Parents whose kids have an Epi-pen-- school question --UPDATE

[mickaholic4077]

I am a substitute teacher for a school district. If offered,I would take any training(if I didn't have to pay for it-I'm being honest here!). My problem is I'm never told about any problems that a child might have that would require medical intervention,or even that a child has to go to the clinic for daily medications.

 

[Mandychelle79]

I would be causing one hell of a riot if my child needed an epi-pen and was not allowed to carry one with him/her. Im ana to bees and have very little time to administer it.

 

[torinsmom]

I am a substitute teacher for a school district. If offered,I would take any training(if I didn't have to pay for it-I'm being honest here!). My problem is I'm never told about any problems that a child might have that would require medical intervention,or even that a child has to go to the clinic for daily medications.

Do teachers in your district not have to have a list of allergies and dietary restrictions in their substitute folder? That is one of the things we have to do by the first day of class. Not having that is REALLY asking for the school to be sued.

I have a child in my class who is allergic to peanuts and both my assistant and I were trained on how to use the epi-pen. We didn't have to sign anything. I hope I don't have to use it, but I would be more worried if I didn't have the training and ended up NEEDING to use it.

At my old school, epipens were in the classroom, but at my current school, they are kept in the nurses office. The rationale is that any location can call the office and the nurse(or secretary) will come to the child. If it was in our room, time would be wasted figuring out whose room the child was in and where the epi pen was kept in the room.

Marsha

 

[mickeywho?]

I'm in shock reading some of your school policies and worries about liability. I can give you a totally different perspective...some food for thought.

In our school, and school district, and I would imagine province-wide as well, epi-pens are kept on the person that is in need. ie - in a small baggie that is attached to a belt or backpack if kept at a desk. That way if something were to happen one is at the ready - many parents give additional ones to the office (we don't have school nurses in our board) and the teacher.

We also have something here in Ontario (may be something similar in other provinces..) called the "Good Samaritan" Law. Quite simply it means if you find someone in any kind of medical distress and you've tried to help you cannot be held liable - EVER! So whether it's a child in a classroom who is having an allergic reaction, or someone dropping in a mall with a potential heart attack - if you have done anything to help no matter what the outcome - you cannot be sued. (Well - if anyone tries to sue you it would be thrown out of court so quickly and the lawyer involved would anger the judge so much they would wish they could disappear so no lawyer would ever go along with someone trying something so lame!)
The example given to me the last time I had my CPR/First Aid training: If a child goes into Anaphylactic shock and you DO administer the epi-pen the outcome...minutes added to their life so that ambulance has time to arrive, possibly a sore and bruised leg because you pushed it too hard, a chance for doctor's to help. If you DON"T administer the epi-pen, they could be dead before an ambulance arrives, dead before they get to the hospital, or dead before a doctor has a chance to help. They're dead or brain damaged to due lack of oxygen while waiting for the doctor to be able to get to them but at least they don't have a sore leg...

People should not be afraid to help because of potential liability. Someone's lame attempts are better than the other potential outcome.

 

[deb24k]

Wow! Here in MA we have to participate in several mandatory trainings at the beginning of each school year and one of them is epi-pen training. Personal epi-pens are in a travel bag in the classroom and we have a universal one located in the nurses office. I work with preschoolers who could never administer their own epi-pen.

Honestly, I would rather take the liability associated with giving a dose of epinephrine than the liablility associated with not giving it. This can be a life and death matter. What if a student passed out prior to being able to administer their own medication? The staff would then do what? Would they watch him go into resporitory distress and hope he doesn't stop breathing before help arrives? I am actually slightly shocked that a large portion of educators would take the risk of a student's death and then lawsuit for not providing care over any of the limited other possibilities.

 

[Christine]

Is there *really* liability associated with using an Epi-Pen on someone?

I was watching the new the other night and they were talking about providing CPR without doing the breathing (mouth to mouth) and how it was okay. They were also discussing the use of the defib units placed in most offices now. At the end, the newscaster said "People, please don't worry about using these devices or any other measures to save a life, you won't get in trouble. Ordinary citizens trying to perform lifesaving measures are protected by Good Samaritan laws." Would a teacher or any other adult close to a anaphylactic child and trying to treat that child be covered by the same laws?

