Possible update to Genie+

[Jrb1979]

As an AP holder I find the strategy of per park pricing to be an interesting question. Prior use of G+ at multiple parks encouraged park hopping on days when one purchased G+. Are they trying to disincentivize hopping? Incentivize hopping from MK to another park? Will they lose more on people eliminating hopping and buying multiple park G+ than they’ll gain from per park pricing? Do they hope to maximize the nickel and diming of the infrequent visitor?

As an AP holder I suspect I’ll be less likely to hop. Or only hop from Epcot to HS. Still can’t see getting G+ for AK and I view it as a half day park so likely to go there even less. It all leaves me wondering what was Disney thinking?

IMO it's to push guests to every park. Unfortunately they haven't figured that Genie+ or reservations are the answers. They need more attractions to draw guests to those parks.

 

[BridgetBordeaux]

Can anyone verify if Standby Skipper and others have indeed been made defunct by new updates or if it's something still "in the works". Genuinely curious.

Things are fine as of today....but could change at any time.

 

[DLgal]

I think that is Disney’s point. They aren’t pricing for the hood of the guest, they are pricing to maximize profit.

My point is that they would pull in more money by charging small amounts for every ride individually. I feel like it would be a LOT easier to pay $5 six or seven times for immediate LL access than to pay out $30-35 as a lump sum with no guarantee that you will get on anything you really want to, and in the time you want to.

People get addicted to instant gratification. It would be quite lucrative for Disney if they did it this way.

 

[crvetter]

My point is that they would pull in more money by charging small amounts for every ride individually. I feel like it would be a LOT easier to pay $5 six or seven times for immediate LL access than to pay out $30-35 as a lump sum with no guarantee that you will get on anything you really want to, and in the time you want to.

People get addicted to instant gratification. It would be quite lucrative for Disney if they did it this way.

This is the way it works in Tokyo (though I think for the summer they are waiving it on most rides but the big ones) and at one point I think Paris had this feature too.

Edit: Paris still has ala carte options or the all in one similar to Universal.

 

[nekonekoneko]

My point is that they would pull in more money by charging small amounts for every ride individually. I feel like it would be a LOT easier to pay $5 six or seven times for immediate LL access than to pay out $30-35 as a lump sum with no guarantee that you will get on anything you really want to, and in the time you want to.

People get addicted to instant gratification. It would be quite lucrative for Disney if they did it this way.

At that point, should we go back to ticket books?

 

[tjkraz]

My point is that they would pull in more money by charging small amounts for every ride individually. I feel like it would be a LOT easier to pay $5 six or seven times for immediate LL access than to pay out $30-35 as a lump sum with no guarantee that you will get on anything you really want to, and in the time you want to.

People get addicted to instant gratification. It would be quite lucrative for Disney if they did it this way.

WDW is already doing that for 5 attractions at much higher prices:
Tron: $20
Mine Train: $11
GOTG: $15
Rise: $22
FOP: $14

And even then, it's not immediate and it's not unlimited. Right now (3pm) all 5 of these attractions are sold out for today. Without some way to regulate the flow of guests (time windows), the LL would just be another bottle neck. There's no time savings if so many people are paying he $5 that the LL stretches to 30...40...60 minutes long.

And the optics of charging a separate fee for every attraction are not an improvement. I know other Disney Parks do it. But it's not something WDW / DL customers would immediately embrace.

 

[starlite_]

At that point, should we go back to ticket books?

This is exactly what came to mind when I read that. I would feel so much more nickle and dimed if I had to pay for each attraction AFTER I already paid for the ticket. At least genie+ is a one time thing, no matter the cost of it.

 

[DLgal]

WDW is already doing that for 5 attractions at much higher prices:
Tron: $20
Mine Train: $11
GOTG: $15
Rise: $22
FOP: $14

And even then, it's not immediate and it's not unlimited. Right now (3pm) all 5 of these attractions are sold out for today. Without some way to regulate the flow of guests (time windows), the LL would just be another bottle neck. There's no time savings if so many people are paying he $5 that the LL stretches to 30...40...60 minutes long.

