Official Thread - New commercial use policy published 03/31

[Girlstar30]

I was going to bring this up if nobody else did. Yes, with ETPE eliminated at Disneyland, and its replacement being a single LL per guest for the entire duration of the reservation, the logical work-around is to book separate reservations for each day at VGC or VDH. Doing so can quickly increase the number of reservations you have; maybe you'll hit 20+ reservations in a year.

I need to do this

 

[VGCgroupie]

Im at 21 so she is more commercial than I loll

Just looked again. I merged some, cancelled my FW so I am actually at 17 now. My last time I counted ( I would keep track for my rolling 12 months) was before my February stays.

 

[Mirabell Rose]

No, for STR it is the reverse, HOA's do not have the restrictions that COA do on not limiting STR ( covered extensively in prior threads)

Extensions are different than restrictions on use of property or rentals.

 

[Mouseforward]

Extensions are different than restrictions on use of property or rentals.

Extensions?

 

[Girlstar30]

Just looked again. I merged some, cancelled my FW so I am actually at 17 now. My last time I counted ( I would keep track for my rolling 12 months) was before my February stays.

I may be down to 20 tomorrow because im pretty sure this renter for my dvc tickets is going to flake. Interesting timing I had to talk about which rental company I loved more. My moonlight magic guessing game is also contributing to my overinflation and I have some aulanis that havent been merged yet so I can more easily go for something else. There is a strategy to being a legit owner too lol

 

[tx911]

Im at 21 so she is more commercial than I loll

I think my resorts are too expensive. I would need thousands of points to have 25 reservations!

 

[Girlstar30]

I think my resorts are too expensive. I would need thousands of points to have 25 reservations!

Cheap SSR owner here and fan of California studios

 

[Spivey378]

Now what am I going to do with my 10,000 points?!

 

[Steelers0854]

I think Disney knows who their problem children are and are going to use this policy to crack down on them. I would be absolutely shocked if anyone on these boards was ever impacted by this policy, unless of course they are not legitimately using their membership as intended. I wouldn’t, and won’t, stress about the number of reservations you have, how often you rent etc. Could end up being wrong of course, but in no world do I see it impacting anyone on here.

 

[cruisehopeful]

That is a good point. We used transfers every year to shore up points for reservations, and if transfers likewise became harder to find, we'd probably buy more points.

Still, it's just basic econ: aggregate demand will be lower so prices will also be lower.

Fwiw, paid transfers have always been against the rules. We can rent our points, but we can't charge a fee for point transfers.

I think if they really bring the hammer down, and that's a big if, resale prices could take a nose dive. If that happens, I'll probably buy some.

 

[SL6827]

I dont think any of us really think they are doing this to help the membership. While we all love Disney and DVC, we know that they are in it for their own interests.

Right, but I wonder if these commericial rentals and the just every so often rentals by members have made an impact on Disney's hotel occupancy and they have noticed that?

 

[juliebee]

Like @Tatebeck This makes me feel better about maybe buying (as I have 20+ rentals a year and might need to rent one every 2-3 years…in year 4 I’ve rented exactly one res!) more, BUT I will be waiting to see if they actually take action against the mega renters first and whether or not it makes it easier to book at 11/7mo.

Did you mean 20 reservations?

Where are you reading this?

https://cdn1.parksmedia.wdprapps.di...Contemporary-Resort-Commercial-Use-Policy.pdf
Section 4 Enforcement

 

[juliebee]

But that's not what it says. It says (emphasis added}:

"In any 12-month period more than 20 reservations are made by an Owner and/or its Associate (which may take into account all Points owned or controlled by an Owner across all Resorts at any given time) and a majority of such reservations are not used by the named Owner or Associate..." is just one of the bullet points provided, which is a non-exhaustive list of examples. It clearly states that "any one or more of the following activities" could be the basis for determination that the points are being used for commercial purposes. They can very clearly make that determination based on any of the other bullet points (or other criteria) regardless of how many reservations were made.

I agree that it says that. My point was that many have claimed they can rent 20 reservations out in a year and not be violating commercial use rules. I do not agree with that, unless they are personally using 21 reservations I guess. I think anyone that hits 11 rentals should be scrutinized (11 being the majority of 20).
DVC could say that a person that makes 5 reservations a year, uses 2 themselves but rents out 3 of them also violates commercial use rules since the majority of their reservations are not for their own use. But I don't think Disney will go there.

I'm very pro go after the big offenders.
I'm also very pro allow a person to rent out their points from time to time.

