Non-verbal child and character M&Gs

[TheRustyScupper]

1) Forget about the card.
2) Just motion to the Character Attendant (aka, HANDLER) that she is non-verbal.
3) Usually, a quick word to the HANDLER or simply pointing to your own mouth and shaking your head "No" is enough.
4) This NOT an uncommon issue, so the characters know how to handle the situation.

 

[Angel Ariel]

1) Forget about the card.
2) Just motion to the Character Attendant (aka, HANDLER) that she is non-verbal.
3) Usually, a quick word to the HANDLER or simply pointing to your own mouth and shaking your head "No" is enough.
4) This NOT an uncommon issue, so the characters know how to handle the situation.

As I said, my concern isn't how or whether or not the characters will be able to interact with her. I am hoping that this will be a reinforcing/encouraging opportunity for her to learn she can communicate even without words.

We did what you suggest above and it works wonderfully . .the characters were great with her last year! We have no doubt they will be this year. This year she's showing a desire to be more independent where she can be, and we are trying to encourage that as much as we can - especially when it comes to her desire to communicate.

 

[elaine amj]

Read this with interest. My niece is joining us next August - she will be 3.5 by then and will likely still be non-verbal. She is just starting to say her first word now (banana). So this is helpful for me too. My son also had speech apraxia but did start speaking about a year earlier (he's almost 14 now and only occasionally stumbles over words).

 

[tjmw2727]

1) Forget about the card.
2) Just motion to the Character Attendant (aka, HANDLER) that she is non-verbal.
3) Usually, a quick word to the HANDLER or simply pointing to your own mouth and shaking your head "No" is enough.
4) This NOT an uncommon issue, so the characters know how to handle the situation.

Why ? (and why the red ?)

It seems as if the OP has established that they have been successful in the past and doesn't "need a card" but the card may make her dd feel more involved in the interaction.

I think what the OP is doing is wonderful and could be very empowering for her dd. If I understand correctly she has had wonderful experiences with the characters so far but would like to give her dd the opportunity to be more involved "if" her dd chooses to.

If the dd has the card or toy and understands how to use it than she can initiate the "conversation" rather than relying on her family. If she is feeling shy the family will continue to use the tools they have in the past.

I think its a great idea not for the education of others but for the benefit the daughter.

 

[SueM in MN]

Why ? (and why the red ?)

It seems as if the OP has established that they have been successful in the past and doesn't "need a card" but the card may make her dd feel more involved in the interaction.

I think what the OP is doing is wonderful and could be very empowering for her dd. If I understand correctly she has had wonderful experiences with the characters so far but would like to give her dd the opportunity to be more involved "if" her dd chooses to.

If the dd has the card or toy and understands how to use it than she can initiate the "conversation" rather than relying on her family. If she is feeling shy the family will continue to use the tools they have in the past.

I think its a great idea not for the education of others but for the benefit the daughter.

I think the card is a great idea for the 'face' characters, but I would shorten it and use the minimum words possible.
You want to make it quick for the character to scan, so just put the important words (not full sentences) with lots of white space because time with the character is short.

For example:
Hi, my name is ________.
May be shy and not talk, but excited to meet you.
Favorite characters: Mickey & Minnie, Flynn Rider, Zero
Favorite rides: Teacups, Dumbo, Haunted Mansion Holiday

Also, be aware that the characters don't 'know' anything outside of their cartoon. So, rather than specific things that are not part of that character's 'world', you might want to have more general likes. For example:
Favorite food: chocolate, pizza, apples
Favorite activity: drawing, swimming, playing

 

[Angel Ariel]

I think the card is a great idea for the 'face' characters, but I would shorten it and use the minimum words possible.
You want to make it quick for the character to scan, so just put the important words (not full sentences) with lots of white space because time with the character is short.