And the optics of charging a separate fee for every attraction are not an improvement. I know other Disney Parks do it. But it's not something WDW / DL customers would immediately embrace.

Agree to disagree. There would not be bottlenecks of crowds if this was an option presented at EVERY ride. I said earlier, keep the ILL high priced rides as they are. And ADD the Lightning Lane option to literally every other ride for a nominal fee for instant access. Crowds will flow naturally and evenly distribute better this way (similar to how it was when there was ONLY standby options for everything after the pandemic reopening, before Genie+ showed up).

 

[DLgal]

At that point, should we go back to ticket books?

No. Standby would continue to be an option. I am suggesting instant LL access for $5 per ride. I hate the scheduling nightmare that Genie+ has created. I'd pay handsomely to get instant LL access when a standby line is longer than about 20 minutes, and I can't be alone in that.

I want something more like Universal Express Pass, where you don't have to book a time, you can JUST GO in the Express lane anytime you want. Of course, they charge $$$$ for that, as they should. Disney needs to adopt the instant access model, but make it pay per ride. It would be a better value than Universal Express, but would likely net Disney far more money than Genie+. Win, win!

 

[tjkraz]

Agree to disagree. There would not be bottlenecks of crowds if this was an option presented at EVERY ride. I said earlier, keep the ILL high priced rides as they are. And ADD the Lightning Lane option to literally every other ride for a nominal fee for instant access. Crowds will flow naturally and evenly distribute better this way (similar to how it was when there was ONLY standby options for everything after the pandemic reopening, before Genie+ showed up).

So you don't think there would be any bottlenecks for Slinky or Rock N Rollercoaster or Test Track or Remy or Frozen if they offered LL at $5 each?

Slinky supposedly has an hourly ride capacity of 1200-1500. You don't think more than 1500 people would head straight back there between 9 and 10am?

Yeah, we're definitely going to disagree.

 

[DLgal]

So you don't think there would be any bottlenecks for Slinky or Rock N Rollercoaster or Test Track or Remy or Frozen if they offered LL at $5 each?

Slinky supposedly has an hourly ride capacity of 1200-1500. You don't think more than 1500 people would head straight back there between 9 and 10am?

Yeah, we're definitely going to disagree.

I never said that they couldn't close the LL off. They could limit it however they choose. But also, what happens now? Does everyone at Studios still mad rush to Slinky Dog Dash in the morning? I doubt it.

If 1500 people bum rush SDD at 9am, I would imagine at least half would pick the standby line. After all, why else would they run straight there? The other half might choose the LL option for $5, and that is no different than what happens now when people are able to book the 9am-10am LL window via G+.

Disney could also make this an option that turns on an hour after park open. Leave the EE and first hour open for JUST standby lines. Would help spread out the crowds better.

 

[starlite_]

I never said that they couldn't close the LL off. They could limit it however they choose. But also, what happens now? Does everyone at Studios still mad rush to Slinky Dog Dash in the morning? I doubt it.

If 1500 people bum rush SDD at 9am, I would imagine at least half would pick the standby line. After all, why else would they run straight there? The other half might choose the LL option for $5, and that is no different than what happens now when people are able to book the 9am-10am LL window via G+.

Disney could also make this an option that turns on an hour after park open. Leave the EE and first hour open for JUST standby lines. Would help spread out the crowds better.

If they close it then it is not instant access. VIP tours exist and you can pay handsomely for one and it does exactly what you want, anytime access to LLs.

The point of the time lock on quick access to rides, be it the current Genie+ or the previous Fastpass was to avoid bottlenecks on peak times. That is a fact. If everyone could pay 5 at the same time for "instant" access then peak times would just be filled with upset ppl that paid that $5 and then had to stand on a 40min LL. It's just unrealistic.

 

[irlandaise]

Anyone know what the prices have been the first two days?

 

[Minnie1222]

Anyone know what the prices have been the first two days?

Yesterday 16, 18, 24, 27, 27
Today 16, 18, 22, 25, 25.

