Reports are in: Bellman are pressuring guest for tips...

[drakethib]

Disney may try to enforce it's standards on sub-contractors, but in my experience, nothing walks and talks like an actual Disney employee. Too many go betweens to get the law layed down when sub-contractors are involved. JMHO.

I disagree at least in my industry anyway.

There are "company" employees tend to get lazy when they have a HR, Seniority, or a Union to back them. This is not always the case but it does happen.


And let me make something clear, I worked for a Union company in the past and they do good things for employees, but I think some of the good things that Unions have done are being taken advantage of sometimes by some people.

Contractors are more willing to do more jobs as they know they only have their performance to keep them employed.

 

[OneMoreTry]

I agree with you on unions... there was a place and time for unions, openining up a can of worms here, but unions are too powerful for their own good these days.

I am glad to agree with you on something.... we're both Disney lovers and I don't want to always disagree. Here's to more agreements.

Maybe it's not the union workers that are too powerful, but the union leaders.

 

[jodifla]

I've worked with the folks from BAGS, and they're every bit as friendly, helpful and courteous as the best Disney CMs I've ever met. As a matter of fact, we've read a lot of reports recently of problems folks have had with rude CMs (specifically bus drivers, but you get the idea) -- that's what makes me think that the unions, in general, are really beginning to have a negative effect on the guest experience, and why I'm so strongly in favor of outsourcing some thing to entities that don't use union workers.

I would agree, though, if we had a choice between non-union Disney employees and non-union contractors, I'd go with the non-union Disney employees.

You keep spouting this line, but Disney employees have had a union from the beginning. The service has been great until recently...when bean counters took over and non Disney workers infilitrated.

When I worked for WDW, I got four days of training before I started, and a lot of the training had to do with how to treat the guests.

Do the non Disney people get this same training?

 

[bicker]

No, the service was great until the labor market got tight. Some people also feel that the service has declined because Disney has reduced the extent of the Traditions training that they deliver to their own employees. My feeling is that there is also a very significant contribution to the problem coming from that rather substantial decline in service quality everywhere. Disney's still the best with regard to theme parks, but they're the best over a field of competitors who are all now much worse in terms of service quality than they were ten or twenty years ago.

All contractors wearing the CM badge get Disney's training, in addition to the training that their own company provides them.

Based on observations of actual performance of BAGS personnel versus the Disney's own bellstaff, non-union non-Disney workers will almost surely do a better job than some of the CMs in the union.

 

[jodifla]

No, the service was great until the labor market got tight. Some people also feel that the service has declined because Disney has reduced the extent of the Traditions training that they deliver to their own employees. My feeling is that there is also a very significant contribution to the problem coming from that rather substantial decline in service quality everywhere. Disney's still the best with regard to theme parks, but they're the best over a field of competitors who are all now much worse in terms of service quality than they were ten or twenty years ago.

All contractors wearing the CM badge get Disney's training, in addition to the training that their own company provides them.

Based on observations of actual performance of BAGS personnel versus the Disney's own bellstaff, non-union non-Disney workers will almost surely do a better job than some of the CMs in the union.

Where are the BAGS people mainly? How many of them are there?

 

[PinkTink63]

People have been known to make up fictions for themselves to deceive themselves into thinking that things are different from how they actually are. However, if you ask most Americans the hard questions ("Do you know that bell staff, valets, waiters and waitresses actually get paid less than minimum wage, and that you, as patron, are expected to tip them so they can make a living wage?") they'll grudgingly admit that they do know this. They wish they weren't obligated to provide gratuities for anything other than going above-and-beyond, but it has never been that way, and most folks know that.

The key word there is "want." Really, no one wants to spend money if they don't have to, so any rationalization to spend less will have some appeal. No question about that.

That's a very pretty fiction. Unfortunately, it's not so clear that it would work if put to the test of reality. Most experts in the Americas, Africa and the Middle East believe that without the direct impact the patron has on the compensation of the server, the service will suffer.

I am a little confused about something.... Where I live, there is a minimum wage and if you are hired legally, you receive at least min. wage. I have friends that are waitresses, bartenders, and bellhops, and they receive minimum wage plus tips. They make quite good money, I might add! Doesn't every state have a minimum wage? How can you be hired at less than min.?

 

[Starr W.]

I think most wait staffs in resturants here in OH are paid less than min wage and are expected to make the rest up in tips. Now in the Nov elections, we got to vote on increasing the state's min wage. It passed, though there has been trouble with Work-study programs for financial aid students in universities. Looks to me like someone didn't do their homework when this was put on the ballot, which I think it's something for the legislative branch to decide not some group who manages to get enough sigs on a petition. At least they have the staff to look at all ramifications of a law and suitable enforcement prior to it being passed.

 

[PinkTink63]

I think most wait staffs in resturants here in OH are paid less than min wage and are expected to make the rest up in tips. Now in the Nov elections, we got to vote on increasing the state's min wage. It passed, though there has been trouble with Work-study programs for financial aid students in universities. Looks to me like someone didn't do their homework when this was put on the ballot, which I think it's something for the legislative branch to decide not some group who manages to get enough sigs on a petition. At least they have the staff to look at all ramifications of a law and suitable enforcement prior to it being passed.

Wow! That is shocking to me! I thought that is why we have a min. wage! My next question is... Does Disney or who ever is paying these people for the service, are they paying at least min. wage?

 

[Starr W.]

I don't have friends now that work as waitresses, but in HS and college I was shocked at how much they got paid per hour. It's different in fast food places, they get paid over min. wage here.

 

[bicker]

I am a little confused about something.... Where I live, there is a minimum wage and if you are hired legally, you receive at least min. wage. I have friends that are waitresses, bartenders, and bellhops, and they receive minimum wage plus tips. They make quite good money, I might add! Doesn't every state have a minimum wage? How can you be hired at less than min.?

Different states have different laws. In many (most?) states, employees classified as tipped employees don't get minimum wage plus tips. Rather they get a token amount, much less than minimum wage, plus tips. The only effect the minimum wage has on those folks is that if the get so little in terms of tips, the restaurant needs to make up the difference.

I don't have friends now that work as waitresses, but in HS and college I was shocked at how much they got paid per hour. It's different in fast food places, they get paid over min. wage here.

Florida is not one of the states that require minimum wage plus tips, so no, generally no place in Florida pays servers minimum wage plus tips.

 

[Mtnman44]

If there is an example of where a Union has increased the efficiency, profit, customer experience, and the quality of the end product of a business or industry, (for the long term) I'd love to hear it.

 

[bicker]

Let's keep it real: I think there are a few (but not many) examples where unions have had some (perhaps minor) positive contributions to some of those aspects (like customer experience), but surely it isn't very common and there is no reason to expect any such benefits from the scenario we are discussing.