Seven Dwarves So Close...

[KaLyn]

I'm beginning to think that Avatar Land will be open before The Seven Dwarves Mine Train... Seems like they've been building this since the 1980's! Jim

Hahahaha! Really though, how long have they been building it?

 

[JimS4210]

Hahahaha! Really though, how long have they been building it?

I think they broke ground late summer/early fall 2012. So by the time they finish, it will have taken two years to build. Thank God they've opened up all of those Princess meet and greets in the meantime to keep up with Universal!

Jim

 

[Mad Hattered]

~It just doesn't take that long to build a coaster. If June is the date then Disney is looking to face off against Universal this summer. Disney also moved Malificent's box office date to May 30, 2014 -- you might as well say June to upstage Jurassic World which was set for release on June 12, 2014. Universal took note and has wisely bowed out of that losing battle by pushing Jurassic World all the way back to June of 2015. Bummer.

The film being pushed back to 2015 would also coincide with the rumored Jurassic Park expansion in IOA that is scheduled to be completed about the same time. It would breathe new life into that area and the new film would renew interest in the IP. Actually delaying the film could be brilliant on Universal's part.

But yeah, I can't believe that Disney would want to time this with Diagon's opening. That would be suicide. They have been working on this coaster for over 2 years now. Check out the link below and you can see how far they've come since December of 2011.

http://pix.aerog.com/Images/Disney/Disney-world-aerials/i-3dzQ4gj/A

 

[Mad Hattered]

I think they broke ground late summer/early fall 2012. So by the time they finish, it will have taken two years to build. Thank God they've opened up all of those Princess meet and greets in the meantime to keep up with Universal!

Jim

They broke ground on it around October 2011. See the link in my post above.

 

[skater]

I'm making this statement as a person uneducated in building attractions, but seriously, it does seem like an extremely long time to build a small roller coaster. Even taking the wonderful Disney theming into account.

 

[Mad Hattered]

I'm making this statement as a person uneducated in building attractions, but seriously, it does seem like an extremely long time to build a small roller coaster. Even taking the wonderful Disney theming into account.

Yes, especially considering that Universal didn't even start demolishing the JAWS ride sad until the end of January, 2012. In that time they have nearly finished an entire land with many ground-breaking attractions. People can say what they want, but Universal is just as good, if not better, at theming these days.

 

[jhaig]

Yes, especially considering that Universal didn't even start demolishing the JAWS ride sad until the end of January, 2012. In that time they have nearly finished an entire land with many ground-breaking attractions. People can say what they want, but Universal is just as good, if not better, at theming these days.

Agreed. In a theme park war, Disney is outgunned at this time. Diagon Alley vs a kiddie coaster? No contest.

 

[Brian Noble]

Yes, especially considering that Universal didn't even start demolishing the JAWS ride () until the end of January, 2012. In that time they have nearly finished an entire land with many ground-breaking attractions.

Well, to be fair, the first New Fantasyland construction walls went up in February 2010, and everything *but* 7DMT---Belle, Be Our Guest, Mermaid, Ariel's new M&G, and all of Storybook Circus (essentially, everything past Barnstormer was replaced from Toontown) was fully open by November '12---2 years and 10 months. That's just a bit longer than the Diagon Alley construction.

I'm not sure why the coaster is taking so much longer, but it was a rather late addition to the New Fantasyland plans, and they are trying to complete it in the middle of an otherwise operating theme park.

 

[Yellowstonetim]

Agreed. In a theme park war, Disney is outgunned at this time. Diagon Alley vs a kiddie coaster? No contest.

I don't know that Universal is so perfect. We went to both this past year. My daughter, who is a HP nerd, loved the HP ride and the HP shops but thought it was too little and far too small and cramped.

We all agreed that Universal was definitely second tier in many ways. Not much in merchandise, not enough rides and good attractions. Yes HP was fantastic but they realized it was way too small.

The idea for Jurassic Park was good, but the animatronics were abysmal compared to Disney. Doom's Fear Fall was lame. Spiderman was good. They could have done much better. My kids decided it wasn't a full day park. And having to pay for FP that doesn't include HP is terrible!

Disney has so much more, and we - even though my HP loving daughter is an adult - like Fantasy land. Much of it is fantastic! And there are so many good rides. I also wouldn't term the mine train a "kiddie" ride. I think it is going to be so much better. The swinging cars look cool. However it is a given that Universal is more geared to older teens and adults whereas Disney is for the whole family.

I believe Disney will be able to use the technology in HP after 5 years have passed, according to the agreements with Universal. It will be interesting to see if Disney uses the tech for something such as Star Wars or Pandora.