 

[mickaholic4077]

Do teachers in your district not have to have a list of allergies and dietary restrictions in their substitute folder? That is one of the things we have to do by the first day of class. Not having that is REALLY asking for the school to be sued.]

I have a child in my class who is allergic to peanuts and both my assistant and I were trained on how to use the epi-pen. We didn't have to sign anything. I hope I don't have to use it, but I would be more worried if I didn't have the training and ended up NEEDING to use it.

At my old school, epipens were in the classroom, but at my current school, they are kept in the nurses office. The rationale is that any location can call the office and the nurse(or secretary) will come to the child. If it was in our room, time would be wasted figuring out whose room the child was in and where the epi pen was kept in the room.

Substitute folder? What's a substitute folder? Okay,I exaggerate a bit,but I almost never have an official substitute folder when I get to a class. I can't tell you how many times I have had to call down to the office when I arrive at a classroom and don't have even a class roster for the day. Teachers,please,at the least put a class roster on your desks at the minimum every day when you leave,so if you are unexpectedly absent,at least the sub will know who is in the class!!

 

[deb24k]

Is there *really* liability associated with using an Epi-Pen on someone?

I was watching the new the other night and they were talking about providing CPR without doing the breathing (mouth to mouth) and how it was okay. They were also discussing the use of the defib units placed in most offices now. At the end, the newscaster said "People, please don't worry about using these devices or any other measures to save a life, you won't get in trouble. Ordinary citizens trying to perform lifesaving measures are protected by Good Samaritan laws." Would a teacher or any other adult close to a anaphylactic child and trying to treat that child be covered by the same laws?

Not in MA as we are protected by a good samaritan law. But, truly the nurses at every training I have been to (13 yrs) have all stated that epinephrine in a limited dose when a true attack in not occuring will have limited short term effect like caffine. Seriously, anaphylaxis equals constricted airways and not breathing. It would be pretty hard to not recognize them with a student with a known allergy. And, I guess I would rather be sued than live with the death of a student for fault of my own unresponsiveness.

 

[chell]

DD has a nut allergy and had a reaction a few weeks ago. It took 90 minutes for a full blown reaction to occur with wheezing and lethargy. I don't know all there is to know about allergies, but don't think it's necessary for a child to carry an epi-pen on them if there is a nurse a few seconds/minutes away. ??

Keep an eye on her though because another reaction can occur faster. Each time you are exposed to an allergen the reaction can happen faster and worse sadly.

It is a shame teachers aren't trained on how to administer these since they are so easy, especially as common as bad allergic reactions are now. Although I have some severe allergies I haven't had an epi pen until last week. As soon as we brought it home my husband & I both read everything thoroughly. But thanks to a thread on the DIS a few months ago with a link to a video and great discussion on the thread I already knew everything I needed to know. Thankfully I've been able to avoid my allergens but I do worry that I'll slip up somewhere, so I figured I should keep a pen on me.

Poor kids don't have the knowledge of foods and ingredients like I do. And I'm sure they are tempted too, I sure am! But I do wish the schools would do something more to keep the pens closer to the students. I would want my child's pen in the room. What if the nurse isn't available? What if she is in the restroom? Those precious seconds could mean life or death for a child.

Thank you to those of you who aren't afraid to administer these if needed.

 

[luvmy3]

I would be causing one hell of a riot if my child needed an epi-pen and was not allowed to carry one with him/her. Im ana to bees and have very little time to administer it.

If the site where I get my info is updated regularly then PA currently does not have a law that says a child can carry their epi-pen on their person while in school. However, school districts can make it their policy to allow it, they just don't have to according to the law. There are only a few states that do not, so hopefully that will change in the near future especially with life threatening allergies on the rise.
My ds will be carrying his inhaler with him and I honestly expect a problem when it comes time to notify the school, but the law says he can so they can't stop him. Its currently at the nurses but now that he is no longer using the nebulizer in school there is no need for his medication to stay at the nurses office. As of now he will not be able to have his epi-pen on him, and unfortunately I don't think I would be able to change that no matter how much hell I gave them.

