So now they're trying to out thrill Six Flags?

[d-r]

Now hang on a minute, Scoop - please don't you or anyone else misunderstand me. I wasn't trying to slam AV. On the contrary, I am quite positive that anything he said was based on good info at the time he said it - gosh, he's proved that many times and I don't doubt it. I meant my point to be that if something turns out to be better than you thought it would be, it is OK to admit it - to yourself as well as others. It still isn't perfect, but it is the result of human enterprise and it never will be - there will always be something abot it that isn't.

It's a glass 1/2 full/empty thing.

Again, I haven't seen it, but from what I hear it turned out better than AV - and others here - thought it would.

Sorry I wasn't clear enough. Please know I don't ever write things here to be malicious, even if I get argumentative.

DR

 

[Bob O]

Yes RNRC is a clone of a coaster that is already in a Six Flags park.
As for its impact in DCA, i think it will be minimal. It will get a little buzz when first opened but the ride doesnt have enough exciting elements to make people want to ride it often or give anyone a reason to come to the park. It is an average coaster at best and not much of an improvement on Space mountain. In fact Space mountain configured with some inversions would be beter than RNRC.
Now a launched coaster with several inversions and a height limit of 200 ft could give people a reeason to visit, escpecailly with elements added to make it a themed ride.
But of course disney is too cheap to do this!!!

 

[MelissathePooh]

Just some cloning FYI's:

Space Mountain
WDW - 1975
DL - 1977

Big Thunder Mountain RR
DL - 1979
WDW - 1980

Splash Mountain
DL - 1989
WDW - 1992

Star Tours
DL - 1987
WDW - 1990

Honey I Shrunk...
WDW - 1994
DL - 1998

Pirates of the Caribbean
DL - 1967
WDW - 1973

Haunted Mansion
DL - 1969
WDW - 1971

Winnie the Pooh
WDW - 1999
DL - 2003

Without hitting all of them as there are so many - those are kind of the newer or the biggies.

Melissa

 

[DVC-Landbaron]

At the risk of "Being DR'd", the One-Trick-Pony chimes in.

And it really is a “one trick” kind of thing. I’d like to speak to your comment quoted below:

It's a glass 1/2 full/empty thing.

In 1968 Disney “proved” itself to me. In 1972 the confirmed my belief in their system. In 1982, although no further verification was needed, they again applied their philosophy and blew me away!!!!!!!!!

So, believe me, I was definitely a 1/2 full kind of guy when it came to Disney. I ‘accepted’ everything Disney gave me. Some hits. Some misses, but never, NEVER did I anticipate anything but sheer wonder from them. Heck!! I even bought the DVC interest, sight-unseen, just because it was Disney!!

“How could it be bad? - - IT’S DISNEY!!!”

However, that was way back in 1992. I think you and I can agree that an awful lot has changed in the meantime. So that while once Disney NEVER had to prove itself to me, sadly today it does. I believe none of the hype, none of the glitz and especially none of the spin that accompanies their ‘official’ press releases.

I think that many share this opinion. While I don’t want to speak for AV, I think he will agree. Where once I was thoroughly content to be simply WOWed by next new Disney ‘thing’, I am now extremely cynical, very cautious and quite frankly, not very optimistic.

Why? Because they poured the glass back in 1955. And like the old coffee commercials filled it to the cup and a half level. And since a certain CEO took over they have been emptying that cup. And emptying... and emptying... and... Until today it is - “half empty.”

I truly hope that I am WOWed by Space. I hope it exceeds my expectations. I am such a Disney nut that it honestly won’t take much. Just that good old fashioned philosophy applied to a ‘spinner’. It ain’t impossible. Just not very likely.

 

[mitros]

There are a number of folks on this site that think only their thoughts and ideas count. Think about it before you rant at someone else's opinion. After all everyone is indeed entitled to their opinion on matters, just like you are. Please give it a thought.. Remember, you DO NOT know everything, although you may think so. PS: this is not necessarily in regard to this thread..... But you know who you are.

 

[HauntedMansionFan]

Originally posted by HB2K

For my money....No. Try Skull Mountain at Six Flags Great Adventure....it's a similar coaster (through the dark with black light stand ins). The only thing that sets RnR apart is the Aerosmith story & preshow.

Whoa... whoa... whoa... hold the phone and hit rewind! Are you seriously trying to compare Skull Mountain to Rock N' Roller Coaster?!?!?! Hahahaha.... I needed a good laugh after the day I had.