Of course it is only Disney, so it is understandable that so many consider it second rate. It's not like the know what they are doing or have the most successful parks or anything.

 

[skater]

Yes, especially considering that Universal didn't even start demolishing the JAWS ride sad until the end of January, 2012. In that time they have nearly finished an entire land with many ground-breaking attractions. People can say what they want, but Universal is just as good, if not better, at theming these days.

Disney gets me back every year based on nostalgia and the incredible memories we've made there as a family. There's a lot to be said for eating that tuna fish sandwich every year and remembering the time DS danced around the tables and knocked over a chair to the loud laughter of his siblings. And countless other memories like that. I'm crazy about Disney and literally cry with relief every time I'm able to get myself down there. But I admit, with the recent changes, feeling like I'm getting less for my money, and watching Universal add so many new attractions, I'm considering giving it a whirl soon. Especially with two older boys who would love it. And if I'm understanding the FOTL system correctly, it sounds like they beat out FP+ by leaps and bounds for ease of touring.

 

[skater]

I don't know that Universal is so perfect. We went to both this past year. My daughter, who is a HP nerd, loved the HP ride and the HP shops but thought it was too little and far too small and cramped.

We all agreed that Universal was definitely second tier in many ways. Not much in merchandise, not enough rides and good attractions. Yes HP was fantastic but they realized it was way too small.

The idea for Jurassic Park was good, but the animatronics were abysmal compared to Disney. Doom's Fear Fall was lame. Spiderman was good. They could have done much better. My kids decided it wasn't a full day park. And having to pay for FP that doesn't include HP is terrible!

Disney has so much more, and we - even though my HP loving daughter is an adult - like Fantasy land. Much of it is fantastic! And there are so many good rides. I also wouldn't term the mine train a "kiddie" ride. I think it is going to be so much better. The swinging cars look cool. However it is a given that Universal is more geared to older teens and adults whereas Disney is for the whole family.

I believe Disney will be able to use the technology in HP after 5 years have passed, according to the agreements with Universal. It will be interesting to see if Disney uses the tech for something such as Star Wars or Pandora.

Of course it is only Disney, so it is understandable that so many consider it second rate. It's not like the know what they are doing or have the most successful parks or anything.

I am finding that I enjoyed the "old" FantasyLand much more than the new one so far. I'm hoping I'll feel differently once its completed. Getting into the new part is cramped and crowded. The double Dumbo is nice and definitely an improvement for younger families. The bathrooms and circus themed store are cool, but not really attractions (maybe that's debatable ). The stress of trying to get a adr for BOG or worse yet, waiting in line for lunch just feels ridiculous and not worth it. I still enjoy PP, and Philharmagic as much as anything in the new Fantasyland. Right now, the crowds over there make me not even want to waste the steps unless I have a fp or an adr. And even then, who knows if the LM ride is even operating as I've had some bad luck with that one!

 

[surferdave]

Well, to be fair, the first New Fantasyland construction walls went up in February 2010, and everything *but* 7DMT---Belle, Be Our Guest, Mermaid, Ariel's new M&G, and all of Storybook Circus (essentially, everything past Barnstormer was replaced from Toontown) was fully open by November '12---2 years and 10 months. That's just a bit longer than the Diagon Alley construction.

I'm not sure why the coaster is taking so much longer, but it was a rather late addition to the New Fantasyland plans, and they are trying to complete it in the middle of an otherwise operating theme park.

I was hoping to be a lot more impressed with New Fantasyland. They put up some really pretty buildings and you can meet princesses until the cows come home, but the one new actual attraction - Voyage of the Little Mermaid - looked noticeably unfinished inside. The result of moving the kiddie coaster and adding the second midway spinner to Dumbo was creating a section of the park that reminds me of Dinoland, my least favorite part of any of the parks, in that the theme is a cheap amusement park. I think the coaster has a lot of ground to make up for this expansion.

 

[Yellowstonetim]

When Universal gets anywhere near 50% of Magic Kingdom's attendance, then we can begin to talk about Universal getting better. They have a long, long, long, long way to go. HP is great. Spiderman is good. That's about it.

It is like comparing a Ford Focus to a Ferrari. Yes the Ford has cool Bluetooth, but step back and look at the whole and that same Ford isn't even in the same league or comparable.

We spend 7 to 10 days at Disney, including one lone day at Universal. (Sometimes, not every trip.)

 

[Mad Hattered]

I don't know that Universal is so perfect. We went to both this past year. My daughter, who is a HP nerd, loved the HP ride and the HP shops but thought it was too little and far too small and cramped.

