Need to correct misinformation on the Kerry and Bush supporters thread...

[jjskribs]

For several weeks I have been trying to follow Elwood Blues thread on Kerry and Bush. I must admit I haven't read it all so if I am repeating information that was already disputed I apologize.

In rereading part of the thread I felt a strong need to question statements that were made by Kendra17 . (page 5) if you want to go back and reread it.

Kendra in talking about George Bush's National Guard service states ...

"Bush flew dangerous supersonic interceptors during the Vietnam War to protect the country against a nuclear attack, actually intercepting Soviet bombers."

While the aircraft that Bush flew (F-102) was AT ONE TIME used as an interceptor it was replaced in 1959 with the faster and more sophisticated F-106.

By the time George Bush was flying this aircraft they were NO LONGER involved in air defense in the United States. At that time the F-106 was patrolling the east coast for Soviet Bear.

The obsolete F-102's were given to National Guard units where they were used in training missions. In Bush's case he was flying them over the Gulf of Mexico. (no Soviet Bear there).

The statement that George Bush was home flying dangerous missions to intercept Soviet bombers is ABSOLUTELY UNTRUE.

If you do a search for F-102's and F-106's on Google you can read all about these two aircraft.

My husband has worked for an Air National Guard unit for the last 35 years. They flew F-106's and now fly F-15's. THEIR MISSION was and is to fly intercept missions along the east coast. They are also involved in Homeland Security. When I showed him Kendra's post he laughed outloud and said, "she's not serious is she?"

Kendra , while I know you would love to believe that your hero was flying Top Gun missions saving the world from nuclear destruction it just isn't true.

I just didn't want to leave anyone with this false picture of George Bush dressed in a flight suit .. helmet under his arm.. trying to look like Tom Cruise. WAIT.... seems like I have seen that picture before..

 

[Grog]

 

[wvrevy]

jjskibs....While you are ABSOLUTELY right, I have to say this: Let's start focusing the debate on the issues of today, rather than 30 years ago. It should be obvious to anyone with a brain in their head that comparing Bush's "service" to Kerry's is an insult to Kerry, but apparently people just can't seem to grasp that.

So....Let's just drop this and move on. What we really need in this campaign is someone like James Carville to grab the Kerry campaign by the metaphorical shirt collar and repeatedly shout "It'S THE ECONOMY, STUPID !!!" into their faces. West Virginia lost 1,700 jobs in the month of July...but is STILL a Bush lean...People need to get Vietnam out of their heads and start looking at the mess we're in NOW....A mess of George W. Bush's making.

I don't have the pic in my signature below because of how Bush screwed up 30 years ago. I have it there because of how he's screwed up for the last FOUR years...and in the fear of how badly he'll screw this country up if we give him four more.

Like one of those protest groups was shouting yesterday:

"FOUR MORE MONTHS !!!"

JMO....

 

[RitaZ.]

Why not make the correction in the original thread?

 

[Dan Murphy]

I am only up to page 522.

 

[jjskribs]

Rita.......... I actually did think of posting on the original thread but as Dan has reminded us I didn't think anyone would actually read through almost 800 posts.

I do agree we do need to "move on" but since this is what my husband does for a living this misinformation ruffled my feathers. Just wanted to clarify lest someone believe it was actually true.

Now on to the economy..... women's rights...... the environment..... where do we begin?

 

[wvrevy]

Originally posted by jjskribs
Now on to the economy..... women's rights...... the environment..... where do we begin?

1.3 Million new poor people....Almost half of which are children...1.6 million new uninsured....The worst jobs record of any president since the great depression.....

Oh, I dunno

 

[bsnyder]

http://www.detnews.com/2004/editorial/0408/27/a09-255537.htm

 

[wvrevy]

Originally posted by bsnyder
http://www.detnews.com/2004/editorial/0408/27/a09-255537.htm

Great...So the 1.4 million new poverty-stricken people...and the 1,700 in my state that lost jobs in July...will now have to pay a little less in taxes....Whoppee

But yeah...we've "turned the corner"

 

[Mamu]

Yes it's time to put the past behind us. This has been the ugliest campaign. Everyone has dirty laundry. Wash it and lets move on.

Our country has a lot of serious issues, starting with the economy. Don't be fooled by the number games there playing. We are facing some problems. The only thing thats keeping us out of a recession is the sale of homes as this slows the economy will fall fast. The average household is spending more then their making and so isn't our government.

 

[Elwood Blues]

Originally posted by Mamu
The only thing thats keeping us out of a recession is the sale of homes as this slows the economy will fall fast.

Care to explain?

The average household is spending more then their making and so isn't our government.

Typo? should isn't=is?

The first you can't control. The second you hopefully can.

 

[Teejay32]

Originally posted by jjskribs
By the time George Bush was flying this aircraft they were NO LONGER involved in air defense in the United States. At that time the F-106 was patrolling the east coast for Soviet Bear.

The obsolete F-102's were given to National Guard units where they were used in training missions. In Bush's case he was flying them over the Gulf of Mexico. (no Soviet Bear there).

The statement that George Bush was home flying dangerous missions to intercept Soviet bombers is ABSOLUTELY UNTRUE.

