Open letter to Disney concerning new TSA full body scan.

[ccgirl]

Figures the person that wrote the letter is from Boston. As my DH says, we are full of Northeast elitests up here. Being from Boston, he could surely drive or take the train. If he wants to fly then he needs to choose one of those. One interesting fact is that Logan Airport in Boston was one of the first to install these machines. That being said, the author of the letter would need to go thru one at the airport regardless of their destination, WDW or not. Secondly, the amount of radiation is less than you get from the airplane itself. Lets not forget where the planes that crashed into the World Trade Center originated.

Anyway, that's just my two cents. Sometimes I think people just look for something to be upset and protest about so they feel more powerful.

 

[TDC Nala]

I've only read the first post, but I can't figure out what Disney has to do with the fact that the writer of the letter refuses to fly because doesn't like the scanners TSA may be using and doesn't like the pat-down alternative. I don't think Disney can stop TSA from using them. Not sure that his threat to withdraw his business from Disney because of the TSA is going to make a lot of difference to Disney. Can't he drive to Florida?

Realistically, the only way TSA might reconsider is if the airlines lose business because nobody flies for fear of these scanners.

The letter came from this blog post which explains why a letter to Congress is not worth it but a letter to Disney (ie. the biggest money maker) would be.

A letter from this one dude won't be worth it. Only if Disney is receiving thousands of letters from guests who say if Disney doesn't do what it can to stop the TSA from using the "intrusive" scanning techniques then they won't fly and won't come to Disney parks, will Disney sit up and take notice. I suppose that's what the blog is for, to encourage others to write. I'm not signing up, I'll be flying scanners or no scanners.

If he is so worried about radiation I'd imagine he doesn't even like the regular x-ray machines. Is he stating that passengers shouldn't be screened at all? That ain't gonna happen.

 

[CPT Tripss]

But isn't that the point - to disassociate the person seeing the image from being able to see the actual person. So say, I, the unscrupulous TSA agent sees something I think I like in that blurry image (LOL - I'll try not to go any further than that!) and decide that on my break, I will go search out that person and see about a date?

Edited: oh yeah, and for the reason dburg posted below - the more obvious one - so everyone else in the security area doesn't see - LOL! kind of forgot about that part!

Ummm.. because they are trying to make it so that people that are seeing you 'naked' dont really see who you are.. So, you'd rather have the screener in YOUR view, which means the 'nude' pictures of YOU are viewable not only to you, but to others around you??? Yea, dont see people letting that happen...

Come on, do better than that . . . one way glass keeps the screener from seeing us and it's a simple matter of positioning the monitor to hide the image from view of those outside the booth.

 

[CPT Tripss]

I'm sorry that is pathetic. Islam is one of the largest if not the largest religion in the world. Because of of extremests that make up less than one percent of the relgion have bad intentions you panic over seeing two together. Gosh I bet 60 years ago you would have panicked over seeing two black men together. I am a new yorker. I saw the destruction. I spent a day worried that my father was dead because he worked there. My husband finally doesn't have nightmares are a regular basis because he was one of the engineers down there trying to pull the buildings off of people after they fell. I hat when people use 9-11 as an excuse for blantant racism that would not be seemly if directed at any other group.
We are travelling ti wdw next week. We will opt out of the scanners. If any one does follow proper procedure as published by the TSA I will be lodging a formal complaint and contacting my congressman and senators.
The founding fathers would be horrified that we are allowing this to happen with no real protests.

Huzzah!

But, TSA won't publish their SOP . . . . . . they don't want us to know when they overstep their bounds.

 

[maxiesmom]

Come on, do better than that . . . one way glass keeps the screener from seeing us and it's a simple matter of positioning the monitor to hide the image from view of those outside the booth.

What do you imagine the screener is doing that you need to see them? I honestly don't want to see the screener who views my pics. That would make me very uncomfortable. My home airport has the scanners now, and Orlando may by the time I fly in December. I will gladly submit if it means a smaller chance of the unthinkable happening on my flights.

