Pool "Hopping Mad" UPDATED

[Werner Weiss]

Dean wrote:<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>However, pool hoping is not part of the contract and can be changed or removed at any time.[/quote]
True. Pool hopping is not a contractual right. It's not part of our deeded real estate interest. But... It is promoted as a benefit in the sales process. And I have pool hopping in writing as benefit in the paperwork that I received after purchasing; there's no disclaimer that it could end. The only disclaimer that I'm aware of is the catch-all disclaimer in the contract that says that Disney owes us nothing except our real estate interest. (The actual wording is different; our salesperson explained it along the lines of, "If Disney decides to close the theme parks and replace them with junk yards, you have no recourse.")

If DVC ever actually tries to eliminate pool hopping (or even to restrict more than they already have), DVC would face a serious negative reaction from the many DVC members who enjoy the benefit and rightfully feel it was promised to them.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>The current rules state that you are to call the front desk and check as to whether pool hoping is currently available or not. I assume they will either have a list or will check individually.[/quote]
Today the OKW front desk told me that members should call the front desk of the resort where the pool is located, not the front desk where they're staying. (By the way, I think it would be a good idea to get the name of the front desk CM and write down the exact time of the call, in the unlikely case that there are any issues later.)
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>One point that is that many timeshares offer use of facilities to members on a year round basis, DVC does not do that. Therefore being a BW member has nothing to do with this scenario.[/quote]
Excellent point!

-----
Werner Weiss, Curator of Yesterland, featuring discontinued Disneyland attractions

[This message was edited by Werner Weiss on 04-12-01 at 07:53 PM.]

 

[ez]

Wow!!!I would have been pool hopping mad too if that had happened to me. I go to disney to de-stress, not to be stressed out. I agree that Disney needs to get their policies straight to ensure this kind of thing does not happen again.
First, they need to actively and daily check resort id's, not just at SAB, but at all resorts. Maybe that would start discouraging all the people that shouldn't be there in the first place!There are many Fla. residents that seem to think a dip in a resort pool is included in their admission ticket. Or other vacationers who think they have really beat the system by staying offsite at a days inn and spending the day at a disney resort pool. Believe me, as a nearby Fl. resident, I have heard some appauling horror stories of what people do repeatedly and always seem to get away with. It never bothered me as much as it does now, being a dvc member. I would not be offended to show my resort id if it meant that everyone using the pool was supposed to be there. And if a pool is closed to pool-hopping, they definitely should post a sign or something. We might be dvc members, but we are not mind readers!

 

[CaptainMidnight]

"I'm tired of reading some posters on this board who suggest that pool hopping will be eliminated or should be eliminated. With some minor tweaking, especially in terms of communications with DVC members, there's no reason why pool hopping shouldn't continue until 2042."

I whole heartedly agree. Very well said.
Thank you for your thoughtful post.

 

[dvcdudes]

This really stinks. I think there are more people who stay outside Disney, using Disney pools, etc. or non DVC members who stay in economy resorts who use the deluxe resort pools etc. I remember reading a post by a DIS member who turned in a couple who were bragging about staying outside Disney and using Disney amenaties (I think it was the jaquzzi). I originally thought I wouldn't have done this but after reading what happened to LIDisneyFan I can now say I would turn in a non member in a heartbeat.
When I purchased my DVC membership, I thought that pool hopping was a great selling point. I would be REALLY, REALLY pissed if that happened to me. I would demand that every person on the pool deck be ID'd and any non members be escorted out before I was made to leave. Especially owning at that resort and being it is a DVC resort. I am planning a trip to Disney (BWV) next Easter and won't be pool hopping. I wouldn't want to be embarrased like LIDisneyFan was, so I'll skip the hop. Lord help any non DVC members I catch invading the BWV pool though. Our dues (LIDisneyFan included) pay to maintain the pool and life guards etc. so non members keep out!
I know it leaves a bad taste in your mouth but don't allow one over zealous CM take the magic out of your heart.

