So did anyone else notice...

[sayhello]

that the website FAQ now says that

Adventures by Disney reserves the right to cancel a trip at any time prior to its commencement for any reason, such as if there are too few Guests, or if the quality of the trip or the safety of the Guests would, in our opinion, be compromised, such as may result from unforeseen circumstances (acts of God) or other circumstances beyond our reasonable control.

So the website now says the same thing as the paperwork that people like abdmom were getting?

http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=2530022

In other words, the 70-day guarantee of no cancellation is now gone! And the folks that said "don't mind the paperwork, the website is correct and binding" maybe didn't know what they were talking about? If I'd booked before they changed the policy back, I'd be pretty pissed off right about now. That's not a minor change. I do wonder if they'd grandfather it if people really complained. I have a feeling not...

Sayhello

 

[Icemann]

After abdmom posted her comments,I looked into it a little deeper.I was thinking of booking early for another Adventure but I'm not so sure Disney is for us anymore?The other tour companys seem to want are business alittle more then Disney.If I bought airplane tickets and made pre and post day plans you are talking about a loss of alot of money.I think ABD needs to re-think their policy and get back to us.It's the people who have used ABD in the past that help keep them solvent,the one time customer doesn't sound like a solid business plan to me.

 

[marcemch]

This seems like even MORE motivation NOT to book early. If you wait until there's enough people already booked on the trip, then you can be fairly assured that they won't cancel due to a small number of guests. Of course, by waiting, you pay more, so they've got you either way.
I can't imagine them being willing to live with the very bad PR they will get if they cancel 30 days out due to small trip enrollment. Surely they realize the impact of that, especially if one of the guests is on the disboards. The other companies will get ahold of this and use it as a selling point to their trips - WHICH THEY SHOULD!

 

[Tozzie]

There are other tour companies but few, in my opinion that offer comparable trips. Backroads and Thompson, while luxury operators are not comparable. As posted in another thread, Tauck cancels tours due to to low capacity and Abercombie and kent has this on their website, if you can actually find it:

A&K Guaranteed Departures:
All escorted group programs* departing between January 1 and December 31, 2011, are guaranteed to operate. Guaranteed departures will operate except only in cases of force majeure, which could include any major world event adversely affecting international travel patterns or other circumstances beyond A&K's control.

* Please Note: Extreme Adventures, Marco Polo Club Invitational, Canal & River Cruising, Escorted Mobile Camping and Journeys for Women programs require a minimum number of passengers to operate.

So if the other companies that people are comparing to ABD cancel tours as well, so what is the big deal. I for one have issues with a few of Taucks policies and I don't think I would travel with them, maybe and for a solo traveler, there is very little if any savings for other companies vs ABD.

 

[sayhello]

There are other tour companies but few, in my opinion that offer comparable trips. Backroads and Thompson, while luxury operators are not comparable. As posted in another thread, Tauck cancels tours due to to low capacity and Abercombie and kent has this on their website, if you can actually find it:

A&K Guaranteed Departures:
All escorted group programs* departing between January 1 and December 31, 2011, are guaranteed to operate. Guaranteed departures will operate except only in cases of force majeure, which could include any major world event adversely affecting international travel patterns or other circumstances beyond A&K's control.

* Please Note: Extreme Adventures, Marco Polo Club Invitational, Canal & River Cruising, Escorted Mobile Camping and Journeys for Women programs require a minimum number of passengers to operate.

So if the other companies that people are comparing to ABD cancel tours as well, so what is the big deal. I for one have issues with a few of Taucks policies and I don't think I would travel with them, maybe and for a solo traveler, there is very little if any savings for other companies vs ABD.

I don't have a problem with ABD compared to other companies. What I have a problem with is them CHANGING the policy mid-stream. For the last month, they have been advertising a policy that says they won't cancel within 70 days of the trip departure. Now it's suddenly gone, & changed to "any time up to the commencement of the trip". And I really have a problem with the way abdmom was mis-led about the discrepancy.

Sayhello

 

[knewton64]

After reading many a thread concerning this and other related topics, I thought I would chime in and give my .02 worth on this issue.


Where I take severe umbrage against this policy change (in mid-stream I might add) is that it is once again giving too much power to the vendors.
Now being myself in the hotel / hospitality industry, I can understand full well how the vendors feel but I also feel that if they can enjoy the good times....well then they need to also enjoy the lean times as well (just like I do here in Dallas Texas).

Per se, it should not be our liability if (just making up an example to prove the point) 14 couples cancel 10 days prior to their date of departure (due to them losing their jobs or what not) - thus leaving the other 6 couples having to scramble. It is to this is where I find this new policy change very questionable.

