Scientology

[stitch'sgirl]

I can't fathom how anyone who reads the whole Xenu story and the understands the concepts of the "religion" can do anything but laugh hysterically. It is so ludicrous! I mean, even if you don't know a whole lot about it, just knowing they make you sign a billion year pledge when you join their Sea Org should be a clue that you are dealing with complete whack jobs.

In the latest A&E episode, Leah had said that if a member talks about Xenu they are fined $100,000 and cause the person they are talking to about it to die.
I think Leah is so brave. Not many people could live under the kind of unrelenting stress she's got to be going through. She brushes it off and acts tough but it's got to be unnerving. In some way it reminds me of getting tangled up in the mafia.

 

[mummabear]

I too find this whole topic fascinating. I watched the 20/20 show and have also read Leah's book as well as Ron's book "Ruthless". I cannot understand how this cult can be called a religion. IMO, it exists because of systematic brainwashing that is being literally "sold" as clearing your reactive mind to reach enlightenment and save the world. If nothing else, I am surprised it cannot be be stopped due to laws that protect the consumer against false claims of industry or bait -and -switch.

I think that can be said about "most" religions.

I do think Scientology is particularly crazy and doesn't do any public good where many organised religions do give back to their communities but many people mention "how can anyone believe that?"(or similar sentiments), and that is basically what an Atheist thinks about any religion

 

[barkley]

I can't fathom how anyone who reads the whole Xenu story and the understands the concepts of the "religion" can do anything but laugh hysterically. It is so ludicrous! I mean, even if you don't know a whole lot about it, just knowing they make you sign a billion year pledge when you join their Sea Org should be a clue that you are dealing with complete whack jobs.

it's only been in recent years that the xenu concept has become public knowledge via former members. the concept isn't introduced to scientologists until-I believe-they reach OT 3 which takes years. it's not like they will hear about it ahead of time from another member, even their closest family b/c the prohibition on speaking about it includes speaking about it to other scientologists. so you've got people who joined years ago or were raised in it-with years and years of conditioning in the program so that when it's finally revealed to them are prone to be more accepting of it.

as for sea org-while the bulk of the people on the a&e show are former members, the bulk of scientologists are not. it's an 'elite' group that's apparently extremely selective and considered a very high honor to be a part of , again-very secretive-so the basic members wouldn't be aware of the billion year contracts.


leah has said publicly that the membership numbers that are publicized are grossly inflated-and that the bulk of 'new memberships' are by virtue of generational participants. members who have kids that were raised in it who then have their own kids who are raised in it. in those families they've never been exposed to any of the media coverage b/c members are not allowed to read or view anything on the church other than church issued materials-it's considered detrimental to them b/c it comes from 's.p.'s'.

 

[mco65]

I can kind of see how people in in the 60s/70s got involved (sort of), but in this day and age I can't imagine how anybody could join a religion that was created by a science fiction writer who had been known to say that the easiest way to become rich is to start a religion!!!

I don't think they get a TON of new recruits... i would bet that most 'new' members are simply BORN into it.

 

[Grace&Carolinesmom]

I think that can be said about "most" religions.

I do think Scientology is particularly crazy and doesn't do any public good where many organised religions do give back to their communities but many people mention "how can anyone believe that?"(or similar sentiments), and that is basically what an Atheist thinks about any religion

Respectfully, I do not agree with your assessment of "most" religions being similar. Most religions publish/display their beliefs for all to see without being required to pay for the privilege. Your participation is voluntary and there is no mandatory systematic punishment levied financially and from other members. Might one be asked to contribute? Yes. Might one be chastised verbally or by guilt of not following one's declared beliefs? Yes. I cannot equate these with Scientology mandates and practices. It thrives on brainwashing and financial control, of which it requires to stay in existence.

I can see where an Atheist may lump all religions together but again, I do not believe Scientology is a religion. IMO, it is a cult hiding behind religious freedom to further its financial and mental control of its members to benefit the ego and lifestyle afforded to its top echelon.

 

[kidshop]

I think that can be said about "most" religions.

I do think Scientology is particularly crazy and doesn't do any public good where many organised religions do give back to their communities but many people mention "how can anyone believe that?"(or similar sentiments), and that is basically what an Atheist thinks about any religion

I think that can be said about "most" religions.

