Need help understanding transfered Update post #19

[gracelrm]

We have an extended family trip planned for June 2010. DH and I were going to use banked, borrowed and current year points to cover the all the rooms for the family. One family we never dreamed would decide to go - has decided to go and they may need 2 additional studios that we had not planned for. We had enough points for 2 2BR & 2 or 3 studios for six nights - now we're going to need 2 2BR & 4 studios and we don't have enough points.

We could pay cash with DVC discount or with an AP discount (if that's possible), but I'm guessing it would make more sense to rent points or have them transfered in to our account. I've never really had to think all this through as we've never had a situation like this so I need help from you experienced with all the rules.

If we get a studio with a DVC discount or an AP discount reserved - then if we had to cancel a room - it wouldn't be too big deal as long as it was within a week or 5 days (whatever the criteria is). So that might be a bonus to paying cash. I'm not sure if AP discounts are even likely for 6 nights in June for a DVC studio. Also, our family will be in a 2BR because of the size of our family - so can we even book a room we're not staying in with an AP discount or DVC discount?

I think a transfer, if we can acquire one would be better than renting - then we would have the ability to manage the points ourselves. Also, if we receive a transfer and they back out (which they will likely do) we'll still have some possibilities for the points, but renting we probably would be stuck. Please tell me if I'm not thinking this part through correctly.

If we were to get a transfer - we would need those points in our account when we made the reservation - (We can make those reservations in a few days). Assuming I can get points transfered into my account - do those points become points for my home of VWL? If they were someone's 2009 points - could I bank them to 2010 so I could use them for this planned trip? If all this worked out and then the extra family backs out (I will then be in therapy to deal with my anger toward these people, but that's a whole different topic!). If they back out - how could we handle the unneeded points?

I'm trying to get this all figured out in my mind before I do anything and our home resort booking time will be here very soon.

I apologize for the length of this post, but please help me know what is best to do. What would you do in our circumstance? A side note - this family backed out 5 years ago when we planned an extended family trip less than 30 days before arrival. Even though we had made it clear the day that was the final day to cancel - they still backed out. So I'm expecting the worse, but for the sake of the entire family (and because DH says we have to include them), I have to have a plan to include them.

Thanks in advance for reading this long thread and for helping with your expert advice!

 

[hakepb]

You may not be able to transfer in any more points, otherwise it sounds like a transfer would be best (I believe the total usage of banked/borrowed/transferred/and current points cannot be more than 3x your points in a year), so darn, you may have to add-on

Otherwise I think you would want to have MS use 1) cash room, 2)current or 3)transferred points on their studio as current and transferred points can be banked..

 

[chalee94]

i'd let the other family handle their own stay - rent the points themselves and be responsible themselves if their plans change.

the other poster may be correct and it may be more than you are allowed to borrow but just FYI:

Assuming I can get points transfered into my account - do those points become points for my home of VWL?

no. they retain their actual home resort status.

If they were someone's 2009 points - could I bank them to 2010 so I could use them for this planned trip?

yes. you cannot transfer banked pts but you CAN bank pts that have been transferred.

If all this worked out and then the extra family backs out (I will then be in therapy to deal with my anger toward these people, but that's a whole different topic!). If they back out - how could we handle the unneeded points?

you'd have to rent them or use them. you definitely couldn't transfer them to someone else.

 

[rowbear]

It would be foolish to get burned a second time. I would have them rent their own points and make their own reservations and offer to pay them back on arrival at Disney.

 

[gracelrm]

You may not be able to transfer in any more points, otherwise it sounds like a transfer would be best (I believe the total usage of banked/borrowed/transferred/and current points cannot be more than 3x your points in a year), so darn, you may have to add-on

Otherwise I think you would want to have MS use 1) cash room, 2)current or 3)transferred points on their studio as current and transferred points can be banked..

hakepb - I looked in the vacation planner book for the rules about transfered points and didn't see anything about not using more than 3X your yearly points. It sort of makes sense, but I'm just wondering if that is in writing somewhere. I'm not doubting you at all, I'm just a person who had thought she had read it all at one time or another and don't remember ever seeing that. Just curious!

rowbear - DH is a super nice guy and although I would suggest something like that - for the sake of family peace - we'll do what we can to accommodate that branch of the family tree!