For example:
Hi, my name is ________.
May be shy and not talk, but excited to meet you.
Favorite characters: Mickey & Minnie, Flynn Rider, Zero
Favorite rides: Teacups, Dumbo, Haunted Mansion Holiday

Also, be aware that the characters don't 'know' anything outside of their cartoon. So, rather than specific things that are not part of that character's 'world', you might want to have more general likes. For example:
Favorite food: chocolate, pizza, apples
Favorite activity: drawing, swimming, playing

Thank you, Sue..this is the kind of thing I was hoping for

The bolded is interesting..we've been watching Youtube videos of character greets, and I remember a couple of characters talking about riding the Matterhorn and Big Thunder Mountain (these were Disneyland M&G, which is where we're going) with the guest. That was why I thought putting her favorite rides in might be good.

I may go back (since I already made the one set of cards) and make another set of cards that have the kind of favorites you mention, and I'll also do the "Favorite ___:" rather than full sentences.

Thanks, Sue

 

[tjmw2727]

Good points - maybe just a simple "greeting card" with hi my name is xx and I am very exited to meet you. This would serve the purpose of letting your dd initiate conversation without to much extra info.

My kids used the autograph book for this when they were to shy to speak to a favorite character by just handing the book to them for signatures.

 

[SueM in MN]

Good points - maybe just a simple "greeting card" with hi my name is xx and I am very exited to meet you. This would serve the purpose of letting your dd initiate conversation without to much extra info.

My kids used the autograph book for this when they were to shy to speak to a favorite character by just handing the book to them for signatures.

yeah.
Autograph books are really good icebreakers

 

[Angel Ariel]

yeah.
Autograph books are really good icebreakers

We are bringing one of DD's multi-story Disney books (Disney Storybook Collection, I think the books are called). Characters with stories in the book sign the title page, other characters sign the front or back cover. It may be a bit heavy for her to hand over herself, but it's a great keepsake at home as we see the autographs when we read the stories for bedtime.

 

[Pridemom]

My eldest daughter had verbal apraxia and started S/L Therapy at three; her expressive language was only at 13 months. If it helps, shes 19, in college, and rarely shuts up. Lol.
We used sign language for her basic communication. She woukd repeat words after us if we prompted her. If you daughter does, that would work. I like Sue's feedback, too.

 

[DisneyOma]

OP, does your daughter understand the info on the card? Can she read? I'm trying to understand the purpose of the card. If she can't read it, understand it, then she's really not gaining communication input, just learning to hand an object to someone. If she does understand the card, is there a way for her to select the actual input - check off a box, put a sticker on it that identifies her name, etc? That way she'd be actually communicating, not just handing over a pre-made card. Or have multiple cards she picks from to state what she wants to share, etc.

 

[SueM in MN]

OP, does your daughter understand the info on the card? Can she read? I'm trying to understand the purpose of the card. If she can't read it, understand it, then she's really not gaining communication input, just learning to hand an object to someone. If she does understand the card, is there a way for her to select the actual input - check off a box, put a sticker on it that identifies her name, etc? That way she'd be actually communicating, not just handing over a pre-made card. Or have multiple cards she picks from to state what she wants to share, etc.

if you want to do cards, going off this idea...
You could have different cards with different messages for various characters. A sticker or picture of the character could be on each card to tell which character the card is about. You could have her choose the card that matches the character she will be seeing (choosing from 2, 4 or however many you think she would be successful with).

 

[Angel Ariel]

OP, does your daughter understand the info on the card? Can she read? I'm trying to understand the purpose of the card. If she can't read it, understand it, then she's really not gaining communication input, just learning to hand an object to someone.

Learning that she can initiate contact (or "hand an object to someone") and get something in return (in this case, interaction) is a precursor to other forms of communication. It's a step that DD is still working on. As difficult as it may be for those not in our situation to understand, this is her level of communication right now. She's been content to let us do the communicating for her. Now she's beginning to want to initiate contact/get a response from someone herself, and we want to encourage that.

She can't read. This is a precursor to her using the PECS system (Picture Exchange Communication System), where she can use cards with symbols on them to indicate what she wants. She doesn't know what the symbols in PECS mean right away either. She learns by our verbal reinforcement (for example, showing a picture for "more" or "open", if she chooses open we verbally say "oh, you want us to open this (whatever it is)?"...as she gets the reinforcement and follow on action, she learns what the symbol means (the card also has the word on it for when she starts reading). We will reinforce what is on our card with her while we are at Disney as well.

