nurses...how much Math do you need to know??

[Judy from Boise]

I so agree, I don't enjoy math the what I need to do, I do well. Skill wise once on the job she will only need basic algebra "solve for X" skills, and understand statistics of central tendency. To get through school balancing equations in chem is the killer.

 

[honugirl]

I have been in and out of the hospital for years. I always end up having extensive conversations with my nurses. One of the common themes is that they all HATE math. They all know math and have no problems with math and are execllent at what they need to know for their job but they absolutely hate it.

That and chemistry seem to be the 2 most loathed classes of any nurse that I have ever had. Everytime they have seen me working on either math or chem homework they all cringe...lol

Its like that with a lot of jobs. Just because you have to be good at something doesnt mean you have to liek it. NONE of my doctors like Organic chemistry. In fact, they all hate it. But they took it, they passed it and all is good. But they say that OChem is the devil. They love the biology adn anatomy/physio. aspect of medicine. Not the chem. aspect.

O-chem is fun! I actually like it, but it is the bane of may people's existence. I actually love doing my chem homework...

Not a big math fan here of anything above algebra, but I have to take it.

I so agree, I don't enjoy math the what I need to do, I do well. Skill wise once on the job she will only need basic algebra "solve for X" skills, and understand statistics of central tendency. To get through school balancing equations in chem is the killer.

Balancing chem equations is fun! It's like solving a puzzle.

 

[MomRN]

A lot of it depends on the program, place you work, etc.

I have my BSN. I needed college level math, biostats, and chemistry. Every clincal nursing class had a pharmalogical test (which included calculations) that had to be pass before clinicals. Often there was a 2 try limit, then you'd be dropped from the class. My pediatric nursing class had math "quizzes" every other week based on pediatric doses. My pharmalogy class had them weekly. So math is pretty heavy in nursing school.

My initial thought was that in the hospital we don't use much math on my floor. I work a specialized surgical floor with a medical mix. There is a calculation program for everything except heparin, and it has a "cheat" sheet like someone else mentioned. My pumps calculate drips, my computer tells me how many mls of a med to give to a person, a computer program tell what to run an insulin drip at.

Then I realized what many other posters have said. I do use math frequently, I just don't think about it being "math" anymore. Double checking dosages is just such a common part of the job, that my mind just automatically runs through it. I blame all those calculation quizzes in nursing school.

 

[nrpofp]

I am nurse. She needs to be able to do basic math ,add, multiply, divide, algebra. Nothing beyound a 6th grade level. I was always amazed in nursing school how many nurses with struggled with simple math problems. I have always been good in Math, but geez. You don't do a lot of math on the floor anymore most drips are programmed into the pump. If a pt needs 50mg of a medicine and you have 10mg pills you should be able to figure out how many pills to give. I think my 7 year old could problably do most of math I do at work now.

 

[LovableGluttons]

I agree, you don't need to love math to be a nurse.

That said, you have to have very critical thinking skills and be a fast thinker.

Years ago, dosage calculations was called "dimensional analysis".

Mosty of me career was NICU. SInce my husband was military, we moved every few years, which meant a new hospital for me.

All of the NICUs I worked in, except for one, required dosage checks with another RN before administration. So we checked each other's math. LOL

I laugh, but it was very reassuring! You came to know what areas each other dominated in and definitely took advantage.

My strength was always titrating dopamine using an old, LONG formula.

When I worked in the one NICU that didn't double check, I did it anyway. The other nurses just put up with it once they realized I wasn't going to stop.

I loved all math, except for Geometry. I still don't "get it". But put calculus in front of me and I'm happy.

If she truly wants to become a nurse, the math thing is easy to overcome and understand that it is only part of your profession.

 

[cm8]

I agree, you don't need to love math to be a nurse.

That said, you have to have very critical thinking skills and be a fast thinker.

Years ago, dosage calculations was called "dimensional analysis".

Mosty of me career was NICU. SInce my husband was military, we moved every few years, which meant a new hospital for me.

All of the NICUs I worked in, except for one, required dosage checks with another RN before administration. So we checked each other's math. LOL

I laugh, but it was very reassuring! You came to know what areas each other dominated in and definitely took advantage.

My strength was always titrating dopamine using an old, LONG formula.

When I worked in the one NICU that didn't double check, I did it anyway. The other nurses just put up with it once they realized I wasn't going to stop.

I loved all math, except for Geometry. I still don't "get it". But put calculus in front of me and I'm happy.

If she truly wants to become a nurse, the math thing is easy to overcome and understand that it is only part of your profession.

That sentence stated it all

 

[Kellydelly]

I got my ADN from a community college and there were no math courses required at all. I did have to prove competency before each clinical rotation with a calculations test, but they give you the formulas beforehand and you can practice. It is basic algebra, for the most part. Not every program requires chemistry and math. I know BSN programs do require chemistry, but not all ADN programs do. I did not have a pharmacy class for my ADN, the instructors inserted different meds into the med-surge classes where they actually applied to the body system/disorders we were learning about.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

I thought of one other thing to add here when I was driving to work. (These things aren't always "easy" to explain simply, and there are a wide variety of practice areas all over the country which may not operate exactly alike, so bear with me. I am speaking in general terms.)

