One Man's Dream closing for a preview ;(

[Planogirl]

I don't agree that Walt is like the current management. He was always innovative which sadly enough is all too lacking nowadays unless you count Disney buying existing IP's. I hope that that is changing but it's been pretty bleak for a while.

No Walt wasn't perfect but he was responsible for what came and that is enough IMO.

 

[chelynnah]

You can find the One Man's Dream movie on youtube. I know it isn't the same, but at least you can see it.

Thanks, I did look it up earlier, but got distracted in another thread, and then in real life (shock-horror lol). I haven't told DH he's going to have to miss it live yet.

I'm just grateful we planned our 'Christmas' trip for this yea pr and not next so we'll still get to see the Osborn Lights. And as long as the rest of One Man's Dream is still there that will be good.

 

[epcotty]

Did anyone see the recent PBS documentary on Walt? That was interesting and informative

 

[havoc315]

I agree that Walt wasn't a saint however I don't think corporate Disney is consistent with Walt. I think that is clearly seen in Disneyland where most of the rides are higher quality then some at WDW and the old rides are better than the new stuff being made. I mean seriously…finding Nemo ride was such a waste all they did was play a projector on a fish tank and the Little Mermaid ride…they couldn't do better animatronics then that?!

Walt engineered WDW as well, just died before it was finished.

And I definitely will take Soarin, Mine Coaster, Star Tours, over Carousel of Progress and Enchanted Tiki Room.

 

[havoc315]

I don't agree that Walt is like the current management. He was always innovative which sadly enough is all too lacking nowadays unless you count Disney buying existing IP's. I hope that that is changing but it's ben pretty bleak for a while.
No Walt wasn't perfect but he was responsible for what came and that is enough IMO.

He was a racist, mysogynist, who allied himself with extreme anti-Semites. (And that's according to his niece!)He put profit above workers.
He was also a great marketer and extremely creative. He was kinda a cross between Donald Trump and Steve Jobs.
Some would suggest that Walt would be appalled by the "bad behavior" of the current corporation. It's really more of the opposite -- the company is now more moral than under Walt himself.

No, the current company isn't trying to forget Walt. Quite the opposite -- they promote a fake myth of Walt... They promote the fake myth, white washing his extreme faults. You get Mr Banks, and One Man and a Dream, etc.

 

[Redcon1]

Walt engineered WDW as well, just died before it was finished.

And I definitely will take Soarin, Mine Coaster, Star Tours, over Carousel of Progress and Enchanted Tiki Room.

You need to retake Walt 101.
Walt did not engineer WDW. His plan was for EPCOT, an entire urban community where people would work and live, not just a resort with theme parks. He also died five years before the MK opened and didn't even see the park being built, much less the city he envisioned.

 

[havoc315]

You need to retake Walt 101.
Walt did not engineer WDW. His plan was for EPCOT, an entire urban community where people would work and live, not just a resort with theme parks. He also died five years before the MK opened and didn't even see the park being built, much less the city he envisioned.

You are technically correct.... I wasn't referring to EPCOT and the subsequent parks. I was referring to the initial construction --- "The Florida Project" with which Walt was very very much involved. And certainly, he was very involved in the plan for Magic Kingdom, which broke ground shortly after his death. In later years, plans did stray from his original plans -- As you correctly said, EPCOT was very very different than envisioned by Walt. But Magic Kingdom was very much designed under his auspices.

 

[Emily Gilmore]

A really good, objective biography about Walt is The Animated Man: A Life of Walt Disney. He wasn't a saint, but he wasn't a horrible human being as some would like to believe.

 

[chelynnah]

A really good, objective biography about Walt is The Animated Man: A Life of Walt Disney. He wasn't a saint, but he wasn't a horrible human being as some would like to believe.

Ahh, so he was just human like the rest of us, with good qualities and flaws...

On a side note, I know it's been addressed above, but can anyone who is there definitely confirm that the exhibit IS open (minus giant desk) even though the film has been switched out for the preview? Touring plans wouldn't let me put it in my plan stating that it was closed for the period mentioned above.

 

[Happy_2_B]

I noticed the post about the PBS special that just ran- and the question was asked did anyone see it? Crickets... It ran two nights, and is a very good narrative about Walt Disney and the company he started. I still have it saved on my TIVO so we can watch it again. As with all PBS documentaries, it contains no 'dramatic license' like the movies do.

