Sateroom attendant

[Kwami]

But, if you’re from a country such as Egypt, Indonesia, Nicaragua, Pakistan, Ukraine, etc., when compared to the average wages in that country (on average, up to a few hundred USD per month… but to a fair degree, costs are commensurate), I think you’re making significantly greater than the average wage back home, pre-tip. For an eye-opening perspective, look into what the average cardiologist in Egypt earns.

Yeah, but a lot of the employees from those countries are leaving behind spouses and children to take these jobs, too. They'd better make a lot of money compared to the alternatives or else nobody would take these jobs.

 

[Mags2002]

Perspective is everything. If you’re a ‘1st world’ working professional, university student, or fresh uni. graduate taking a gap year and working in this service capacity, it’s probably not all that awesome. At all. Maybe the same is true for somebody from the same country who was never a university student, but does have hundreds of dollars a month in car payments, high rent, etc.

But, if you’re from a country such as Egypt, Indonesia, Nicaragua, Pakistan, Ukraine, etc., when compared to the average wages in that country (on average, up to a few hundred USD per month… but to a fair degree, costs are commensurate), I think you’re making significantly greater than the average wage back home, pre-tip. For an eye-opening perspective, look into what the average cardiologist in Egypt earns.

Again, I’m not here to bash tips. I do tip for competently performed services. I am opposed to ‘mandatory gratuities’. Particularly when folks deride and aver/allude that the worker is going to be hard-up, but for those tips flowing.

One thing Disney does extremely well is service recovery. But they need to be aware of the problem immediately, not at the end of the cruise or when you are home when nothing can be done. This goes for any problem. Let us do what we do best and leave you with that magical “I’ve just been to Disney” feeling rather than disappointment and anger

 

[Dug720]

All I can guess is that it must feel horrible to think that a Guest believes you weren’t good enough

Or worse that people were super friendly to you all cruise but then decided at the last minute to take the tips away.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

One thing Disney does extremely well is service recovery. But they need to be aware of the problem immediately, not at the end of the cruise or when you are home when nothing can be done. This goes for any problem. Let us do what we do best and leave you with that magical “I’ve just been to Disney” feeling rather than disappointment and anger

It goes for the other lines as well.

Whenever someone complains about something on the Seabourn FB pages the first and repeated question is "did you talk to ___" insert the appropriate party. It's much better for informational purposes if someone posts a complaint and then said how they got it resolved. When people complain (in earnest rather than just a passing comment) but don't seek to get it resolved the cruise line at the basic minimum can't rectify it.

And by people sharing their experiences I've learned where I need to go should I experience a problem so I don't think people should just not mention something to others, it's problematic when people complain but never told so and so about it and then just want to arbitrarily take it out on the cruise line (either by reputation or in the case of DCL removal of tips).

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Yeah, but a lot of the employees from those countries are leaving behind spouses and children to take these jobs, too. They'd better make a lot of money compared to the alternatives or else nobody would take these jobs.

There was just a post this morning about one of the Seabourn ships docked in Manila, Philippines and how the ship was extra full and full of families visiting their loved ones (which isn't super common on that line) because so many crew members have family in the Philippines.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

It matters on the state you are in and what that state's minimum wage laws are for tipped positions. For example, in California, the restaurant servers receive a minimum wage of $16.50 and hour. While in North Carolina that same server would only receive $2.14 an hour, with the expectations that the tips will make up the difference between the minimum wage and the tipped minimum wage.

So those in California get the benefit of both a higher minimum wage and tips, while those in other states, have to rely mostly on tips, and I've been in many restaurants to where the server has to rely on tips and received very poor service and the server still expected a large tip.

Psy

I agree with the PP that it would be hard to hire people that are in traditionally tipped positions at restaurants if a place didn't have tips (we don't have anywhere near the amount of places in the U.S. that operate that way so it would not be favorable) but you have a point on the location. Of course COL comes into play but so does the state's own rules around that as you can have lower COL locations with higher ultimate tipped minimum wages than a place with higher COL.