DVCDUDES
Owner BWV Feb 2000

 

[downontheBW]

I'd be furious! My husband would have been ready to fly back home right then and there. And the entire Disney experience would never be the same. I realize that they have to suspend pool-hopping privileges sometimes (although maybe not this time) but I think we should always able to use the pool of the resort where we belong as long as we're staying on points. That is, if I'm staying at OKW on points, I should be able to use the BWV pool but maybe not the VWL pool.

Also, on the days that pool-hopping is suspended, a sign should be posted stating that. It doesn't have to be large, just something that us DVCers would know to look for. That way we'd know before being embarrased.

I think they owe your family at least a dinner!

Dixie Landings '94, '96 / Wilderness Lodge, Yacht Club '98
Off site (never again) '99 / BWV '00 / HHI '01 / BWV '02

Heidi

 

[Werner Weiss]

downontheBW wrote:<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>I realize that they have to suspend pool-hopping privileges sometimes (although maybe not this time) but I think we should always able to use the pool of the resort where we belong as long as we're staying on points.[/quote]
But that isn't how it works. The pool hopping rules have nothing to do with your home resort. Nor, as Dean pointed out, do we have any special rights to use the facilities of our home resorts when not staying there (unlike some other timeshares).

When you stay at another DVC resort, you're a guest of that resort, not of your home resort.

-----
Werner Weiss, Curator of Yesterland, featuring discontinued Disneyland attractions

 

[babydoll]

I am truly horrified by this account. Pool hopping is a very big deal for my 3 kids. I hope this one incident didn't ruin the magic of your entire trip.

Please, please, please write those letters! Your fighting for each and every one of us. I think I might start a writing campaign of my own. Maybe if we all regulary send letters and email to DVC management about how stongly we feel about this pool hopping privilege they will not even THINK about messing around with it and maybe improve upon it.

 

[Bennet]

I think there is a problem when they make a big deal to point out when SAB is close to hopping, put up signs, card people at the gate, etc. That establishes expectations for notice.

In the interest of consistancy all resorts closed to pool hopping should have the same notice practices. So if BWV pool is going to be closed notice in VM, signs and carding like SAB are only appropriate.

 

[Dean]

Sorry, I'm one of those that believe DVC will eventually do away with Pool Hoping. Though we really don't use it, I certainly hope it continues.

Here's a quote from the VM Vol. 8, No. 1. <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Be sure to check at the Front Desk for info on the current perks. The listing will also let you know if pool-hopping is open across the Walt Disney World Resort hotels. [/quote] The way I read this and other limited info I've seen, they couldn't (or at least shouldn't) just decide to close a resort pool on the spur of the moment, at least not on a whim during a particular day.

Dean

[This message was edited by Dean on 04-12-01 at 09:05 PM.]

 

[DisneyMim]

I am outraged at this as well. We have been going to Disney forever and have been DVC members since it started and I can tell you that most of the people at pools who do not belong there are not DVC members, but people staying at other resorts both onsite and offsite just as other posts have stated. I am really tired of hearing people bragging about how they use any pool they want. Just a couple of weeks ago I was talking to someone who told me they do this all the time and have never been caught. I have heard people countless times at different pools (OKW, BWV, CSR, even Vero) talk about how they aren't staying there, they are just using the pool. Some are so obvious about it too!! I can't believe that you were singled out, I feel real bad for you. Tons of members use their bags so I can't even remotely imagine how that would lead them to question you. I use mine all the time. Pool Hopping is a great perk and while it is not in the contract it has certainly become part of the norm. Let's not start, but other things were not part of the original contract either and have apparantly become part of the norm also. I don't like the fact that you were singled out. I don't like when any member is told that they cannot do something and others can. It just is not right. I'm betting you were not the only member who was pool hopping that day. I hope they apologize to you big time.

 

[Dean]

69 points for a Jan studio, pool hoping without checking, extra towels and soaps, some of the room furnishings were the norm also and have changed. The idea that things have been that way for a while and cannot or will not be changed for that reason alone is silly. Things will change and some will be for the better and others for the worse. Of course some changes will help one person and hurt another. Does anyone really feel like SAB will be routinely open for pool hoping when the BCV guests are added to the already present YC/BC guests there now? And since that is the main pool that is used for pool hoping, that will likely be the beginning of the end or possibly even the end itself. Just another reason why BCV points will be higher cost and higher points per night than BWV.

