questions about renting points

[illiram]

I would like to rent points from a DVC member but my wife is skeptical and I want to put her mind at ease.

Is this a safe thing to do?

Does the DVC member actually book the reservation in their name or my name?

 

[JimMIA]

I think it is a safe thing to do, as long as you understand what you are doing, and understand the key differences between renting points from a DVC owner vs. just making a cash reservation. The place to start is the FAQ and "A Word to the Wise" over on the DVC Rent/Trade board. Both contain very valuable information.

As far as feeling comfortable with a DVC owner to rent from, I would look for one of two things.

One, I'd look for someone who has a number of posts on these boards -- and not just on the Rent/Trade Board. I'm not talking about dozens of posts, I'm talking about thousands. That tells you the owner is a regular here, they're part of our community, and you are not likely to have trouble who lives on this board. It also gives you the ability to go take a look at their posts and get an impression of what kind of person they are.

Personally, I would be very leery of a person with a couple dozen posts and hundreds of points to rent. They may be perfectly legit, but they wouldn't get my business.

The other thing I would consider would be references. If someone has rented numerous times, they probably have people who would be happy to give them a reference...in fact, they probably have people who have rented from them repeatedly. Be sure to check the references you get.

 

[Etnmom]

I agree that you need to check out references. I disagree that one should only feel comfortable renting from those with thousands of posts. As a wife and mom of three holding down a full time professional job, how would I have the time to haunt these boards ( and sleep) without neglecting my very important roles? I have read this business about all the posts one should have to be considered trustworthy before and have not seen anyone question this. Yes, there are legitimate newbieslooking to rent their points out, as there are newbies looking to rent them. The references should be checked no matter how many posts any one individual has to their credit!

 

[JimMIA]

I agree that you need to check out references. I disagree that one should only feel comfortable renting from those with thousands of posts. As a wife and mom of three holding down a full time professional job, how would I have the time to haunt these boards ( and sleep) without neglecting my very important roles? I have read this business about all the posts one should have to be considered trustworthy before and have not seen anyone question this. Yes, there are legitimate newbieslooking to rent their points out, as there are newbies looking to rent them. The references should be checked no matter how many posts any one individual has to their credit!

My post above was an either-or piece of advice, and I don't think there was anything in it which would exclude a person who had rented before and had good references. As a matter of fact, that's one of the things I suggested someone look for.

IMHO, there are two potential risks in renting points from a DVC owner -- one of them possible, and one very remote.

The most likely possibility I see - and I've seen it a good bit - are owners renting points who don't know what they are doing. They mean well, but they mess up, and they put themselves and the renter in an awkward situation. So I think that someone who does hang out here and does have a pretty good feel for what's going on is likely to present less risk than someone who has neither rented before nor hung out much. Plus, you have the ability to review their posts and gauge them a little from that.

The other issue is simple fraud. I think the likelihood of fraud is very remote -- I don't recall a situation like that happening here, but it is always possible.

We have also just had a major article posted on Mousesavers which included some very favorable comments about renting points from DVC owners. When I see people with a half-dozen posts to their name trying to rent 500-800 points, I have to wonder where they came from, and what prompted them to get into the business of renting tons of points all of a sudden, especially when their ads sound like come-ons to start with.

Presumably, anyone who had 500 points to rent would have been a member for some time. I would expect them to at least have rented before and have references. Absent references, I'd look for posts. Absent both, I'd go elsewhere.

I'm sure there are folks out there who are perfectly legitimate...who have never posted much here...who have never rented points before...and who are now trying to rent a bunch of points to fund a cruise, a divorce, to meet some financial need, etc. You can rent from them if you wish -- if I were renting points, I'd rent from some of the people I know around here rather than a total stranger.

Anyone is welcome to disagree, and I'm sure some will, but I'd rather be safe than sorry.

 

[connorsmom911]

Hi Jim,

I have the utmost respect for your knowledge, suggestions and your posts that I have read. Perhaps in this case I could offer a suggestion...maybe not only looking at the number of points, but also the "join date" as an indicator. I tend to agree with the previous poster, I am on these boards at least every other day, but between full-time shift work, raising a 2 yr old and training for a 60km walk for breast cancer, I'm usually just trying to keep up with reading the posts, let alone posting myself. I don't have a whole lot of posts. I love reading the boards, find the information invaluable, but often times I don't find myself in a position to offer a whole lot of info as I myself have only been to the world 4 times (although most who know me would still call me a Disney nut).