On a cruise ship it is a different environment and in some ways more sensitive to the subject. There's a lot of moving parts on a cruise ship that people either don't know about or don't interact with and not as straightforward as going out to eat at a restaurant.

 

[DVCSunDevil]

I think you're mixing up your acronyms in both your posts...you mean DCL rather than the several mentions of DVC

You are correct! My bad. Anytime I said DVC, I meant DCL.

On another note, it is always funny to me to read through threads like this on these boards. The thread always starts out with something specific to Disney, but then somehow morphs to a macro view outside of Disney. Like this thread…it started with a comment in which the OP says they stiffed their stateroom attendant and then that somehow morphed to people commenting about how they don’t like tipping in general in the US. Hilarious.

It’s not that hard. 1) the tipping environment is the way it is in the US…we are not France or some other European country. 2) people know that going into a tipping situation. 3) knowing numbers 1 and 2, if someone is going to be cheap and not tip then don’t enter that situation. So don’t go out to eat, don’t valet park your car, and don’t sail on a Disney Cruise Line ship. That’s the bottom line.

 

[Mags2002]

Or worse that people were super friendly to you all cruise but then decided at the last minute to take the tips away.

I myself have been in this situation where a family literally came to every meet and spoke to my character friend every chance they got, I gave them a little pixie dust, they gave me some. Then made a complaint about my character friend (yes a fictional character)

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

It’s not that hard. 1) the tipping environment is the way it is in the US…we are not France or some other European country. 2) people know that going into a tipping situation

Respectfully that's such a poor statement to make especially in a thread about cruising. Cruising is multi-national and multi-cultural; you're literally vastly likely to visit another country than the U.S. when you're cruising (especially given laws the U.S. has surrounding port requirements). To strictly think in an American viewpoint is well kinda awful. I agree that people know going in about tipping expectations at least so much as what is printed on cruise policies it doesn't remove how their own culture may handle it or their own background. To that end when visiting other countries you should be learning their norms and how the tipping environment is.

While on the boat remember you're not just surrounded by Americans and I can't believe that has to be stated. Cruise policies aside.

how they don’t like tipping in general in the US.

It's all related though, tipping in general and most especially how someone feels about tipping. Different environments have different policies but the social discontent surrounding tips, whether you feel that is right or wrong, very much exists and more widespread since the pandemic where tipping has become so far reaching. Even people in the UK have been posting how U.S. tip culture has been creeping itself across the Pond much to their immense displeasure.

 

[DVCSunDevil]

Respectfully that's such a poor statement to make especially in a thread about cruising. Cruising is multi-national and multi-cultural; you're literally vastly likely to visit another country than the U.S. when you're cruising (especially given laws the U.S. has surrounding port requirements). To strictly think in an American viewpoint is well kinda awful. I agree that people know going in about tipping expectations at least so much as what is printed on cruise policies it doesn't remove how their own culture may handle it or their own background. To that end when visiting other countries you should be learning their norms and how the tipping environment is.

While on the boat remember you're not just surrounded by Americans and I can't believe that has to be stated. Cruise policies aside.

It's all related though, tipping in general and most especially how someone feels about tipping. Different environments have different policies but the social discontent surrounding tips, whether you feel that is right or wrong, very much exists and more widespread since the pandemic where tipping has become so far reaching. Even people in the UK have been posting how U.S. tip culture has been creeping itself across the Pond much to their immense displeasure.

To your point, when I travel abroad I adhere to the way things are done there. I abide by their customs. So if someone from another country sails on a DCL ship and knows going in that a tip for their server, assistant server, head server, and stateroom attendant will be added to their bill then they should definitely NOT be demanding it be removed (like the OP did). To even attempt to argue the opposite is being disingenuous. Again, you are trying to zoom out and make this some macro conversation. Give people from other countries credit…they are smart enough to know how the tip structure works in DCL because the cruise line literally tells them that the gratuity is being added. Someone going out of their way to remove one of those tips is a new level of low.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

To your point, when I travel abroad I adhere to the way things are done there. I abide by their customs. So if someone from another country sails on a DCL ship and knows going in that a tip for their server, assistant server, head server, and stateroom attendant will be added to their bill then they should definitely NOT be demanding it be removed (like the OP did). To even attempt to argue the opposite is being disingenuous. Again, you are trying to zoom out and make this some macro conversation. Give people from other countries credit…they are smart enough to know how the tip structure works in DCL because the cruise line literally tells them that the gratuity is being added. Someone going out of their way to remove one of those tips is a new level of low.

