. She absolutely IGNORED all of the knowledge that the OP is talking about, and the info that babies fed formula have higher rates of blood sugar problems...her mom has diabetes, she got gestational which is linked with a higher chance of being diagnosed with "normal" diabetes later...but she just flat out decided that it just wasn't worth the benefits to her child, because it would be so "gross" for her.

I never said a word to her about it; I knew her feelings and knew she knew all the stuff and flat out didn't care...but it still boggles my mind.




The time when women are struggling is the time to HELP them, not give in to what seems to be the easiest thing. By reminding women of the problems with formula, you are treating them as adults who might have simply forgotten what they already knew. Many a nurse in the hospital has destroyed nursing relationships by offering, or not trying to help a woman when she's in need of assistance, and just bringing the formula over.

I have a friend who nursed her daughter for awhile. Her mom watched the baby while my friend went to work. Her mom would toss the b'milk bottles and give the baby formula. Eventually, my friend gave up.

She now has a new baby (her daughter is 8), and she is reveling in being able to nurse him and pump for him without anyone interfering. She is so happy and proud. I'm so glad no one interfered with her this time!

Just because someone chooses a different path doesn't mean they were not educated and didn;t ahve all the facts. They just came to the conclusion that bottle feeding is right for them and their child at the time. Just because she didn't go your way doesn't me she is uninformed or didn't care.

Same for me except it took me 3 months & a failure to thrive diagnosis to say enough is enough. They all said my supply would get better her latch would get better just give it time. Yeah well I gave it time.

It was a wake up call for me to find at her 2 week checkup that dispite nursing for 45 min, with 45min breaks in between round the clock that DD was losing weight. It really took the ped. sitting me down and telling me that if she continued to decline we were looking at a hospital stay, and that it was indeed ok to give her formula to prevent that. I came to the realization that neither of us was in a healthy state and something had to be done. It just wasn't working. I am just glad someone intervened, or I would have likely been in the same boat.