New DCL PIF Date Rules

[brentm77]

Except that is exactly what used to be the case. Plenty of people have been denied boarding for illness in the pat. My husband spent his first Disney Cruise in quarantine because he came down with a stomach bug after dinner on the first day. And it was absolutely "tough luck, no money back" for us--we even had the Disney cruise insurance, but they gave us the runaround and wouldn't grant our claim and we didn't want to go through the expense of taking them to court. Now that was shipboard quarantine but denial of boarding works the same--it's up to insurance; the cruise contract you signed did not provide for refunds if you are denied boarding due to illness.

Knowing Disney is basically giving everyone free denial-of-boarding insurance without having to go through the insurance claims process is a huge plus.

The biggest problem with no-refund policies, is they strongly encourage lying. People have to make a choice between being honest and loosing thousands of dollars or lying and hoping its a fluke that they aren't feeling so hot. It is time for Disney to bake in some level of insurance to the cost of cruising and reimburse those who need to cancel last minute due to illness. I get there are other losses (time off work, plane tickets, etc.), but it's one less lost expense pushing someone to make the wrong choice. I could personally live with a refund and finding accommodation near a beach to recover before traveling home.

 

[DisneYE]

Except that is exactly what used to be the case. Plenty of people have been denied boarding for illness in the pat. My husband spent his first Disney Cruise in quarantine because he came down with a stomach bug after dinner on the first day. And it was absolutely "tough luck, no money back" for us--we even had the Disney cruise insurance, but they gave us the runaround and wouldn't grant our claim and we didn't want to go through the expense of taking them to court. Now that was shipboard quarantine but denial of boarding works the same--it's up to insurance; the cruise contract you signed did not provide for refunds if you are denied boarding due to illness.

Knowing Disney is basically giving everyone free denial-of-boarding insurance without having to go through the insurance claims process is a huge plus.

I get it. Is why ppl buy insurance & if they get sick before the sailing, they can get their money back. It's why most people buy insurance.
But if **Disney** denies you boarding bc a test came down positive at the port , and its known false positives are common in Covid testing, then they SHOULD offer refunds. Especially now that few (if any) insurance companies offer Covid coverage.

Anyway, I'm glad they did this.
I'd have cancelled all 4 cruises we have booked for 2021 if Disney didn't do this, and I couldn't get Covid-related cancellation insurance elsewhere.

 

[KashasMom]

How does this apply to concierge? You normally lose your deposit. Would they same apply if you met one of the conditions to cancel or would you get your deposit back?

 

[bcwife76]

I received this email too for our late March cruise but the PIF on the app and in my ressie hasn't changed to reflect this new date, not yet anyway.

 

[stout]

What if one person in the party indicates high risk, but the rest of the party doesn’t? Is the refund only for that person or can the whole stateroom decline to sail and get a refund? What if the party is booked in two separate but connecting staterooms (mom in one with a child, dad in other with a child)...does that change the analysis?

 

[ursookrazie]

We're booked for end of March 2021 and when this pandemic was just starting, I was being hopeful saying "oh, we're a year away. Things should be back to normal by then." And now, it stresses me out. We have plans to get married on that trip (already had the package added when we first booked) and now I have to start thinking about pushing it to a later date. We want to have it on a trip leaving from San Diego because that's where all of our family and friends are so it'll be easier. Unfortunately, there aren't many Baja/Mexico cruises leaving from SD later in the year so we might have to postpone it until March 2022. Hopefully by then everything will be back to "normal."

This PIF change does take some stress off though. I have some guests that are very cautious about covid and won't go unless there's a vaccine. At least with this later date, they have more time to think about whether of not they will attend. And it gives me more time to decide on a new date when spring 2022 cruises are released.

 

[MomOTwins]

How does this apply to concierge? You normally lose your deposit. Would they same apply if you met one of the conditions to cancel or would you get your deposit back?

It says “full” refund so that should include deposit. Also, per another thread, Concierge deposits are no longer nonrefundable through March and are on the same new penalty schedule as everyone else.

 

[MomOTwins]

The biggest problem with no-refund policies, is they strongly encourage lying. People have to make a choice between being honest and loosing thousands of dollars or lying and hoping its a fluke that they aren't feeling so hot. It is time for Disney to bake in some level of insurance to the cost of cruising and reimburse those who need to cancel last minute due to illness. I get there are other losses (time off work, plane tickets, etc.), but it's one less lost expense pushing someone to make the wrong choice. I could personally live with a refund and finding accommodation near a beach to recover before traveling home.