 

[Mandychelle79]

If the site where I get my info is updated regularly then PA currently does not have a law that says a child can carry their epi-pen on their person while in school. However, school districts can make it their policy to allow it, they just don't have to according to the law. There are only a few states that do not, so hopefully that will change in the near future especially with life threatening allergies on the rise.
My ds will be carrying his inhaler with him and I honestly expect a problem when it comes time to notify the school, but the law says he can so they can't stop him. Its currently at the nurses but now that he is no longer using the nebulizer in school there is no need for his medication to stay at the nurses office. As of now he will not be able to have his epi-pen on him, and unfortunately I don't think I would be able to change that no matter how much hell I gave them.

I was allowed to carry my epi-pen ten years ago, when the schools were just beginning to get up in arms about things. That said if it wasnt allowed, I would have still carried it ( and allow my child to do so). Id fight it in the courts if I had to.

 

[JessicaR]

If the site where I get my info is updated regularly then PA currently does not have a law that says a child can carry their epi-pen on their person while in school. However, school districts can make it their policy to allow it, they just don't have to according to the law. There are only a few states that do not, so hopefully that will change in the near future especially with life threatening allergies on the rise.
My ds will be carrying his inhaler with him and I honestly expect a problem when it comes time to notify the school, but the law says he can so they can't stop him. Its currently at the nurses but now that he is no longer using the nebulizer in school there is no need for his medication to stay at the nurses office. As of now he will not be able to have his epi-pen on him, and unfortunately I don't think I would be able to change that no matter how much hell I gave them.

This article is dated 09/14/09, I would search for an update. Looks like it has passed or is about to be.

"Most of the states have it," said Nate Silcox, a legislative assistant in Orie's Harrisburg office. "It's time that Pennsylvania got in line."


Legislation moving through the General Assembly would change that. Senate Bill 736, sponsored by Sen. Jane Orie, R-McCandless, would require schools to allow students to carry epinephrine auto-injectors, best known under the trade name EpiPens, in school. The bill passed the Senate in June, and it was approved by the House Education Committee last month, clearing it for a vote by the full House.

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/s_642960.html

http://www.legis.state.pa.us/cfdocs/billinfo/billinfo.cfm?syear=2009&sInd=0&body=S&type=B&bn=736


Right to Carry Medications in School for Asthma & Allergies

 

[luvmy3]

This article is dated 09/14/09, I would search for an update. Looks like it has passed or is about to be.

"Most of the states have it," said Nate Silcox, a legislative assistant in Orie's Harrisburg office. "It's time that Pennsylvania got in line."


Legislation moving through the General Assembly would change that. Senate Bill 736, sponsored by Sen. Jane Orie, R-McCandless, would require schools to allow students to carry epinephrine auto-injectors, best known under the trade name EpiPens, in school. The bill passed the Senate in June, and it was approved by the House Education Committee last month, clearing it for a vote by the full House.

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/s_642960.html



http://www.legis.state.pa.us/cfdocs/billinfo/billinfo.cfm?syear=2009&sInd=0&body=S&type=B&bn=736


Right to Carry Medications in School for Asthma & Allergies

From the article it doesn't seem like its a law, still just a bill. I found the same for my state, there is a bill to allow students to carry but it is not yet a law. Still good news for these states, it means they are trying to change things, I can't imagine it not going through in either.

 

[luvmy3]

I just got a call from the nurse and the doc won't sign off on ds's self administering. I can underdstand the hesitation with the epi-pen, but the inhaler He was diagnosed with asthma almost 4 years ago, dh and I made it a point to make sure he knew exactly what to do if an attack happens, and he always self administers his medication at home. I am so surprised.

DS just brought home a sheet for me to sign stating that teachers are not permitted to administer the epi-pen. I can't even believe this, so a child cannot carry his epi-pen, and even if he could the doc won't give him permission to, and nobody but the nurse can administer it. I guess they really have the safety of their students as a top priorty, huh

 

[MM27]

I was allowed to carry my epi-pen ten years ago, when the schools were just beginning to get up in arms about things. That said if it wasnt allowed, I would have still carried it ( and allow my child to do so). Id fight it in the courts if I had to.