 

[Deb & Bill]

So when they back out 30 days or less out, your husband won't be mad because you spent $1000+ to get the two extra studios and they burned you once again.

 

[SuzanneSLO]

hakepb - I looked in the vacation planner book for the rules about transfered points and didn't see anything about not using more than 3X your yearly points. It sort of makes sense, but I'm just wondering if that is in writing somewhere. I'm not doubting you at all, I'm just a person who had thought she had read it all at one time or another and don't remember ever seeing that. Just curious!

rowbear - DH is a super nice guy and although I would suggest something like that - for the sake of family peace - we'll do what we can to accommodate that branch of the family tree!

It is not in the current Vacation Planner. It is in the Home Resort Rules and Regulations, which were included in my Multi-Site Public Offering Statement booklet given to me when I purchased BWV in 2005. Specifically, it is Section II -- Using Home Resort Vacation Points, Paragraph 5 -- Banking and Borrowing Home Resort Vacation Points, subparagraph c, -- Banking and Borrowing Limitations, part 2), which reads as follows: "The total number of Home Resort Vacation Points combined from Home Resort Vacation Points that are allotted, banked and borrowed may not exceed three-hundred percent (300%) of the Club Member's Home Resort Vacation Point allotment for the current Use Year."

As this doesn't limit points from Transferring, it may not impact the OP's ability to transfer in more points so that she can book with more than 3X her current points.

By the way, a nearby Section (paragraph 4) provides that Transfers may be done in the current UY and the next UY.

Best of luck -- Suzanne

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

Since you feel there's a very good chance the family would back out I think that booking cash would be the best way - then you can cancel and don't have to worry about what to do with the points.

If they do go, it may be a bit more expensive that way, but you retain control and can cancel without worry.

You also would be able to book with the DVC discount (and no, you don't have to be staying in the room AFAIK), and when AP rates and other deals come up you could compare and decided if you keep the DVC rate or book the AP.

 

[CarolAnnC]

Since you feel there's a very good chance the family would back out I think that booking cash would be the best way - then you can cancel and don't have to worry about what to do with the points.

If they do go, it may be a bit more expensive that way, but you retain control and can cancel without worry.

You also would be able to book with the DVC discount (and no, you don't have to be staying in the room AFAIK), and when AP rates and other deals come up you could compare and decided if you keep the DVC rate or book the AP.

The DVC Member cash discount (25% off rack rate) is to be for members' use only. DVC specifies this so as to avoid members booking at that discount and then renting out to others.

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

The DVC Member cash discount (25% off rack rate) is to be for members' use only. DVC specifies this so as to avoid members booking at that discount and then renting out to others.

Interesting- MS was going to let me book a one night member cash room in May for my mother. As it turned out the next day a point room opened up, but they were about to begin typing the day before. We were also booked at the same time in a point room.

 

[gracelrm]

I spent months planning and thought it was all planned and time to make reservations then found out last week one extra family was coming (which I had thought was possible and had a plan B for). Then three days ago find out another family needing a fourth studio in addition to the 2- 2BR we would need "might" come. I have literally spent three days trying to come up with all our options and the one that would cost us the least amt. of money. All the while knowing that one or two studios may possibly back out and all this stress could have been avoided. Okay, enough of the pity party.

I think booking rooms on cash will be our safest bet. If a member discount is available for the 2BR my family (dvc members) will be staying in - then we'll get it for two days and do the rest on points. I would much rather pay for one of the studios for the 6 nights - but without a discount - would likely cost way more than 2 nights of the 2BR on cash. If one or two of the families in studios do back out - I will be aggravated because I will likely (by the time they let us know) not be able to switch the 2BR from cash to points.

I've exhausted my brain trying to decide what is best. If anyone has a better idea - please let me know. I can make reservations tomorrow (Sun.) but may wait until Monday just so I can think this all through a little longer.

