Remember that custodian that I filed a complaint abaout?

[wvjules]

*golf claps for Rajah*

I think this is a great statement too.

do find it sad that in today's society, someone in a different "working class" trying to be friendly is instantly construed as being creepy.

I whole heartedly agree.

 

[Bumbles]

Yes if he's lonely he could talk to the adults in the school.

maybe he enjoys talking with the kids because they don't judge him unfairly?

 

[AirForceRocks]

I do find it sad that in today's society, someone in a different "working class" trying to be friendly is instantly construed as being creepy.

Bravo Rajah!! What I got from the original thread on this subject is that the problems with this man started when he DARED to say hello to jan/cape numerous times during the day. When jan/cape complained and the custodian then DARED to question her objections, she became the eagle-eyed mama, out to protect all of the kids from this obvious (to her) threat to their safety.

How very sad.

 

[Toby'sFriend]

I haven't seen anything described so far that makes me suspicious of the man. I keep reading and trying to figure it out.

It seems to me that he likes kids and does things likes eat lunch at their table and play around with them sometimes. There are many people working at my son's school who do those things.

As for whether or not his work is getting done - that is between him and his supervisor.

I'm just not getting what the fuss is about.

 

[annemariec]

Originally posted by annemariec
The situation with Jan hinges on a man that takes liberties that are sometimes not within policy and liberties that fall into a grey area. He has amassed numerous complaints. Most people that have had complaints lodged against them and have the rules and or situation spelled out for them adjust their behavior. (If he was lonely) He could be friendly by asking what he could do to be helpful and within policy.

JMO

Annemarie

I think the above bears repeating.

I think Jan is being characterized unfairly.

Annemarie

 

[Jenzebelle]

Excellent post, Rajah I agree

 

[Blondie]

Well, I still don't get it.

Maybe this guy is a creep, and maybe he is just a lonely man, trying to be friendly, and maybe just maybe he's trying to brighten someone else's day by saying hello or by giving them a high-five.

I guess I better stop saying hello to the custodian in the lobby, he might think I'm hitting on him and report me for sexual harrassment.

I better tell my DH to stop commenting on how cute the baby in the stroller is behind us and to stop looking at that baby and waving because the mother might think he is going to molest him. My DH misses the days when our kids were in strollers and truly adores little babies.

I do find it sad that in today's society, someone in a different "working class" trying to be friendly is instantly construed as being creepy.

Words of wisdom.

 

[Rajah]

Annemarie, I'm not trying to characterize Jan. Actually, she's the only one of us who is *there* and can see more than what words can express. Maybe it's not his saying hello that creeped her out -- maybe it was the tone of his voice, or the look in his eye, or the way he stood as he said it. Maybe there is something more in how he's looking or speaking or interacting with the kids that is setting off a mother's/teacher's "there's something wrong here" instinct, but it's something subtle that can only be picked up on by *being* there.

What I'm saying is just the act of saying hello to someone or interacting with kids doesn't, in my book, justify a classification of "creepy". I haven't seen anything said here to give others the idea that the guy is creepy because he likes kids, except that he's creeped Jan out. Jan may be totally right to be creeped out. But we aren't in a position to know unless we get a chance to interact with him as well, or unless he does go beyond friendly into creepy.

I *totally* agree that if Jan feels there's something wrong with this guy, she should continue to keep an eye on him. Don't ignore instinct, even if you can't put a finger on why the instinct's red flags are going off. I'm just saying let's not judge a guy as being creepy just because he interacts with kids when it isn't in his job duties to do so.

 

[annemariec]

I agree Rajah. Jan is the only one that has first hand experience. I understand your viewpoint on not judging a man hastily also. But IMHO I don't think that is the case here.

I was (and am) focused on the circumstances in which Jan provided. Regardless of his rank in the workforce he has been reprimanded. And he hasn't adjusted his behavior. I think that is key.

There are ways to be friendly that aren't outside of the realm of policy and aren't in the grey areas. His continuing to operate outside of policy is where the suspicion comes into play.

Annemarie

 

[Wishing on a star]

Okay,

Couple points here...