Yet, one of the questions I asked an ABD rep a few weeks ago had to do with the essence of this issue and her response was:

"We have no control over our vendors."

I had to seriously bite my lower lip to keep from laughing as I know that is not the truth. We (where I work at) , like they - DO HAVE control over their vendors - it's just they CHOOSE to not control them.



Q: So, as we all come full circle on this issue - should we complain?
A: **** YES ****



Q: Does it pay to complain??
A: ** YES **


I am very proud to say that after hearing initially from ABD reps that Corporate doesn't field complaints from people like you, I used that comment as a motivational these last 90 days to kick my concerns all the way past the office of Craig Hodges and straight onto his supervisor - Robert.


Moreover -
* It is a complete waste of time to deal with Guest Services and or to deal with it on a local level. *



And fair to say that approx 75% of my concerns were resolved with the other 25% I chose to let drop.

But I do add that one of my 14 questions answered during this process (among other issues) was a sight to behold for now I know WHY Walt had an ascending staircase (that leads to the roof) built into his apartment overlooking the fire station at Disneyland.
** THIS you will not be told while on A.B.D.'s "Backstage Magic" tour **




So, good luck to all on this issue as my choice on what to do has been made easier by this flip flop on policy by Craig's office as well as how they reacted to my concerns over their un-Disney like presentation / show and courtesy of Disneyland /DCA and such (late March 2010 as I took part in an A.B.D.'s "Backstage Magic" group tour).


Anywho -

I am looking forward to my upcoming trip to Ireland (June 2011) and just two days ago, I now have on my "on deck circle" a run to 2 islands of Hawaii - slated for either mid October or early November 2011. Oahu is one of the islands but haven't figured out yet which other island to hop on over while there, etc.
I have 90 more days to go before I can book it as Dole pineapple tour, Pearl Harbor, etc is looking pretty good.


And Craig has made my choice for a vendor for this trip a lot easier to make as well.



T.T.F.N.

 

[Momof3greatkids]

I think that with A&K you get a better guaranteed departure policy. They guarantee all of their regular group tours will depart. It is only the ones that are specialized that require a minimum number to go. So, if you book a familly group tour with A&K, for China, Egypt, etc. they guarantee it will go regardless of number (unless of course there is a natural disaster or war, etc.) . From what I am reading here, Disney will not. Thompson Family Adventures is also another one that offers a guaranteed departure no matter the number. That is so important becasue for many of us we can only go at certain times, use FF miles, plan Pre and Post travel days. So, I really think you have to give that alot of thought. I think Disney would be so much better off absorbing the cost of a small tour, even without a minimum number, than turning people off with there guarantee departure policy.

 

[ILuvCrush]

This is really confusing... and concerning!

We are already booked for Sept 2011 for Gateway to London and Paris. I figure I'd keep an eye on the website and watch for a 'waiting list' entry to be added to our trip... figuring it would be pretty much at capacity at that point. I noticed, however, that particular trip is still listing a guaranteed departure after 70 days clause. I just looked at it 5 minutes ago....

2) Guarantee Terms & Conditions: Adventures by Disney Travel Services, Inc. will not cancel any regularly scheduled departure of any 2011 season itinerary less than 70 calendar days prior to its scheduled start date, except if cancellation of same is due to: (1) non-payment by the Guest; or (2) factors beyond our reasonable control, such as, but not limited to: industry-wide strikes, civil unrest, embargos, fires, explosions, floods, earthquakes, typhoons or similar severe storm, wars (whether or not declared), or acts or threats of terrorism or a direct response to same; in which case the provisions of our standard Terms and Conditions shall apply.

I wonder if they are not guaranteeing all trips.... just some??? That seems like an odd plan....

 

[sayhello]

This is really confusing... and concerning!

We are already booked for Sept 2011 for Gateway to London and Paris. I figure I'd keep an eye on the website and watch for a 'waiting list' entry to be added to our trip... figuring it would be pretty much at capacity at that point. I noticed, however, that particular trip is still listing a guaranteed departure after 70 days clause. I just looked at it 5 minutes ago....



I wonder if they are not guaranteeing all trips.... just some??? That seems like an odd plan....

Wow! That *DOES* seem odd. Unless whoever made the website changes just missed one?

Now, I'm looking at the FAQ for Gateway London & Paris, and it says

Adventures by Disney reserves the right to cancel a trip at any time prior to its commencement for any reason, such as if there are too few Guests, or if the quality of the trip or the safety of the Guests would, in our opinion, be compromised, such as may result from unforeseen circumstances (acts of God) or other circumstances beyond our reasonable control.