 

[RobDoc]

If you would be making the reservation more than 7 months in advance using transferred points they must be from the resort you want to reserve. Transferred points will retain their Home Resort status and Use Year - so if you want to stay at VWL you would need to find VWL points available for transfer. As already noted, there is no limitation placed on the number of points that may be transferred each year - only that they must all be done in one transfer. They can be banked however, so if they were used for a reservation later cancelled, they could still be banked into the next Use Year.

MS has been allowing members to reserve stays using the member discount even if not staying in the room themselves (this was not always the case), so in this situation I'd see if that would be an option for your family members - if they later cancel there would be no penalty like there could be if using points. Member discounts are not always available at 11 months though, so you might be forced to wait to see if that is an option. I would still ask though.

Good luck with your decision.

 

[Chuck S]

Interesting- MS was going to let me book a one night member cash room in May for my mother. As it turned out the next day a point room opened up, but they were about to begin typing the day before. We were also booked at the same time in a point room.

That is likely the difference. Most people, if they are travelling together, have been able to get a DVC Discounted room for their guests. But technically Carol is correct, our contracts specify members only.

 

[Chuck S]

If anyone has a better idea - please let me know.

I think the better idea is to give them the phone number to WDW Central Reservation and let them book their own room, no matter the cost.

Honestly, we have a rule for our guests...we are happy to give you points for your stays. Once we have discussed the dates, you've agreed to go, and the reservatoin are made...if you cancel for any reason other than an emergency (sorry, daughter's cheer camp, or son's football camp is not an emergency) you are NOT invited back. Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me!

 

[CarolAnnC]

That is likely the difference. Most people, if they are travelling together, have been able to get a DVC Discounted room for their guests. But technically Carol is correct, our contracts specify members only.

Don't forget, AP discounted rooms may be a better value than DVC Member discounted rooms...

 

[CarolMN]

It's good of you to offer the free lodging for your family members. There have been lots of horror stories here about people backing out at the last minute and leaving the member in a bind (I'm sure you have read them).

If you are uncomfortable asking some of the family to make their own reservations when you are offering for the others, then be sure to do something to protect yourself.

We generally make sure our guests book something that is nonrefundable before a deadline. An example would be nonrefundable airfare, or buying MYW tickets. The deadline could be your banking deadline or a week or so before the 31 day mark. Having something of their own at risk seems to make a difference in guests' propensity to cancel without a very good reason.

We also give everyone a "budget" so that they know what the trip will cost them well ahead of time. Many people do not realize how expensive a trip can be and they do not like to admit they may not be able to afford it. Break it down for them - transportation, tickets, food, and souvenirs. Include a note that while you are happy to treat them for lodging, if they cancel after (insert date here), you will lose the opportunity to use their room for something /someone else, and that you would have to pay for something no one used. Then send that budget memo out again a couple of weeks before the deadline and ask for a firm yes or no.

You still might get burned, but it is less likely. It's worked for us every time.

If you have one or more families that are "flaky" or "financially iffy", I agree that the cash reservation route would be best. As you said, those are a lot easier to cancel. Since your trip is a ways out there, you have a good chance of running across some good discounts before you go.

Good luck!

 

[gracelrm]

Thanks to everyone who has helped me through this family trip planning. I know it's silly but I have felt so anxious the past few days worrying so much about the trip and it has truly helped to be able to come here and get input from so many knowledgeable people. I've decided to pay cash for the 6 nights of the extra studio. Even though it would be cheaper to pay for a couple of nights for my 2BR - I'd rather not have to worry if the family in question cancels out then me not being able to transfer my room to points. If they cancel - I won't have anything to be angry over - I won't have any points tied up and I'll have $1500 more dollars in my pocket than if they had actually showed up. What's to be angry about then! Hopefully if they do make it - an AP rate or something will come along to help out with the cost and will make this decision seem like the "right" one.