For Halloween she used this PECS card to "say" trick or treat at each house. She gave the card while I indicated that this was her saying "trick or treat", and she got a verbal response from neighbors as well as candy.

If she does understand the card, is there a way for her to select the actual input - check off a box, put a sticker on it that identifies her name, etc? That way she'd be actually communicating, not just handing over a pre-made card. Or have multiple cards she picks from to state what she wants to share, etc.

What you are referring to is much like PECS, which is also the same type of cards that will be on her AAC device. She does not yet have the vocabulary in this system to be able to use it at Disney as you are suggesting. We have 5 words that we are working on in this system at the moment, and they are not ones that would be particularly helpful in a M&G situation. (Nor does she have an AAC device to be able to take to and from school at this point. We are in the middle of that process right now).

We have discussed this at length with her SLP, and her SLP agrees that this step could be very reinforcing for her at Disney. I understand that it may not seem like communicating to others, but it is a big step for her and one we want to encourage as best we can.

 

[Angel Ariel]

if you want to do cards, going off this idea...
You could have different cards with different messages for various characters. A sticker or picture of the character could be on each card to tell which character the card is about. You could have her choose the card that matches the character she will be seeing (choosing from 2, 4 or however many you think she would be successful with).

To be honest, getting her to be successful with 1 card would be a big step for her. Making choices between 2 is a skill she's still working on in therapy.

To say that speech therapy and communication in general is a struggle for DD would be an understatement. Improvement up until the last 2 months or so has been very slow. Now there seems to be motivation. We've heard her say approximations of full sentences...but they're very inconsistent. Volitional vocalization is very difficult for her. We're just trying to encourage her in any way we can now that she is more interested in doing things herself.

 

[SueM in MN]

Food for thought....
You might want to read this on whether there are prerequisites to communication:
http://www.aacandautism.com/faq

https://www.speechandlanguagekids.c...device-augmentativealternative-communication/

 

[Angel Ariel]

Food for thought....
You might want to read this on whether there are prerequisites to communication:
http://www.aacandautism.com/faq

https://www.speechandlanguagekids.c...device-augmentativealternative-communication/

I'm not saying prerequistes in meaning she can't do other things before learning other forms of communication. If that's what came across, I apologize. I meant more of a precursor, not a requirement before being able to try something. She's receiving PROMPT therapy multiple times a week, focusing on her physical ability to create sounds. We're in no way waiting on anything. She's got some form of therapy - PT or speech - virtually every day of the week. I'm simply saying she is still learning to understand that she has the power to initiate contact and receive a response in return.

Her AAC device is in process. They aren't waiting on anything for it because of her, the paperwork and things needed to have one going back and forth to school are what we're waiting for...basically the bureaucracy part. She has an AAC device at school. She's using the ipad and proloquo2go there. They are in the process of acquiring a device that she can take back and forth. She's been using big macks since last year, and they have done exactly what your link suggests in terms of using the device to help her learn the pictures (rather than waiting for her to understand the pictures first).

I'm sorry if my use of the word prerequisite came across poorly. I did read through both of your links, and we are doing what those links suggest (and have been).

It is very likely that the child does not yet understand the power of communication.

Once you teach the child that pushing a button will get her something she wants, you may be surprised how much her interest in communication grows. For many children, spoken words are much too difficult so verbal communication is not even an option. If that is the only means of communication they have been exposed to, they will not be very interested in communicating since it is so difficult for them.

Once you give them an easier means of communicating, you may be able to show them how wonderful communication is and get them interested. Once they are interested in communicating, they often begin making more attempts at verbal communication as well!

DD's understanding the power of communication is emerging at the moment. Her interest is growing, and we want to encourage that at Disney. She is making more verbal attempts as well now that she's finding the power..we're hoping Disney will encourage that even more. If I could take her AAC device with us, I would, but it's not allowed off of school property at the moment. We are taking the steps to address that, just waiting on the school.

 

[Angel Ariel]

I'm sorry too if I'm coming across as defensive. I'm trying to explain where we're at, and I'm feeling like I'm not doing a very good job.

