Need some advice

[TKERBELL]

This may be a bit long so please bear with me.

DS11 is a very outgoing kid - but at times he has a mouth on him that will not quit....There are a couple of older kids in the neighborhood who - for lack of a better phase - will pick on DS - call him a sissy or *ag or other very nasty and colorful names and phrases - ok they are boys and as the old saying goes "boys will be boys".... Now DH and I have always taught our kids that fighting is wrong - that there is NO ONE in this world worth getting into trouble (with the law) for by hitting them...so we teach the boys to walk away (and yes even in self defense) - which brings forth the name calling and the nastiness -

Reverse to the past - my brother used to get beat up at the bus stop almost everyday and I would be the lucky one who dragged him and his bloody ______(insert whatever facial feature) home

Fast forward to present - this afternoon a "friendly" football game was started DS11 and the boys were all involved - there was tackling and this older kid was telling some of the other boys to kick DS in the stomach and where ever while he was down - DS got up and left - more name calling - #*ssy and such - now DS tells DH and I what happened and knowing my son as I do I know he was NOT innocent - remember he has a mouth on him that could make a Saint lose patience - time passes and DS decides to "show" two of the boys what they had done to DS fingers (a bit bruised) and then tells one of the boys that they are no longer friends.....time passes and then the phone calls start - finally DH has had ENOUGH - tells the boys to stop calling - DS is on lockdown - they continue to call - so DH speaks to the mother of one of the boys (whom we are good friends with - the mother that is) and the conclusion is that the boys think DS has gotten them into trouble and now I have two fears going on -

1) these kids will destroy my property (house, car...etc)
2) DS will run into issues on the bus and at the bus stop

So - should I be the mother hen that I was with my brother ( I swear this is deja-vu for me) and protect my son (by driving him back and forth to the bus stop..etc) or do I let him "fight" his own battles and stay out of it and just see what happens -

FYI - the one kid whose mom we are good friends with has many OLDER friends where we always encouraged our boys to stay within their age range (no-one more than 1 year younger or more than 1 year older) for friends for this exact reason

I am so confused and I realize that by posting this kind of thread I am opening myself to many opinions and possibly some flaming....

Anyway thanks for reading -

 

[chris1gill]

I guess I will post on this... First off, WHY does your son (according to you) have a mouth that won't quit? First off, that wouldn't fly with me... not at all. If he's got a mouth that won't quit, he'd better be able to back it up. Saying thing's that shouldn't be said generally open's oneself up to trouble. I suspect he is now used to using his mouth, and getting him to stop may be very difficult.

Having said that, what is with these boys? You are friends with one of the mothers & yet your son's go at it?? Where is the respect? There is a serious lack of respect here & you as their parents need to work on it... it is completely unacceptable, what you are describing.

I have an almost 11 year old myself, so I understand what having an 11 year old is like, but you need to gain control of the situation as soon as possible I'm sorry to say....

 

[dg39]

My dd, 11, was good friends with this girl. I also was friendly with the parents. For a few weeks now, the girls aren't getting along so well. Nothing major, just girlie nonsense. While speaking to the mom yesterday,she mentioned that she also noticed the girls not getting along, so we both said that they should take a brake from each other and hopefully in time, they'll be friends again. I also told the mom, that from my experience with my older girls ( their in the 20's) that sometimes a break is good and as long as there not being mean to eachother, I'm sure this will pass. Maybe you should tell your ds, to stay away, try to ignore whatever mean things they say to him and before long, they'll get bored with him not responding to their insults. Have him take the bus, but, if he's getting bothered, then drive him for a short time and see how it goes. If your friendly with the other boys parents, call them and let them know whats going on and that you told you ds to take a break from the friendship for awhile, just until things calm down. Because, your friendly with the mother, doesn't mean that the kids have to get along. Sometimes personalities clash and its best to stay away. And I'm sure you did this already, but, tell him again and again, to watch what he says, because a big mouth can and will get you in all sorts of trouble. Good luck...

 

[TKERBELL]

First - Thank you both very much for replying - I truly appreciate you insight and thoughts on the situation

I guess I will post on this... First off, WHY does your son (according to you) have a mouth that won't quit? First off, that wouldn't fly with me... not at all. If he's got a mouth that won't quit, he'd better be able to back it up. Saying thing's that shouldn't be said generally open's oneself up to trouble. I suspect he is now used to using his mouth, and getting him to stop may be very difficult.

I know you are right - his mouth can lead to BIG trouble - because DH & I do not believe that physical fighting is the answer to anyone (our belief - not trying to put anyone elses ideas down - there is a reason behind why we tell our boys not to hit ANYONE) I have tried to explain to DS that a quick wit can sometimes be a great defense - my thinking is that if they are picking on you and you show with your quick with that it does not bother you it will eventually go away -in this case it has escalated - now DS has been known to be mouthy with me or DH and trust me when I say this - WE DO NOT TOLERATE IT AT ALL - He doesn't threaten anyone as you seem to have implied

If he's got a mouth that won't quit, he'd better be able to back it up.

he just hasn't learned that it is NOT what you say but HOW you say it.....we are working on that...

