Rider Switch changing (Started June 16th)

[marcyleecorgan]

I think this whole frustration with the now-changed policy is pretty amusing - trying to negotiate a way to NOT stand in line at Disney? Whaaaaaaaaaa? If you're not standing in a FP+ line, you're standing in a SB line. If you're not at a ride, you're standing in a line for the toilets or a line for food service. Or waiting for a seating area. Or waiting for a train, bus or boat. Or waiting for the rest of your party to get back to the chosen "meetup" spot. Change the perspective - EVERYWHERE at Disney is standing in some line, somewhere, waiting for something.

If you're worried about waiting twice, don't. Go to the ride, park your stroller, get the RS dealt with and scanned in. Riding party gets in line, non-riders immediately head off to another ride, or a snack, or the bathroom. By the time both parties finish their respective lines, they can meet back up again.

And the CM's are pretty agile at handling FP+ times. I have seen them give leeway, I have seen them wave small children back in line from a potty break ; I have seen plenty of Pixie Dust but you know what I have NOT seen? CM's or Security hunting down guests via their touring plan and bodily hauling them out of the queue because their FP+ had expired while they were standing in line. Especially NOT the RS FP+ - they can see all that is going on with that, now that it's digital. They can figure out pretty quickly that your party was issued that RS 62 minutes ago on a busy day and the second Party is just about to enter the line, versus a CM scanning the band and noticing that the Guest obtained this RS pass at 9:52 am and now it's 4:45 pm.

and of course Disney made the language describing the program very vague! They didn't want to argue with guests' constant barrage of semantics and technicalities, so they leave the enforcement up to the CM's at the attractions. If it's a good day and everything is running great, then the CM's might be able to overlook an extra few dozen FP+ riders. But on a day where there's less CM's to man the ride, 6 of the ride vehicles are being glitchy, and you've evacuated the ride twice already today, you're gonna be "a stickler to the rules" that shift.

It wasn't a problem until it became a problem. It's become a problem with the addition of Pandora and it started interfering with Holiday Parties and it definitely became a problem until they closed the loophole about *all* MB functioning and added the clause of "ticket used for FP+ must be the the ticket scanned for park admission". They HAVE to get control over this before SWL opens... TSL has enough tiny young fans that everyone can sort of accept the longer lines... Star Wars fans have absolutely no mercy and they will NOT recommend the Disney experience if all it appears to be is waiting in a line for 8 hours, looking at the backpack of the person in front of them...

 

[OSUZorba]

@whiporee TOTALLY!!!! YOU ARE STILL IN WDW/DISNEYLAND, and not everyone gets to be there. So you miss a ride, that's life!

I know most people on here are Disney loyalist that would go no matter what, but that is not true for the general population. If I get more value or a better experience somewhere else, I'll go somewhere else.

Missing rides is also a big deal when you may not get a chance to ride it again for years and in some parks, half the rides are RS.

 

[Krandor]

I totally get the frustration. Disney has a really nice and flexible system but it sounds like some people were abusing the flexibility so they decided it was time to make a change. sucks but it happens. Reminds me of when they changed how they handled disabled people at the rides.

It does sound like the system disney had was never really true rideshare. Rideshare to me is you go through the line - person A rides and B stays with kid and person B rides and A stays with kid. Then go to next ride. Disney letting people use them days later seems almost overly generous but I can understand how people are currentl used to that system and have even planned their trips around that system as it existed so it changing is going to have an affect on people especially though with upcomiong trips that may have already done FP reservations assuming the system would be like it used to be.

 

[DizneyMommy]

I read the Doctor Disney and WDWNT article. Where does it say that everyone in the party must have a fastpass to get the rider switch, including the waiting parent?
Also, doesn't rider switch also work for standby? The person receiving the rider switch doesn't have to have a fastpass, so why different if you have a fastpass?

It is not in the article. A couple of people have posted email responses from Disney when they asked about it, and Disney’s response is if you are in the fast pass line asking for a writer switch, all parties should have a fast pass. Not the child who cannot ride, just all of the other people want to ride. Also, cast members have been starting to enforce this at more popular rides

 

[Krandor]

It is not in the article. A couple of people have posted email responses from Disney when they asked about it, and Disney’s response is if you are in the fast pass line asking for a writer switch, all parties should have a fast pass. Not the child who cannot ride, just all of the other people want to ride. Also, cast members have been starting to enforce this at more popular rides

That seems appropriate. RS should be about making sure everybody can ride that has a FP not as a way of getting "extra" FPs.