We all agreed that Universal was definitely second tier in many ways. Not much in merchandise, not enough rides and good attractions. Yes HP was fantastic but they realized it was way too small.

The idea for Jurassic Park was good, but the animatronics were abysmal compared to Disney. Doom's Fear Fall was lame. Spiderman was good. They could have done much better. My kids decided it wasn't a full day park. And having to pay for FP that doesn't include HP is terrible!

Disney has so much more, and we - even though my HP loving daughter is an adult - like Fantasy land. Much of it is fantastic! And there are so many good rides. I also wouldn't term the mine train a "kiddie" ride. I think it is going to be so much better. The swinging cars look cool. However it is a given that Universal is more geared to older teens and adults whereas Disney is for the whole family.

I believe Disney will be able to use the technology in HP after 5 years have passed, according to the agreements with Universal. It will be interesting to see if Disney uses the tech for something such as Star Wars or Pandora.

Of course it is only Disney, so it is understandable that so many consider it second rate. It's not like the know what they are doing or have the most successful parks or anything.

In order of bolded:

Tell your daughter not to be mad at Universal for the size. The size was determined and controlled by JK Rowling.

By "so many good rides" do you mean the ONE actual ride they have in New Fantasyland?

Pandora will more like Soarin' and not resemble FJ in any way.

 

[Mad Hattered]

When Universal gets anywhere near 50% of Magic Kingdom's attendance, then we can begin to talk about Universal getting better. They have a long, long, long, long way to go. HP is great. Spiderman is good. That's about it.

It is like comparing a Ford Focus to a Ferrari. Yes the Ford has cool Bluetooth, but step back and look at the whole and that same Ford isn't even in the same league or comparable.

We spend 7 to 10 days at Disney, including one lone day at Universal. (Sometimes, not every trip.)

You do realize that DISNEY barely gets 50% of MKs attendance in 2 of it's 4 parks....on their own property, right?

 

[Yellowstonetim]

And as far as theming goes, Fantasy land and BOG are great, but I was so very disappointed in Seuss land at Universal. I love Dr Seuss and this was one of the main things I wanted to see. It could have been so much more. Some of it looked nice, but after that. Pffffft. Everyone LOVES Dr. Seuss. Universal missed a real opportunity here. I wonder if it is because they want to pursue more adult focused rides such as HP and Spidey.

 

[Jennasis]

When Universal gets anywhere near 50% of Magic Kingdom's attendance, then we can begin to talk about Universal getting better. They have a long, long, long, long way to go. HP is great. Spiderman is good. That's about it.

It is like comparing a Ford Focus to a Ferrari. Yes the Ford has cool Bluetooth, but step back and look at the whole and that same Ford isn't even in the same league or comparable.

We spend 7 to 10 days at Disney, including one lone day at Universal. (Sometimes, not every trip.)

You are certainly entitled to that opinion, but you simply cannot discount or disregard the fact that others feel differently. I personally couldn't spend more than a day at IoA or USO. There's isn't enough for me to do...but what I DO do (hehehe...doodoo) is a boatload of fun. Universal IS, IMO making terrific inroads and continuing to pour MASSIVE amounts of capital back into the parks..something I wish Disney would do (spend money on attractions). The promise of, sigh, Avatarland is a step in a direction (the right one? I dunno yet). If they announce Star Wars Land I swear I'll never set foot in USO ever again out of gratitude and loyalty!

Anyhoo...we WDW diehards will generally continue to think of USO as the red headed step child and WDW as the golden-boy he is...but that step-kid...he's been pretty impressive lately.

 

[Yellowstonetim]

You do realize that DISNEY barely gets 50% of MKs attendance in 2 of it's 4 parks....on their own property, right?

Yes, that is why I said we can talk about Universal's success when it reaches those lofty levels that are 50% of MK! Those parks ALL BEAT UNIVERSAL by half again as much!!! Universal even beats its original Hollywood park only because it is located near Disney. Universal Orlando wouldn't exist except it lives off the table scraps of Disney. And when I visited Universal for the first time this year, I understood why. A few good rides but NOTHING to compare with Disney. But hey, Universal got a 0.2% bigger increase in 2012 than MK (2.5 to 2.3) Woo hoo! 6 mill. Definitely second tier for a long time to come.