As long as we're on the subject, google "F-102 Vietnam" and you get a whole different picture. Bush entered the air guard when the air guard was serving in Vietnam. (in F-102s.) It's in here. And the information in the OP supports that, if they weren't being used to patrol for Soviet bombers in the states, then they were more likely to be used in Vietnam.

Thanks for clearing that up.

 

[wvrevy]

Originally posted by Teejay32
As long as we're on the subject, google "F-102 Vietnam" and you get a whole different picture. Bush entered the air guard when the air guard was serving in Vietnam. (in F-102s.) It's in here. And the information in the OP supports that, if they weren't being used to patrol for Soviet bombers in the states, then they were more likely to be used in Vietnam.

Thanks for clearing that up.

And Bush specifically requested NOT to go to Vietnam, and he also only got into the guard because of his daddy's connections:

Politicians Admits to Pulling Strings for Bush

Now...Still want to stay with this issue ?

 

[Teejay32]

yes, I do. When that guy makes a real case out of what he's saying, then you have something to argue with. Until then, you have comments made at a Kerry fundraiser.

And how do you get out of that, "Bush requested NOT to go to Vietnam"?

 

[Nancy]

Ok so we all know that Kerry served in Viet Nam and Bush didn't...old news...can we move on to some of the other issues and get over it already?

What I want to know is...if Kerry gets elected, how does he plan on getting us out of Iraq? How is he going to improve the economy? How is he going to help those with no jobs get jobs?

I hear alot of talk about what Bush has done wrong and how bad he is (and I am not dissagreeing) but as much as everybody thinks Kerry is going to save the country and the world...how is he, as one man, going to accomplish all that everyone thinks he can.

 

[Teejay32]

Originally posted by Nancy
Ok so we all know that Kerry served in Viet Nam and Bush didn't...old news...can we move on to some of the other issues and get over it already?

Um, no. Not in this thread.

Thanks anyway.

 

[Elwood Blues]

Originally posted by wvrevy
And Bush specifically requested NOT to go to Vietnam, and he also only got into the guard because of his daddy's connections:

Politicians Admits to Pulling Strings for Bush

Now...Still want to stay with this issue ?

Still stuck on that issue??

Of course you fail to point out that the man saying he helped get Bush into the NG got asked for help from a now dead man who can't back up his claim. Nor do you point out that the NG itself says it has no waiting list to refer to.

And please point out in that article where is states that Bush requested NOT to go to VN.

 

[wvrevy]

Originally posted by Elwood Blues
Still stuck on that issue??

Of course you fail to point out that the man saying he helped get Bush into the NG got asked for help from a now dead man who can't back up his claim. Nor do you point out that the NG itself says it has no waiting list to refer to.

And please point out in that article where is states that Bush requested NOT to go to VN.

Wait...the Swift Liars are contradicting themselves all over the place, yet you believe them...but this guy, who is actually taking responsibility for an action of HIS OWN, you choose to ignore ?

Oh, and that article doesn't say that Bush requested not to go...his own paperwork (what he's released, anyway) does...He marked the box requesting not to be sent overseas on his Guard "application".

 

[Elwood Blues]

Originally posted by wvrevy
Wait...the Swift Liars are contradicting themselves all over the place, yet you believe them...but this guy, who is actually taking responsibility for an action of HIS OWN, you choose to ignore ?

So.... when is Kerry going to take responsiblity for his actions? I mean he did admit to committing attrocities (which some are considered war crimes)? Still waiting.

Hey, I could say that I kicked a dog the other day. Can you prove it one way or the other?


Kerry's accounts of his time spent in VN and what he said when he returned are the not the complete truth either. So here we have a "he said he said" situation and we will each believe who we want to.

Looks like a draw to me.

Oh, and that article doesn't say that Bush requested not to go...his own paperwork (what he's released, anyway) does...He marked the box requesting not to be sent overseas on his Guard "application".

Well, you certainly implied that it did. My mistake for making that assumption. This also assumes that "overseas"= VN. But at that time, it probably did.

But here we are right back to "Kerry went" and "Bush didn't". Personally, I don't care why one went and the other didn't. If there was a checkbox on the form, why do you feel that checking it was wrong? Even Bush admitted that Kerry's service was honorable. What do you want from Bush? Do you want him to get into his "wayback" machine and go back to uncheck that box?

 

[jjskribs]

Teejay32.......... I think you missed my point. The OP in her post clearly stated ,

"Bush flew dangerous supersonic interceptors during the Vietnam War to protect the country against a nuclear attack, actually intercepting Soviet bombers."

That was the MISINFORMATION that I was attempting to clarify. Bush did not fly an F-102 in order to intercept a Soviet bomber.
Glad to clear that up for you

Just a little more info ...my husband served in Southeast Asia. He was stationed at several airforce bases. In all the time he was in Vietnam he saw one F-102. It was not a widely used aircraft in the Vietnam war. As my husband put it.... the F-102 was old, slow and a piece of JUNK ( he said something besides junk but I'm being nice.) It actually carried little armament compared to other aircraft. Remember, it's a fighter jet not a bomber.....