Putting in offers on multiple contracts - wrong?

[wrighter]

Just wondering what my fellow DISers thought about this. We are currently in the market for a resale add-on, and we have decided to be fairly flexible on # of points and cost pp, but we are fixed on a specific resort and UY.

I put in an offer on a contract yesterday. If another "perfect" contract came up today, would it be unethical to put in an offer on it also? I have no idea how long the sellers have to respond to our offer - but I'd hate to watch something else go by while I wait for them to pick their noses.

Which I guess leads to a follow up question: IF the sellers accept our offer, we can still back out, right? I certainly don't intend to, but I also want to make sure we cover our own butts wherever possible.

Thoughts?

 

[timandjanl]

I'm not sure how I feel about the question of putting in multiple offers so I will leave that to others. As for backing out, it depends on what the contract says. After the sellers accepted our offer, we were sent a contract that says we have 10 days to change our mind. Of course if we were to change it after that point they can't make us go through with the contract, but I suppose there could be legal ramifications if they really wanted to go that route.

 

[MiramarQE]

Real estate sellers have no problem when they juggle multiple offers, and very few sellers/agents would have a problem keeping you on a string waiting to see if a better offer comes in before you get fed up and retract yours.

I don't see anything "unethical" in working to purchase one contract from multiple sellers. Nothing says you can't specify in your offer that "time is of the essence" and that you will be continuing to attempt to satisfy your need while a seller is contemplating accepting your offer or not.

Any offer on real estate I make has a time limit - "this offer valid until XX." because sellers DO like to hope something better will come in - well seller - you have until "XX" to decide or you lose this offer.

Once you have an agreement on a contract you just call and retract the open offers.

[Just don't sign anything that says "deposit non-refundable" . . . ]

 

[wrighter]

I figured that until both parties actually sign on the dotted line, there would be no "legal" recourse. Either party could back out for any reason as long as there is no signed contract in place. But I also really like to do things on the up-and-up, you know? But I know that oftentimes that means I'm low man on the totem pole - because when it comes to money people who don't care about "ethics" will usually finish ahead of me.

Very curious to see what others think here. Are multiple offers - with the intention of only purchasing one - a no-no?

 

[wrighter]

Real estate sellers have no problem when they juggle multiple offers, and very few sellers/agents would have a problem keeping you on a string waiting to see if a better offer comes in before you get fed up and retract yours.

I don't see anything "unethical" in working to purchase one contract from multiple sellers. Nothing says you can't specify in your offer that "time is of the essence" and that you will be continuing to attempt to satisfy your need while a seller is contemplating accepting your offer or not.

Any offer on real estate I make has a time limit - "this offer valid until XX." because sellers DO like to hope something better will come in - well seller - you have until "XX" to decide or you lose this offer.

Once you have an agreement on a contract you just call and retract the open offers.

[Just don't sign anything that says "deposit non-refundable" . . . ]

I like this idea of putting a time limit on the offer. Very smart move! Thanks for the advice. This also ensures that the broker can't pull any funny business.

 

[nabi]

We put an expiration on our offers too. That way, the seller can't sit around and wait for a better offer, they either accept, decline, or counteroffer.

I don't like the uncertainty of waiting more than a rejection.

 

[jerseyduke]

on a scale of 1 to 10, 10 being totally unethical, it MAY be about a 1.

Offers get rescinded all the time. I am sure the buyer is probably trying to wait, get an few bucks a point.

If you withdraw your offer to buy, the seller has only lost a few days in time, they haven't incurred any fees or anything, so I highly doubt there is any legal course. (And if there is, putting myself in the seller's shoes, I doubt I would peruse it).

If I were the seller I would probably be mad for a bit, as a knee jerk reaction, but then calm down and realize its all part of life.

Also, contracts are going so fast, I think you are being overly concerned.

 

[bighoo93]

Just wondering what my fellow DISers thought about this. We are currently in the market for a resale add-on, and we have decided to be fairly flexible on # of points and cost pp, but we are fixed on a specific resort and UY.