You are cruising with people from all over, the whole point of cruising is to go all over (unless you're doing a Mississippi river cruise). The point is to follow the protocol for the cruise line you booked whatever that may be; it applies to all on board irrespective of one's nationality. That said when I was looking at all the lines that do include tips in the fare I did see one (and I'm blanking on which) that included it strictly for UK residents which is them considering the customary norms there.

Following what the cruise line has is the thing people agree with and why the discussion about the removal of tips can put people off. BUT it's not about saying what you essentially said which is "this is 'Merica and in 'Merica we do this". It's not about saying "this is America and we're not Europe" it's about saying X cruise line has Y policy which normally is in the form of automatic gratuities but is also in the form of a specified suggested tip (sometimes based on room category).

I more or less agreed with you until you started making it about "it's America/U.S. not some other country" if your idea of cruising is that count me as grateful to not share in that opinion.

 

[brentm77]

On another note, it is always funny to me to read through threads like this on these boards. The thread always starts out with something specific to Disney, but then somehow morphs to a macro view outside of Disney. Like this thread…it started with a comment in which the OP says they stiffed their stateroom attendant and then that somehow morphed to people commenting about how they don’t like tipping in general in the US. Hilarious.

It’s not that hard. 1) the tipping environment is the way it is in the US…we are not France or some other European country. 2) people know that going into a tipping situation. 3) knowing numbers 1 and 2, if someone is going to be cheap and not tip then don’t enter that situation. So don’t go out to eat, don’t valet park your car, and don’t sail on a Disney Cruise Line ship. That’s the bottom line.

One can both think the American tipping system is an outdated and inefficient system that doesn't actually improve service anymore, and still advocate for not only paying the customary tip, but being generous when possible too. There is nothing wrong with advocating for change and not just accepting the way things are, while still following current norms.

I also think it's a relevant discussion on these boards, since it's such a major part of cruising with lines sailing out of America. It was also relevant to this particular thread, since OP's stiffing the staff is a strong argument for getting away from the tipping culture. Let the business stand by good service to drive its reputation and repeat customers; don't make the low-paid workers take the risk.

Will our little discussion make a difference in the tipping culture? Almost certainly not, but if preferences slowly change as a culture, one day we may move away from this silly antiquated system.

 

[DisneyKatie1]

Everyone can argue about tipping til they are blue in the face. That won’t change the fact that those in tipped positions are paid a ridiculously minuscule amount by DCL and rely on their tips to make a decent wage. It isn’t fair for people to remove them unless the service was truly bad, which hopefully is a rarity on DCL. Until anything changes, which I doubt it will, Guests will have to cruise with the knowledge and acceptance that the crew deserve their tips and factor it in to their overall budget.
If after a couple of days you think the service is lacking, mention it to them and they will do their best to recover the situation. There is nothing they can do at the end of the cruise or when you get home. Give them a fair chance to re-earn their tips.
I am fortunate enough to be paid well in my role so I dont know how it feels to get to the end of a cruise and realize that the people you tried so hard to please didn’t think it was even worth a tip. All I can guess is that it must feel horrible to think that a Guest believes you weren’t good enough

Do they also like receiving gifts? like from people’s home state/country? Or not bother with this?

 

[Dug720]

Do they also like receiving gifts? like from people’s home state/country? Or not bother with this?

They have really small quarters that are usually shared with others. They really don't have room for trinkets. And foods...there are allergies, dietary restrictions, etc.