I wonder which one of us maybe needs to clear our cache? Can you provide a link to the page you're looking at? Here's mine...

http://abd.disney.go.com/abd/en_US/destination?name=LondonAndParisGatewayLandingPage#q17

ETA: Well, that doesnt' seem to work... just goes to the main page. But I went under FAQ from there, and that's what I see...

Sayhello

 

[Diskidatheart]

In other words, the 70-day guarantee of no cancellation is now gone!

That doesn't seem to be 100% accurate. On the FAQ section of each itinerary, they do indicate that they can cancel at any time for any reason. However, if you go to the Rate and Dates section for the 2011 trips, they do have it in writing that their 2011 trips will not be canceled except for non payment and essentially dangerous situations. I think ABD needs to clarify which one is accurate to start calming people down a bit. They need to be consistent within their website so that they are saying the same thing everywhere. We'll see if something changes.

 

[sayhello]

That doesn't seem to be 100% accurate. On the FAQ section of each itinerary, they do indicate that they can cancel at any time for any reason. However, if you go to the Rate and Dates section for the 2011 trips, they do have it in writing that their 2011 trips will not be canceled except for non payment and essentially dangerous situations. I think ABD needs to clarify which one is accurate to start calming people down a bit. They need to be consistent within their website so that they are saying the same thing everywhere. We'll see if something changes.

Oh, heck! You're right! I was looking at the FAQ's, but there the 70 day policy is, on the Rates & Dates page! D'oh! Well, isn't that just wonderful! Talk about conflicting information!

Sayhello

 

[Momof3greatkids]

I am wondering how we get this clarified. I have always found the booking department to be very pleasant, and professional. But, would they really know for sure, if asked. I am not sure they have the authority to say. But, I would love to know!! So, how do we find out? Anyone?

 

[sayhello]

I am wondering how we get this clarified. I have always found the booking department to be very pleasant, and professional. But, would they really know for sure, if asked. I am not sure they have the authority to say. But, I would love to know!! So, how do we find out? Anyone?

Well, I just spoke to someone in the booking department, and she saw the contradictions (and actually found one place where it still said *85* days, left over from 2010.) She is going to take the question to the higher ups, and get a clarification, and will have someone call me with an official clarification.

She did state, however, that they have all been told that the policy is the no cancellations less than 70 days before the trip goes, and that is how they are counseling people when they reserve trips. So it *appears* the old policy in the FAQ is in error. We shall see!

Sayhello

 

[Bobo912]

Well, I just spoke to someone in the booking department, and she saw the contradictions (and actually found one place where it still said *85* days, left over from 2010.) She is going to take the question to the higher ups, and get a clarification, and will have someone call me with an official clarification.

She did state, however, that they have all been told that the policy is the no cancellations less than 70 days before the trip goes, and that is how they are counseling people when they reserve trips. So it *appears* the old policy in the FAQ is in error. We shall see!

Sayhello

But abdmom's paperwork didn't have the guarantee of no cancellation less than 70 days, so they need to get the website straightened out and include the same agreement in the paperwork.

 

[sayhello]

But abdmom's paperwork didn't have the guarantee of no cancellation less than 70 days, so they need to get the website straightened out and include the same agreement in the paperwork.

I mentioned the discrepancy in the paperwork also. We'll see what the person who calls me back says. I plan to dog this issue until it's resolved... It's really pretty ridiculous at this point!

Sayhello

 

[ILuvCrush]

I had looked under the Dates and Rates section which is where I had quoted! I hadn't thought to look in th FAQ tab

 

[Momof3greatkids]

Sayhello, Thanks for checking into this. Sounds, like Disney needs to get its act together. As you have pointed out, this is not a minor point. However, their best case scenario, still leaves you vulnerable to a cancellation slightly over 2 months out. Ouch!

 

[Bobo912]

Thanks, Sayhello for being so diligent. I'm sure you'll get ABD straightened out eventually. Speaking of contracts, just curious if anyone is aware of any other companies that require you to sign a contract and send it back so quickly or even to sign a contract at all. I didn't have to sign anything for the Tauck trip - just paid the deposit and that was it. There's no contract to sign for the Lindblad trip either.

 

[abbyjt]

Sayhello,
Did you ever get a response from Disney on this? Just curious.

 

[sayhello]

Sayhello,
Did you ever get a response from Disney on this? Just curious.

No, I didn't. I'm going to give them another call, and see what's up!

Sayhello