 

[roymccoy]

Peterpirate....just out of curiousity, how do you count "10 high quality rides at DCA"?

Soarin Over California
California Screamin'
Muppetvision 3D
Grizzly Rapids
WWTBAM
Playhouse Disney


What am I missing? The Tortilla Factory?

Roy

 

[d-r]

land baron
maybe I should say don't keep pouring that half out everytime something gets poured in it, I guess I'm stretching the metaphor too far -

what I mean is why keep looking so hard for something to be wrong that when you fnd out the first thing you thought would be wrong with it isn't going to happen you find a second thing, and when that second thing isn't going to happen you find a third thing and so on. It isn't just AV he just got exampled because I listen to him enough to remember what he says.

I know there are things that have disappointed you, you know things have disappointed me. But that doesn't mean everything will suck, just like not everything will be fairy tale pixie dust.

oh yeah, scoop, I did use the search.

DR

 

[Peter Pirate]

roymccoy, in addition to your list (of six items) I included the absolutely fantastic Aladdin Show (7), The Animation Building (8), Fliks Fun Faire (very good indeed for the tykes) (9) and the under construction Tower of Terror (10).

Add to this the fact that my youngest LOVED the Orange Stinger Spinner and we had an absolutely unbeatable lunch at the Wine Restaraunt (whatever the name) and DCA was a nice day and a half for us.

BTW, I did have some gripes about DCA to be sure, I just haven't seen the forum or had the time to bring it up...This board generally isn't too intesested in DL...

Mr. Pony, despite all of the fantastic reviews of M:S you still prefer to "Eisner" it? This is why conversation is so difficult...

 

[Another Voice]

Hmmm…

A line with a big spinning prop, two videos. Yup – "pre-show".

No interaction on the ride, the entire point is to squeeze your sinus until they drain through your ears. Yup - "more than thrills"

Walk around the blank hallways and step inside your pod with no attempt to hide the ride mechanism. Yup – "themed to the hilt".

Play a computer game and shop. Yep – a full pavilion that explores the entire topic of space.


Why is the glass half full – because all I hear are people making excuses for Disney ("we all know that with any project there will be ideas that are abandoned") rather than holding them up to high standards people claim they have.

And I because I understand that "better" can still fall short of "the best".


P.S. - Again Mr. Pirate, you might have had a wonderful time at DCA, but millions and millions of other people haven't. To deny that Disney has a major problem on their hands just becasue you had a good dinner is to deny the basic principles of running a business.

 

[shariskates]

I don't see what's wrong with "cloning" popular rides. Personally, I have no desire to go to California, so I will probably never see Disneyland. So I was thrilled when we got Thunder and Splash... hell, I'm still waiting for an Indiana Jones clone... yes I know there is the stunt spectacular, I just don't think it's that spectacular.

Perhaps when they clone RnRC, they will add a new story, a new band.... something to make it different from it's sister in Florida. It doesn't matter to me, I love Disney, MK is my favorite park and always will be. Say whatever you want, I love that greedy little mouse.

Sharon

 

[Another Voice]

"Can you honestly look back at everything you've done in the last however many years and say that every time it was the best?"

Absolutely not.

I work hard on my projects. Sometimes they succeed, sometimes they don't. But I am utimately responsible.

I don't whine about how expensive it was. I don't have people making excuses for it. I don't demand that people accept less because I'm unwilling to put out the extra effort. I don't tell people "better be happy with what you get". I don't expect people to ignore the flaws or the problems. I don't shift the blame somewhere else, even if they # deserve it.

And I sure don't ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever say "it's good enough". In fact, I fired the last guy who told me that.

In short, the difference is I try. That's something Disney seems to have forgotten. From Dino-Rama, every square millimeter of California Adventure to budget knock off of 'Pooh' and 'Tower' – and yes, even to the quarter of the Space pavilion they had someone else pay for. There isn't a single stretch, a single reaching beyond the norm, a single risk to be great. All they want is "just good enough".

I guess there's anouther difference. I don't run a $20 billion company with resources that could buy countries. It's one thing to do your very best with limited resources, it's quit another to do little with a great deal.

How's this for not trying – Disney spent three times the budget of 'Mission: Space' on airplane leases for United Airlines. Disney lost every single penny. Disney can't even bother to invest in their own core business and then people make excuses because Disney couldn't afford to build something better?

