ROFR Thread July to Sept 2023 *PLEASE SEE FIRST POST FOR INSTRUCTIONS & FORMATTING TOOL*

[Bearval]

I had the same experience. The contracts that have been listed for months (especially the ones since 2022), those were the ones didn't want to budge, at all. I recently got an add-on, it was listed for 12 mins, yes 12 whole minutes , I put an offer in right away, got accepted with no counter.

They don’t want to budge because they most likely overpaid and don’t want to take a huge loss or they financed and don’t have enough money to bring at closing. It is not the buyer’s jobs to make the seller whole for a bad financial decision on their part.

It’s interesting to me that prices are slowly trending up despite better direct incentives and a lack of ROFR. My plan is to, for now, sit out this quarter on resale. As we reach the end of the year and dues start coming in, let’s see where the market goes, especially if the economy starts to soften. I’d love more points, and might even consider BW or BC, but not at the current resale prices I am finding overall.

I am not so sure prices are trending up. I am seeing some lower than average prices still and some where it appears the person may have paid more then they should have if they would have been more patient.

 

[Epcot Forever Forever]

…how do we explain the Magical Beginnings incentive to buyback points from new owners at $22/pt?

That’s been around for ages, they just recently increased the $ value of it.

I don’t think it’s a great business decision.

 

[AwfulWaffle]

They don’t want to budge because they most likely overpaid and don’t want to take a huge loss or they financed and don’t have enough money to bring at closing. It is not the buyer’s jobs to make the seller whole for a bad financial decision on their part.

I am not so sure prices are trending up. I am seeing some lower than average prices still and some where it appears the person may have paid more then they should have if they would have been more patient.

Not to mention some brokers, not naming any, will try to convince a buyer of what market value actually is and diminishes any data found in this thread as stale or invalid data. After a few interactions with said broker I simply stopped submitting offers to them because they clearly only care about their commission and not giving the seller actually good advice. Hopefully I am wrong but my interactions with brokers elsewhere created more opportunities for good negotiations.

 

[crazycatlady]

Contract twins! Wishing us both a quick and easy ROFR!

My broker told me that the sellers had another contract they had just sold in the $270s, so maybe they really are "twins".

 

[Sandisw]

That’s been around for ages, they just recently increased the $ value of it.

I don’t think it’s a great business decision.

The first I have heard of it was last year. It was not an option when I bought RIV in 2019. So, I don’t think this has been around as an incentive for long.

 

[DonMacGregor]

The first I have heard of it was last year. It was not an option when I bought RIV in 2019. So, I don’t think this has been around as an incentive for long.

Yeah, I’ve never heard of it either, and it was a huge deal when it was announced last year.

 

[emchen]

Interest rates are high and that's a sneaky way to get people into larger point purchases and resultingly higher loans.

They needed to find a way to discount to move inventory. Direct DVC sales at the beginning of the year prior to magical beginnings were incredibly sluggish.

That’s been around for ages, they just recently increased the $ value of it.

I don’t think it’s a great business decision.

Regarding MM, what do we think about the counter thesis that those inventory rooms sell like hotcakes? I personally found that theory convincing when I look at the rack rate for VDH grand opening (and presumably the forseeable future) as an example.

Besides that example, Aulani, Poly, Riviera, VGF all sell out their inventory with great consistency.

I don’t remember who posted it, but they convincingly argued that Disney found it extremely lucrative to sell inventory…more so than rapidly selling out the dvc points in the form of contracts. Therefore it was in their business interest to game their contractual obligations to optimize that revenue stream (hence MM).

Sounds pretty wiley to me, and not such a bad business decision. But thats just my opinion…what do you guys think??

 

[Epcot Forever Forever]

The first I have heard of it was last year. It was not an option when I bought RIV in 2019. So, I don’t think this has been around as an incentive for long.

Yeah, I’ve never heard of it either, and it was a huge deal when it was announced last year.

I’m not going to pretend to know the history of DVC as well as some but DVCNews says it’s been around for 20 years. IIRC the offer before was like $13.

https://dvcnews.com/dvc-program-men...ave-up-to-22-per-point-via-magical-beginnings

Edit: here’s a thread about it from 2001
https://www.disboards.com/threads/what-is-magical-beginnings.23418/

 

[Epcot Forever Forever]

Regarding MM, what do we think about the counter thesis that those inventory rooms sell like hotcakes? I personally found that theory convincing when I look at the rack rate for VDH grand opening (and presumably the forseeable future) as an example.

Besides that example, Aulani, Poly, Riviera, VGF all sell out their inventory with great consistency.

I don’t remember who posted it, but they convincingly argued that Disney found it extremely lucrative to sell inventory…more so than rapidly selling out the dvc points in the form of contracts. Therefore it was in their business interest to game their contractual obligations to optimize that revenue stream (hence MM).