AK, EP, HS, MK, Multi-parks

 

[New Mouse]

Agree with this comment. The entire WDW experience, when taken as a whole, is far too complicated now. But this one change doesn't really make it more complicated. The cost is getting stupid high, especially for multi park Genie+. You are already paying a significant amount more just for the park hopper ticket, and now Genie+ will add $25 to $35 (or more someday) per person. What baffles me is how Disney still doesn't seem to be hitting the price point where people are bailing and vacationing elsewhere. Demand seems as strong as ever. Or maybe we are at that tipping point now. I "hear" demand is suffering and attendance is down, likely due to the recession, but I don't know where those sources got their data.

Attendance is down.

 

[Upatnoon]

Attendance is down.

The number of people who don't want to stand in line for any attraction is at an all-time high

 

[dvc lover 1970]

My point is that they would pull in more money by charging small amounts for every ride individually. I feel like it would be a LOT easier to pay $5 six or seven times for immediate LL access than to pay out $30-35 as a lump sum with no guarantee that you will get on anything you really want to, and in the time you want to.

People get addicted to instant gratification. It would be quite lucrative for Disney if they did it this way.

I dont think that would work in DW. There are too few rides that are worth the money to charge per ride. I haven't had luck with genie plus either

 

[New Mouse]

The number of people who don't want to stand in line for any attraction is at an all-time high

This number was actually significantly higher and arguably worked better when fp plus was free.

 

[tjkraz]

This number was actually significantly higher and arguably worked better when fp plus was free.

Standby lines for the newest, most popular attractions had become completely unwieldy under FP+. There were reports that upward of 85% of daily capacity had been allocated to FP, making standby a literal crawl. Plus the tiering of attractions and the early booking given to WDW resort guests meant rides like Slinky, 7DMT and FOP were completely off the table unless staying at a Disney Resort.

FP+ worked great if you were spending a week or more at a Disney Resort and could afford to tackle the parks in small bites. You could spread the tiered attractions over several days and still hit most of them. Or locals could visit in short bursts on evenings & weekends, and still be able to hit a couple key attractions with no wait by booking in advance.

It wasn't so great if you were making a 1-day visit to a park, staying off site. And if you didn't have advance knowledge of FP+ or made a spur-of-the-moment visit, it was slim pickings by the time you entered the park and got up to speed.

Do WDW resort guests and other knowledgable visitors deserve the better access that FP+ offered? I wouldn't argue against that, but I'm guessing it was a constant pain point for guest relations and WDW managers.

At the end of the day, they're just doling out resources within a system that doesn't have enough capacity to satisfy everyone. Slinky can handle maybe 15,000 guests on a good day, but there could be 30-40k entering the park. Same is true of Test Track, Rise and other low capacity / high demand rides. There's absolutely no way to accommodate everyone. FP+ and Genie+ are just different approaches to turning people away, with the added fee being the signature difference between the two.

If there's one advantage to Genie+, it's that standby lines aren't nearly as oppressive as they were under FP+. On the most popular attractions, less of the capacity is being dedicated to Genie which means faster-moving Standby. Of course, it also means more people using standby. It's difficult to gauge the net impact on wait time because it ultimately comes down to how many people are willing to stand in that line. There will always be people who draw the line at 30-45 minutes...and others who are willing to wait 2 hours because they refuse to buy Genie or prioritized other passes.

 

[crvetter]

Plus the tiering of attractions and the early booking given to WDW resort guests meant rides like Slinky, 7DMT and FOP were completely off the table unless staying at a Disney Resort.

But this still exists in the current system. With ILL assigned to the biggest rides during the peak seasons on-site guests book them often out before park opens when the rest of the guests are able to.

There were reports that upward of 85% of daily capacity had been allocated to FP, making standby a literal crawl.

Do we have a reason to believe that anything different is done now? I think comparing pre to post COVID isn’t fair knowing that the parks aren’t at 100% capacity compared to back then. We can see that with the visitor numbers still being below.

If there's one advantage to Genie+, it's that standby lines aren't nearly as oppressive as they were under FP+

Is this true, I still see slinky being quite long, rise quite long. The only major drop I notice is FOP which I think has to do with its popularity waning given that more new rides have opened recently that draw attention to it over FOP.