First, JanCape posted because she feels she has real concerns... She has backed this up, as others have also had similar concerns.

Second, This guy is crossing every boundary there is. This is not about any 'Servant class'... Not even close... Anyone here who has been out in the working world knows that you have a job description, and you stick to that... You do not just invite your selves into others work areas, their conversations with associates/students, as they are trying to go about their work... etc. If my job is receptionist, then I do not just meddle with the work going on in Cust.Relations, Tech, Support, or whatever! And, if I am the Receptionist, I do NOT want a janitor behind my desk, interfering as I am trying to go about a busy morning as students and staff are all arriving!!! If I am a teacher, I do not want the Janitor meddling as I am going about my 'very demanding' job of working with the students!

And, yes, some may bemoan the fact that the days are gone when we left our doors unlocked and our kids ran the neighborhood and the parks without concern... But, YES, those days are gone! There have been a couple instances in this area of my State alone where school employees have been charged!

While many say, perhaps this guy is just looking at the students as 'friends'. Sorry, but this is highly innappropriate! Adults should NEVER be looking to tiny elementary aged children to meed their needs! ( not even friendship....)

Now, I have to say this. It looks as if it has now turned into the 'Let's bash the original poster.....' People who only know half the story are trashing JanCapes concerns.

 

[yoopermom]

As a teacher myself (in a very small town, nonetheless), I know that DS7 and his classmates are *very* trusting of any adult they come into contact with in a school setting. If they have trouble, they're told to, "Run and tell an adult", not "Run and tell a teacher/aide/secretary, but not a custodian/cook". Because they're not old enough to make this judgement, I do believe it's our responsibilities as adults to keep an eye on all adults who come in contact with them (although I won't start heating the tar until I see something definite...).
Terri the Yoopermom

 

[aahmom1]

I think Jan is being characterized unfairly.

I think others are just trying to say the same thing about the man.

 

[PRINCESS Ariel34]

Originally posted by DaisyDebbie
Yes if he's lonely he could talk to the adults in the school.

Sorry I don't see the harm in him being friendly. Unless he stepped over the line with the kids than thats another story. He seems to be a friendly person who happens to be disliked by someone who seems to look down her nose at. Maybe I'm wrong, but if the other teachers/staff members are as snotty as the op, than I would stay away from teachers also.

 

[PRINCESS Ariel34]

Originally posted by Wishing on a star
Blondie,

Hate to even acknowledge your post with a reply...

BUT, this is not a young PE instructor!!! This is an elderly custodian in full clothing, etc.... Yep... I stand by my words... And I stand by Jan-cape

Uggghhhh!!!!!!

Soooo wrong on Soooo many levels.

I just have to ask, DO YOU FEEL THE SAME WAY ABOUT ELDERLY JOGGERS GOD FORBID HE HAS TO RUN PAST A GROUP OF SCHOOL CHILDREN I GUESS YOU WOULD CRAP A BISQUIT THE HORROR Or, does it have to do with him being a custodian (which you are no better than no matter what your title is) that makes your skin crawl with such nastiness. I'm not trying to be mean, but I honestly think you are being quite nasty towards this man. What was so wrong with saying "HI" back to this guy. For you to be a teacher I do think you are showing your kids a bad example on how to treat people. Maybe just maybe you need to look that word up because from what I can see the school children posess a higher level of maturity

 

[raidermatt]

If the man has legitimate and justified complaints against him, and is not doing his job, escalate until you are satisfied. Pretty simple.

But complaining about him running laps with kids while he is fully clothed does nothing but harm credibility. (By the way, would it be better if he changed into some workout clothes...maybe some spandex shorts and a tank top????)

As long as he is interacting with the kids in supervised situations, again, there is nothing wrong with that in and of itself.

(And as many have pointed out, if the "running laps" situation was unsupervised, the teacher should be fired. If there were other teachers there, then it was a supervised situation).

Talking to kids at lunchtime is creepy?

Geez, just when you think you've heard everything...

What if the guy never spoke to anyone and lurked in darkened doorways? Then he'd be creepy for other reasons, and we'd have people comparing him to Freddy Krueger...

