New Dining Plan Brochure?

[pperfectmom]

I really just enjoy ! We don't know exactly how we'll be using our credits, yet, but I do agree with the folks who think that Disney knows full well what they are doing and could change it at any time IF they so desire. I do know that I have never eaten at a TS restaurant at WDW and without the DDP I probably never would because they are so expensive. Anyone with basic knowledge of how the food industry works knows that Disney is not losing money on any level.

 

[meshmar]

I've never liked the limited selection available on children's menus (and not just at Disney). Many children want what their parents are eating. When you go to a steakhouse, the children should be able to order steak too (like they can at Yachtsman Steakhouse ). By the same token, many adults (like my elderly DMom) are small eaters and should be able to order a reduced sized order - preferably at a reduced size price . Maybe one of these years ...

 

[BlindTyldak]

I really just enjoy !

Yeah, I thought about making a thread saying the new rules were a complete rip and I was going to bring my mug from 1996 and demand free refills by walking into TS restaurants to get my money's worth but then decided it would be just too cruel.

 

[meshmar]

I'm sorry, but bad apples my tail. The child credits were usable for years in various incarnations of the dining plan (Magical Wishes, etc.) and people were, I will stress again, told by their waiters, CM's making ADR's, the host at the front desk, you name it, that their credits were not separated, they were pooled, and they were up to the guest to spend as they wished. In 2004 some of the waiters actually opened the payment conversation with "will you be paying out of pocket for the child's meal?" on our trip. People were not ripping off Disney, they were using the meal plan in a completely Disney sanctioned - and suggested - fashion.

Now Disney has figured out that it wasn't such a good idea, which is 100% their right. But prior to that, no one "ripped off" the Mouse, or stretched or broke any rules. That is how the meal plans were implemented and that is how they were used.

If a meal credit was a meal credit was a meal credit, then they would not have been labeled (and priced) differently. The people that used a child's credit to buy an adult menu WERE ripping off Disney. You may not like me calling a spade a spade, but the ones that did so were effectively stealing from me by driving up prices ...

 

[paigeandmorgansmom]

My 10 year old will want a kids meal in 2 of the TS we are going to. Can i pay out of pocket, or do we have to use her ATS and get her something she hates. I would rather pay out of pocket and she can get a TS meal somewhere else. Is that cheating? she is only 52 inches and weighs 50 pounds and is the size of most 7 year olds. I am paying ATS for her at all the character dinners, so I am not trying to cheat.

 

[BlindTyldak]

If a meal credit was a meal credit was a meal credit, then they would not have been labeled (and priced) differently. The people that used a child's credit to buy an adult menu WERE ripping off Disney. You may not like me calling a spade a spade, but the ones that did so were effectively stealing from me by driving up prices ...

That's just it, they were not labled differently. Were they priced differently? Yes, I won't say they weren't. But they were not labled differently, counted differently, or in any way marked or distinguished as separate once paid for.

If you want to blame anyone for supposedly driving up your prices, blame Disney. I'll say it for the last time, Disney routinely told guests that they were allowed to use the credits as they saw fit and were not required to use the credits in any specific combination of child and/or adult meals, and that the credits, even if purchased for a child, could be used for adult meals and that was perfectly okay. If sorry if you did not agree with the original incarnations of the meal plan, but you cannot call people essentially thieves and scam artists for using it as originally designed at the time and as told they could use it by the corporation who designed the plan.

 

[meshmar]

My 10 year old will want a kids meal in 2 of the TS we are going to. Can i pay out of pocket, or do we have to use her ATS and get her something she hates. I would rather pay out of pocket and she can get a TS meal somewhere else. Is that cheating? she is only 52 inches and weighs 50 pounds and is the size of most 7 year olds. I am paying ATS for her at all the character dinners, so I am not trying to cheat.

No reason you can't buy a child's meal OOP and use an adult TS for an adult's meal later ...

 

[meshmar]

That's just it, they were not labled differently. Were they priced differently? Yes, I won't say they weren't. But they were not labled differently, counted differently, or in any way marked or distinguished as separate once paid for.

If you want to blame anyone for supposedly driving up your prices, blame Disney. I'll say it for the last time, Disney routinely told guests that they were allowed to use the credits as they saw fit and were not required to use the credits in any specific combination of child and/or adult meals, and that the credits, even if purchased for a child, could be used for adult meals and that was perfectly okay. If sorry if you did not agree with the original incarnations of the meal plan, but you cannot call people essentially thieves and scam artists for using it as originally designed at the time and as told they could use it by the corporation who designed the plan.

Some of the waiters may have allowed them to be used as such, But DISNEY did not sanction it directly as you alledge. You knew that you paid less and used it for a higher priced use. That is SCAMMING. Anyone that used them that way did effectively steal from me. I blaim you and the others that 'worked the system' for the increased costs and tighter rules. You don't like the facts - tough.

 

[pperfectmom]

BlindTyldak-just give up. Some people just can't handle the truth.

