Official word on the success of MyMagic+

[Laketravis]

FP+ gets most guests into the park and on a few rides quicker than before, who then leave the park to do other resort activities. This makes room in the park for other guests to now enter. It has to do with increasing efficiency to get more ppl thru the same capacity.

I completely agree with that. This last trip we found ourselves being able to do much less in each park after we used our 3 FP's - essentially because the SB lines were much longer than we were willing to wait; we found ourselves seeking out the few attractions that had (to us) reasonable waits but you can only do CoP or People Mover so many times no matter how much you enjoy it.

Guests who used to go, spend all day, ride many rides, will still go, spend all day, and ride many, or a few less, rides. But the majority of guests who used to go and want to ride 4-6 things and be good can now do so in much less time.

I think this is the part that is open to debate. The long-term question that remains unanswered is will guests still find value in being able to accomplish less per day in the parks.

 

[Angel Ariel]

No they're not saying that. But FP+ gets most guests into the park and on a few rides quicker than before, who then leave the park to do other resort activities. This makes room in the park for other guests to now enter. It has to do with increasing efficiency to get more ppl thru the same capacity.

But people leaving the park earlier to make room for more is only an issue on the days that they close the parks because they've reached capacity. That's only a handful of days out of the year. On the 99% of days that the parks *aren't* closing because they've reached capacity, a guest staying in the park all day doesn't prevent any other guest from entering the park.

I can definitely see how MM+ would increase attendance on those capacity days, and Disney pretty much spelled out last January that it did exactly that. But the rest of the year when the parks aren't at capacity?

 

[Burnedout]

Perhaps. But, you'd have to see the statistics and how the statistics were gathered to know if it is a fallacy or a true refection of cause-and-effect. To jump to either conclusion before seeing it all (which we will never get to do) is illogical.

Lol you aren't suggesting that statistics can be manipulated to say whatever you like are you?

Every story can be spun. To not realize that is ignorant of the process of research and the presentation of the numbers.

 

[MrInfinity]

I think this is the part that is open to debate. The long-term question that remains unanswered is will guests still find value in being able to accomplish less per day in the parks.

Most do not accomplish less. As I said, most are now able to quickly ride 4-6 big things plus a few smaller rides or shows, which is the sweet spot for most guests. They can do this in very little time. We had ~no~ trouble at all riding 6 major attractions plus a slew of minors in a half-day at the MK. FP+ makes this very attainable for pretty much everyone. That is they create a pretty darn good experience across the board in about a half day. When guests are content w what they rode, they leave. More room on the rides now for others.

The only ones who accomplish less are the extreme minority of ppl who used to get quite a bit more than the average guest out of FP-.

But people leaving the park earlier to make room for more is only an issue on the days that they close the parks because they've reached capacity.

I can definitely see how MM+ would increase attendance on those capacity days, and Disney pretty much spelled out last January that it did exactly that. But the rest of the year when the parks aren't at capacity?

Wrong kind of capacity. Don't think of it as park occupancy capacity... but in terms of capacity that the desirable rides can accommodate. So one person arriving, getting on 4-6 major attractions early plus some shows or secondary rides, then leaving the park, takes that person out of the pool for everyone else waiting to get on 4-6 major attractions.

By giving everyone a few rides fast, you accommodate most guests in less time.

 

[surferdave]

Customer approval of MDE means nothing, nada, zilch. They can point to their dubious surveys and take credit for all those people showing up to meet the Snow Queen as MDE gains all they want.

The real story is in the operating costs. Until the bulk of guests (first timers, long timers, whatever) become self sufficient users, the ponderous system becomes reliable and the overhead of extra CMs nursing it through the day can be released (maybe they can clean bathrooms) then they will have hard questions to answer from the more discerning investors studying the financial reports.

