Should Prostitution be decriminalized?

[Colleen27]

Why wouldn't legalizing it change it, though?

Farming is legal, and yet slave-like conditions for migrant farmworkers are an ongoing problem. Prostitution would likely follow very similar patterns - whorehouse operators import/sponsor foreign women, maybe honestly or maybe by misrepresenting what they're being brought here to do, charge them "room and board" and other expenses for the privilege of living and working in their establishment, and have the ability to hold deportation over their heads to silence any complaints about the conditions. Meanwhile, the NIMBY problem (more on that below) and the stigma of visiting known whorehouses will ensure black market demand continues.

Not sure if it's a direct comparison, but legalizing marijuana and highly-regulating (and taxing) legal sales doesn't seem to have curtailed the illegal drug trade - much of which is controlled by organized crime. They certainly didn't all just pack up and go home when the legal pot-shops opened.

It's apparently a matter of marketing. Legalize marijuana sales are all done through government-licensed shops. The government controls the product and the prices are set. The street-dealers simply offer better stuff and under-cut the prices. The regular pot smokers I know didn't find the lofty ideal of going legit to be worth the extra money; they both still buy from "their guys".

It isn't strictly a question of marketing or price, at least not here in the U.S. In the states that have legalized pot here, it is generally still subject to local zoning ordinances... so most suburbs, particularly those that aim for an upscale or family friendly image, and most conservative rural communities have prohibited pot-related businesses. The black market continues to thrive, because the pot shops are very distant from many of their potential customers (for example, pot is legal in my state but I'd have a 3-4 hour round trip drive to the nearest place I can buy it legally). The costs of buying legally are only slightly higher here, comparable enough that a lot of people would accept the trade-off between paying more to get a known quantity/quality and a supplier that is consistently available. But they're not so committed to buying on the legal market that they're willing to waste half a day to go pick up a dime bag. So the black market continues to thrive because it is right around the corner, not confined to the urban centers and college towns that didn't rush to ban pot businesses.

The same forces would likely be at work if prostitution were legalized. The places where business could be done wouldn't necessarily be the places where people are looking to purchase sex, and where the mismatch is large enough, the black market would persist.

 

[sam_gordon]

Farming is legal, and yet slave-like conditions for migrant farmworkers are an ongoing problem. Prostitution would likely follow very similar patterns - whorehouse operators import/sponsor foreign women, maybe honestly or maybe by misrepresenting what they're being brought here to do, charge them "room and board" and other expenses for the privilege of living and working in their establishment, and have the ability to hold deportation over their heads to silence any complaints about the conditions.

Doesn't that happen now? I'll be honest a lot of the "no" answers seem to be saying "conditions for sex workers will be bad". Like they're all sunshine and daisy's now?

 

[mummabear]

I think, there are bigger fish to fry than wasting time on legalizing this vice.

Really, is there a reason not to do both?
It isn't about legalizing the vice, but the work, that is happening either way and the legalization has a wide range of positive benefits for the workers, the johns as well as society.

**** I misread the post I quoted. Disregard any alerts


People are forced into it all of the time. Coerced, threatened, physically beaten if they don’t perform etc... The johns may or may not know...

Many prostitutes are victims of sex trafficking.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

But I do think, of there were some way to regulate, tax it, and ensure safety it should be legal.

It becomes a lot safer for everyone when the police can be called without fear of being arrested for being a prostitute or john.

As far as the argument about trafficking and unwilling participation, that isnt going to be made worse by it being legal, it may not be better either, but some things will be, and not fixing all the associated problems isnt a reason to keep it illegal.

I'm a trophy wife and yes, I excel at it.

But to be serious, I do understand there are women who choose to do this, by their own free will. I also recognize that many are victims of sex trafficking and have no say in what they are doing, under threat of injury or death. Those are the ones that make me hesitate in saying 'legalize it'.

So they are already being forced to do it, how do you believe they would be worse off by it being legal?
The fact that they could call the police takes away a small amount of power that John's and pimps currently have.

Prostitution was legalized in NZ in 2003, a review of the reform act was completed in 2008.
If a client attacks a prostitute she can file a police report. If she doesn't want to have sex with a client, she can say no, regardless of whether he's paid.

There is a nordic model that makes it legal to work as a prostitute but illegal to pay for sex, so shifts the criminality to the John's.

 

[mummabear]

Farming is legal, and yet slave-like conditions for migrant farmworkers are an ongoing problem. Prostitution would likely follow very similar patterns - whorehouse operators import/sponsor foreign women, maybe honestly or maybe by misrepresenting what they're being brought here to do, charge them "room and board" and other expenses for the privilege of living and working in their establishment, and have the ability to hold deportation over their heads to silence any complaints about the conditions. Meanwhile, the NIMBY problem (more on that below) and the stigma of visiting known whorehouses will ensure black market demand continues.

So do you think farming should be made illegal?

 

[mummabear]

I do think some people would be helped by legalization, but I think even more would be hurt. Overall, I'm not for it.

My issue lies with the women (and men) in the majority of prostitution -- this isn't the profession they chose, it was one they got into blindly and/or forcefully. And I particularly worry about sex trafficking and its potential increase if it is legalized.

It is a tricky one. I just worry about the victims . . . they got dealt an incredibly ****ty hand and can't find a way out. I don't see how legalizing it will make it any better for them.

Studies havent shown increase index work in countries wherenitnis legalised.
Legalizing does make it better, it doesnt make it perfect, but there is no downside to doing so.
All the arguments against it, are arguments against sex work as a whole, and nothing is going to stop it.