 

[meshmar]

BlindTyldak-just give up. Some people just can't handle the truth.

The truth is ... Disney didn't approve. If there was no difference in a child's credit and an adult credit then they would have been the same price. They weren't. A child's credit was never meant to be used as an adult credit. Disney was too trusting and scammers took advantage of it - to the detriment of everyone else. That's the truth that you and others don't want to face.

 

[pperfectmom]

Nobody has said that they approved it. They just don't care enough to change it. It's not worth it monetarily to them. No matter what you say, you won't convince me that Disney is losing money on the DDP.

 

[PureTcrazy]

Everytime someone tries to justify what they are doing, they always bring up speeding etc. Do you go on a car buying forum and post to others about how you got away with speeding and tell how it was really the cops fault?? I just hope that the ones who are doing this will be surprised by having to pay oop when they get to their signature restaurants where they planned to pay with their $22 worth of Child TS credits.

Why would a CM at a TS recommend that you pay oop for the childs meal? Could it be they were hoping for a bigger tip? or maybe a return trip? The brochure previously stated that children should order off the children's menu. I believe that was their obviously too subtle method of saying that childrens credits were meant to be used to pay for items on the children's menu. Again I guess if you look at the letter, rather than the intent... you can make it sound like what you were doing was ok.

Thank you Goofy4Disney3 for understanding the points I was trying to make. The sad thing is that what I am saying is no different than any number of previous posts that have said essentially the same things. When you read my posts its like preachin' to the choir!

 

[kcrew]

If a meal credit was a meal credit was a meal credit, then they would not have been labeled (and priced) differently. The people that used a child's credit to buy an adult menu WERE ripping off Disney. You may not like me calling a spade a spade, but the ones that did so were effectively stealing from me by driving up prices ...

Ummm, let's take a look at Disney food prices...who's stealing from who? The reason the DP exists at all is because enough people were not willing to pay the prices to keep the restaurants full. How about this: get rid of the DP altogether and just lower the prices! No plotting, no manipulation of credits, no abuse of the system. A win/win for everyone!

 

[meshmar]

Nobody has said that they approved it. They just don't care enough to change it. It's not worth it monetarily to them. No matter what you say, you won't convince me that Disney is losing money on the DDP.

Nobody ... that would be BlindTyldak?

BlindTyldak:
"Disney routinely told guests that they were allowed to use the credits as they saw fit and were not required to use the credits in any specific combination of child and/or adult meals, and that the credits, even if purchased for a child, could be used for adult meals and that was perfectly okay."

"People were not ripping off Disney, they were using the meal plan in a completely Disney sanctioned - and suggested - fashion. "

And apparently they DO care enough to change it. The new brochure is more explicit and rumor has it that computer tracking will also soon be in place.

Strike three - I never said that Disney was losing money on the DDP. That would be you trying to justify yourself.

You knew (or should have known) it was 'wrong'; you abused the trust Disney had that people would 'do the right thing'; now you are trying to say it was ok because Disney still made money. What a load of %$^&.

 

[wdwobsessed]

The truth is ... Disney didn't approve. If there was no difference in a child's credit and an adult credit then they would have been the same price. They weren't. A child's credit was never meant to be used as an adult credit. Disney was too trusting and scammers took advantage of it - to the detriment of everyone else. That's the truth that you and others don't want to face.

You know it amazes me that back in the days of the "Silver" plan people did not have this debate (to my recollection) over child wishes and adult wishes and the like. Wishes were wishes and your party used them as you saw fit. IN FACT ... the encouraged and never debated suggestion on this board was to NOT use child wishes for meals and to use them for recreation such as boating or meals for Mom and Dad at 2 wish TS. I guess the fact that they were "wishes" made people feel you could use them as you "wish"!!!!!

Anyway ... it was set up this way for quite a few years if I remember correctly and nothing was changed, or highly debated, people were not called out for stealing.

When WDW set up the DDP they followed along the same lines as what had been done with the Silver wishes previously. It was pooled.

HOWEVER ...

The DDP is much more popular than the Silver plan and more people are getting the DDP than the old Silver plan. I don't know figures but I'm sure it has to be more than double.

In light of the increased usage of the DDP vs the old Silver plan the effects of this "pooled" policy were felt more heavily. Combine that with the high numbers of people CALLING Disney and ASKING if C credits can be used for A credits. It was bound to happen that WDW is now answering this question, along with others in the new FAQ.

I have no problems with Disney changing the system. They have the power and perogative to make changes as they see fit. But UNTIL they seperate the credits out on a computer system it is too much to ask guests to keep track of who's credits they have used where. This is very true for families who split up, share meals or where everyone does not order with a credit at every meal. (Like if Suzy just wants a bowl of soup and pays OOP for it.)

If each person were issued a card with only thier meal allotments on them (just like the tickets on the KTTW card) it would make it easier to keep track of who has what left. OR If your print out reads "XX C TS & XX A TS" on the bottom after each meal that would suffice as well.