I do think Scientology is particularly crazy and doesn't do any public good where many organised religions do give back to their communities but many people mention "how can anyone believe that?"(or similar sentiments), and that is basically what an Atheist thinks about any religion

I do not have issues with the beliefs, that is not the important thing to know about Scientology. It is the controlling of the members, the extremely high cost to belong, and the shunning and breaking up of families that this cult requires: that is what Leah is trying to expose IMO You cannot leave without escaping, you are then tracked down, all the while they harass your family and friends, and then the 'church' actively attacks you and your reputation, trying to destroy your life. Because you left the cult and told others what happened to you. I can't think of any other religion that would picket you..and want to destroy you for leaving.

I did laugh in the last episode when the neighbor who disconnected wanted to still see the dog!! LOL twisted stuff!

 

[StitchesGr8Fan]

Reading through the thread, I see mention of a book called Dianetics. Was there a commercial in the 80's or 90's for that book, or am I hallucinating? I remember a cryptic commercial advertising a book that would change people's way of thinking.

 

[barkley]

Reading through the thread, I see mention of a book called Dianetics. Was there a commercial in the 80's or 90's for that book, or am I hallucinating? I remember a cryptic commercial advertising a book that would change people's way of thinking.

there were commercials-and the books were also handed out for free in public places (they would set up a table and offer people a book that 'will change your life'). I have to say that the members pushing the book that I encountered many times near where I used to live were very polite/not pushy/seemed genuinely enthusiastic. if someone expressed that they weren't interested that was it-no negative statements about their choice not to read it/learn more (unlike most of the other religions that solicited members in the same area-express 'not interested' and get told in no uncertain terms where you were damning yourself eternally to).

 

[CdnCarrie]

I do not have issues with the beliefs, that is not the important thing to know about Scientology. It is the controlling of the members, the extremely high cost to belong, and the shunning and breaking up of families that this cult requires: that is what Leah is trying to expose IMO You cannot leave without escaping, you are then tracked down, all the while they harass your family and friends, and then the 'church' actively attacks you and your reputation, trying to destroy your life. Because you left the cult and told others what happened to you. I can't think of any other religion that would picket you..and want to destroy you for leaving.

I did laugh in the last episode when the neighbor who disconnected wanted to still see the dog!! LOL twisted stuff!

But the dog would be confused and wouldn't understand! (never mind the kids next door who couldn't even talk to their grandparents down the street.....)

I'm not sure how selective Sea Org is after reading several biographies and watching the show. I think they will take anyone willing to join and will follow orders.
Sea Org is not the top executives. They are the slaves who do all the grunt work including the laundry for the executives.
You do have to be a good Sea Org cadet to be trained to be an auditor.

Jenna Miscavage describes the training and it sounds crazy - they have to sit for 2 hours without moving. Bait each other for hours on end. Yell at the wall. Order others to yell at the wall. It's all very bizarre.

 

[prprincess]

Reading through the thread, I see mention of a book called Dianetics. Was there a commercial in the 80's or 90's for that book, or am I hallucinating? I remember a cryptic commercial advertising a book that would change people's way of thinking.

No you're not. I remember the commercials clearly--it was of a volcano exploding. And I recall that my mom purchased the book and read it. At the time, my father had just passed away and she was into reading self-help books. I don't recall what she thought of it, since I was a kid, but thank goodness it didn't get any further than that!!

 

[Domo]

No you're not. I remember the commercials clearly--it was of a volcano exploding. And I recall that my mom purchased the book and read it. At the time, my father had just passed away and she was into reading self-help books. I don't recall what she thought of it, since I was a kid, but thank goodness it didn't get any further than that!!

Watch this. If it's even half true, Scientology is pretty messed up!

https://www.buzzfeed.com/whitneyjef...lieve?utm_term=.jkZXbNz58K&sub=1649856_405932

 

[mummabear]

Your participation is voluntary and there is no mandatory systematic punishment levied financially and from other members. Might one be asked to contribute? Yes.

Many people are born into a religion that their parents have chosen for them.
Several churches announce how much each family has "donated".
Several do this while the Pastor use that money to live in luxury.

It thrives on brainwashing

I would argue that all religions do this.

Scientology is clearly not there to help people, they do no good where most other churches are contributing to their communities.
However Scientology doesn't ask the government to make laws or exemption of laws for their beliefs either.