 

[CPT Tripss]

What do you imagine the screener is doing that you need to see them? I honestly don't want to see the screener who views my pics. That would make me very uncomfortable. My home airport has the scanners now, and Orlando may by the time I fly in December. I will gladly submit if it means a smaller chance of the unthinkable happening on my flights.

Aren't you uncomfortable with the thought that the screener could be sitting there joking with another screener about some part of you that is on their screen? They ain't always discrete or professional!

From http://www.nbcmiami.com/news/local-beat/TSA-Fracas-After-Body-Scanner-Reveals-TMI-92971929.html

Perhaps the new airport body scanners are a bit too revealing.

A TSA worker in Miami was arrested for aggravated battery after police say he attacked a colleague who'd made fun of his small genitalia after he walked through one of the new high-tech security scanners during a recent training session.

Rolando Negrin, 44, was busted for assault after things got ugly at Miami International Airport between Negrin and some of his fellow Transportation Security Administration workers on Tuesday.

Sources say Negrin stepped into the machine during the training session and became embarrassed and angry when a supervisor started cracking jokes about his manhood, made visible by the new machine.
...

 

[N965VJ]

Not flying is a valid option. I'm sure Greyhound would love to have more business!

If you want to build or buy your own private plane/jet feel free, then you won't be held to the TSA or governmental security scanning.

Train, bus, car, rent a plane, plenty of other options if you can't live with the current regulations.

If I don't want to take my shoes off to go through security, I can CHOOSE not to fly. There are busses, trains, cars, horses, and walking.

2.) Don't fly commercial airlines, and find another way (ground, chartered priviate flight, etc.)

Sorry, no. The TSA has set up operations at Greyhound terminals, train stations and recently on an Interstate just outside of Atlanta. The TSA has also been trying to encroach on General Aviation (privately owned aircraft):

Personal Liberties — For the first time, the TSA’s regulatory activities would be extended to personal GA aircraft, historic and vintage aircraft, and operators, passengers, and pilots flying for personal and business use. As such, the LASP is a radical departure from anything the TSA has enacted to date. It would, in effect, require governmental review and authority before you could operate your own personal vehicle.

And it would require separate review and authority for every single flight that included passengers. Nothing like the LASP has been imposed on cars, trucks, boats, or any other privately owned, privately operated vehicles. The TSA’s proposal raises serious constitutional questions about personal liberty, privacy, and freedom of movement.

The above is from the EAA, one of the largest General Aviation advocacy groups in the nation, and the bolded words are theirs. PM me if you would like a link, as I cannot post links in this forum just yet.

thanks but tsa agents arent underpaid they pay them well it dose not take alot to become a tsa agent you really just have to have a high school degree and pass their training and test.

TSA screeners are not required to have a high school diploma.

Can they see tattoos? I'd be tempted to have one showing them the middle finger. They can't prove that I'd done it just for their viewing pleasure.

The machines do not see tattoos, but an undershirt with a message in duct tape may work. Of course, the best option is to simply opt-out. See the DontScan link in my sig for more info.

Number 1. TSA agents who view the images of people in the backscatter machines are completely AND I MEAN COMPLETELY isolated from the machine itself. They have built soundproofed, windowless rooms for the person viewing the images.

<SNIP>

I work for TSA

Are you not aware of the Whisper Radios that will link the booth operators to their colleagues out at the checkpoint? They are not as isolated as you imply.

 

[maxiesmom]

Aren't you uncomfortable with the thought that the screener could be sitting there joking with another screener about some part of you that is on their screen? They ain't always discrete or professional!

From http://www.nbcmiami.com/news/local-beat/TSA-Fracas-After-Body-Scanner-Reveals-TMI-92971929.html

No, becasue I think the type of person to joke would still do it, even if they were in view. I also wouldn't think that that kind of behavior would be anywhere near the norm.

If you have looked at the images, they are not not detailed to the point that they would even be able to see a nude snapshot of you and know they were the same person. The images looks more like something I would color, if I were 8yrs old.

