So angry I could bust!! (Vent)

[LisaR]

I worked for Dr's all my life. I would bet that more than half of them have the handwriting of a 5 year old, their grammar is horrible and they can't spell. But they sure were very well regarded as far as the medical practice.

I do think it is important, but I also think that they need to be graded for the subject they are taking. Maybe this area is her weakness and to continually knock her down because of it, isn't doing her any favors.

I spent years working for doctors and while they did seem to have some of the sloppiest handwriting, I never worked for one that couldn't spell.

 

[tlbwriter]

I think it's a bad idea to have children in the same school as you teach.

Well, sometimes there's nothing you can do about it. In my town, if you teach anything beyond grade school, your children are going to be in your school. No other options unless you choose to homeschool or send them to a very small religious private school.

I'm still trying to wrap my head around a teacher thinking these writing skills shouldn't pertain to homework. They should pertain to all work.

My experience in school (lo these many years ago) was just the opposite - students would ask "does spelling count?" and the teacher would say "no, this isn't an English class." Even as a high school student I thought this was monumentally stupid. While we're at it, let's say math doesn't count since it's not a math class, okay? How long did the Civil War last? Oh, a couple of years.

I have always picked my daughters teachers from grade school - 6th grade...and yes I am sure if any parent wanted to do it they could, I know others who have--most just don't want to be bothered.

Your district may be the exception, not the norm. In mine, you can make a request for educational reasons. And you cannot request a specific teacher, you can only request that you not have a specific teacher. Interestingly, our grade school principal's son was in the same grade as my daughter, and for 5 years he always ended up with the best teacher somehow... I always knew it was going to be a good year when I saw him on the class roll.

 

[Allison]

No sympathy from my. Spelling, grammar and punctuation SHOULD count. Poor lady - having a co-worker call her an "Old Hag" just for doing her job. Being a teacher is rough. You would think you would know better.

I agree. Good for the teacher for being concerned about these things and bad for the OP for being so unprofessional.

 

[erincon23]

First, I'm squarely in the camp that says spelling and grammar matter...
Second,

Oh yea, we have school districts here that force a freshman to take earth science their freshman yr. Let's just say I am disgusted with this and leave it at that.

They only allow "gifted kids" to take biology.

our high school's "regular" track starts with earth science then moves to bio, chem and physics. DS19 was in the "honors" science track, so he started with honors bio, but then never had the earth science stuff at all -- no space science, weather, etc. DS15 is in the regular track, and had earth science last year -- which he really enjoyed, since those subjects are much more interesting to him. We'll see how he does in bio!

And picking teachers -- when I was in elementary school, I somehow got the idea that I was in charge . I requested both my 5th and 6th grade teachers, and got the ones I asked for!

 

[Mermaid02]

I spent years working for doctors and while they did seem to have some of the sloppiest handwriting, I never worked for one that couldn't spell.

I work for a surgeon that can't spell.... the man is a genius... but spelling baffles him. His penmanship- incredibly neat btw!

 

[mhsjax]

Here is my basic problem, and I am not saying the grammar and spelling doesn't count, but in our school system, grammar isn't even taught with the exception of maybe present and past tense verbs and that type of thing, until middle school, and we are considered a great school system.

They need to make spelling and grammar priority and quit teaching to the test here in the good ole US of A. Our education system stinks and the kid are suffering for it.

 

[K and K's Mommy]

My oldest once got a D on a social studies paper because he misspelled Antarctica and Arctic - he left out the first C. He did this 5 times, I think. THIS WAS IN SECOND GRADE about the second month of school. Guess what? We both ended up loving this teacher. She works them hard and expects a lot. My youngest now has her for first. She has him doing the third grade spelling words because she doesn't want him not to work!

I'm ETA that when my DD had her three years later, I made sure she knew how to spell Antarctica and Arctic, and when she brought home that social studies worksheet with an A, we all got a laugh! Plus, my oldest has never forgotten how to spell those words. LOL!

 

[mhsjax]

I work for a surgeon that can't spell.... the man is a genius... but spelling baffles him. His penmanship- incredibly neat btw!

That is my point. If we failed everyone that couldn't spell, the world would probably be missing some great Dr's, scientists, etc. Math and science use one side of the brain, english, the other side.

There has to be a middle ground. If this is a science class, I think spelling should count, but grammar, get over it. I want a Dr that can cure my disease, not diagram a sentence.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

First, I'm squarely in the camp that says spelling and grammar matter...
Second,

our high school's "regular" track starts with earth science then moves to bio, chem and physics. DS19 was in the "honors" science track, so he started with honors bio, but then never had the earth science stuff at all -- no space science, weather, etc. DS15 is in the regular track, and had earth science last year -- which he really enjoyed, since those subjects are much more interesting to him. We'll see how he does in bio!

And picking teachers -- when I was in elementary school, I somehow got the idea that I was in charge . I requested both my 5th and 6th grade teachers, and got the ones I asked for!

My dd did earth science 6, 7, and 8th. Your son did not do that in middle school?

The problem with the reg. track is that it does not keep you on track for the ACT/SAT. You are always 1yr behind the bulk of students and your score suffers because of it.

 

[lovesmurfs]

There has to be a middle ground. If this is a science class, I think spelling should count, but grammar, get over it. I want a Dr that can cure my disease, not diagram a sentence.

I disagree. I want a physician who will communicate professionally with me and my family, and grammar is an important part of communication. It is also a core competency in the medical profession. I would be more concerned with grammar than with spelling.