I put in an offer on a contract yesterday. If another "perfect" contract came up today, would it be unethical to put in an offer on it also?

I'll answer a qualified "yes" to this. It is disingenuous because you are making an offer to buy according to terms you specify, and if that offer is accepted you would be backing out of your side of the deal. I don't think that is right at all. And it is a dishonest negotiating tactic that people could exploit by making an offer that is accepted, and then taking that back and offering lower until the seller says no.

Here are my qualifications on that though:
1) I think you could tell your original potential seller and the new one that you have made two offers, and will accept the first one that you hear back from. This is honest and up front with them, and may provide them each with some incentive to agree to your terms and respond promptly.

2) The other thing is that the DVC resale market is almost a wild west free-for-all. There are virtually no standards or ethics, other than what people want to hold themselves to. I don't find this a good excuse for joining in and going to the lowest common ground, but the fact is that it is a far stretch from the "regular" real estate market that you deal with through realtors when buying your primary home (or even vacation homes).

 

[Deb & Bill]

I figured that until both parties actually sign on the dotted line, there would be no "legal" recourse. Either party could back out for any reason as long as there is no signed contract in place. But I also really like to do things on the up-and-up, you know? But I know that oftentimes that means I'm low man on the totem pole - because when it comes to money people who don't care about "ethics" will usually finish ahead of me.

Very curious to see what others think here. Are multiple offers - with the intention of only purchasing one - a no-no?

You also tie up the owner when you don't intend to purchase more than one. So an owner who has their points posted for sale, gets an offer from you that they want to accept and you pull it because another one turned out better for you. Sounds just like what some renters do to members trying to rent out their points. And that really makes the owner who did all the work, but doesn't get the sale, angry.

Would you put multiple offers on a home out at the same time only intending to purchase one?

 

[SFlaDisneyfans]

In most circumstances I would feel this to be unethical. However, in the case of DVC resales (where sellers have been recorded backing out of sales that have already passed ROFR) I have to reassess my thinking on the subject.

 

[Deb & Bill]

In most circumstances I would feel this to be unethical. However, in the case of DVC resales (where sellers have been recorded backing out of sales that have already passed ROFR) I have to reassess my thinking on the subject.

On a single contract that I was selling, I had two buyers back out after ROFR was passed. TWICE. But I did get half their deposit each time. So my contract (a small 50 point contract) was on the market for three to six months with two offers and neither one was a completed sale.

So buyers backing out probably happens more often than sellers backing out.

 

[MickeyFan612]

When I've offered on separate contracts, I have always carried through with the purchase of all accepted offers. It feels wrong to tell the broker you have changed your mind when you get that e-mail or phone call congratulating you on your accepted offer. I also suspect my broker would no longer work as diligently for me in the future. I suppose if you are only buying the one contract you may not care but as you may have read not many can stop at just one!

 

[wrighter]

So for those who recommend putting a time limit on offers, how long of a time limit would you suggest? Since this is our first foray into the world of resale, I am completely clueless.

Along these lines, how long have you waited to hear back from the seller? I keep reading about people who hear back that same day or the next day - but are these people the exception or the rule?

Just wondering how long I should be patient before I call to add a time contingency on our current offer if we don't hear back.

Many thanks to everyone offering their thoughts and advice here - it is greatly appreciated. We're learning a lot! Always something new to learn when it comes to all things Disney.

 

[MiramarQE]

Would you put multiple offers on a home out at the same time only intending to purchase one?

Absolutely - when South Florida was a burning hot single-family home market that was the ONLY way to get a house - it was a buyer's market (much like most DVC resale now), there was a very good chance a seller would get multiple offers. To increase your chances of getting one accepted by a seller in a reasonable time you put offers in on multiple different homes. If you had only one offer in at a time you might never have gotten a home.