Until then ... with people who cannot even keep 4 tickets straight as to who's is who's .... it's not my responsibility to keep track of A vs C.

WDWO

 

[meshmar]

Ummm, let's take a look at Disney food prices...who's stealing from who? The reason the DP exists at all is because enough people were not willing to pay the prices to keep the restaurants full. How about this: get rid of the DP altogether and just lower the prices! No plotting, no manipulation of credits, no abuse of the system. A win/win for everyone!

Check out the prices at restaurants in an area of equal overhead, atmosphere, etc., and you will find the prices aren't that far out of line. Compared to the VERY rural area I am in, they ARE high. We had friends visit NY City and talked about how outrageous the prices were there and that Disney was LOWER. I'm sure that they could have spent a lot of time hunting around and eaten cheaper, but they were effectively the same captive audience that Disney has.

Can someone stay off-site and eat off-site and save money. sure they can ... but it sure isn't as much fun!

The win-win situation I would like to see ...
let everyone pre-purchase 'tickets' good for appetisers, entrees, desserts, childs meals, buffets, etc in whatever quantities they desired so they could individualize their own meal plans.

 

[jackskellingtonsgirl]

You guys lost me on something a few pages back. Forgive me for being a bit slow, but HOW do the changes have any impact whatsoever on people who were already using the credits as they were intended? I don't understand what difference it will make. I get that people will sometimes use child credits for adults, but if I wasn't planning to do that then how do the actions of those people have any impact on my use of the plan?

We're going for 9 nights in August, we have 13 TS meals booked, one of those is signature. We learned on the last trip that 2 single credit meals are more expensive than a signature meal, so we'll pay OOP for everyone at that meal. We also learned that buffets are more expensive than kids' meals at TS restaurants with menus. It would be more cost effective to pay OOP for DS at TS meals and use his credits for his buffets, but I probably won't. I'll probably just pay OOP for the signature meal and the other least expensive meals and be done with it.

So if they DO separate credits why will that make the plan less flexible or user friendly for me?

 

[LizinSTL]

You guys lost me on something a few pages back. Forgive me for being a bit slow, but HOW do the changes have any impact whatsoever on people who were already using the credits as they were intended? I don't understand what difference it will make. I get that people will sometimes use child credits for adults, but if I wasn't planning to do that then how do the actions of those people have any impact on my use of the plan?

We're going for 9 nights in August, we have 13 TS meals booked, one of those is signature. We learned on the last trip that 2 single credit meals are more expensive than a signature meal, so we'll pay OOP for everyone at that meal. We also learned that buffets are more expensive than kids' meals at TS restaurants with menus. It would be more cost effective to pay OOP for DS at TS meals and use his credits for his buffets, but I probably won't. I'll probably just pay OOP for the signature meal and the other least expensive meals and be done with it.

So if they DO separate credits why will that make the plan less flexible or user friendly for me?

It won't have any effect on you at all. It wouldn't have had any effect on us either- we used our TS credits for the 7 TS meals we enjoyed.

I HOPE they do separate the credits so that people stop speculating about it! For now, they are pooled. Disney doesn't expect that the guest keep track of what meal was bought with what credit. If nothing changes before your trip, just let the CM know how you plan to pay for the meals you enjoy. If it does change, just let the CM know how you plan to pay for the meals you enjoy.

The idea that "everyone" who feeds their child anything that may be on an adult menu is scamming Disney is ridiculous. The vast majority of guests are using the plan as Disney intended. But reading this board, you'd think that people are registering rooms full of 9 year olds rather than paying for Adult credits.

 

[meshmar]

You guys lost me on something a few pages back. Forgive me for being a bit slow, but HOW do the changes have any impact whatsoever on people who were already using the credits as they were intended? I don't understand what difference it will make. I get that people will sometimes use child credits for adults, but if I wasn't planning to do that then how do the actions of those people have any impact on my use of the plan?

The changes WON'T affect anyone that use the credits as originally intended. How do the actions of those who 'abused' the system affect others? The overall costs at DISNEY have gone up; the prices of meals OOP have gone up; ...
How much of this is due to the 'cheaters'? Some of it, I'm sure.

 

[zulaya]

I for one am glad they have made the distinction between adult and child.

We haven't used the plan yet, but are giving it some thought for this December, yet last year, I couldn't believe all the people I overheard saying, "I'm paying out of pocket for the kids and saving their meals for later."

Here's another tangent...I do wish they would loosen the restriction on everyone in the same room buying the dining plan. My FIL is coming with us this time, and everyone else would love to do the dining plan. However, he had esophageal cancer surgery and can only eat the equivalent of an appetizer at a time now. Even at home. Someone mentioned above that many elderly people have smaller appetites...it would be nice if they could figure out a category for these people, but this plan is already causing so much to-do that any other changes would be cosmic to us planners I imagine.