Years ago (and maybe still in some places) nurses could go into "med rooms" or "stock rooms" and pick out the medications they wanted, mix them, and administer them. However, modern thinking is that "dispensing medications" isn't part of a nurse's scope of practice; it's a pharmacists.

So in JACHO approved facilities, it no longer happens in that fashion except in certain highly acute areas, such as ERs. (Other issues surfaced, too, like medications needing to be mixed under hoods; and intravenous drips with medications having to be mixed by pharmacists, not nurses, etc - all safety issues.) Stock medications are still available, but they are limited to common dosages in common, less serious medications - in a computerized vestibule that tracks users and medications, etc.

My point being that, again, in most places, even those not having computerized systems but who surely will be at some point, figuring out complex dosages is going to be taken out of nurses' hands, as it should be. Nurses will still, again, need to know basic computation skills and should understand the thinking behind drugs and dosing, but their role is one more of administering the medication than figuring out the dose.

And just in case anyone thinks it's mindless, it's not. Far from it. Nurse's roles in administering medications DOES include knowing the drug you're administering, observing safe practices in administration, observing for effects of the medication - both expected and unexpected/problematic, and responding if an adverse reaction occurs.

So nurses have their hands full already without the added problems and liability of "dispensing" medications. Once again, find employment in a facility that does not put you in this predicament.

Read more: http://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q...Bt0oUy&sig=AHIEtbTjYdlt_4zBWR7cmxQjeoJYwLL4Qw

 

[xCourxCorex]

For my program, math was definitely needed for Chem (a 1st year prereq before beginning "real" nursing classes). Statistics is the required math for nursing majors as well. Once we started being able to pass meds at clinical (2nd semester Sophomore year) we started dosage calculations.

As others have said, it's not THAT difficult, lots of solving for X etc. We did a lot of review and practice questions during lectures. Then before we were allowed to officially pass meds with our instructors, we had to pass a med math test. Every school is different, but in my program you have 3 opportunities to take the test, and you must pass with 100%. At first a lot of students were upset by the 100% and getting really stressed about it, but really, would you want a nurse who doesn't know how to correctly calculate how much of a drug you're supposed to get?

We have med math tests every semester. We also do things like fluid volume replacement and IV drip rates. For some, it's really not too bad (in fact I love math questions on exams because I'm comfortable with them and I know they're easy points) but for others, they struggle every time it comes up.

She should focus on maybe getting some extra help or tutoring from her high school teacher or an outside source to help her feel more confident with math, especially the basics. Also, most colleges and programs offer tutoring or math services. Good luck to your DD!

 

[LovableGluttons]

I thought of one other thing to add here when I was driving to work. (These things aren't always "easy" to explain simply, and there are a wide variety of practice areas all over the country which may not operate exactly alike, so bear with me. I am speaking in general terms.)

Years ago (and maybe still in some places) nurses could go into "med rooms" or "stock rooms" and pick out the medications they wanted, mix them, and administer them. However, modern thinking is that "dispensing medications" isn't part of a nurse's scope of practice; it's a pharmacists.

So in JACHO approved facilities, it no longer happens in that fashion except in certain highly acute areas, such as ERs. (Other issues surfaced, too, like medications needing to be mixed under hoods; and intravenous drips with medications having to be mixed by pharmacists, not nurses, etc - all safety issues.) Stock medications are still available, but they are limited to common dosages in common, less serious medications - in a computerized vestibule that tracks users and medications, etc.

My point being that, again, in most places, even those not having computerized systems but who surely will be at some point, figuring out complex dosages is going to be taken out of nurses' hands, as it should be. Nurses will still, again, need to know basic computation skills and should understand the thinking behind drugs and dosing, but their role is one more of administering the medication than figuring out the dose.

And just in case anyone thinks it's mindless, it's not. Far from it. Nurse's roles in administering medications DOES include knowing the drug you're administering, observing safe practices in administration, observing for effects of the medication - both expected and unexpected/problematic, and responding if an adverse reaction occurs.

So nurses have their hands full already without the added problems and liability of "dispensing" medications. Once again, find employment in a facility that does not put you in this predicament.

Read more: http://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q...Bt0oUy&sig=AHIEtbTjYdlt_4zBWR7cmxQjeoJYwLL4Qw

Exactly!

No, we're not supposed to dispense meds, but are sometimes put in the position of dispensing meds. (I remember 6 packs of oral narcotics for ER patients we would give them to go home with to get them through until they could fill a prescription. We had no all night pharmacies in town).

We mix antiobiotics in piggyback iv bags. In the NICU, we mix it, draw it into syringes, and infuse it into our patients with syringe pumps.

Knowing your measuremnts is really important for patient care and documentation

Nurse get sued. How often do you read about non medical professionals who are patients who gripe about their nursing care and talk of lawyers comes up?

The reality it, we work with that hanging over our heads every day.

Heck, if there is one thing I'd recommend any parent of someone (or spouse for older students) to read is a book called "I'm Dying to Take Care of You".

It explains a lot about the life of many nurses. I'm guilty of it myself.

While the math and science knowledge is important, there is a certain life when you are a nurse that is different from most occupations. It is important to know ahead of time what you are setting yourself up for before making that leap.