 

[SFlaDisneyfans]

On a single contract that I was selling, I had two buyers back out after ROFR was passed. TWICE. But I did get half their deposit each time. So my contract (a small 50 point contract) was on the market for three to six months with two offers and neither one was a completed sale.

So buyers backing out probably happens more often than sellers backing out.

I agree that buyers may back out more often, but they have skin in the game. They have a deposit to lose. Speaking strictly on the DVC resale issue, I don't see sellers losing anything if they back out. With the housing market it is a totally different animal in my opinion.

 

[Dean]

Just wondering what my fellow DISers thought about this. We are currently in the market for a resale add-on, and we have decided to be fairly flexible on # of points and cost pp, but we are fixed on a specific resort and UY.

I put in an offer on a contract yesterday. If another "perfect" contract came up today, would it be unethical to put in an offer on it also? I have no idea how long the sellers have to respond to our offer - but I'd hate to watch something else go by while I wait for them to pick their noses.

Which I guess leads to a follow up question: IF the sellers accept our offer, we can still back out, right? I certainly don't intend to, but I also want to make sure we cover our own butts wherever possible.

Thoughts?

I believe there are 2 answers here. This is one of the very few situations related to timeshares where I believe the legal and ethical answers vary. Technically one can legally do so because you can back out even with a signed contract for the first 10 days. However, IMO, it's completely unethical to do so then switch around because another contract came along that was even better. If one makes an offer, simply add the caveat that one is making offers on more than one contract and the first one that is accepted will be the one that you go with. Once under contract, to back out and switch around is completely reprehensible. I'll go a step further, a broker that knowingly allows this type of behavior is also just as wrong.

 

[Splashboat]

I don't believe it is right to justify bad behavior with bad behavior.
I am more of a Do unto others person.
Another thing to consider is that the contract that you tie up in limbo for a bit is no longer available for another potential buyer - that isn't fair to them either.
You asked for thoughts, mine is: legal/yes but ethically and morally wrong. Better to give a 24 hour time period for the seller to respond - then move on if you want.

 

[MiramarQE]

I agree that buyers may back out more often, but they have skin in the game. They have a deposit to lose. Speaking strictly on the DVC resale issue, I don't see sellers losing anything if they back out. With the housing market it is a totally different animal in my opinion.

Exactly the same animal - they are both "real estate" transactions.

Sellers DO have something to lose - if they "back out" of a full price offer their broker is likely going to be looking for a commission check. Now - if they have or expect a better (over full price offer) the broker will not press the issue (after all, then the broker's cut will be bigger) - but in any real estate listing I've been involved in the broker is protected from "seller's remorse" - in the listing contract there will be a clause that states once a qualified full price offer is presented the broker has done their job and get their commission if you as a seller decide "I didn't really want to sell"

I just can't say for sure if any of the more common DVC brokers have ever had to do so. Any brokers with data????

 

[Dean]

Exactly the same animal - they are both "real estate" transactions.

Sellers DO have something to lose - if they "back out" of a full price offer their broker is likely going to be looking for a commission check. Now - if they have or expect a better (over full price offer) the broker will not press the issue (after all, then the broker's cut will be bigger) - but in any real estate listing I've been involved in the broker is protected from "seller's remorse" - in the listing contract there will be a clause that states once a qualified full price offer is presented the broker has done their job and get their commission if you as a seller decide "I didn't really want to sell"

I just can't say for sure if any of the more common DVC brokers have ever had to do so. Any brokers with data????

I doubt they go after sellers who back out because collecting would be more hassle than it's worth.

The buyer doesn't really have financial risk until 10 days after a contract is signed and they've paid the deposit.

 

[tlh]

If it was the boards sponsor I would just do one contract at a time. If it was F idelity I would not pass up on something on the boards sponsor if it comes up and you like it. F idelity normally takes longer and the sellers are normally upside down or other issues are going on even though you can get some deals through them. I missed quite a few contracts I liked because I was waiting on the F idelity people and finally ended up with buying with Timeshare Store.