Pennsylvania governor orders flags to be flown at half staff - agree or disagree

[declansdad]

What the lawyer and the reporter's quotes both show it that reasonable intelligent people can and will disagree on this. Trying to bully the other side with bombastic pronouncement usually makes the poster feel good but doesn't really accomplish anything.
I mean seriously? You have a person who sat down with the man and interviewed him and a professor of law and yet somehow you know better!

On the legal points, I certainly don't disagree with them. Given what we know, Paterno fulfilled his legal obligations, no doubt. However, Geoff_M does raise a good point, what should he have sone if his superiors didn't do anything? Should he have left it at "I did what I was suppose to do under the eyes of the law?" or should he have said "I need to make sure this was looked after in order to ensure no child in being harmed?" The law will always stop at a point much shorter than morality.

 

[LuvsDragonflies]

The answer to your question seems to be evolving, doesn't it?

Yes, yes it does.

Whatever the "law" states he can get away with doing or not doing has nothing to do with the fact that "JoePa", beloved of 10's or 100's of thousands, did NOT do the honorable thing. He did NOT do what a man given this kind of "hero worship" should have done. Morally, he blew it.

You can play ring round the rosie with all the points of law you want, you aren't going to change the fact that JoePa, when all is said and done, did not act with honor, integrity or with any kind of grit at all.

He sat in his little weasel hole and let it all play out. He deserves no honor given because in the end he was shown to have none himself.

 

[babyrich]

my husband's grandfather is 85. He may not want to talk about child molestation; but he certainly understands what it is and that it is wrong.

Even if you believe Paterno did what he was required to do, did he ever question why Sandusky is still hanging out with boys? Even asking the people he reporting the indicident too could have helped.

There is no doubt in my mind that the "powers that be" knew what was going on. I dont doubt that they threatened Sandusky; but he is a sick animal and never stopped.

I wonder if these boys had been from well off families and not from less fortunate situations if the results would have been the same.

 

[WebmasterAlex]

Yes, yes it does.

Whatever the "law" states he can get away with doing or not doing has nothing to do with the fact that "JoePa", beloved of 10's or 100's of thousands, did NOT do the honorable thing. He did NOT do what a man given this kind of "hero worship" should have done. Morally, he blew it.

You can play ring round the rosie with all the points of law you want, you aren't going to change the fact that JoePa, when all is said and done, did not act with honor, integrity or with any kind of grit at all.

He sat in his little weasel hole and let it all play out. He deserves no honor given because in the end he was shown to have none himself.

If we are discussing morality the Reporters comments are the much more meaningful ones. OH and the lawyer for the victims, how come nobody has addressed those?

See I think it's actually a healthy thing we are having this discussion. Nobody is arguing that Sandusky, if found guilty, and it appears he will be, should be sent away for the rest of his life and I think we all wish the death penalty applied.
Nobody is arguing that Mike McQueary a 28 year old man should have done more than run and call daddy and I think we are all bummed out that isn't a crime.
Nobody is arguing that Curley or Schultz handled this correctly
Pretty much everyone agrees on most of this. We are arguing over what a peripheral figure knew. Joe wasn't central to this no matter how you slice it.

 

[LuvsDragonflies]

Also no matter how you slice it, he showed himself to be an ineffectual coward when push came to shove.

Again, not honorary material. He knew what he knew and he allowed it to perpetuate.

 

[Wadecool]

Yes, yes it does.

Whatever the "law" states he can get away with doing or not doing has nothing to do with the fact that "JoePa", beloved of 10's or 100's of thousands, did NOT do the honorable thing. He did NOT do what a man given this kind of "hero worship" should have done. Morally, he blew it.

You can play ring round the rosie with all the points of law you want, you aren't going to change the fact that JoePa, when all is said and done, did not act with honor, integrity or with any kind of grit at all.

He sat in his little weasel hole and let it all play out. He deserves no honor given because in the end he was shown to have none himself.

to the bolded. His legacy is going to be eternally connected to this scandal and rightfully so. Just deserts.

 

[WebmasterAlex]

Let me make sure I understand. If you repeat the same thing over and over, don't include any facts and add an occasional it becomes true?