This is what I think many people miss in discussions on this topic. Legalizing is not going to magically give every prostitute a safe brothel to work at where they are receiving medical care and fair wages. The same girls (and boys)-- especially the addicts, runaways, and homeless-- will still be meeting strangers on the street, putting themselves in dangerous and abusive situations, being manipulated and held captive, etc. The only difference is that it will be "legal" so the johns and pimps will not have the fear of possible arrest holding them back.

This is it exactly, it isnt a magic bullet, but it does reduce the number of issues.

 

[Bianca and Bernard]

We lived in a county that allowed prostitution. (Northern Nevada, if you really must know).

To be a prostitute, one had to be fingerprinted, background checked, physical (including screening for drugs and STDs), and have a license to do so. No 'street trolling'; they were required to work in a 'house'. Mandatory weekly (or bi-weekly, I really can't remember) checks for drugs/STDs.

The 'houses' looked like normal businesses. They could have a sign with the name in the window, but the names were just..names (Inez's was my favorite, lol, since that's my middle). No advertising what they were anywhere around the place (only in yellow pages/internet). Doorbell to let them know you wanted in, and you had to be id'd before entering. (apparently they had a menu you could pick from, but IDK about that; I never entered one.)

never had a problem with 'street trolling', as if they were caught, they would lose their license, and it was stiff jail time. They could work for a 'house' or rent a space in a 'house' as freelance, but not work freelance anywhere else. No license, no work. I'm not sure if it was a rule, or just good business practices, but supposedly they couldn't live in the town they worked in.

Much nicer than when we lived in Aurora CO, and my DH got propositioned at the bus stop multiple times by a prostitute. Or when they'd come into the McD's we both worked at, and do their business in our bathrooms (yeah, that was always fun to have to stop).

So, yeah, I'm ok with legalized prostituion. I look at it like alcohol and marijuana. People are gonna do what they want, government might as well make money off it too.

 

[ronandannette]

...There is a nordic model that makes it legal to work as a prostitute but illegal to pay for sex, so shifts the criminality to the John's.

This part I totally don't understand. Legal to sell it but illegal to buy it? How would that even work?

 

[chickapin parterre]

Farming is legal, and yet slave-like conditions for migrant farmworkers are an ongoing problem.

where in the USA do you see this happening?. I can give you first hand experience that workers from Mexico do not work nor live in Slave-like conditions in the winter Salad Bowl of the world. Sure,they may have to live 4 to a hotel room to have more money to Western Union to mexico, but they travel in warm buses to work, they have excellent healthy work environments, there hotel is near grocery store chains so they have acesss to inexpensive food choices. They work in large groups so there back breaking activity is not continuous but they shift responsibility. They have lunch and breaks in comfort. Though like every American citizen worker, their commute is hell while sitting on the buses.

 

[low-key]

I would like to Pass Allen

 

[Disney_Alli]

I think it should be regulated and decriminalized as do all the sex workers I know.

 

[tzolkin]

This part I totally don't understand. Legal to sell it but illegal to buy it? How would that even work?

In this model it’s still illegal. But the way it’s enforced eliminates the barrier (fear of getting arrested) for prostitutes to seek medical or police help if they have been assaulted or mistreated.

 

[Boardwalk Jedi]

Yes. Regulate it, of course. Do so in a way where forced situations could be detected.

 

[mikehn]

This is interesting and potentially a double edged sword. Legalizing it could potentially change the game, especially for the participants. For the most part, buyers and sellers are now anonymous. Regulating it could change that. I cant see too many spouses buying or selling if they have to give up their name, address, and phone number.

 

[Colleen27]

So do you think farming should be made illegal?

Of course not. I do think we need to make reforms to certain employment rules that pertain to farming that encourage particularly vulnerable worker groups, but conversation about that is outside the rules of the DIS. I also think we should look at the lessons of the past and of other industries to guide us in the future, which is why I think it is relevant here.

where in the USA do you see this happening?. I can give you first hand experience that workers from Mexico do not work nor live in Slave-like conditions in the winter Salad Bowl of the world. Sure,they may have to live 4 to a hotel room to have more money to Western Union to mexico, but they travel in warm buses to work, they have excellent healthy work environments, there hotel is near grocery store chains so they have acesss to inexpensive food choices. They work in large groups so there back breaking activity is not continuous but they shift responsibility. They have lunch and breaks in comfort. Though like every American citizen worker, their commute is hell while sitting on the buses.

The most recent cases have been in the Florida tomato industry. I wouldn't consider working conditions in other countries particularly relevant to questions of U.S. industry regulation. We have a poor record on worker protection here and now, so I'm not sure legalizing another industry that is known to be highly exploitative is a good move.

 

[mummabear]

Of course not. I do think we need to make reforms to certain employment rules that pertain to farming that encourage particularly vulnerable worker groups, but conversation about that is outside the rules of the DIS. I also think we should look at the lessons of the past and of other industries to guide us in the future, which is why I think it is relevant here.

So logically those same sorts of reforms could be made to prostitution

 

[Hikergirl]

I know this is an older thread but I'm bumping because I just heard about this today.
I wonder if it will pass this year.

https://fingerlakes1.com/2020/02/10...-bill-reintroduced-to-decriminalize-sex-work/

 

[Disneypro1]

May as well legalise it. Making money is making money. And it would be a fun revenue. If someone wants to pay or receive money for that. Go for it.