Is this the way Disney tries to earn your money and your loyalty? They had the entire Universe as their story – billions of worlds to explore and sights beyond imagination. And all they came up with was "I least I didn't hurl".

For some, I guess, it's just good enough.



P.S. And yes, I do know what it feels like when you don't follow the rules and turn your head to the side. The headache lasted for an hour.

 

[d-r]

All right, then, I haven't seen it so I can't say anything about it.

 

[crusader]

And yes, I do know what it feels like when you don't follow the rules and turn your head to the side. The headache lasted for an hour.

Nonconformists typically have that problem. (can you feeeel the smiley?????)

I want to say thanks AV because I hear you. I really do.

I also want to say I agree. Whoa!

BUT (there's always a but) what you often fail to concede on is that perfection is something we always strive for but rarely achieve. Did Walt ever really feel satisfied that what he had accomplished was beyond improvement? I doubt it. Did he raise the bar so high that it had to be lowered? of course not.

So what's really going on? According to you the company is spending the bare minimum on improvements and wasting excessive amounts on failed ventures. Golden carrots dangling out there which seem so appealing and could quickly grow the company but come at a very hefty price and equally high risk. Sounds very similar to the stock market.

Did this happen? Absolutely. Is this happening? No. So when do we stop criticizing the past mistakes and start focusing on the future. I'm really not making any excuses. I do believe the company should strive to deliver only the best. I also realize the strain its' under because of how far it sunk. So what that says is: Yes, I'm willing to accept the fact that you can see the pod and equally willing to embrace the fact that this company has once again broken new ground with this attraction.

By no means am I blinded by a storm of pixie dust. I'm watching very carefully and wholeheartedly I might add.

 

[Peter Pirate]

M. Voice, please note that I specifically said I had many "issues" with DCA in the very same thread. Also, on many occasions I have discussed my feelings on the BIG, GIANT mistaks that went into DCA. But just like M:S some of us don't feel the need to lump it all together and scream "there's only one solution"!!!!

It's great that you were able to ride M:S already (I asume that is what you meant) - Obviously none of those folks know you as 'Another Voice'... But as your opinion with M:S and DCA is consistent so is the fact that you refuse to see another possible point of view and that is that despite the evil guy at the top it appears some good directional changes are being made to Disney (as has been pointed out on these boards).

If you really think the biggest issue with M:S is that it cold have been better, then I don't disagree but in using that philosophy, it's really too bad Walt was so dad gum shortsighted (or Cheap)that he didn't think of intermixing real people pirates with the animatronics, boy what an ever changing & lively show that could have been...If only...

 

[doombuggy]

you might have had a wonderful time at DCA, but millions and millions of other people haven't. To deny that Disney has a major problem on their hands just becasue you had a good dinner is to deny the basic principles of running a business.

I and my 2 cousins had a great time at DCA last year, so don't count me in the "millions and millions" group. Wait a minute - if "millions and millions" have been there in the 3 (/) years since it opened, it would be successful, wouldn't it?

Just my opinion, of course..........

As for riding M:S, I think it's open for cast previews right now, but don't hold me to it.

I have been to 2 Six Flags Parks (Astroworld in Houston, and Great Adventure in NJ). I LOVE thrill rides, but WDW or DL is more than that. I guess why that's why I go to these parks as often as I do instead of GA (which is only 1 1/2 hours from me).

 

[EUROPA]

Originally posted by doombuggy
I and my 2 cousins had a great time at DCA last year, so don't count me in the "millions and millions" group. Wait a minute - if "millions and millions" have been there in the 3 (/) years since it opened, it would be successful, wouldn't it?

Just my opinion, of course..........

Some people don't need to eat a **** sandwich to know it's not going to taste good.

 

[doombuggy]

Originally posted by doombuggy: I and my 2 cousins had a great time at DCA last year, so don't count me in the "millions and millions" group. Wait a minute - if "millions and millions" have been there in the 3 (/) years since it opened, it would be successful, wouldn't it?

Some people don't need to eat a **** sandwich to know it's not going to taste good.

EUROPA, what are you trying to say to me, that I am a **** because I enjoyed Soarin', Calif. Screamin', etc???

 

[EUROPA]

Originally posted by doombuggy
EUROPA, what are you trying to say to me, that I am a **** because I enjoyed Soarin', Calif. Screamin', etc???

Not even close. It simply means that you don't need to experience some things to know that you will not like it. That is why there are millions and millions of people that know that DCA is not up to Disney standards. First hand experience is not required for all things.