The good thing about this is it starts 14 days prior to cruising so ideally that means few people will be stranded at the port.

 

[ajo]

It says “full” refund so that should include deposit. Also, per another thread, Concierge deposits are no longer nonrefundable through March and are on the same new penalty schedule as everyone else.

Are you referring to the new PIF policy for Concierge deposits? It says concierge loses their deposit at cancellation, even if more than 60 days out.

Suites and Concierge Staterooms
Days Prior to Vacation Commencement Date Fee Amount
60 days or more Deposit per Guest
59 – 56 days 50% of vacation price per Guest
55 – 30 days 75% of vacation price per Guest
29 days or less 100% of vacation price per Guest

 

[mmouse37]

This makes me happy.

MJ

 

[CamColt]

Just a heads up there are 3 threads merged on this one, as they were all about the same thing, posted about 1 hour apart. So if anything looks a little repetitive or out of order, that is why.

 

[FigmentSpark]

Does this mean that if you are already PIF, you can still get your money back if you're outside the 60 days? Can you put your credits back, as well, then? What about the previously announced policy that allowed you to move to a 2022 cruise, but you only had the previous sailing as a full refund date?

 

[KashasMom]

It says “full” refund so that should include deposit. Also, per another thread, Concierge deposits are no longer nonrefundable through March and are on the same new penalty schedule as everyone else.

Our cruise isn't until August.

 

[o&smom]

I think getting a full refund/rebooking for Covid-related cancelations by DCL at port is great & kind of normal I think. And tbh I'm extremely thankful they're doing this.
If they didn't it would've created an uproar and triggered mass cancellations.
Can you imagine being denied boarding at port and the cruise line saying "oh well, tough luck, no money back" ... I'd be up in arms, as most people would.

The other point you make is scary. It'd be devastating to be denied boarding if the test catches it all the while you thought you were healthy. Imagine all the asymptomatic ppl that will get denied. Just thinking about it makes me cringe. I have allergies and I sneeze lots and have a runny nose every morning. I could easily fail a test. Scary stuff.

You should not be able to fail a test because of allergies or a runny nose. The test looks for the virus that would cause those symptoms.

 

[pumpkinqueen93]

This is good to hear. It's great that have a Covid related refund policy. Now I'm just waiting to hear if they will require a test before or if they will test at the port. But this seems like it's a step in the right direction.

 

[Intr3pid]

While this does allow us to wait a bit longer for our 7-nighter on the Fantasy in February, it's Disney being Disney again - to be honest. Dragging their feet to do what all other major cruise lines had already done a while ago.

I hope they also bring the late reschedule time down to 48 hours that others are allowing.

 

[DisneYE]

You should not be able to fail a test because of allergies or a runny nose. The test looks for the virus that would cause those symptoms.

And all the false positives?
This article from Harvard says accuracy is between 63-98% depending on the test

https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/which-test-is-best-for-covid-19-2020081020734
What if you get a false positive? Do they test you again?
I'm just saying there's a chance you get a positive result and not having the virus.
It'd be a crushing experience.

 

[tee11]

So how would you (and others) interpret that our PIF date is now 4 months for a cruise in fall 2021 that we booked about 2 months ago?
Traditionally the PIF date was 90 days, in line with their cancellation policy and penalties. I feel they are moving two different directions simultaneously?
I already feel the pressure for next year - 4 months ahead of time is a very long time currently. 2 months across the board would be more realistic.

Just got an email from DCL that final payment dates for cruises through March 31, 2021 have been extended to 60 days prior to sailing.

All of us at Disney Cruise Line continue to think of you and your family. We realize these are uncertain times for many of our Guests, and want to let you know we’ve temporarily modified our final payment and cancellation policies to provide you with greater flexibility.

For sailings through March 31, 2021, we are temporarily extending final payment until 60 days prior to sailing for Guests booked in unrestricted stateroom categories. This means that those Guests who have not yet reached their final payment due date can wait until up to 60 days prior to sailing to pay for their cruise vacation. Onboard cruise activities can be scheduled within your Castaway Club booking window once final payment is received.

In addition, we are temporarily relaxing our cruise cancellation fee schedule for sailings through March 31, 2021, as described below.

