Should alimony be abolished?

[dogluva]

We will quit being so defensive as soon as working moms quit looking down on us. Very simple it really it.
Now off to eat my bon bons. and watch TV.

Oh please, I hate that expression. I find it is said when there is nothing left to say.

 

[mhsjax]

Oh please, I hate that expression. I find it is said when there is nothing left to say.

ok.

 

[branv]

Well no working mom should resent a SAHM. I envy them lol. That's what I was trying to get at. I feel some SAHM exaggerate things. It is easier to be a SAHM. And I know that because I have been at home. They should be happy with their decision and thankful for the opportunity and not feel the need to justify what they do all day.

Well actually, I find it's "benign" statements like this that inflame the issue on both sides. To say "It is easier to be a SAHM" is an absolute statement that has zero basis in fact except for your anecdotal experience. How in the world does your experience make that true for every SAHM or every working mom? And why in the world are so many people running around trying to prove that what they do is harder. Who in the heck is keeping score?!

Fact: some SAHM's work harder than some working moms. Perhaps they go hard all day long, 24/7. Perhaps in ways some of us can't even fathom, including caring for a child with severe challenges, caring for elderly parents as well, doing homeschooling, caring for every single aspect of the home/family with zero outsourcing or help, etc, etc. Working mom's do not, in fact, do the same things SAHMs do, because that is physically impossible. The child does not sit in a vacuum until mom/dad get home and do every single thing in a 12 hour period that others do in a 24 hour period. Add to this that simply working outside the home doesn't always mean that work is hard. I've had plenty of jobs that consisted of hours in boring meetings twiddling my thumbs or behind a computer clicking at a keyboard. I had quite a lot of autonomy, leisurely breaks, lunches and socializing with coworkers, had mostly low or stress-free days. And I know many many people whose work days are largely along these lines.

Fact: some working mom's work considerably harder than some SAHM's. They work grueling hours, physically/mentally/emotionally demanding jobs, or just work for or with nasty nasty people that kill their spirit. They come home, have no help from a SO (or has one who makes it harder), and still give 100% to their children. Some SAHM's do the bare minimum during the day. Perhaps they barely pay attention to their child's needs, lead a lazy, slovenly lifestyle. Some outsource many hours of childcare a day to others, have a cleaning service, use restaurants rather than cooking, buy rather than make anything, etc, etc. Some have extensive girl-time and play-dates with a very social network of similar SAHM friends that get together constantly for lunch and/or park time. Yes, some are doing the equivalent of eating bon-bons in front of soap operas all day.

In short, anyone saying in one breath that they don't look down on a particular group, then in the next saying that that group has it easier or better is at best disingenuous. No one has any way of knowing that. Respect that we each have our own shoes to walk in, and we have no way of knowing if our situation is the same as another's. I wish more than anything that people would just learn to say and believe, "This is what works for me. I find it both difficult and rewarding, as I'm sure you do in your own situation. What we have in common is that we believe we're doing the best we can for our children." All this bickering, condescension and finger wagging simply comes down to two causes: insecurity or a desperate need to feel superior. Honestly, at what point do people not just get tired of playing that game?

 

[Lolsmum]

Thank you!

I stay at home. My sister worked full time until recently and is now going back to school, which also includes more hours home with her son. We both know there are pros and cons to all three of those situations and manage not to play the "I have it harder" game.

I had days, weeks even, that I would kill for adult conversation and oh how I still envy my husband's commute: 2 hours a day on a train with a book, usually with a seat, with nobody asking me to do anything. I watch the couples who both have careers like his and how much harder it gets once kids are added to the mix, especially if no family to help out is nearby. We, as a couple, decided that wouldn't work for us and I stepped back to allow his career to flourish. Others make other choices and that is fine. There is no single right answer to how to make a family work. I have never once claimed working mothers don't work hard or aren't raising their kids. Those attitudes have been fairly rare on this thread when compared to the SAHMs don't work or don't work as hard attitude.

 

[dogluva]

ok.

What are Bon Ons anyway?

 

[WDW in Pearls]

Not to be devil's advocate here, but if its so hard to be a SAHM and easier to be a working mom, why don't the SAHM moms get back into the work force?

 

[dogluva]

I don't think that either mother work harder than the other when there are pre school kids at home. But don't tell me the mothers who have kids in school all day work harder than those that work. My neighbor puts her daughter on the bus at 8 and doesn't need to pick her up until 3. She has seven hours to do her shopping, cleaning and everything else needed to do to take care of her family. I go to work at 8:15, right agree my daughter get on the bus. I work from 8:30 until 3:45. Oh yes, I get a 40 minute lunch which I very rarely take due to things I try to get done so I don't have to take as much home. I also work with special needs children, ages 6-10. Then I come home and try to do what she has done along with driving my daughter to some activities (not every day). So I really think it is a stretch to say that SAH mothers who have kids in school all day work harder than Working mothers. I just don't see it unless you are caring for an elderly or sick relative. Volunteering is just that, volunteering, I think it is noble but you have more control of what you choose to do. I also volunteer but don't consider this work. Anyway, maybe I am wrong but when your kids are in school all day, life for a stay at home mother has to be easier.