 

[Boski]

It wasn't a problem until it became a problem. It's become a problem with the addition of Pandora and it started interfering with Holiday Parties and it definitely became a problem until they closed the loophole about *all* MB functioning and added the clause of "ticket used for FP+ must be the the ticket scanned for park admission". They HAVE to get control over this before SWL opens... TSL has enough tiny young fans that everyone can sort of accept the longer lines... Star Wars fans have absolutely no mercy and they will NOT recommend the Disney experience if all it appears to be is waiting in a line for 8 hours, looking at the backpack of the person in front of them...

TBF, that line was always there. Its just that 1)people who were cheating that system had convinced themselves that it did not mean what it clearly states and 2)Disney was not enforcing it. The TOS hasn't changed in a long time, the only thing that changed was the fact that they started enforcing the policy and removed the way to work around the system.

 

[DisFanDad]

They also already are limiting it to just one at a time. So the 1 hour rule really is just to discourage the use of it, IMO.
FOP is the worst for this. Takes us at least 35-45 mins to get all the way off the ride. Back to back can put you at 90 mins. Lord help if you want to schedule a FP so your little one could at least ride the Navi Small World while waiting. The Dis hammer will come down on you for that "extra" FP use!

That is a VERY interesting take, and indeed, I am sure these changes would greatly decrease its use, which in turn means we (and many others) will get on far fewer rides during our trips, which means we will be getting even less for quickly increasing vacation costs. On top of that, I am sure Disney will be able to use a decrease in ride usage to cut staffing even further, especially during the slower times. It would appear this could be a win for disney and its shareholders and yet another loss for its guests.

you are right, they could eliminate it - but one reason many families vacation at WDW is because Disney makes it relatively easy to vacation there as a family. Not saying all families would stop going or anything, but removing something that improves how a family vacations there isn't necessarily the best for their bottom line
I also found it about 10x more challenging to navigate Disneyland as Walt Disney World so while that model might work great for you it doesn't for everyone

Yes, they could eliminate it, but its actually one of the reasons we bought into DVC when we were starting our family. We locked in to WDW because we "knew" they cater to families with small children and still allow the adults / older children to enjoy the parks the way they want to. This would greatly alter that calculation.


Ultimately I very much understand they want to prevent people from selling or redistributing these, from abusing the fastpass loophole, etc. I am ok with ALL of that. But there is no good reason (from a guest perspective) to limit these to 1 at a time or enforce a strict return window. That is clearly going to diminish the guest experience and the usefulness of the system. By linking these to magic bands, requiring all people to have a fastpass etc, would remove the abuses.

 

[DisFanDad]

@whiporee TOTALLY!!!! YOU ARE STILL IN WDW/DISNEYLAND, and not everyone gets to be there. So you miss a ride, that's life!

This isn't "life" I am not just "living" when I go to WDW. It's a Transaction, I am PAYING for a good / service. If I am riding fewer rides because of a change WDW makes, I am getting a crappier deal out of the transaction. If disney does something which decreases my experience and increases their profits, they are trying to take advantage of me as a customer. I don't pay just to "GO" to WDW, I pay so I can DO things in WDW. Your Mileage may vary, but unless you have a response to the honest and clear impacts this will have on my vacation and the things I like to do, please keep it to yourself and don't try to tell me what I should and should not be upset about. I mean, by all means let people know that it doesn't bother you if you miss rides, maybe you don't care, but pretty clearly, lots of us do, and again, this is a transaction, its not "life".

 

[middlechild]

But there is no good reason (from a guest perspective) to limit these to 1 at a time or enforce a strict return window.

How would you suggest to keep the RS pass off of EBay? The parameters of the solution are not to replace FP functionality (already works for guests to reserve a ride), not asking web sites to take them down (too many sites selling things), are focused only on families with small/old members, who did not apply for FP return times to accommodate the needs of the group?