Additionally, I keep saying reservations, but it's also # of points. If I use 100 points but rent out 1000, that will draw concern too--

 

[VGCgroupie]

Right, but I wonder if these commericial rentals and the just every so often rentals by members have made an impact on Disney's hotel occupancy and they have noticed that?

I think they have. So pair the fact that they lose money to dvc rentals, paired with member complaints, paired w/ guest complaints, it makes sense to crackdown. Also they are very protective of their IP and and with AI people are creating cute rental advertisements with their IP.

 

[Sandisw]

So does this mean the previous is null and void? Or is it still applicable?

This would be the new policy and would replace any previous policy in existence.

So, they thhis replaces the 2011 policy and applies to all resorts.

 

[mkatsy]

I think Disney knows who their problem children are and are going to use this policy to crack down on them. I would be absolutely shocked if anyone on these boards was ever impacted by this policy, unless of course they are not legitimately using their membership as intended. I wouldn’t, and won’t, stress about the number of reservations you have, how often you rent etc. Could end up being wrong of course, but in no world do I see it impacting anyone on here.

Yup … I am approaching 20 reservations too. However, I also know that my face is on the cameras on property, my magic band is tracking me, and my credit card is recording the damage not too hard to determine how my membership is being used.

 

[VandVsmama]

I’m totally in favor of this new policy.

 

[Sandisw]

This one kind of gets me a little bit. For example, I have a December Poly reservation in a studio for myself and my husband. I have a second reservation for my adult child in a duo studio. Those are overlapping since it's the same dates. Since those situations are rare and easily explainable, I think most people will be able to justify it with DVC, but I don't like that people would feel the need to justify it.

I personally like that they have really come to it with specifics but the key for me, at least is that it makes clear that this is abutment runnimg DVC as a business.

So, you may have overlapping, but it’s still reads to me that volume is key…and if you don’t have the volume that they see as rising to the level of a business or enterprise, you will be fine for specific situsitons.

 

[O2HO2HO2H]

Full disclosure so we're all clear:

I'm back down to just over 1,100 points. I have rented a few times (once or twice a year maybe), but it has always been to unload points that we couldn't use (typically borrowed points on cancelled stays that were made in my name, for my use). I've always tried to use up as many points as possible in one rental, focusing on just getting rid of the points rather than seeking out the most money across multiple rentals. I think the most points I've ever rented in one year was maybe +/- 350, which is probably the average for a week-long stay in a 2 BDR, our preferred vacation stay. I've also gifted stays to family (I've apparently irritated people in other threads by saying I'd never charge family or close friends for using my points because I feel over a lifetime, things tend to balance out as long as it's not repeated or expected).

With that said, I absolutely despise anyone who's buying up points for the sole (or even primary, since I don't care what they think of me) purpose of renting them out for profit. I particularly can't stand those who clog up high value dates or room types simply because those dates maximize profits. If DVC were to catch one of those @#$&'s with 25 or 30 discrete rolling reservations advertising them on Facebook, I'd probably soil myself laughing. And I've yet to even find one of those people renting out dates that I want.

Since we're on full disclosure mode, I also happen to vehemently disagree with anyone who says "Points are points, it doesn't matter if the owner stays on them or rents them out". Members using points for their own stays, in the room types they prefer, at the resorts they prefer, during the travel times they prefer (or are restricted to by life), create an organic distribution of reservations. Yes, there will always be more popular dates and room types (I own at SSR, but I'm not jumping on standard view studios in August or September). but there will still be a predominantly organic distribution of stays. "People" (don't want to get put in timeout for using the more appropriate and accurate term) who solely buy points to target specific dates and specific rooms with absolutely no intention of using any of those reservations for their own use, do not, in any way, mimic that natural distribution.

There's my lean.

Say it louder for the people in the back.

If you're regularly making a profit, you're in it for commercial use.
If you're gifting stays to all your friends and family (or even extended people you know like friends of friends of cousins on your auntie's father's mother's side) that's not profit. You gave them away.

Edit: removed extraneous words from 3rd sentence.

 

[mkatsy]

A few weeks ago Disney sent cease and desists letters to third party providers of services like photography, cottage bakers, room decorators, etc. Basically people that were making an income off of resort guests. I think this policy update is in keeping with that theme, by finally reducing the amount of people making a profit off of the actual accommodations. Wait there’s more! … they also began restricting resort busses at Disney Springs to registered guests or dining patrons. It’s like Christmas the resorts are finally feeling some love.