 

[disney david]

Sorry, no. The TSA has set up operations at Greyhound terminals, train stations and recently on an Interstate just outside of Atlanta. The TSA has also been trying to encroach on General Aviation (privately owned aircraft):

Personal Liberties — For the first time, the TSA’s regulatory activities would be extended to personal GA aircraft, historic and vintage aircraft, and operators, passengers, and pilots flying for personal and business use. As such, the LASP is a radical departure from anything the TSA has enacted to date. It would, in effect, require governmental review and authority before you could operate your own personal vehicle.

And it would require separate review and authority for every single flight that included passengers. Nothing like the LASP has been imposed on cars, trucks, boats, or any other privately owned, privately operated vehicles. The TSA’s proposal raises serious constitutional questions about personal liberty, privacy, and freedom of movement.

The above is from the EAA, one of the largest General Aviation advocacy groups in the nation, and the bolded words are theirs. PM me if you would like a link, as I cannot yet post links in this forum just yet.





TSA screeners are not required to have a high school diploma.





Are you not aware of the Whisper Radios that will link the booth operators to their colleagues out at the checkpoint? They are not as isolated as you imply.

sorry i was trying to be nice to them figured they didn't

 

[npcougar]

Sorry, no. The TSA has set up operations at Greyhound terminals, train stations and recently on an Interstate just outside of Atlanta. The TSA has also been trying to encroach on General Aviation (privately owned aircraft):

AFAIK there are no fully body scans at train stations or bus terminals.

 

[vicki_c]

No, becasue I think the type of person to joke would still do it, even if they were in view. I also wouldn't think that that kind of behavior would be anywhere near the norm.

If you have looked at the images, they are not not detailed to the point that they would even be able to see a nude snapshot of you and know they were the same person. The images looks more like something I would color, if I were 8yrs old.

It's funny but BEFORE this exchange even started - I was going to come back and say that I could care less about what a screener thinks about my image on the scanner. Really - there's tons of things that might make me uncomfortable (hand pat downs) but this wouldn't be it. I don't really care if they laugh, make comments, poke their fellow screeners in the ribs and point at the screen with tears of laughter rolling down their face -- it just doesn't matter to me. I won't know about it and I don't know them AND they can't even see me face to face. I really don't care what they think or say about it.

 

[N965VJ]

AFAIK there are no fully body scans at train stations or bus terminals.

DHS/TSA is busy acquiring mobile scanners:

Chaffetz: Mobile Scanners Invade Privacy
by Daily Herald
Thursday, 26 August 2010

Not content to keep security employees from ogling naked pictures of air travelers, Rep. Jason Chaffetz is going after similar technology driving down the road.

Chaffetz (R-Utah) saw a video this week for American Science & Engineering's Z Backscatter Van. It performs in a generally similar way to airport body scanners, though instead of looking through clothes, the van-mounted machine sees through vehicles and cargo containers. Pictures shown on the company's web site show less detail of the human body, but it's not just nudity that bothers Chaffetz -- it's privacy.

"Americans have a reasonable expectation for a degree of privacy," he said. "I can't imagine that that is legal and lawful. If (it is), then we're going to have to change the law."

 

[maxiesmom]

It's funny but BEFORE this exchange even started - I was going to come back and say that I could care less about what a screener thinks about my image on the scanner. Really - there's tons of things that might make me uncomfortable (hand pat downs) but this wouldn't be it. I don't really care if they laugh, make comments, poke their fellow screeners in the ribs and point at the screen with tears of laughter rolling down their face -- it just doesn't matter to me. I won't know about it and I don't know them AND they can't even see me face to face. I really don't care what they think or say about it.

I agree. And not only do I think the people reading the scans will be way too busy to take the time to point and make fun, I think the novelty of it would wear off really fast. How many times could you point and make fun of the same body parts? After a while it will be old hat and boring.