 

[gdrj]

Some of y'all are really reaching saying that Disney is lying about the statement that MM+ is positively contributing to the operating income. Hasn't everyone heard of Sarbanes-Oxley (SOX)? Robert Iger would be subject to criminal prosecution if he made false statements related to earnings. You can bet your house that Disney has data that supports that statement. I have reviewed and edited external communications for a Fortune 100 company. These communications are completely vetted and then have to pass Legal review. There is nothing that is left to chance.

Also, I do not read the quote as saying that MM+ is increasing attendance. That sentence is only stating a fact that attendance is up, not that MM+ is the cause (or for some of you - is correlated to MM+ ). If Disney was attributing the increase in attendance to MM+, they would make a direct reference to MM+ in that sentence.

"The early returns we are seeing from MyMagic+ are encouraging. During the fourth quarter MyMagic+ had a positive contribution to year-over-year increase in the segment’s operating income. Attendance at our domestic parks was up 4% with Walt Disney World setting a new fourth quarter record."

I agree! Also after spending a Billion (or whatever the investment is), I think there are probably analyzing data a bit more than just wow attendance is up, MM+ is a success. Obviously public comments are paired down, and not all information is shared. I hope at some point in the future when its not considered confidential that they share some of the data and how they used it and analyzed it. I think it would be fascinating.

On a separate note I wonder with all the DTD construction what impact has been felt in the Company owned retail stores there? Add to it all the construction projects in the Parks and the Poly what impact they have on attendance and sales. I know we have spent less time in DTD with our visits over the past year.

 

[Suvadoo]

My intent was not to quote statistics. I was responding to Laketravis when he said: Despite WDW's efforts so far to educate, I lost count of how many guests asked CM's how much the FP line cost or how it worked or where to get them. That's a pretty steep learning curve with a constantly renewing source of new students which presents quite a training challenge.

I then responded with:

This has always been the question. How much is Disney willing to pay for continuing guest education? This is not something that's going to change since most guests are one and done.

Why make up statistics. When I quote stats, they're real data.

So you're saying "Most guests are one and done". So you believe, honestly, that 51% or more of those who have been to Disney World have only gone once and will never go back. Riiiiight. I'd guess the # of ppl that fit that bill is something like 1%. I know lots of ppl that go more than once. Almost everyone on the Dis has or will go a second time, and everyone I know has been or will go more than once.

I don't know Anyone who has gone once, said it sucked, and will not go back.

Perhaps ppl from overseas for which it is a major expense, but of those who CAN (logistically and financially) go more than once, almost all will.

Show me this 51% that only go a single time.

I'm sorry that you found the one and done part of my statement so wrong. I have read on multiple web sites and I know that Len Testa has mentioned it on several occasions that most guests visiting WDW are first timers or they visit WDW so infrequently that it qualifies as a first time visit. I was talking about educating new students about FP+ nothing else.

 

[Mome Rath]

Lol you aren't suggesting that statistics can be manipulated to say whatever you like are you?

Actually they can't be manipulated to "say whatever you like" but close! lol

Every story can be spun. To not realize that is ignorant of the process of research and the presentation of the numbers.

Yup. As my stats prof said oh so long ago; Statistics never lie, but statisticians do. That's why to ever trust the outcome of a study you need to see the raw data (at the very least), and see how that data was collected and crunched. My husband and I both graduated from research oriented psych programs (his PhD level more so than my Masters), and we've seen first hand exactly what can be done with numbers and stats programs.

Not every statistician manipulates numbers, but that's not the point; the point is that they can indeed be manipulated in multiple ways. I for one love MB's, and MDX, and FP+, and I also like Disney as a company... but I'm not for one minute convinced they are above statistical manipulation (and that doesn't actually make them unethical). I also believe that their new system is working well for the company for the most part.

 

[dfb]

Why make up statistics. When I quote stats, they're real data.
:

Is this a joke?

A corp CEO's statements to the public or even its stockholders - real data??

I guess you believe Presidential candidate promises/ stats as well!

MM+, FP+ or whatever - it either works for you or it dosen't as evident in these threads. That determines success or not! Not the words of a corp CEO.