2012
1. Magic Kingdom: 17,536,000 (+2.3% change)
2. Disneyland Park: 15,963,000 (-1.1% )
3. Tokyo Disneyland: 14,847,000 (+8.5%)
4. Tokyo Disney Sea: 12,656,000 (+8.5%)
5. Disneyland Park, Disneyland Paris: 11,200,000 (+1.9%)
6. Epcot: 11,063,000 (+2.2%)
7. Disney’s Animal Kingdom: 9,998,000 (+2.2%)
8. Disney’s Hollywood Studios: 9,912,000 (+2.2%)
9. Universal Studios Japan: 9,700,000 (+14.1%)
10. Islands of Adventure: 7,981,000 (+4%)

11. Disney California Adventure: 7,775,000 (+22.6%)
12. Ocean Park (Hong Kong): 7, 436,000 (+6.9%)
13. Everland (South Korea): 6,853,000 (+4.3%)
14. Hong Kong Disneyland: 6,700,000 (+13.6%)
15. Lotte World (South Korea): 6,383,000 (10.4%)
16. Universal Studios Orlando: 6,195,000 (+2.5%)
17. Universal Studios Hollywood: 5,912,000 (+15%)

 

[Yellowstonetim]

You are certainly entitled to that opinion, but you simply cannot discount or disregard the fact that others feel differently. I personally couldn't spend more than a day at IoA or USO. There's isn't enough for me to do...but what I DO do (hehehe...doodoo) is a boatload of fun. Universal IS, IMO making terrific inroads and continuing to pour MASSIVE amounts of capital back into the parks..something I wish Disney would do (spend money on attractions). The promise of, sigh, Avatarland is a step in a direction (the right one? I dunno yet). If they announce Star Wars Land I swear I'll never set foot in USO ever again out of gratitude and loyalty!

Anyhoo...we WDW diehards will generally continue to think of USO as the red headed step child and WDW as the golden-boy he is...but that step-kid...he's been pretty impressive lately.

Yes, everyone is welcome to their opinion. And doo doo.

Yes, Universal is fun. But I agree with your last part. I actually want Universal to do even better. Competition is good. I also want Disney to do more rides. I think Pandora and Star Wars will be great. But there is still a huge gap in many ways.

 

[Mad Hattered]

Yes, that is why I said we can talk about Universal's success when it reaches those lofty levels that are 50% of MK! Those parks ALL BEAT UNIVERSAL by half again as much!!! Universal even beats its original Hollywood park only because it is located near Disney. Universal Orlando wouldn't exist except it lives off the table scraps of Disney. And when I visited Universal for the first time this year, I understood why. A few good rides but NOTHING to compare with Disney. But hey, Universal got a 0.2% bigger increase in 2012 than MK (2.5 to 2.3) Woo hoo! 6 mill. Definitely second tier for a long time to come.



2012
1. Magic Kingdom: 17,536,000 (+2.3% change)
2. Disneyland Park: 15,963,000 (-1.1% )
3. Tokyo Disneyland: 14,847,000 (+8.5%)
4. Tokyo Disney Sea: 12,656,000 (+8.5%)
5. Disneyland Park, Disneyland Paris: 11,200,000 (+1.9%)
6. Epcot: 11,063,000 (+2.2%)
7. Disneys Animal Kingdom: 9,998,000 (+2.2%)
8. Disneys Hollywood Studios: 9,912,000 (+2.2%)
9. Universal Studios Japan: 9,700,000 (+14.1%)
10. Islands of Adventure: 7,981,000 (+4%)

11. Disney California Adventure: 7,775,000 (+22.6%)
12. Ocean Park (Hong Kong): 7, 436,000 (+6.9%)
13. Everland (South Korea): 6,853,000 (+4.3%)
14. Hong Kong Disneyland: 6,700,000 (+13.6%)
15. Lotte World (South Korea): 6,383,000 (10.4%)
16. Universal Studios Orlando: 6,195,000 (+2.5%)
17. Universal Studios Hollywood: 5,912,000 (+15%)

Yes, I am very aware of the numbers. Why is it that you think MK had 17.5 million visitors and DHS only had 9.9 million?

I'm also aware that IOA had a 30.2% increase in attendance after Potter opened. You do realize they are building a bigger better land on the Universal side of the park, correct?

You do realize there are plans to add additional rides to Jurassic Park, right? You do realize there are plans to add a Kong attraction to IOA, right? You do realize there are plans to build a big water park with a Minion Island, right? You do realize there are plans to overhaul the Woody's Kid Zone, right?

You do realize that Comcast has committed to investing $1.5 billion in it's parks over the next 5 years, right? Where Universal is investing money on attractions in it's parks, Disney invested that same amount in a weak plan (MM+) to try to keep people from going to Universal to enjoy the new enhancements. You may think Universal is second tier and write them off. I guarantee that Disney doesn't think that now.

It's all really funny when you stop to think about it!