Most of my time is spent on other DIS boards, like the Canadian Community, or researching my trips, reading trip reviews or dreaming of a vow renewal ceremony. Now my thoughts have turned to DVC just recently and if we manage to get ourselves into a position to buy, I may be trying to rent out points to help supplement maintenance fees for the first year and I would hate to think someone would automatically not trust me because I don't have thousands of posts.

Just a suggestion...

Tracey

 

[cmoore]

...I may be trying to rent out points to help supplement maintenance fees for the first year and I would hate to think someone would automatically not trust me because I don't have thousands of posts.

I had the same thought. So far I've learned from the board:

1) Don't use your points to exchange outside of DVC. Instead, rent
you points and use the cash to book ouside of DVC.

2) If someone wants to rent points they should only do so from someone
with lots of references.

Sounds like a Catch-22. No one's going to want to rent my points because
I've never done it before, so I'll never get any references. Didn't everyone
who rents out their points have a first time once? How does one get started renting if you need references to do it?

Chris

 

[Y-ASK]

The other problem is that you can only ask for a reference so many times before it becomes a nusiance. But you can take comfort in the fact that there are very few (if any because I have never seen one) post where someone who was renting points came back here and said that they got ripped off. I just don't ever recall that happening. Any way we're talking about 100s of transactions per month that take place. So far it's been a very safe place to rent points. I would have to agree with taking a look at the post that someone who is renting has made. See if they are really participating in the discussions. Good luck in your decision.

Y-ASK

 

[schatterjee]

from both parties. We rented ours for the first time this year (not a lot of posts and no refs) and I was a little worried about how it would go. We have had a great experience. Not every family that rented has taken their trip yet but I believe that it's been smooth sailing for everyone involved so far.

I have to say that at first I was worried about our exposure but the more I've thought about it - the people renting do seem to be in a more vulnerable position.

I think you'll feel better about giving it a try after e-mailing or talking with someone who is ready to rent. Like anything if you get a bad feeling - try again with someone else. We hope to use our points in the future but it was nice to have such a great hopefully win-win option when it turned out we couldn't make it this year.

Best of luck planning your trip!

 

[Popovich]

I agree with previous respones that one does not need to have thousands of posts to be a legit renter. I have a full time job, two small children and although I scan the boards at least weekly for the last 3 1/2 years, I've yet to get to 1,000 posts, let alone THOUSANDS! However, we have rented points to others many times .

I always do a conference call with the person and member services. Just so they know: the resies in their name, I've noted any preferences, I have the dates right and I confirm with MS that there are enough points. I also do a follow up conf call or two as the check in date nears so everyone's on the same page and I give the renter the written conf from MS.

We tend to have the same people rent from us each year and it has always worked out well for all. I think the suggestion of asking and checking references is a good one.

Good luck!!

 

[JimMIA]

First of all, I'm sure none of us have an exclusive on a busy life. I'm sure most of the people here work full time, have kids, are involved in church/community activities, etc. Personally, I work 50-70 hours a week (as does DW), I travel a lot, we have DD3goingon23, a big house to take care of, I do volunteer work at Everglades National Park, etc. etc. Welcome to life!

Some choose to post; some don't. Nobody is saying that people who post are more trustworthy than anyone else, or that people who don't post can't be trusted.

All I'm saying is the ability to research someone's posts, and the fact that they are an active member of a community we know, is ONE avenue we can use to evaluate the person. It's not my first choice, but it's ONE way. You have to establish a level of confidence with the other party, and learning more about them is one way. If thousands of posts doesn't make sense to you, fine. Use a number you are comfortable with, or none at all if you prefer.

My main point in my first post was that any renting transaction carries with it some element of risk to both parties, and requires trust from both parties.

The transaction is completely un-policed by anybody. Disney is not involved in any way - nor will they become involved if you have a problem. The DISboards have no way to screen transactions in any way, or to assist in any way if a problem develops. You are completely on your own, and it is up to you to use common sense and protect yourself.

Renting points is safe, IMHO, but it is a transaction between two people who start out knowing absolutely nothing about each other. If there was ever a situation where "caveat emptor" applied, it is here -- not because the experience has been bad, but because the potential for difficulties is real.