 

[Laz]

Actually they can't be manipulated to "say whatever you like" but close! lol



Yup. As my stats prof said oh so long ago; Statistics never lie, but statisticians do. That's why to ever trust the outcome of a study you need to see the raw data (at the very least), and see how that data was collected and crunched. My husband and I both graduated from research oriented psych programs (his PhD level more so than my Masters), and we've seen first hand exactly what can be done with numbers and stats programs.

Not every statistician manipulates numbers, but that's not the point; the point is that they can indeed be manipulated in multiple ways. I for one love MB's, and MDX, and FP+, and I also like Disney as a company... but I'm not for one minute convinced they are above statistical manipulation (and that doesn't actually make them unethical). I also believe that their new system is working well for the company for the most part.

Some random thoughts:

If your working for a company and doing research on the success of a new system that cost the company multiple millions of dollars, would you want to be the one to say that it is not working as planned? Or that many long time customers hate it? So if the researcher is an outside firm hired by Disney, and the researcher reports negative results, what are the chances that Disney execs would hire that firm again?

 

[jade1]

But people leaving the park earlier to make room for more is only an issue on the days that they close the parks because they've reached capacity. That's only a handful of days out of the year. On the 99% of days that the parks *aren't* closing because they've reached capacity, a guest staying in the park all day doesn't prevent any other guest from entering the park.

I can definitely see how MM+ would increase attendance on those capacity days, and Disney pretty much spelled out last January that it did exactly that. But the rest of the year when the parks aren't at capacity?

We were discussing this last night.

FP+ has created a huge potential to increase attendance even on days the park is not full-not just the handful of days with park closure, but other busy and moderately busy days as well. Really slow days it probably will not be as much of an impact, but even the slower days many guests would arrive sooner than just an evening of scheduled headliners.

We were at MK for Thanksgiving-but only went after 8PM to knock out the big 3 in an hour and a half. Would have never been able to do that in the past.

So we were not counted as attendance for the first 12 hours the park was open. That is a huge window for others to come and go that we normally would have been in, many that will also knock out 3 quick attractions and some will leave, some will stay.

So FP+ would indeed disperse crowd arrivals and departures making buses (and park entrances) more evenly (less) populated throughout the day.

In fairness we have AP and have visited a lot, so a 12 hour day in the MK is far from a priority for us any more.

Especially now with FP+.

We did Thanksgiving at our friends and just went to MK in the late evening.

So in theory, ride reservations pre-reserved ahead of time through an entire day (FP+), can allow a 75,000 park capacity to swell to 125,000 for the day-with never more than 40,000 in the park at one time.

Before there was a huge amount of FP+ dispensed at 11AM for a 7PM to 8PM return time-locking those folks in the park for 10 hours just to get on one attraction.

We did the same at AK last weekend, but a late morning 2 hour window.

 

[jade1]

Most do not accomplish less. As I said, most are now able to quickly ride 4-6 big things plus a few smaller rides or shows, which is the sweet spot for most guests. They can do this in very little time. We had ~no~ trouble at all riding 6 major attractions plus a slew of minors in a half-day at the MK. FP+ makes this very attainable for pretty much everyone. That is they create a pretty darn good experience across the board in about a half day. When guests are content w what they rode, they leave. More room on the rides now for others.

The only ones who accomplish less are the extreme minority of ppl who used to get quite a bit more than the average guest out of FP-.



Wrong kind of capacity. Don't think of it as park occupancy capacity... but in terms of capacity that the desirable rides can accommodate. So one person arriving, getting on 4-6 major attractions early plus some shows or secondary rides, then leaving the park, takes that person out of the pool for everyone else waiting to get on 4-6 major attractions.

By giving everyone a few rides fast, you accommodate most guests in less time.

 

[mummabear]

Yes, I'm sure that Disney is happy with MM+. I've said it before ... they are not interested with the repeat visitor as much as the "once in a lifetime" visitor.