One solution is FP is in wide use. A party of four gets FP for one adult / old kid for one time, and a second FP for other adult / old kid, and remove any need for RS altogether. Could the best solution be the most simple?

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

How would you suggest to keep the RS pass off of EBay? The parameters of the solution are not to replace FP functionality (already works for guests to reserve a ride), not asking web sites to take them down (too many sites selling things), are focused only on families with small/old members, who did not apply for FP return times to accommodate the needs of the group?

One solution is FP is in wide use. A party of four gets FP for one adult / old kid for one time, and a second FP for other adult / old kid, and remove any need for RS altogether. Could the best solution be the most simple?

Wouldn't putting it digitally vs paper solve that issue?

 

[linzbear]

Wouldn't putting it digitally vs paper solve that issue?

Exactly, attach it to a band, and anyone who is on "friends and family" for that person can use it. Give it a 3 day expiry.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

Wouldn't putting it digitally vs paper solve that issue?

I guess theoretically you could arrange to meet someone in the park and give / loan your magic band to that person in exchange for $ but, yeah, I would think the digital element would make it, at the very least, very challenging to sell them

 

[OSUZorba]

What is really funny. All the of the people that really want to make RS back-to-back only so us parents don't get some type of advantage (still can't figure out what it is), don't realize this change will probably add more people to the FP lines.

Currently I can decide that for whatever reason I don't want to ride now, but I know I can come back later, so I move on and do something else. For me, 75% of the time I never circle back and ride that ride. However, if you change the equation to Ride Now or Never, I would almost always go ahead and ride now. So instead of a significant number of RS passes going unused, now more of them will be used and add to the FP lines. But at least those parents dealing with small kids won't get an "advantage" am I right?

I still have yet to see a logical argument for why they shouldn't be able to return later in the same day.

 

[WillowRain]

Yeah but come on, with all due respect, the argument, whelp you're in Disney it's better than nothing works for some things (like a hot day vs a working day) but it shouldn't be a sin to want to experience all that you can.

Expectation-wise it's unlikely you'll get to experience everything you want (except if you go during a hurricane lol) but I really don't think we need to give people a hard time because they actually want to experience an attraction and then call it-well that's life.

As for missing a ride..people do need to understand that if you're a frequent enough visitor it's less harmful but for less frequent visitors it can be a real bummer. I still haven't seen Fantasmic! in my trips (at least I have no memory from my earlier trips and in 2011 and in 2017 we were rained out), never got to go on Backlot tour as it was closed in 2011 and then closed down for good several years back, etc. You get the picture. Sometimes missing a ride really really sucks. It happens and you try to shrug it off but don't shame people for wanting to experience something. They may never get that chance to ride it or ride it again and I think we all know how that can feel.

I say this as actually having no problem with having people ride back to back, a 1 hr time limit, etc. I just think we can understand the desires people want without the whole guilt trip.

Okay fair, BUT, to complain about Disney closing a loophole in which has been exploited because now your child doesn't get to somewhat cheat the system with multi tier FP's and RS's, come on! The hour time window has obviously been created to create better control, prevent people from selling, prevent people from collecting and abusing and especially things like someone mentioned above, of an "afraid" teen (lies) and they get a swap to use whenever for the month??? No. There is simply no reason you cannot make it back in the hour window, please everyone needs to get over it. Adapt to the change or don't go.

 

[Krandor]

Exactly, attach it to a band, and anyone who is on "friends and family" for that person can use it. Give it a 3 day expiry.

Why should anybody on F&F be able to use the rideshare?

IMO it should works like 4 people have FPs for FoP. The 4 scan in. 2 get to ride then. The other 2 get their FP converted to a RS pass they can use before the end of the day. I think that would be fair and you wouldn't be creating new FPs just changing the type of one of them.

 

[WillowRain]

What is really funny. All the of the people that really want to make RS back-to-back only so us parents don't get some type of advantage (still can't figure out what it is), don't realize this change will probably add more people to the FP lines.

Currently I can decide that for whatever reason I don't want to ride now, but I know I can come back later, so I move on and do something else. For me, 75% of the time I never circle back and ride that ride. However, if you change the equation to Ride Now or Never, I would almost always go ahead and ride now. So instead of a significant number of RS passes going unused, now more of them will be used and add to the FP lines. But at least those parents dealing with small kids won't get an "advantage" am I right?