Dean

 

[Peggy Sue]

What a horrible experience! So sorry you and your family had to go through that.

Thanks Werner Weiss for calling OKW and getting the "up to the minute" guidelines for all of us.

We don't take advantage of pool hopping, but many do and it is a nice perk to have. I agree with Werner Weiss that Disney should get their act together and come up with a better system to monitor and enforce their rules.

I also agree with Dean that Pool hopping to your home resort is not guaranteed if you are not a guest at your home resort. However, Disney should have a better way to communicate with DVC members about which pools are closed that day to pool hoping. Werner Weiss had an excellent suggestion of a voice message we all could dial to check out what was closed before heading out the door for the day.

You never should have been singled out and asked to leave after being at the pool for 3 hours, plus the CM didn't make any effort to find other ture "gate crashers", who should have been asked to leave immediately.

Write the letters, keep writing them, and print and send this thread along. Hope this incident didn't ruin your entire vacation. Please let us know how they respond to your letters.

Have a wonderful day!

 

[LIDisneyFan]

Again, I'll quote the DVC website regarding pool hopping during this period:

Due to the high occupancy that is expected in early April, DVC Members will not be permitted to use the pool at Disney's Yacht and Beach Club Resort on certain dates. The dates that have been identified so far are April 1-15, 2001, but additional dates may be included. Please check with the resort front desk regarding pool availability prior to going over to the resort.

This says nothing about checking at the desk for any other resort. period. I did not get my vacation magic (which I thought was a mirror copy of the website - I'm wrong) until after I was away. If I knew I was supposed to call Boardwalk to confirm, I would have. Disney needs to get together their communication so that this does not happen again.

Again, the pool was not crowded. Let's get that point straight.

Also, I understand the contractual issues - However, I do have a problem with sales people representing a product in a certain way during a contract signing - My main concern is the lack of trust in what I am told during my sales presentation.

By the way, I reread our documents last night - Disney can also remove any DVC property from DVC point sharing (or the entire program) whenever they feel like it - so those of you who are quoting contract should be prepared when you can only use your home resort (no, I don't think this will ever happen - I'm just pointing out that the contract we all signed gives Disney carte blanche on virtually every decision. So don't assume the BCV will be part of our program)

No, I will not be quiet because a sales person told me something that is untrue - Disney is not my parents - I don't expect them to pull rights from me because I complain or make it difficult.

I spoke with the Manager of Product Development, who basically agreed that the situation was mishandled, but explained that pool hopping can be revoked at any time. I tried to explain that this benefit costs nothing, and that the number of poeple who use it at other DVC resorts is inperceivable compared to the total capacity - that removing this right causes detriment and nothing else. They should concentrate on checking everyone at the pool before they come in, and make sure they don't overbook their rooms with too many guests.

She did tell me that I should speak with the GM of any hotel wif anything like this should ever happen again BEFORE we leave the pool area. Usually it can be rectified. I went to the DVC offices instead (thinking this was a DVC sales misrepresentation issue)

I then got a very sincere call from the GM at the BW, who appologiozed for the way the situation was handled. Without going into details, he has 'made up' for the embarrasment. He also indicated that operationally they may have to come up with a better system (checking everyone on the way in) like SAB does.

Missed a call from the Director of DVC sales (I'm calling him back Monday) - this is the one that converns me most, because (just like the 5 in a room story), I feel I was lied to in a direct manner when a direct question was asked. I'll post back again after that call.

I never thought for a moment that other DVC resorts were treated like other "WDW reorts' for us memebers. The program was described as one big happy family, where points were interchangable, and the only difference was your booking window. Again, I guess I misunderstood, or was mislead.


On a totally seperate topic, If SAB is so crowded now, how on earth will they handle the crowds when BCV opens. We know the pools for the villas (based upon WLV) are much samller, and most people will use SAB.