I understand being upset about an attraction being closed/changed for a movie preview- regardless of what that attraction may be about. Instead of the concern that Walt's attraction is slowly being phased out anyways- why not just watch or read something that actually has some 'meat' to it and learn his story if one really cares that much? PPs are right- most of the current guests do not care about Walt- or who he was.

The are very few of us on the boards that are old enough to remember sitting in front of the TV every Sunday night to watch The Wonderful World of Disney when it was actually hosted by Walt himself. The show hosted by him started on a Friday night in the late 50's, but then moved to Sunday in the early 60's and stayed there for many, many years. I feel fortunate to have had the opportunity to grow up with Walt in my living room every week, and agree that people interested in who he was should learn about him. But, a dated theme park attraction probably isn't the best way to go about that for anyone that is truly interested in the history of the company and the man. For those wanting to learn about Walt, who he was, and what he did- there are better alternatives than a short film and a few relics stashed in a room in a theme park.

 

[chelynnah]

I noticed the post about the PBS special that just ran- and the question was asked did anyone see it? Crickets... It ran two nights, and is a very good narrative about Walt Disney and the company he started. I still have it saved on my TIVO so we can watch it again. As with all PBS documentaries, it contains no 'dramatic license' like the movies do.

I understand being upset about an attraction being closed/changed for a movie preview- regardless of what that attraction may be about. Instead of the concern that Walt's attraction is slowly being phased out anyways- why not just watch or read something that actually has some 'meat' to it and learn his story if one really cares that much? PPs are right- most of the current guests do not care about Walt- or who he was.

The are very few of us on the boards that are old enough to remember sitting in front of the TV every Sunday night to watch The Wonderful World of Disney when it was actually hosted by Walt himself. The show hosted by him started on a Friday night in the late 50's, but then moved to Sunday in the early 60's and stayed there for many, many years. I feel fortunate to have had the opportunity to grow up with Walt in my living room every week, and agree that people interested in who he was should learn about him. But, a dated theme park attraction probably isn't the best way to go about that for anyone that is truly interested in the history of the company and the man. For those wanting to learn about Walt, who he was, and what he did- there are better alternatives than a short film and a few relics stashed in a room in a theme park.

Well I'm in the UK so no specials, no channel, but I HAVE made a note to keep an eye open for it. If you have the name of it (rather than just PBS documentary) that would be helpful

I'm 'almost' old enough. I do remember watching WWoD every Sunday night with him hosting, but it could have been a recorded host. I think I also remember it being hosted by Jiminy Cricket. That night was always family night for us

Maybe people don't care who he is anymore but maybe with the two movies out recently people might have been. Anyway, if it closes it closes, I think it's sad but I understand things move on. However, while it's still open I think it's silly to put a non-related film in there instead of leaving it alone for people to see one last time or a first time.

 

[seashoreCM]

You need to retake Walt 101.
)Walt's) plan was for EPCOT, an entire urban community where people would work and live, not just a resort with theme parks. He also died five years before the MK opened and didn't even see the park being built, much less the city he envisioned.

(for deep thinking, i.e. not to be replied to in the next hour) Did (could) Walt envision the women who sat at rows of desks in multistory non-airconditioned flat buildings and who painted the cels for Snow White and the 7 Dwarfs (and for other features) living in the Experimental Prototype Community Of Tomorrow with their children and (adding another feature of today) without husbands?

(footnote) A documentary on Walt Disney seen on public television recently.

 

[kaybird]

Well I'm in the UK so no specials, no channel, but I HAVE made a note to keep an eye open for it. If you have the name of it (rather than just PBS documentary) that would be helpful

.

The PBS special ran for 2 nights, two hours each, under the series "American Experience" Happened to see a poster advertising it when my family took me on a surprise trip to the Disney museum in Marceline, Missouri. Well worth the trip is you are ever near the area, lots of personal letters, many given by Walt and Roy's sister.

 

[chelynnah]

The PBS special ran for 2 nights, two hours each, under the series "American Experience" Happened to see a poster advertising it when my family took me on a surprise trip to the Disney museum in Marceline, Missouri. Well worth the trip is you are ever near the area, lots of personal letters, many given by Walt and Roy's sister.

Thanks, I will have a browse and see if i can find it here

 

[Delirium]

Every guest that walks through the museum should tell the cast members working (do it nicely) what a stupid idea this is.