 

[rosiep]

It's funny but BEFORE this exchange even started - I was going to come back and say that I could care less about what a screener thinks about my image on the scanner. Really - there's tons of things that might make me uncomfortable (hand pat downs) but this wouldn't be it. I don't really care if they laugh, make comments, poke their fellow screeners in the ribs and point at the screen with tears of laughter rolling down their face -- it just doesn't matter to me. I won't know about it and I don't know them AND they can't even see me face to face. I really don't care what they think or say about it.

I agree. I simply don't give a flying fiddle what someone thinks about my saggy ****s or my granny panties or whatever else they care to laugh at.

 

[pr surfer]

Hey N965VJ,

Nice to see another TS&S FT'er over here!

-Rob (mkt)

 

[sam_gordon]

DHS/TSA is busy acquiring mobile scanners:

Chaffetz: Mobile Scanners Invade Privacy
by Daily Herald
Thursday, 26 August 2010

Not content to keep security employees from ogling naked pictures of air travelers, Rep. Jason Chaffetz is going after similar technology driving down the road.

First, because of the part I bolded, this sounds more like an opinion piece instead of a factual piece. Second, while I don't doubt scanners that you mention are being developed, that doesn't mean they are considered legal, or have even been put into government use.

Although it's been a long time since I traveled by bus or train, I drive on a regular basis. I have yet to see (or hear about) any more intrusive steps taken by the government.

 

[N965VJ]

Hey N965VJ,

Nice to see another TS&S FT'er over here!

-Rob (mkt)

Thanks for the welcome!

First, because of the part I bolded, this sounds more like an opinion piece instead of a factual piece.

What I quoted appeared in the digital version of Homeland Security Today.

Editor's bio:

David Silverberg, Editor, is a respected Washington writer and editor with experience in defense, technology, congressional affairs and publication management. He helped conceive and launch Homeland Security Today in May 2004. In 2009 he was the first-ever recipient of the "Journalism That Matters" award from the American Society of Business Publication Editors.

David Silverberg has reported for Defense News, where he covered international trade and technology issues, and Armed Forces Journal, where he was editor-at-large. In 1998 he conceived, helped launch and edited the magazine Military Information Technology . He also served as executive editor of Military Training Technology and Missiles & Munitions. From 1999 to 2002 he served as managing editor of the weekly newspaper The Hill, covering Congress. During that time, he also authored the book Congress for Dummies (October, 2002), part of the popular "Dummies" book series, as a comprehensive and accessible guide to the US Congress. His writing has appeared in a variety of publications from the popular to the academic, including The Annals of the American Academy of Political and Social Science. Silverberg also has appeared on numerous TV and radio talk shows.

Second, while I don't doubt scanners that you mention are being developed, that doesn't mean they are considered legal, or have even been put into government use.

There is serious money to be made in the security-industrial complex. The TSA's 2011 budget is pegged at $8.2 billion dollars. The company making the scanners just received a $2.8 million order.

Although it's been a long time since I traveled by bus or train, I drive on a regular basis. I have yet to see (or hear about) any more intrusive steps taken by the government.

The Show Of Force Farce™ in Atlanta just recently was only the beginning.

 

[padawans]

I would like to know why Janet won't go through the scanners aren't our fearless leaders supposed to set the example for us little people. For those of you that oppose the scanners don't give up hope. There are several privacy advocate group and other groups that have filed lawsuits. This is America you have the right to fight for your constitutional rights. I can tell you after Janet left his state. All the speed cameras she put up on the freeway were shut down. There were a lot of people filing lawsuits and fighting hard to have these removed. A regime change also helped. If you feel strongly about it don't give up. The same people will not be in control for ever.

 

[padawans]

In addition I just read an news piece about Janet trying to unionize the tsa. If this is true. It will be really hard for them to get fired for any abuse of their power.

 

[CPT Tripss]

I agree. And not only do I think the people reading the scans will be way too busy to take the time to point and make fun, I think the novelty of it would wear off really fast. How many times could you point and make fun of the same body parts? After a while it will be old hat and boring.

If it becomes old hat and boring to the screeners and there is no one to monitor them as they "work," how long will it take for them to get sloppy on the job. They can't miss a red light on a WTMD.