Besides cash, the best thing you can do is to mention them by name on the survey and/or a note taken directly to guest services. That gets passed along to their supervisor and they get recognition and can get stuff like extra time off, internet time, etc.

 

[mjkacmom]

One can both think the American tipping system is an outdated and inefficient system that doesn't actually improve service anymore, and still advocate for not only paying the customary tip, but being generous when possible too. There is nothing wrong with advocating for change and not just accepting the way things are, while still following current norms.

I also think it's a relevant discussion on these boards, since it's such a major part of cruising with lines sailing out of America. It was also relevant to this particular thread, since OP's stiffing the staff is a strong argument for getting away from the tipping culture. Let the business stand by good service to drive its reputation and repeat customers; don't make the low-paid workers take the risk.

Will our little discussion make a difference in the tipping culture? Almost certainly not, but if preferences slowly change as a culture, one day we may move away from this silly antiquated system.

Servers would be hard to find if they were just paid a wage. Servers make more money during busy hectic shifts, and choose to work them because in spite of being harder, they will make more money in tips. Servers do not like quite easy shifts. Why would anyone wait tables when they can make the same money as a cashier, or hostess? Try finding bartenders to work until 3am on a Saturday night without tips. Americans are used to getting a lot of attention from servers, being asked if everything is okay, drink refills, bring the check promptly, to the extend that overseas visitors get annoyed with all of the attention.

 

[brentm77]

Servers would be hard to find if they were just paid a wage. Servers make more money during busy hectic shifts, and choose to work them because in spite of being harder, they will make more money in tips. Servers do not like quite easy shifts. Why would anyone wait tables when they can make the same money as a cashier, or hostess? Try finding bartenders to work until 3am on a Saturday night without tips. Americans are used to getting a lot of attention from servers, being asked if everything is okay, drink refills, bring the check promptly, to the extend that overseas visitors get annoyed with all of the attention.

And yet, there are servers and bartenders in hundreds of countries around the world who work without relying on tips—often providing much better service than what you typically find at an average American establishment these days. The market would need to adjust wages to attract the right talent, but it works just fine.

As for attentiveness, having traveled extensively, I’ve never noticed a significant difference in the level of attention provided, except for the occasional American server who overcompensates to the point that it detracts from the experience. I doubt many would miss that kind of service. Overall, service in the U.S. is often subpar, even with tipping—an outdated system that has now crept into more and more routine interactions without improving anything.

 

[ajs123]

The OP wrote a similar post a few months back on a similar thread - not tipping the stateroom attendant if the services were not used. The OP got blasted and seems to enjoy getting a rise out of everyone. Time to stop feeding the beast.

 

[John VN]

The OP wrote a similar post a few months back on a similar thread - not tipping the stateroom attendant if the services were not used. The OP got blasted and seems to enjoy getting a rise out of everyone. Time to stop feeding the beast.

Might not intentionally *feeding the beast* when done adroitly very well encourage continued dialog for additional feeding of the beast.

 

[KrzyKtty101]

Yes I did, I didn't use there services at all. If I did used the service, I would have tipped or adjusted accordingly.

This is where you lost me. And the fact that you only have 15 messages leads me to assume that this is a troll.

 

[KrzyKtty101]

I do know that the first Australian season, a significant number of Guests removed tips from their account altogether as Australians do not have a big tipping culture. Crew lost a lot of money that season, and a lot said they would not go back to Australia. I’m not sure if a similar thing happened during the second Australian season

This is astonishing to me. It doesn't matter what culture you come from nor what customs you are used to; part of traveling is learning the culture and customs of where you are going, and respect that. If you can't do that, then you should really stick to traveling in your country and the customs you are comfortable with.

Saying, "Well tipping isn't a big part in our culture, or considered rude back home," isn't an excuse, if you are going to a culture where tipping is the norm and expected. It would be like me going to Japan and saying, "Well back home it is acceptable to talk talk on the train and make noise, so I'm going to do it here to even though I know it is considered rude. Because only what I am used to matters."