I still have yet to see a logical argument for why they shouldn't be able to return later in the same day.

Exactly, some people DO NOT circle back, and want to get it done now. This is a control thing. Knowing how many passes are out in the system will mean better control of the numbers, I swear!

 

[OSUZorba]

Exactly, some people DO NOT circle back, and want to get it done now. This is a control thing. Knowing how many passes are out in the system will mean better control of the numbers, I swear!

If Disney really wants that much control, to me that is a sign of nefarious things to come. But I don't really understand why people that aren't hoping to monetize the FP system are rooting for that change.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Exactly, attach it to a band, and anyone who is on "friends and family" for that person can use it. Give it a 3 day expiry.

Yeah. And honestly as I was thinking about it while I'm not opposed to back to back or 1 hr like I mentioned previously I also understand how it can be quite a shock if one was going in thinking "oh it's good til the end of the month" kind of thing and now finding out it may be 1 hr. I was even thinking that since normal park tickets expire 14 days after the first usage they could attach that to RS. It would still impact APs but would be a graduated system. Then in the future it could be adjusted to maybe even midnight and then an hour (or whatever number of hrs they wanted).

IDK it could be a sticker shock kind of thing, YKWIM? Maybe a graduated system would help things out. Star Wars is still just under (or thereabout since only the season was announced) 1 1/2 years away and I think we can all agree that Star Wars will change things at WDW so maybe in that time before Star Wars opens up they slowly adjust the program. Totally thinking out loud here lol

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I guess theoretically you could arrange to meet someone in the park and give / loan your magic band to that person in exchange for $ but, yeah, I would think the digital element would make it, at the very least, very challenging to sell them

Yeah where there's a will there's a way, right? lol

I do think the digital aspect helps tremendously if the concern is large enough regarding selling them. I do understand how people are disappointed on the not being able to give them out randomly thing as I think it's a kind gesture however I do understand that RS is intended for your own traveling party's characteristics rather than something more generic.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Okay fair, BUT, to complain about Disney closing a loophole in which has been exploited because now your child doesn't get to somewhat cheat the system with multi tier FP's and RS's, come on! The hour time window has obviously been created to create better control, prevent people from selling, prevent people from collecting and abusing and especially things like someone mentioned above, of an "afraid" teen (lies) and they get a swap to use whenever for the month??? No. There is simply no reason you cannot make it back in the hour window, please everyone needs to get over it. Adapt to the change or don't go.

Generally speaking I'm going to assume most people here weren't using it for nefarious reasons (yes I know what they say about assuming). I think people were utilizing it the best way it worked for their traveling party but not trying to be evil about it. People selling on eBay? Yeah those people are wrong and they know it-to sell something that clearly says "not for sale" there's not an innocent factor to that. But posters here discussing their concerns with the adjustment I don't think are bad people.

In my previous comment though I was explaining another perspective with regards to missing out on rides. By your comments above I'm going to guess you don't fully agree which is fine. Yes one can adapt or not go..but from something that may have been quite vital to their touring strategy perhaps have a bit more...understanding to why people are upset. If they all of a sudden said "hey by the way those 3 FP we give you included in your ticket--yeah well we're dropping it down to 1" there would be a lot of upset people and same goes for if/when (if we're speculating) they remove the 'included' aspect or make you pay for additional ones beyond your included ones.

I do think the fact that Disney didn't adapt the way they handled RS when FP came along and then further adapted it when FP+ came along just made it worse and now it's like playing catch up (which reminds me of all the construction that's been going on for years now lol) with how they want to actually handle it. Disney is unique in that they give FPs (and 3 to begin with) for a guest to work with since FP+ was introduced. All other similar 'get ahead of the line' passes other companies use are not pre-planned this way or in the case of Universal they have two to work with (single-use and unlimited) and forgive me as I may not be aware of other companies that utilize two versions (single-use and unlimited).

IDK I get both sides really and like I said don't see a big issue with back to back and time limits (though I do think going from end of the month to 1 hr is very drastic) but I also totally get how others were touring.