 

[elaine amj]

You are doing so many awesome things!! There is SO much involved in working through these types of issues. My own son had apraxia, but his issues were much, much milder than your daughter, so hats off to you.

As I mentioned earlier, I'm taking notes since my niece is still nonverbal (turning 3 next month) and we are all going to Disney next August. I was just explaining to my teen daughter tonight that it is highly likely her cousin will barely talk at all during the trip. (They live across the pond so my DD hasn't seen her since she was a baby).

 

[DisneyOma]

Learning that she can initiate contact (or "hand an object to someone") and get something in return (in this case, interaction) is a precursor to other forms of communication. It's a step that DD is still working on. As difficult as it may be for those not in our situation to understand, this is her level of communication right now. She's been content to let us do the communicating for her. Now she's beginning to want to initiate contact/get a response from someone herself, and we want to encourage that.

She can't read. This is a precursor to her using the PECS system (Picture Exchange Communication System), where she can use cards with symbols on them to indicate what she wants. She doesn't know what the symbols in PECS mean right away either. She learns by our verbal reinforcement (for example, showing a picture for "more" or "open", if she chooses open we verbally say "oh, you want us to open this (whatever it is)?"...as she gets the reinforcement and follow on action, she learns what the symbol means (the card also has the word on it for when she starts reading). We will reinforce what is on our card with her while we are at Disney as well.

For Halloween she used this PECS card to "say" trick or treat at each house. She gave the card while I indicated that this was her saying "trick or treat", and she got a verbal response from neighbors as well as candy.

What you are referring to is much like PECS, which is also the same type of cards that will be on her AAC device. She does not yet have the vocabulary in this system to be able to use it at Disney as you are suggesting. We have 5 words that we are working on in this system at the moment, and they are not ones that would be particularly helpful in a M&G situation. (Nor does she have an AAC device to be able to take to and from school at this point. We are in the middle of that process right now).

We have discussed this at length with her SLP, and her SLP agrees that this step could be very reinforcing for her at Disney. I understand that it may not seem like communicating to others, but it is a big step for her and one we want to encourage as best we can.

I've worked with special needs students with apraxia, etc, for over 15 years. I'm just wary of the trendy stuff that comes and goes, the weight people are putting on devices, etc. The PECS system has its positives and negatives as well. Not everyone understands PECS outside the classroom, for instance. Just be careful that they don't limit her communication ability by depending too heavily on this or that.

I always picture my students on their own somewhere, trying to communicate with a stranger, police, etc. Would the person off the street be able to understand what my student is trying to communicate? What if the communication device is broken, the card with the ID/contact info was in the wallet that was lost, etc? While I work with older students (high school) not all of them have the ability to understand/communicate at that level. Taught one nonverbal student to look for the letters of his name around the room - pointing out how to spell his name. Of course, then there has to be signs up, reading material, something available in a situation for the above to work. But it was just one strategy.

Sounds like you have a good team behind your daughter. I hope they find many solutions to help your daughter communicate, and I hope your trip opens up many avenues of success for her!

 

[Angel Ariel]

I've worked with special needs students with apraxia, etc, for over 15 years. I'm just wary of the trendy stuff that comes and goes, the weight people are putting on devices, etc. The PECS system has its positives and negatives as well. Not everyone understands PECS outside the classroom, for instance. Just be careful that they don't limit her communication ability by depending too heavily on this or that.

I always picture my students on their own somewhere, trying to communicate with a stranger, police, etc. Would the person off the street be able to understand what my student is trying to communicate? What if the communication device is broken, the card with the ID/contact info was in the wallet that was lost, etc? While I work with older students (high school) not all of them have the ability to understand/communicate at that level. Taught one nonverbal student to look for the letters of his name around the room - pointing out how to spell his name. Of course, then there has to be signs up, reading material, something available in a situation for the above to work. But it was just one strategy.

Sounds like you have a good team behind your daughter. I hope they find many solutions to help your daughter communicate, and I hope your trip opens up many avenues of success for her!

As I said earlier we are working on multiple avenues for her communication. She is under the care of a wonderful private SLP and has a great team working with her both at school and privately .