 

[Happy_2_B]

Did (could) Walt envision...

the company is now more moral than under Walt himself...they promote a fake myth of Walt...

No real deep thinking required since most of us aren't mind readers of people that are no longer on the planet- and he left nothing behind that has surfaced relating to any vision/thoughts he may have had relating to this issue. One could do the same hypothesizing with Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, or any other founder of what later became huge multinational conglomerates. We could even do it with ourselves. IMHO what is important- in all these cases- are what the corporations became once seeded by the founder's original visions.

That Walt has been 'whitewashed' by the company is just good business. It isn't 'fiction' or 'myth'- the corporation is just smart enough to highlight his strong points. To do otherwise would have been bad for business. Do any of us put our character flaws on our resumes? I think the answer is 'no'- as one generally leaves their personal life at home, because if it is brought into the workplace one can expect to be quickly replaced by someone smart enough to 'leave their personal life at their front door' when they head out to work. We are all human, and we all have flaws- his just happen to be more in the 'public realm' than those of us who get to keep our skeletons hidden away in the closet. Is the company more 'moral' without him? A bit of a reach I think- since profits are at or close to all time highs, and one's character flaws generally have nothing to do with business. A smart businessman puts his personal views to the side and focuses on ways to increase profits- Walt was no different, and his corporate legacy has nothing to do with his personality quirks. A whole lot of smart people have followed in Walt's footsteps and, although they haven't carried out all of his plans, they have kept the majority of the 'essence' of his vision alive for millions to enjoy today and into the future.

Am I saddened by the idea that this attraction might be eliminated at some point in the not-too-far-off future to make room for current Disney offerings? No. Times change, and although Walt will always be the founder with the original vision, the visitors of today want to experience Disney as it exists now and into the future, not it's legacy. Put simply, it's good for business- and Walt would probably have approved.

 

[Happy_2_B]

Every guest that walks through the museum should tell the cast members working (do it nicely) what a stupid idea this is.

It isn't that far from KC, and we were thinking of heading that way when we are in the area. What exactly about it did you feel was an issue for you when you visited? Have read some positive comments, but am also interested in the other side of the story. Thanks.

 

[havoc315]

No real deep thinking required since most of us aren't mind readers of people that are no longer on the planet- and he left nothing behind that has surfaced relating to any vision/thoughts he may have had relating to this issue. One could do the same hypothesizing with Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, or any other founder of what later became huge multinational conglomerates. We could even do it with ourselves. IMHO what is important- in all these cases- are what the corporations became once seeded by the founder's original visions.

That Walt has been 'whitewashed' by the company is just good business. It isn't 'fiction' or 'myth'- the corporation is just smart enough to highlight his strong points. To do otherwise would have been bad for business. Do any of us put our character flaws on our resumes? I think the answer is 'no'- as one generally leaves their personal life at home, because if it is brought into the workplace one can expect to be quickly replaced by someone smart enough to 'leave their personal life at their front door' when they head out to work. We are all human, and we all have flaws- his just happen to be more in the 'public realm' than those of us who get to keep our skeletons hidden away in the closet. Is the company more 'moral' without him? A bit of a reach I think- since profits are at or close to all time highs, and one's character flaws generally have nothing to do with business. A smart businessman puts his personal views to the side and focuses on ways to increase profits- Walt was no different, and his corporate legacy has nothing to do with his personality quirks. A whole lot of smart people have followed in Walt's footsteps and, although they haven't carried out all of his plans, they have kept the majority of the 'essence' of his vision alive for millions to enjoy today and into the future.

I agree with all that. But remember, Disney was a massive conglomerate at the time of Walt's death, and his vision was to continue its expansion.

And yes, I agree with whitewashing of his history is purely a business decision, promoting a fake image of Walt as part of promoting the brand.

What I'm disagreeing with...
Some claim that Walt was a selfless hero, and Disney is trying to erase his history as they pursue greed.

It's really the opposite -- Walt pursued corporate greed, the current Disney goes out of their way to promote a heroic image of Walt.

And yes, the corporation probably is more "moral" today. Much like Apple and Steve Jobs. After his death, they improved their employee policies, they started corporate charitable donations.
In the case of Disney, in contrast to Walt, they have been more diverse and inclusive. Walt famously barred women from working in creative, he was a hard liner against organized labor, and many of his movies had racist overtones.