 

[kimblebee]

Watch this. If it's even half true, Scientology is pretty messed up!

https://www.buzzfeed.com/whitneyjef...lieve?utm_term=.jkZXbNz58K&sub=1649856_405932

Wooooooow......

 

[prestoncaldwell]

Reading through the thread, I see mention of a book called Dianetics. Was there a commercial in the 80's or 90's for that book, or am I hallucinating? I remember a cryptic commercial advertising a book that would change people's way of thinking.

70s and 80s.

 

[bcla]

there were commercials-and the books were also handed out for free in public places (they would set up a table and offer people a book that 'will change your life'). I have to say that the members pushing the book that I encountered many times near where I used to live were very polite/not pushy/seemed genuinely enthusiastic. if someone expressed that they weren't interested that was it-no negative statements about their choice not to read it/learn more (unlike most of the other religions that solicited members in the same area-express 'not interested' and get told in no uncertain terms where you were damning yourself eternally to).

From what I understand, the "church" would actually purchase copies of Dianetics in order to keep it on various bestseller lists. These were likely copies that were handed out for free.

 

[Magpie]

Many people are born into a religion that their parents have chosen for them.
Several churches announce how much each family has "donated".
Several do this while the Pastor use that money to live in luxury.

I would argue that all religions do this.

Scientology is clearly not there to help people, they do no good where most other churches are contributing to their communities.
However Scientology doesn't ask the government to make laws or exemption of laws for their beliefs either.

With regards to "thriving on brainwashing", I'd say "many", but definitely not all.

There are religious movements that encourage individual thought and freedom of conscience. Modern Quakers, and Unitarians, are two I know quite well. Heck, you can be a Unitarian Atheist, if you like. I once had a pastor who described himself that way!

Also, every Jesuit priest I've ever come across seems to thrive on debate and intellectual challenge. Judaism, also, appears to encourage individual thought and discourages hasty conversions. At least, Reform Judaism does (I'm not very familiar with other kinds).

 

[bcla]

it's only been in recent years that the xenu concept has become public knowledge via former members. the concept isn't introduced to scientologists until-I believe-they reach OT 3 which takes years. it's not like they will hear about it ahead of time from another member, even their closest family b/c the prohibition on speaking about it includes speaking about it to other scientologists. so you've got people who joined years ago or were raised in it-with years and years of conditioning in the program so that when it's finally revealed to them are prone to be more accepting of it.

It's actually been somewhat public since at least the 80s. I read about it maybe 30 years ago in a book called Bigger Secrets, which was about various things that people attempted to keep secret from the general public. Someone sued the Church of Scientology. During the proceedings, some of the sci-fi-like material became part of the court record and were made available to the public. The author of the book I read wrote that the church sent people to the court clerk to attempt to buy out every copy that they prepared, but there were also reporters in line. This was well before most stuff would be made made available online as PDF documents.

The guy who sued them has a description of what happened:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lawrence_Wollersheim

Wollersheim is also a former Scientologist. He sued the Church of Scientology in 1980. The story of Xenu was made public when Church materials detailing the Operating Thetan were used as exhibits. In Wollersheim’s court case Scientology's "top secret" materials about Xenu and their beliefs in past alien invasions of Earth was filed with the LA court on his behalf and then copied from court records and published by media all over the world.​

 

[RedAngie]

It seems the Unification Church (Moonies), similar in some respects to Scientology, is rarely mentioned anymore, even though it still exists. I remember in the 1970s and early 80s members used to hang out in airports and other public places to solicit donations and proselytize.

 

[maxiesmom]

Many people are born into a religion that their parents have chosen for them.
Several churches announce how much each family has "donated".
Several do this while the Pastor use that money to live in luxury.

I would argue that all religions do this.

Scientology is clearly not there to help people, they do no good where most other churches are contributing to their communities.
However Scientology doesn't ask the government to make laws or exemption of laws for their beliefs either.

Most other religions don't force you to separate from your family if they decide to not stay with the church. Most other religions don't spy on or harass former members. Or put up hate web sites about former members.

 

[Domo]

Religion is what you take away from it. In all honesty I have had a very rocky decade - serious illness, dangerous procedures, shocking side effects, pill upon pill... but I take away from my religion a message of unconditional love and peace. So yeah... I guess there is such a thing as a selfless religion.