Cruises 1 to 5 Nights (Excluding Suites and Concierge Staterooms)
Days Prior to Vacation Commencement Date Fee Amount
60 days or more No fee
59 – 45 days Deposit per Guest
44 – 30 days 50% of vacation price per Guest
29 – 15 days 75% of vacation price per Guest
14 days or less 100% of vacation price per Guest

Cruises 6 Nights or More (Excluding Suites and Concierge Staterooms)
Days Prior to Vacation Commencement Date Fee Amount
60 days or more No fee
59 – 56 days Deposit per Guest
55 – 30 days 50% of vacation price per Guest
29 – 15 days 75% of vacation price per Guest
14 days or less 100% of vacation price per Guest

Suites and Concierge Staterooms
Days Prior to Vacation Commencement Date Fee Amount
60 days or more Deposit per Guest
59 – 56 days 50% of vacation price per Guest
55 – 30 days 75% of vacation price per Guest
29 days or less 100% of vacation price per Guest

Categories with Restrictions
Reservations for Inside, Outside or Verandah Categories with Restrictions remain nonrefundable and nontransferable.

These temporary changes are in addition to our Cruise Date Flexibility Option that already allows Guests the flexibility to change their sail date up to 15 days prior to departure for any cruise booked by October 31, 2020 for scheduled sailings on or before May 31, 2021. Additional details on the Cruise Date Flexibility Option can be found on our website at DisneyCruise.com.

We look forward to welcoming you aboard for your sailing and hope that this added flexibility is helpful.
Sincerely,

The Cast and Crew
Disney Cruise Line

 

[tee11]

You are completely misinterpreting the information in your own link. The false NEGATIVE rate has been quite high for many of the antigen tests. Meaning you get an "all clear" but in truth, you do have Covid (=false negative), and can pass it to others.

Here are the important take aways from your Harvard link:

On the antigen tests (testing for active infection):
"The reported rate of false negative results is as high as 50%, which is why antigen tests are not favored by the FDA as a single test for active infection. However, because antigen testing is quicker, less expensive, and requires less complex technology to perform than molecular testing, some experts recommend repeated antigen testing as a reasonable strategy. According to one test manufacturer, the false positive rate of antigen testing is near zero. "

On the antibody tests (testing for past infection, in particular testing for antibody immune response):
Having an antibody test too early can lead to false negative results. That’s because it takes a week or two after infection for your immune system to produce antibodies. The reported rate of false negatives is 20%. However, the range of false negatives is from 0% to 30% depending on the study and when in the course of infection the test is performed. Research suggests antibody levels may wane over just a few months. And while a positive antibody test proves you’ve been exposed to the virus, it’s not yet known whether such results indicate a lack of contagiousness or long-lasting, protective immunity.

And all the false positives?
This article from Harvard says accuracy is between 63-98% depending on the test

https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/which-test-is-best-for-covid-19-2020081020734
What if you get a false positive? Do they test you again?
I'm just saying there's a chance you get a positive result and not having the virus.
It'd be a crushing experience.

 

[Starwind]

And all the false positives?
This article from Harvard says accuracy is between 63-98% depending on the test

https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/which-test-is-best-for-covid-19-2020081020734
What if you get a false positive? Do they test you again?
I'm just saying there's a chance you get a positive result and not having the virus.
It'd be a crushing experience.

The article says that false positives [i.e the test says you have it but you actually don't] for both kinds of diagnostic tests are close to/near zero. See added bold below:

For molecular tests:

What about accuracy? False negatives — that is, a test that says you don’t have the virus when you actually do have the virus — may occur. The reported rate of false negatives is as low as 2% and as high as 37%. The false positive rate — that is, how often the test says you have the virus when you actually do not — should be close to zero. Most false-positive results are thought to be due to lab contamination or other problems with how the lab has performed the test, not limitations of the test itself.

For antigen tests:

What about accuracy? The reported rate of false negative results is as high as 50%, which is why antigen tests are not favored by the FDA as a single test for active infection. However, because antigen testing is quicker, less expensive, and requires less complex technology to perform than molecular testing, some experts recommend repeated antigen testing as a reasonable strategy. According to one test manufacturer, the false positive rate of antigen testing is near zero. So, the recent experience of Ohio Governor Mike DeWine, who apparently had a false-positive result from an antigen test, is rare.