Personally, I couldn't do it. I am home in the summer and try to keep busy with my younger kids ( and older when they have time for me) but when the end of August comes, we are all ready to go back to school. When they were younger, it was definitely harder but my youngest is ten so she doesn't need me physically anymore.

 

[EnduringWone]

Not to be devil's advocate here, but if its so hard to be a SAHM and easier to be a working mom, why don't the SAHM moms get back into the work force?

The same thing can be said for those of you that work outside the home.

 

[dogluva]

The same thing can be said for those of you that work outside the home.

Because sometimes it means that we would not be able to feed our kids or have a roof impoverished our heads, give me a break.

 

[WDW in Pearls]

The same thing can be said for those of you that work outside the home.

Well that's easy, financial reasons. Many families can't afford a single income.

Also, why are we assuming the stay at home parent is always the wife and not the husband?

Again, just food for thought.

 

[dogluva]

Because sometimes it means that we would not be able to feed our kids or have a roof impoverished our heads, give me a break.

Over!

 

[WDW in Pearls]

Over!

Didn't see your reply before mine. Sorry to pretty much repeat what you've already said! I think it's easier to live with more money than less.

 

[EnduringWone]

Exactly!

I had to stay home with my son for a time because of some health issues.

It was cake compared to working full time.

I think this is the root of the mommy wars. Stay at home moms are very defensive and braggart like about what they do while working moms know they do the exact same things. No one begrudges you staying home, just do make out like you have it so much harder or are more present for your kids than anyone else. Food for thought, maybe if you feel looked down on, you are bringing it on yourselves.

I am out if this discussion as I have stated my point. Will agree to disagree.

And right back to you. SAHM are more present for their kids, they are not at outside work during the day, duh. And there are many outside work moms that are defensive and brag.

I think as families we do our best to do what is right for our families, whether it be working outside the home or working in the home. The "Mommy Wars" are ridiculous and women should just respect and support each other regardless of their decision of being in the home full-time or working outside of it.

As far as alimony, no it should not be abolished. A parent that stays home for a lengthy period of time should be compensated. Assets are split in divorces and the other spouse's "equity" in their job that the sahp helped build should be taken into consideration when it comes to alimony.

 

[dogluva]

Didn't see your reply before mine. Sorry to pretty much repeat what you've already said! I think it's easier to live with more money than less.

No worries! I kind of need my income so I really don't have a choice unless I win the lottery. It all good, I love my job.

 

[DVCJones]

I think if someone cheats on their spouse, they should pay alimony. For the simple reason of the other spouse should not have to experience any financial hardships because of their cheating spouse.

 

[WDW in Pearls]

No worries! I kind of need my income so I really don't have a choice unless I win the lottery. It all good, I love my job.

Same. Even I can afford to stay home with my kids one day I probably won't. I love my job. Besides, I think it's healthy to have that socialization and sense of identity, for me at least. No disrespect to SAHMs, I just take a lot of pride in my career and don't think I'm a bad person/parent if I don't give it up.

 

[WDW in Pearls]

I think if someone cheats on their spouse, they should pay alimony. For the simple reason of the other spouse should not have to experience any financial hardships because of their cheating spouse.

I agree. I work with a guy whose wife cheated on him, and even disappeared on him for a few months, leaving him alone to take care of the kids. Now that they're working out the divorce, she wants alimony. Uh...?

 

[mhsjax]

What are Bon Ons anyway?

I really don't know. I think it came form Peg Bundy on the show Married with Children. I think they are little chocolate covered ice cream things.

 

[wdwmom3]

Why would you still be doing everything and working full time? I've done the working mom thing. I've done the SAHM thing. I've done a few in-between things too (like the full time college student/mom thing, and the work from home mom thing). You know what? I don't think any one is unequivocably harder than the others. When I worked DH did more around the house and we set the bar lower for some things (ate out rather than cooking more often, kept the house tidy but did the deep-cleaning less often, volunteered less, didn't bake from scratch or grow veggies or things like that, etc). I certainly wasn't working 40 hours, commuting 10, and doing everything I do now - there quite simply aren't enough hours in the day for that. And I think no matter what your responsibilities are - at work, at home, in a marriage, as a parent, in any role you have in life - it will sometimes feel like work. You'll have days where you'd rather sleep in, when you just want to call in sick or order pizza instead of cooking dinner, when you feel like you're going to scream if you get another "urgent" e-mail or step on another Lego, whatever. Life is work. Parenting is work. Working is work. Marriage is work. Nothing is easy-fun-playtime all the time. But a lot of people seem to think staying home is for some reason.

Well when I was home with my kids it never felt like work. I loved it so much and cherished it.

But I don't see why there is even this argument. Who cares what other people think about what you do with your time. Why justify things to people. Just live your life how you think is best and be happy with that. I think we need to live our lives for us not for other people.

 

[chobie]

Well that's easy, financial reasons. Many families can't afford a single income.

Also, why are we assuming the stay at home parent is always the wife and not the husband?

Again, just food for thought.

Because they are mostly women and this argument is between women. Men don't care about this issue. And women tend swoon all over men who are SAHDs and give lots of .