 

[Liberty Belle]

That is my point. If we failed everyone that couldn't spell, the world would probably be missing some great Dr's, scientists, etc. Math and science use one side of the brain, english, the other side.

There has to be a middle ground. If this is a science class, I think spelling should count, but grammar, get over it. I want a Dr that can cure my disease, not diagram a sentence.

My youngest has a writing disability and can't spell worth a damn, but he's very smart. He's an excellent problem solver, his verbal skills are just exceptional (per his teachers, speech teacher, etc), he's very good at math, etc.

 

[mhsjax]

I disagree. I want a physician who will communicate professionally with me and my family, and grammar is an important part of communication. It is also a core competency in the medical profession. I would be more concerned with grammar than with spelling.

Again, it depends on what level we are talking about. Most people can communicate very well at that level of education. However, I am sure that an English teach could absolutely pick apart their use of grammar.

 

[Nancyg56]

That is my point. If we failed everyone that couldn't spell, the world would probably be missing some great Dr's, scientists, etc. Math and science use one side of the brain, english, the other side.

There has to be a middle ground. If this is a science class, I think spelling should count, but grammar, get over it. I want a Dr that can cure my disease, not diagram a sentence.

I believe that there should be some sort of effort to ensure that by the time children reach HS spelling and grammar have been taught. If there is a reason that a child is not able to spell there are avenues available to ensure that the student does not fail. Grammar? I would imagine that if your Dr did not present papers that were grammatically correct his professors would have had issues with his presentation.

It is imperative that we teach children that proper written communication is an important part of presenting ideas. If we convince ourselves that that aspect of education will not be an important part of life after school we are going to lose our ability to compete in a global marketplace. It is already very difficult to keep jobs that can be outsourced in this country. If our students fail to communicate properly their ability to compete for jobs will be markedly diminished.

I would never suggest that a child with a learning challenge be failed but I do feel that if the reason that a child has not mastered basic skills is lack of effort then that needs to be addressed.

 

[Alesia]

That is my point. If we failed everyone that couldn't spell, the world would probably be missing some great Dr's, scientists, etc. Math and science use one side of the brain, english, the other side.

There has to be a middle ground. If this is a science class, I think spelling should count, but grammar, get over it. I want a Dr that can cure my disease, not diagram a sentence.

Even kids as young as 7 or 8 are able to use a dictionary to look up how to spell a word. I just don't buy the whole idea of "I can't spell." Yes, it may be more difficult for some, but everyone (barring those with actual learning disabilities) can learn to spell correctly - it just takes practice. Parents and teachers are doing their kids a major disservice when they don't require them to practice.

You may not care whether your doctor can diagram a sentence, but you should care if he can communicate his thoughts and ideas clearly both verbally and in writing. I've read plenty of papers written by doctors published in scientific journals. Do you honestly think any of them would be taken seriously if they were full of spelling and grammatical errors?

 

[MIGrandma]

I haven't seen the OP back yet....

I agree with the majority, the biology teacher was right. I can't imagine handing in papers as a freshman in high school with a bunch of spelling, punctuation and grammar errors. And worse, if I did do that, then having my Mom yell at the teacher about it!!

 

[mhsjax]

My youngest has a writing disability and can't spell worth a damn, but he's very smart. He's an excellent problem solver, his verbal skills are just exceptional (per his teachers, speech teacher, etc), he's very good at math, etc.

Same with DS, Genius IQ, DH same way. They wiz through math like it was adding 2+2. But can't spell if their life depended on it, and grammar, it is ok, but not always correct.

DH was an air traffic controller, damn good one. Retired now. Do people really care that he couldn't spell very well, or do they care that during a major thunderstorm in the rush hour in Orlando, that he could keep all those tourist's planes from becoming one?

 

[cornflake]

There has to be a middle ground. If this is a science class, I think spelling should count, but grammar, get over it.

Unless there's some really specific reason (like that English is not their first language), any professional with bad grammar? I'm simply not hiring or engaging in any professional endeavour. I do judge people by their mastery of their native tongue, sorry.

 

[punkin]

I haven't seen the OP back yet....

I agree with the majority, the biology teacher was right. I can't imagine handing in papers as a freshman in high school with a bunch of spelling, punctuation and grammar errors. And worse, if I did do that, then having my Mom yell at the teacher about it!!

Have you seen some of the comments directed at her...downright nasty. I'm not sure I'd want to come back to such abuse if it was me.

 

[mhsjax]

Even kids as young as 7 or 8 are able to use a dictionary to look up how to spell a word. I just don't buy the whole idea of "I can't spell." Yes, it may be more difficult for some, but everyone (barring those with actual learning disabilities) can learn to spell correctly - it just takes practice. Parents and teachers are doing their kids a major disservice when they don't require them to practice.

You may not care whether your doctor can diagram a sentence, but you should care if he can communicate his thoughts and ideas clearly both verbally and in writing. I've read plenty of papers written by doctors published in scientific journals. Do you honestly think any of them would be taken seriously if they were full of spelling and grammatical errors?

Do you honestly thinking that those articles were proofed by an editor. AGain, big difference in not being able to communicate well, and having an English teacher critique everything written or said.

I am not discouting grammar or spelling, just saying that in other classes, if it isn't absolutely horrible, give the kid a break.

 

[bellarella]

Have you seen some of the comments directed at her...downright nasty. I'm not sure I'd want to come back to such abuse if it was me.

I haven't read the whole thread, but after reading the OP where she called a colleague an "old hag" I'd be incline to think karma might be in play.