 

[Toby'sFriend]

Sorry Wishing. As I said before, I just don't see it. I kept reading the post waiting to get to the really horrible awful thing that this gentleman has done -- and I've yet to find it.

Second, This guy is crossing every boundary there is. This is not about any 'Servant class'... Not even close... Anyone here who has been out in the working world knows that you have a job description, and you stick to that... You do not just invite your selves into others work areas, their conversations with associates/students, as they are trying to go about their work... etc.

uh well. Please don't come work for me. But regardless, I didn't see in the post where he stepped into the classroom and tried to take over teaching Reading to the first graders. He ate lunch with some kids and was running in the gym with some kids. Big deal.

He probably should restrain himself from taking pity on the kid being punished at lunch, but I always feel a bit sorry for those in the desks facing the wall myself. I've been known to smile at them and give them a wink. I guess I might be creepy also.

I am curious as to how much is known about the supposed numerous complaints that have been made about this gentleman. Information such as that is supposed to be kept private.

 

[disneyjunkie]

Originally posted by raidermatt
(And as many have pointed out, if the "running laps" situation was unsupervised, the teacher should be fired. If there were other teachers there, then it was a supervised situation).

I want to know where the gym teacher was. If he/she was not in the gym to supervise the child, did the op file a complaint about him/her not doing his/her job?

As a parent and a teacher, I'd be more worried about a teacher leaving students alone in the gym than I would be about this man running laps with students.

 

[Bob NC]

Originally posted by jan/cape
In October I complained about a custodian that makes me very uncomfortable around kids. I complained that he was sitting with students at lunch (kindergarteners and a boy that was sitting at a table by himself for discipline reasons.) This man just gives me an uneasy feeling around kids.

Part of the reply I got after he was spoken to was.......

1. Mr.* will curb his presence in the cafeteria aside from his usual custodial duties in that area.
2.Mr.* will no longer sit with students in the cafeteria or interrupt the discipline process of a student or students that another staff member is handling.
3. Mr.* will primarily have lunch in the staff dining area.
4. Mr.* may have lunch in the cafeteria, but will do so at the senior citizen table or with other adults.
5.Under the ' Bullying Program', Mr.* may adress and report misbehavior as all staff can under this program.
6. Mr. *'s interactions with students need not cease, but it has been recommended to Mr. * that his conversation with students MAINLY center around school safety and care of property.

Part of Mr. *'s response to my voicing concerns was"....He also states that his interaction with children has always been in the open, amongst adults and therefore does not feel it creates an uncomfortable situation. UHG!!!

Well, Friday I had to stay behind in the Kindergarten classroom as one of the students was not having a terrific morning. (I have to go to all of the specialists with the Kindergarten). Well, the teacher walked the kids to the gym and when she returned to the classroom I headed for the gym. When I walked into the gym this custodian was running laps with them. I didn't say anything and I tried my darnedest to ignore him, but I was wild!!
I later went right back to the assistant principal told him about the gym insident and asked him what part of the above did Mr. * not understand?

The A.P. said could this be bordering on harassment? I said I am not accusing Mr. * of anything, but if I did not say anything and God forbid something awful happened I would be sick.
The A.P. went on to say that this custodian has been saying how terribly busy they are and just can't get to everything and that they are 'staight out'. So he shouldn't have any time to run laps in the gym with kids.

This custodian just makes me CRAZY/ANGRY!!!!!

Ya ever think that maybe the A.P and everyone else is just saying what you want to hear because they are tired of dealing with the "CRAZY/ANGRY!!!!!" lady?

 

[RitaZ.]

Ya ever think that maybe the A.P and everyone else is just saying what you want to hear because they are tired of dealing with the "CRAZY/ANGRY!!!!!" lady?

That comment was uncalled-for!

 

[Bob NC]

Originally posted by RitaZ.
That comment was uncalled-for!

Why?

Isn't it an explanation for why the actions she thinks *should* have happened, haven't happened? When you think that someone's complaints are baseless, (and they admit that they may appear CRAZY/ANGRY), it is conceivable that you might just say what they want to hear.

I feel sorry for this poor guy who has done nothing wrong, that I can see.