Sounds pretty wiley to me, and not such a bad business decision. But thats just my opinion…what do you guys think??

I think if that were correct they would be building new hotels instead of new DVC buildings.

 

[emchen]

I think if that were correct they would be building new hotels instead of new DVC buildings.

They are right? Gran Destino Tower for example.

But I suppose it is about optimizing the model they have with timeshare as a primary driver of occupancy at any given property.

When they perceive an overmatch of demand vs inventory, they guarantee flexibility and stability by building DVC buildings instead of hotel rooms. They capture a certain long-term occupancy base (50 years) while increasing hotel inventory which they can “fine tune” by aquiring points through “breakage” and buyback programs like (MB).

I think they’ve thought this out a lot more than we give them credit for. IMO, it is probably not a bad business decision.

 

[Sandisw]

I’m not going to pretend to know the history of DVC as well as some but DVCNews says it’s been around for 20 years. IIRC the offer before was like $13.

https://dvcnews.com/dvc-program-men...ave-up-to-22-per-point-via-magical-beginnings

Edit: here’s a thread about it from 2001
https://www.disboards.com/threads/what-is-magical-beginnings.23418/

Thanks for sharing. Obviously, it has been something off and on but I can tell you that it did not exist as an option when I have bought direct over the years...first time would have been last year when buying VGF, and I don't think they were allowing VGF to qualify.

 

[Bozni]

Alright, it took a while to set up, but I added a page with current resale listings from the 9 major sites (https://www.dvcrofr.com/resale-listings). There are links to open and auto-populate the pricing tool for any listing, which was my original vision for the tool. I hope my site doesn't get censored by the board sponsor for this, but I do feel it was the last step to becoming a useful tool for anyone looking to evaluate resale contracts.

I also started a thread for questions/comments/suggestions (https://www.disboards.com/threads/dvcrofr-com.3924179/). I really appreciate all your input!

This is epic. Thanks!

 

[DonMacGregor]

I’m not going to pretend to know the history of DVC as well as some but DVCNews says it’s been around for 20 years. IIRC the offer before was like $13.

https://dvcnews.com/dvc-program-men...ave-up-to-22-per-point-via-magical-beginnings

Edit: here’s a thread about it from 2001
https://www.disboards.com/threads/what-is-magical-beginnings.23418/

It may have been an option back in the day, and something they’ve kept in their back pocket, but you’ll find absolutely no one who had that offer extended to them anywhere in recent history (the last ten years or so).

 

[Rex1993]

MB has a very similar feel to some of what goes on in commercial office leasing. Landlords always want to hold the line on face rates of leases ($5/ft per month for example) and are loath to ever drop them. So instead they use free rent and other incentives to drive down the effective rate but keep the face rate high. After a year or two, the incentives have all been used up and the rent roll just shows a tenant paying $5/ft plus increases. Lenders look at the rent rolls maybe once a year and if you’re selling a building, the buyer almost never dive into what incentives you gave a tenant four years ago, they just look at the current rent roll.

 

[nalabear]

MB is a win-win for Disney if they are selling out of hotel inventory.

They get a 40-50year contract purchase bolus of $$ AND maintain ability to rent out that rebought hotel at 50%+ profit as a rental unit.

 

[emchen]

MB is a win-win for Disney if they are selling out of hotel inventory.

They get a 40-50year contract purchase bolus of $$ AND maintain ability to rent out that rebought hotel at 50%+ profit as a rental unit.

Exactly! They are practically the only company that has managed to make the timeshare model work for them…and all the DVC fans like us. Win-win in my eyes as well. For those not so happy with joining the club, they have a way through the rental and resale markets to be made whole again! Win-win-win!

 

[shand32783]

If you had the option to pick your title company/agent, who'd it be? Looking for some feedback. Thanks.

 

[MsChristy12]

If you had the option to pick your title company/agent, who'd it be? Looking for some feedback. Thanks.

For my 2nd contract, I chose Mason as my agent actually asked me if I have a preferred one we would like to use. Last time I was assigned to First American and it was okay, nothing bad. My escrow official was actually nice to work with, not the fastest but it was also not their fault, the seller was very slow getting the docs back to them.

 

[Good Ol Gal]

If you had the option to pick your title company/agent, who'd it be? Looking for some feedback. Thanks.

We've recently used Mason amd everything went smoothly.
This thread might help you.

https://www.disboards.com/threads/dvc-resale-broker-thread.3915583/

 

[shand32783]

We've recently used Mason amd everything went smoothly.
This thread might help you.

https://www.disboards.com/threads/dvc-resale-broker-thread.3915583/

Thanks, I'll look at it. Need to find out what title/closing fees are and want a good reputable company.