 

[DVCDAVE]

Quote-- "By the way, I reread our documents last night - Disney can also remove any DVC property from DVC point sharing (or the entire program) whenever they feel like it - so those of you who are quoting contract should be prepared when you can only use your home resort"

Yes, the contract does say that, and I asked for clarifaction on that before I purchased. I felt I received a fair and honest answer from my CM, Jim McCoy. He, like you, explained that no one expects this to happen. However, it is there to emphasize the fact that we each own a real estate interest in a resort, not a program. Further, whatever 'privilages' that are currently packaged around ownership of the real estate interest are subject to change. As a result, Disney must use the broadest language possible to cover almost any contigency that may arise, in order to clearly express that what you are only buying is a real estate interest, and nothing more.

I would also like to add that on the cover of the offering statement there is a disclaimer that there is no guarantee that this or any property will be added to the program. So it should not be a surprise to anyone that BCV or any future property will be added. I belive this disclaimer is repeated more often than any other phrase through out the offering statement.

WDW:
76,77,78,87,FW
92,Offsite
95 POL
96(2), GF,Offsite
97,GF
98,99,00,FW
8/00 DVC member @ BWV
3/01 BWV, FW
3/01 DVC member @ WLV
11/01 BWV !

[This message was edited by DVCDAVE on 04-13-01 at 09:59 AM.]

 

[Tinkerbelloncapecod]

It is a sad day when Disney treats their customers like this poor family.

Yes we were told we could pool hop when we bought into BW and I understand when it's crowded that we cannot pool hop but to single out this family and ruin their vacation day was inexcusable! they should have asked guests of guests to leave the pool area first instead of a DVC Member!

SHAME ON DISNEY!!!!! roboucher@nehcf.nemc.org

Tinkerbelloncapecod

 

[dtheboys]

So that the pools are used by DVC and guests of the resort, have a towel check in area! You must show the girl your DVC card or Hotel I.D. The towel can be all white w/ a colored stripe, or some other markings. This will eliminate non-Disney pool hoppers, and guests trying to sneak in from Let's say All Sports, etc.
Will this work?? <IMG SRC="/infopop/emoticons/icon_confused.gif" alt="confused">
This towel check only has to be used during peak periods at the resort. Ex: April, June, etc.

[This message was edited by dtheboys on 04-13-01 at 10:06 AM.]

 

[DVCDAVE]

I like that idea DTHEBOYS !! it is sutle, yet affective !!

WDW:
76,77,78,87,FW
92,Offsite
95 POL
96(2), GF,Offsite
97,GF
98,99,00,FW
8/00 DVC member @ BWV
3/01 BWV, FW
3/01 DVC member @ WLV
11/01 BWV !

 

[LIDisneyFan]

Actually, at OKW, you get your towels from Hanks (they don't ask for ID, but I know many other timeshares request ID when getting towels) -having a similar setup at BW might work well, but it would cost an additional person working there (community hall is much farther away) - but the idea is a good one, and shows that this does not need to be major problem for a company as smart as Disney.

 

[dtheboys]

This can also be as easy as a waterproof handstamp. Just go up to the food area at the pool bar, show your I.D. and get a hand stamp!
Then no additional staff is even needed!
I love DVC, and the people who are members( well most of them HA HA HA)

 

[tarzanman]

I am glad that the BW GM apologized for the wrongdoing that occurred to you and your family. While pool hopping still exists, the way it is done or allowed should be made more clear to the DVC members. DVC and the resorts should be on the same page.

It actually irks me that the Y & BC pool is not available like the others. I know that it gets crowded. It should however be set up so that if its full that people will have to wait to get in whether you are a resort guest or not. That is why there are so many pools. You just have to go to a different one. Should people that buy 1 day park tickets to MK get to go on rides before me because I have a hopper and can come back later. No! If I want to go early in the morning when no one is there but still can't get in that is pretty stupid.

Just another opinion.

some trips as a child
DxL 4/00
DVC member 4/00
BWV 9/00, 12/01
VB 9/00, 5/01
DCL 1/01, 12/01-1/02 New Years Cruise
OKW 1/01

http://gennaroworld.topcities.com