 

[Wadecool]

Let me make sure I understand. If you repeat the same thing over and over, don't include any facts and add an occasional it becomes true?

Take away the and the quote above could be attributed to a few of the JoePa defenders. See how that works?

 

[Geoff_M]

to the bolded. His legacy is going to be eternally connected to this scandal and rightfully so. Just deserts.

I'm afraid that experience has shown that history will be much kinder to Paterno's memory that his critics hope for. If you wish to see the arc that this story will likely follow, see: Michael Jackson.

 

[WebmasterAlex]

Take away the and the quote above could be attributed to a few of the JoePa defenders. See how that works?

No, actually I don't, there have been plenty of new facts brought in, the interview with the reporter, the article from the lawyers, the quote from the victims attorney

 

[WebmasterAlex]

I'm afraid that experience has shown that history will be much kinder to Paterno's memory that his critics hope for. If you wish to see the arc that this story will likely follow, see: Michael Jackson.

Especially when you consider that Michael was the one charged with molestation and Joe is at best several level's removed

 

[lions1995]

I find it repulsive that a governor would order flags flown at half mast for a man that condoned child rape.
QUOTE]

Are you speaking about the governor himself? he knew about it and investigated it for years, but did nothing to alert anyone or ensure Sandusky was removed from the presence of children. Even AFTER he bacame governor and sat on the Board of trustees at Penn State, he allowed for Sanducky to have an office in Beaver Stadium. I am sure HIS excuse is that he could not do anything to interfere with the investigation / Grand Jury. I think it shows a complete break down in the legal system.

 

[WebmasterAlex]

Anyway this has way crossed the line into debate
I'm not just going to lock it, since I participated that wouldn't really be fair. (and probably the only reason another admin didn't lock it a long time ago!)
If it straightens out we'll just let it go, if it crosses back over to debate I'll lock it

 

[HelenePA]

Since your here... Alex why are the boards sooooo slowwwwwwwww and are you going Thursday or will you be watching on TV?

 

[sunshinehighway]

People can argue that Paterno was just a football coach or that he told his superiors and they were responsible for taking care of the situation. The truth of the matter is Paterno wasn't just a football coach. He was an extremely powerful man at that university. All of this hoopla associated with his death proves just how powerful he was. If he cared enough he could have done something about the situation. He chose to protect his football program from scandal at the cost of those boys.

He didn't understand what was happening because he was on old man? Give me a break. In that same interview he later says that if someone was doing that to one of his kids, he'd get a group of guys together and take care of the situation.

He was a disgusting person. He used his power to protect a sick child rapist because it benefited him.

 

[Wadecool]

Anyway this has way crossed the line into debate
I'm not just going to lock it, since I participated that wouldn't really be fair. (and probably the only reason another admin didn't lock it a long time ago!)
If it straightens out we'll just let it go, if it crosses back over to debate I'll lock it

Ya think? Good to know that one of the main Paterno defenders (and debaters) in this thread also just happens to have his/her finger on the kill switch...

 

[LuvsDragonflies]

Okay, so I have sunshine down for a "no".

 

[WebmasterAlex]

Since your here... Alex why are the boards sooooo slowwwwwwwww and are you going Thursday or will you be watching on TV?

These servers were supposed to be replaced a looonnng tim ago they are ancient. I have brand new servers ready to go that I put a LOT of work in to and there's an issue with the host- trust me I'm major frustrated!
Nah, it's kind of a long drive from Boston

 

[LuvsDragonflies]

No, actually I don't, there have been plenty of new facts brought in, the interview with the reporter, the article from the lawyers, the quote from the victims attorney

Fact: he knew about the molestations

Fact: he walked away without ever looking back or ascertaining that the molestations had ceased.

Fact: Honorable people don't do that. Honorable people protect the children, not their own butts.

Fact: Honorable people deserve half flags, cowards who let children continue being molested don't rate that. Michael Jackson included.

If this signals debate, I beg you pardon.

 

[WebmasterAlex]

Ya think? Good to know that one of the main Paterno defenders (and debaters) in this thread also just happens to have his/her finger on the kill switch...

Nobody got a point or a warning nobody was deleted, nobody was cut off
Nobody was proved right or wrong and nobody's opinion was changed.

All fair and life on the internet