CarolMN - thanks for your suggestions. I have sent two letters that spell it all out. I even indicated that our points were like non-refundable airline tickets (okay maybe I was exaggerating just a bit), but in all honesty after the 30 day mark - that's really what they are in our situation. The family in question will drive to WDW and may not even purchase park tickets and just enjoy the resort - so there's not really a way to have them financially tied to the trip. That would have been a good idea though. I've given them links to Disney's website, Discount ticket sites, etc... I was so frank in my letters that I'm almost embarrassed for the responsible family members that had to read them. I'm hoping they know that the directness was meant for one family. But I'm at the point that I can live with my decision for the next 11 months while not shooting mean, resentful looks toward them at family gatherings!

Again, thanks everyone for your help. I slept much better last night!

 

[Deb & Bill]

Thanks to everyone who has helped me through this family trip planning. I know it's silly but I have felt so anxious the past few days worrying so much about the trip and it has truly helped to be able to come here and get input from so many knowledgeable people. I've decided to pay cash for the 6 nights of the extra studio. Even though it would be cheaper to pay for a couple of nights for my 2BR - I'd rather not have to worry if the family in question cancels out then me not being able to transfer my room to points. If they cancel - I won't have anything to be angry over - I won't have any points tied up and I'll have $1500 more dollars in my pocket than if they had actually showed up. What's to be angry about then! Hopefully if they do make it - an AP rate or something will come along to help out with the cost and will make this decision seem like the "right" one.

CarolMN - thanks for your suggestions. I have sent two letters that spell it all out. I even indicated that our points were like non-refundable airline tickets (okay maybe I was exaggerating just a bit), but in all honesty after the 30 day mark - that's really what they are in our situation. The family in question will drive to WDW and may not even purchase park tickets and just enjoy the resort - so there's not really a way to have them financially tied to the trip. That would have been a good idea though. I've given them links to Disney's website, Discount ticket sites, etc... I was so frank in my letters that I'm almost embarrassed for the responsible family members that had to read them. I'm hoping they know that the directness was meant for one family. But I'm at the point that I can live with my decision for the next 11 months while not shooting mean, resentful looks toward them at family gatherings!

Again, thanks everyone for your help. I slept much better last night!

Just feeling a little more in control of the situation should help. Good luck.

 

[gracelrm]

Called today to make reservations. 3 glitches: 1st - I didn't have phone numbers for everyone in the rooms. I had a few on my cell phone that I could retrieve, but didn't have them all. Next time I'll know to have all addresses and phone numbers handy. 2nd - In my mind I wanted the studios (which are for the people that are most likely to back out) to come from my 2010 points - so if they cancel, then I would still have the option of banking those points to 2011. I knew if I used banked or borrowed points - then I would be forced to use them all in 2010 and wouldn't be allowed to bank them. I realized this AFTER I booked the two 2BR unit and used almost all of my banked & current year points. The nice lady at MS explained she'd have to cancel one of the 2BR and sort of start over, but sort of encouraged me to just wait and if it happened to reallocate points at that time. After me apologizing 10 times and explaining why it was important to me to have it done right from the beginning - she cancelled the 2BR that she used the 2010 points for and started putting the studios from those points. I appreciated her doing this. 3rd - I had decided to reserve the 4th studio with cash. If a member discount was possible - I'd get that - if not I'd keep calling back. She told me that there was no inventory to book on cash yet. I asked if I called CRO - could I book a studio and she said there are none available yet. I guess it makes sense, but I wasn't expecting that. So after all my worrying and fretting - I still only have 2 - 2BR and 3 studios. I'll just have to wait on that 4th studio. She suggested calling back once a month until one became available.

If anyone thinks there is anything else I can do - please let me know. I know that often the people on this board know as much as the MS people do.

 

[RweTHEREyet]

The DVC Member cash discount (25% off rack rate) is to be for members' use only. DVC specifies this so as to avoid members booking at that discount and then renting out to others.

I booked a cash room for friends of the family during our stay this past January. Names aren't the same, and we aren't related in the least. I didn't ask if I could do this, and didn't know I wasn't supposed to, but MS did not ask any questions about who these people were other than names, address and phone number.