Walt's real history is very complex. Disney has not tried to erase Walt -- on the contrary, they have sought to promote a fake history solely about his virtues. Which is fine, as a business decision. But don't pretend that One Man's Dream is "historical." It's an attraction about a fictional character. If they terminate it, it would be no different than shutting down Peter Pan or the Tiki Room.

 

[Happy_2_B]

What I'm disagreeing with...
Some claim that Walt was a selfless hero.

This has been your ongoing platform to ensure everyone here knows Walt was not a saint- yet not a single post in this thread has referenced him as anything close to a 'selfless hero'. We are all adults, and we all know Walt was human and as such had his fair share of character flaws- and not one person on this thread has said otherwise. PP's have pointed out this fact to you as well in your earlier posts- yet you seem to just want to repeat your misguided belief that Walt's positive qualities which are highlighted by Disney are 'fictional' or not 'historical'. That simply isn't true. It is accurate historical information- and just because his positive traits are Disney's focus does not make them 'fictional' or 'non historical'. Disney has no obligation to highlight their founder's shortcomings. That's why they make biographies- if people want to know more they can read one. That information has no place in an attraction at WDW. They have, instead, included the facts and history which makes the attraction uplifting and positive- it is their right to do so- and nothing they have included is inaccurate from a historical perspective.

 

[havoc315]

This has been your ongoing platform to ensure everyone here knows Walt was not a saint- yet not a single post in this thread has referenced him as anything close to a 'selfless hero'. We are all adults, and we all know Walt was human and as such had his fair share of character flaws- and not one person on this thread has said otherwise. PP's have pointed out this fact to you as well in your earlier posts- yet you seem to just want to repeat your misguided belief that Walt's positive qualities which are highlighted by Disney are 'fictional' or not 'historical'. That simply isn't true. It is accurate historical information- and just because his positive traits are Disney's focus does not make them 'fictional' or 'non historical'. Disney has no obligation to highlight their founder's shortcomings. That's why they make biographies- if people want to know more they can read one. That information has no place in an attraction at WDW. They have, instead, included the facts and history which makes the attraction uplifting and positive- it is their right to do so- and nothing they have included is inaccurate from a historical perspective.

I didn't say his positive qualities are not historical. Even Adolf Hitler had positive qualities. Now, Walt Disney was certainly not Adolf Hitler. But if you did a movie about Adolf Hitler only mentioning his positive traits, I'd consider it a pretty fictional account of him. Walt Disney wasn't a great man with a few minor flaws. He was a pretty awful human being (again, not as awful as Adolf Hitler, obviously). Disney has no obligation to mention to Walt Disney at all! They have as much obligation to mention Walt Disney, as they have an obligation to offer a meet and greet with Duffy the Bear.
You talk about what information has a "place in an attraction at WDW" -- WDW is about fantasy and magic. Fantasy and magic and fun, these have a place in attractions. One can say that history -- along with religion and politics -- don't belong in any WDW attraction. But honestly, if you are going to put in history, you should make it accurate history. If someone did an attraction about Hitler, about, "He was a great orator! A visionary! And really kind to animals!" -- It would all be technically historically true. But it would also be a total white wash.

OP said:
"everyone should remember how Disney was started…or maybe heads of Disney don't want people to remember how and why it started because it goes against what they are doing with Disney now"

No, I don't think everyone has an obligation to remember how Disney was started. And if they did, then they certainly should hear the whole story -- About how it started in racism, antisemitism and sexism. Can't have it both ways... Can't say... "everyone should know the story -- but they shouldn't know the whole story, they should only hear the whitewashed parts of the story."

As you said, some things have a place in Disney World, some don't. I don't object to "One Man" -- But I see it for what it is. A pure and total fantasy depiction of a man. Takes a pretty horrible human being, and only mentions him being a "visionary", etc. But like Peter Pan and Cinderella, "One Man" is a fantasy depiction. Yes, he was a visionary. And Adolf Hitler was a great orator. And Benedict Arnold was a great officer in George Washington's army. But such depictions are soooooo incomplete, that they cannot possibly be considered accurate historical depictions.

I assume we agree that Disney has absolutely no obligation to present any depiction of Walt Disney whatsoever.
I assume we can also agree that it makes good business sense for them to present a glorified white-washed version of Walt Disney to the public.
Therefore, I'll simply shed no tears if they shut down "One Man" -- just as I wouldn't shed any tears if they shut down "Tiki Room" or "Stitch's Great Escape."