I agree, I'm spending way more if "I'm never coming again" than if I go to the same place every year.[/QUOTE]

Interesting, we came for a once in a lifetime trip to WDW, have now gone 3 times and am planning a 4th. We have spent more every trip.

 

[Mome Rath]

Some random thoughts:

If your working for a company and doing research on the success of a new system that cost the company multiple millions of dollars, would you want to be the one to say that it is not working as planned? Or that many long time customers hate it? So if the researcher is an outside firm hired by Disney, and the researcher reports negative results, what are the chances that Disney execs would hire that firm again?

From what I've seen on the 'net, Disney would be collecting raw data and crunching it in-house. I have no doubt the execs want the actual data, and want accurate stats, as they can adjust what they are doing to become more efficient and profitable. How they share that data and what they say about it is another story. A good company watches over the interest of their investors and their customers, how they do that can enter "fuzzy" areas. I believe their overall releases about data, but what are they not reporting openly is sometimes just as important as what they do report, and further how they report it has a lot of wiggle room, all within the law. That's the business world.

 

[Laketravis]

I've often wondered why Disney doesn't report actual park attendance numbers.

 

[ellie05]

We really enjoy our last trip with MM+. I think it is a lot more planning far in advance but it seems less stressful while we were there. With FP you had to wait to see what time you were able to get the FP then adjust your plan. With FP+ you can plan your day months is advance and once you get there just follow the plan. Also it gives you a chance to sleep in and still hit the big attractions specially in HS and AK. Being able to make the 4th FP+ reservation with your resort concierge it is also great.

 

[Laketravis]

Being able to make the 4th FP+ reservation with your resort concierge it is also great.

Now that's something I completely overlooked during our stay. How did that work for you? Did you return to your resort after using your 3 FP's in a park that day, and then make an additional FP for a park you were headed to? What sort of availability were you seeing?

 

[Wenny]

I can't say I get why MM+ would cause increased attendance. Increased spending, sure. But are there people going "Hey...they just implemented this $2billion new system...gotta go try me some of that!"? Seems like the advent of Frozen would cause a rise in attendance more than MM+. I've got my next 3 trips planned despite MM+...certainly not because of it.

Says it all!

 

[emldrl]

Here is my experience with all this. We have not been since 2004, so you could call us the "once in a lifetime" visitors (or close enough). When I started looking into going, I of course started with the WDW site. MDE and FP+ is all over the place. The more I got into it, the more I had to research. A random bing search led me here, so I quickly learned a great deal more than a typical newbie.

I was surprised at all the advanced planning we will have to do, with ADRs and FP+. I didn't like this at first, but I'm fairly laid back, so decided to just do my homework and roll with it. Now, here's where all this planning is gonna get Disney more of our money than they would have originally:

1. We are scheduling at least 3 or 4 ADRs, where before we would have taken our chances with walkup.
2. We are getting hoppers, so that I don't have to stress about lining up park days with ADRs, FP+, crowd levels, etc.
3. We are now staying deluxe, as opposed to moderate. We decided to put our trip off to save more money, partly because of the extras like hoppers and ADRs, and if we're gonna wait, we're gonna go big when we finally get there.

Would we be spending as much before as we are now? Probably not. Is the extra spending because of all the changes? Partly. So you see, Disney wins again!! Oh, and by the way, we are at the lower end of the income scale, so their strategy is kind of brilliant, as pertains to us. (this is just one example, of course)

 

[Wood Nymph]

Now that's something I completely overlooked during our stay. How did that work for you? Did you return to your resort after using your 3 FP's in a park that day, and then make an additional FP for a park you were headed to? What sort of availability were you seeing?

We were able to have the concierge get us a 4th fastpass for Fantasmic. We gone back to the resort to swim and got the 4th fp from them that afternoon. It was very convenient since would not have bothered to go to DHS that night if we hadn't been able to get the fp for Fantasmic.