Having said that, what is with these boys? You are friends with one of the mothers & yet your son's go at it?? Where is the respect? There is a serious lack of respect here & you as their parents need to work on it... it is completely unacceptable, what you are describing.

We do discuss this with "Nick's" mom - she is very aware of the problem her son is having and has been trying to correct it - I do respect his mom that is why DH & I do talk to her about this.....I do not know the other boy's parents - my DC14 (cousin who lives with me) does know him from the bus stop and has mentioned that he is not a kind of kid she would want to associate herself with - hmmmmmmmm but respect goes both ways it is also something that is earned not just given freely - and I see my DS respecting my & DH's wishes to WALK AWAY - I don't see the sense or respect in the other boys following him and taunting him - again I know my son is not completely innocent but he is trying to do what I would consider the right thing and they can't back off - the way I see it - they are older than him and while they are not much bigger I think they view it as picking on a younger kid......

If your friendly with the other boys parents, call them and let them know whats going on and that you told you ds to take a break from the friendship for awhile, just until things calm down. Because, your friendly with the mother, doesn't mean that the kids have to get along.

We have spoken to the mom and I agree 100%.


One of my "jobs" if you will as a parent is to prepare my kids for the "real world" and part of that "real world" is realizing that you need to stand up for yourself and what you believe in and to abide by the laws (meaning that physical fighting is the eyes of the law is assualt and battery and these days the victims seem to get into as much trouble as the aggressor) however he is still a child and sometimes children do need our intervention

Again - I do thank you for your insight and thoughtfulness in this sensitive matter.....

 

[disneyeveryyear]

In my opinion, your son's mouth is probably as hurtful as the other children's fists and feet.

He needs to learn to put up or shut up.

I also have a DS11 and the one rule we have taught him is "never hit first, but always hit back." His DF and I will deal with any school discipline should there be any. My DS is not at all aggressive, nor is he extremely mouthy, but I don't want him to be perceived as weak and thus picked on by the other kids.

I think you need to quick focusing on his "wit" and let him learn that his actions (or words) have consequences. He needs to shut his mouth and stand at the bus stop. They already call him a sissy, it will only get worse if his "mommy" drives him to the bus stop and waits.

Stop babying this kid and make him responsible for his action.

 

[VSL]

Maybe he doesn't have quick wit, but is just plain offensive?

When I was young I was verbally bullied by a girl for about two years. I didn't do anything to her, but she, like your son, '[had] a mouth that [would] not quit' (I know your son says he was provoked, but nonetheless). In the end I cracked and stabbed her in the head with a pencil (hey, I was only about 7!). These boys sound a lot more aggressive than I was (I have aggression, but I do not hit people generally - this was after years of being pushed to my limit that I actually lashed out), and they could do a lot worse..

Trust me, ignoring people or responding in a way to offend them will not make them go away. I know first hand.

At 11yrs old, your DS should already know (as disneyeveryyear said) to either 'put up or shut up'.
Maybe you should really speak to him about the consequences of being so mouthy?

(BTW, my bully never spoke to me again - hooray!)

 

[aprilgail2]

I would never have my child walk away from a fight..if someone hits, punches, kicks etc her then I fully expect her to turn around and pound them. I don't care if its in school and she gets in trouble, I will deal with that myself but I told her to never hit first but if you are hit you darn well should take care of yourself. Walking away just leads to them thinking your child is a sissy and they will use him/her as a punching bag over and over again.

 

[VSL]

Unfortunately, for many kids, aprilgail2 is right.

In my post you can see that it only ended when I resorted to violence.

It's sad, but often true.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

Why is he called names? What is it about him that lends to that specific name calling?

Does he act, dress, speak "girly" according to the guys? Normally guys that are called that are "feminine" type.

I only am asking this because of the example you put forth. I know that from my dd's, guys that are gay are labeled early sometimes by their peers.

 

[crz4mm2]

I felt much the same as you. FIghting never solved anything. Shouldn't resort to hitting etc etc.... DS was the smallest in his class. Wore glasses, cried easily. was picked on all the time.... Went to an outdoor party once when he was about 6. kids were picking on him. throwing dirt at him. just boy stuff. He kept coming over and complaining. I kept saying "ignore them. Just forget it" things like that. Finally his Dad said "Don't take that crap son. Fight back". So the next time this really big kid threw sand at him, my little tiny son, who was at least two heads shorter than this big bully, drew himself up and jumped and knocked that kid right on his butt..... No more problems.
I still don't believe in violence. BUT..... sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do and I DO think you have to teach your kids to stick up for themselves!!!!

I also know from experience that 'mouthy' kids bring a lot on themselves too (got two of them). Its a hard thing.
Good luck.

 

[TKERBELL]

Thanks everyone - I really appreciated the responses and ideas.

I have and will continue to keep an open line of communication with DS and I will continue to work with him on his being mouthy -

side note - I was taunted as a freshman until I was a junior with threats and threatening phone calls by more than one person - nothing that I did I just happen to be caught in the middle of a he-likes-me-she-likes-him-thing that happens in high school - so I am well aware that just ignoring it does not always make it go away - but I was lucky - it was never more than words and I never had to defend myself physically

regarding how he dresses - no he does not act or dress "feminine" -