My second main point is that - if you take the time to visit the Rent/Trade Board right now -- you will see some posts there that have to make you wonder. They may be perfectly legitimate; they may not be. The person offering points may know what they are doing...or they may not.

Some of us who watch these boards closely have been watching the Rent/Trade Board and talking offline (PMs, emails, etc.). Some of us are free to post our opinions here; others are not free to do so.

OP's original question was "Is this a safe thing to do?" In my mind, the answer to that question is "Yes, but..."

Yes, but...use your head. Do your homework. Understand the process. Understand what the risks really are. And use some common sense precautions to protect yourself from risk as much as you can. Don't just wander in trusting blindly.

If you use common sense, you will find that renting points from a DVC owner is a great way to get a huge vacation bargain -- plus you'll probably make a new friend in the process.

 

[Ali and boyz]

did I read somewhere that if you rent points from another DVC member they can trasfer them into your account

 

[mikesmom]

I agree with JimMIA. It's ONE way to get to know the other party.

Another issue, and this really has less to do with safety, is that I can't help but notice that at busy times for DVC - such as the Oct/Nov/Dec time frame, folks are posting for rentals and it's the posters with the low counts that are jumping in with the "I have points" replies. A Board member with experience knows that you can have hundreds of points for Oct/Nov (Food & Wine Fest) or Dec (popular time plus holidays) and it won't do you any good this close to date. DVC reservations are sold out or very close to sold out on all fronts. What these folks need right now are reservations that a member made and can't use. When I see folks posting "I have points" or even asking the potential renter if THEY have checked availability (which they cannot do as a non-member), I know everyone (renter and rentee) is setting themselves up for disappointment and frustration.

 

[CarolMN]

did I read somewhere that if you rent points from another DVC member they can trasfer them into your account

Yes - if you are a DVC member and rent points from another member, you may have them transferred into your account.

Points are of no value to non-members. Non-members are not really renting points - they are arranging to use a DVC member's reservation.


Best wishes -

 

[JimMIA]

A Board member with experience knows that you can have hundreds of points for Oct/Nov (Food & Wine Fest) or Dec (popular time plus holidays) and it won't do you any good this close to date.

When I see folks posting "I have points" or even asking the potential renter if THEY have checked availability (which they cannot do as a non-member), I know everyone (renter and rentee) is setting themselves up for disappointment and frustration.

These are perfect examples of the BIGGEST potential problem with rentals -- not that there is a small fraud risk (which there is), but that there is a large risk of disappointment and financial loss if BOTH parties do not fully understand what they are doing. The reason why newbies are the only ones who respond to some of these inquiries is that the veteran renters KNOW BETTER!

Everything goes smoothly when everything goes smoothly...which it does most of the time. When problems arise, however, is when knowlege of the system pays off.

I'll give you just one typical example of what can go wrong if both parties don't understand the process. There can be MAJOR implications to both parties when plans change. The DVC owner could lose the points they rented and have their entire account tied in knots; the renter could lose all of their money...and their vacation, of course.

Let's say you make a reservation for a vacation. The reservation is made, confirmed, paid for...all systems go. Then, three weeks from your vacation, something comes up -- someone gets sick, a work situation develops...something happens.

If this were a hotel reservation, you could probably just call an 800 number and cancel with no penalty...but this is NOT a hotel reservation. The vacationer calls the DVC owner to get their money back, reschedule, whatever.

A knowledgeable DVC owner would already have advised the renter that cancelling within 30 days is not possible without serious penalties. A knowledgeable DVC owner would have previously made clear their policies on cancellations, and the renter would have understood and agreed to those policies. If the renter wanted to mitigate the risk of cancellation, they would have had the opportunity to obtain trip insurance.

A knowledgeable DVC owner would also know that there may be some way to save the vacation, but it will require a lot of work, patience, and flexibility from both parties to do so. A knowledgeable DVC owner will also know that it may NOT be possible to save the vacation -- and someone may have to eat the loss.

A DVC owner who doesn't know what they are doing would not anticipate all of the potential problems, nor would they be likely to know all the options available to them and the renter.

That's the REAL risk in renting for both sides -- not that anyone will intentionally cause a problem, but that lack of understanding on one or both parts will cause a problem.