I agree 100% with that. I know it's not the same, but when I was in school we were not allowed to have aspirin on us and the nurse couldn't give it out. My mom gave me a bottle to keep in my bookbag and told me to ask to go to the bathroom and take it in there if I needed it.

 

[lovetoscrap]

I have allergies and asthma. I have an inhaler and an epipen. My DD also has asthma. I am not sure why the child carrying the inhaler and self administering that is an issue? While asthma attacks can come on fast and be severe, there is time to get to the nurse and give the inhaler. If the attack is so bad that there isnt time for that then 2 puffs from the inhaler immediately aren't going to help. I have had attacks so severe that multiple inhaler puffs weren't effective. A few minutes to get to the nurse wouldnt make a difference. DD13 has permision to carry and self administer hers but she is in Middle School and needs it before and sometimes during PE everyday. This is just a formality so she can keep it in her PE locker and not have to go to the nurse everytime she needs it. I have no problems with an inhaler staying in the nurse's office.

But for an epi pen I think if the allergy is severe then it should be on the child's body at all times (they make special fanny type packs for this). My allergy isn't to anything common where I live now so I don't worry about having it on me at all times. If it was a nut allergy or bees or something common I could come in contact with I would have it on my body. With a truly severe allergy the time it takes to asses the situation, pick up a classroom phone, call for help (hoping someone picks up the phone immediately), for the nurse to get the message, grab her keys, unlock the cabinet, find the epi pen for that particular child and then run to the classroom could mean death.

The fact that someone could get to the nurse's office in 30 seconds means nothing. The epi pen isn't in her hand waiting to be administered. And as someone mentioned, what if the nurse is in the bathroom? in a classroom? at lunch? Life and death may be the difference between administering the epi pen within seconds. In the teachers desk? Not acceptable, what if it is locked? What if papers got thrown in on top of it? In the child's backpack? Well, is the backpack in the closet with 22 others? Do you remember which pink backpack belongs to the child turning blue on the floor while you are panicing?

The idea of an epi pen being in the nurse's office scares the heck out of me. As has been mentioned, you can't tell what a reaction will be based on the last time. They tend to get worse each time. I know mine did. Throats can start closing up in seconds and you don't have the luxury of time. As a former teacher and current substitute teacher I would be very angry to have a child have a reaction and NOT have an epi pen available to administer.

 

[flying_babyb]

I work in childcare and we keep our kids epi pens locked in our classrooms. No licenced nurse on staff and NO epi pen training. Actully I never thought about it but im in a class with a child alergic to bees and have never used a epi pen. I guess I better look up how to use one just to be safe. Where can one find a epi pen traning class? I would be so willing to do a class just for peice of mind.

 

[Talking Hands]

I am a substitute teacher for a school district. If offered,I would take any training(if I didn't have to pay for it-I'm being honest here!). My problem is I'm never told about any problems that a child might have that would require medical intervention,or even that a child has to go to the clinic for daily medications.

Same thing in my district. Only time we know if a student has a medical problem is if they tell us themselves. I would be glad to take any training necessary. It is really dangerous to the kids to keep subs in the dark about medical needs of students they work with.

 

[Mandychelle79]

I work in childcare and we keep our kids epi pens locked in our classrooms. No licenced nurse on staff and NO epi pen training. Actully I never thought about it but im in a class with a child alergic to bees and have never used a epi pen. I guess I better look up how to use one just to be safe. Where can one find a epi pen traning class? I would be so willing to do a class just for peice of mind.

Seriously, its super easy. Take out of tube, pull gray cap in back to activate, and press hard into outside of thigh. It can go through jeans, but is easier if undressed. My 6 yr old can do it on me if needed.

 

[flying_babyb]

thank you, I feel better knowing how to use one. Allergies at work make me nervious since Im in 7 diffent classrooms and NEVER have a clue whos alergic to what (and each teacher has there allergy list in a differnt place) so its very scary. Ive talked to my boss but got ignored.