Need help regrowing my frugal brain

[rnorwo1]

Hi All!
When we got married 24 years ago, my husband and I were very frugal with most things. I budgeted and tracked spending like crazy, and we did all the great things like pay our house off very early, never had credit card debt, etc. As we made more money, and became so busy with kids and careers, we have gotten away from some of those things. My husband's retirement fund is great, but I just entered the workforce as a full time employee a few years ago (was always a part time contractor/self-employed so I could be at home more with kids). We will both get pensions in addition to our retirement savings. We have stayed out of debt. We have plenty of savings for emergencies. HOWEVER, I am horrified by the amount of money we spend and would like to save more. My husband can retire in 5 years, but he's reluctant to do so because his pension increases so much if he waits to retire in 10 years. He works shift work, though, so I'd rather that he retires in 5 for his health. If we would cut back on the wasteful spending that is not enriching our lives, then this would be an easy goal for us. We have few bills, so we should really be putting lots away. Right now our financial strategy is just to spend slightly less than we make, and hell if I really know if we are doing that because I don't even look at our accounts!

Picking up food, buying convenience foods, and throwing away uneaten, spoiled food is a huge waste for us. I not only don't budget, I put all my bills on auto-pay and rarely look at the accounts AT ALL. I really don't know where our money goes. In my small business, I leave money on the table all the time because I don't want to deal with the few minutes it takes to take care of business. I still have all the knowledge that helped us early on; I've just completely lost the desire or will to apply it even with our good goals of saving my husband's health!

Anyone else been in this situation and were able to get back to frugality? How did you give yourself the kick in the butt to get back on it?! We don't have to go back to eating beans and rice by candle light, but the fear of deprivation is not an issue for me. I honestly think I'm just lazy and "meh" about it all. Looking for some inspiration!

 

[DaviVascaino]

It seems you already have your life set, already paid off your mortgage and has a good retirement fund.

As a physician who has seen many young/middle age healthy people just pass away unexpectedly , I would say live your life. It does not mean you should burn money, but just do what you want, eat and drink what you want.
If Covid-19 taught us anything, it taught us that we should celebrate our present more and worry less about the future.

 

[MomToOne]

Think small. Pick one area to focus on at a time - say, eliminating food waste. Even then, you can break it up into smaller chunks - like let's make it a point to eat any leftovers. Or if you sometimes throw out half a loaf of stale bread (ah hem...not that I EVER do that LOL), start by freezing half of any loaf you buy.

Once you feel you've got that one thing well under control, pick another area to focus on.

If you try and do it all at once, you'll give up in just a few days.

 

[georgina]

Hi All!
When we got married 24 years ago, my husband and I were very frugal with most things. I budgeted and tracked spending like crazy, and we did all the great things like pay our house off very early, never had credit card debt, etc. As we made more money, and became so busy with kids and careers, we have gotten away from some of those things. My husband's retirement fund is great, but I just entered the workforce as a full time employee a few years ago (was always a part time contractor/self-employed so I could be at home more with kids). We will both get pensions in addition to our retirement savings. We have stayed out of debt. We have plenty of savings for emergencies. HOWEVER, I am horrified by the amount of money we spend and would like to save more. My husband can retire in 5 years, but he's reluctant to do so because his pension increases so much if he waits to retire in 10 years. He works shift work, though, so I'd rather that he retires in 5 for his health. If we would cut back on the wasteful spending that is not enriching our lives, then this would be an easy goal for us. We have few bills, so we should really be putting lots away. Right now our financial strategy is just to spend slightly less than we make, and hell if I really know if we are doing that because I don't even look at our accounts!

Picking up food, buying convenience foods, and throwing away uneaten, spoiled food is a huge waste for us. I not only don't budget, I put all my bills on auto-pay and rarely look at the accounts AT ALL. I really don't know where our money goes. In my small business, I leave money on the table all the time because I don't want to deal with the few minutes it takes to take care of business. I still have all the knowledge that helped us early on; I've just completely lost the desire or will to apply it even with our good goals of saving my husband's health!

Anyone else been in this situation and were able to get back to frugality? How did you give yourself the kick in the butt to get back on it?! We don't have to go back to eating beans and rice by candle light, but the fear of deprivation is not an issue for me. I honestly think I'm just lazy and "meh" about it all. Looking for some inspiration!

I agree with the start small suggestion. If you can find the motivation to track your spending again, even if only roughly (not every dollar), it may become self-reinforcing. Seeing where you are spending a lot can be eye-opening.

Both DH and I had parents live into their mid-90's, I want to be able to enjoy life and have enough to do it comfortably, plus help out our kids & grandkids.

 

[lockets]

Was the way that you used to track your spending too labor intensive and that’s why you’re dreading it? Does the method need to be modernized w/the help of an app or just simplified in some manner? I’m dealing w a similar situation in that I don’t have as much time as I used to to track my budget but since I know how important it is I modified the way that I track it. Moved away from manual excel spreadsheet method to a budgeting app that I LOVE. I still need to put more time into analyzing what’s on the app but the work has definitely been cut in half and even analyzing is way easier.

Second thought. Hire a bookkeeper and schedule a semi annual reviews with them. Look for a retired accountant that might need part time work for a reasonable price if you want to save $.

 

[DL1WDW2]

? New Years Resolutions ? … Top of my list …
Great thread Thanks for reminding me

 

[trenty]

You might not need to be "frugal." You might just need to budget. As others have mentioned here, there are many budgeting apps that make it so much easier than it was 24 years ago. We use Everydollar - but there are others. I find that budgeting lets me spend on what I need (sometimes on what I want/don't need) and more importantly, save each month. At first, it takes some trial/error to get the budget set and you need to invest some time, especially at the beginning fo the month. Once you get the hang of using the app, it takes only a few minutes a day to enter your spending.

 

[rnorwo1]

It seems you already have your life set, already paid off your mortgage and has a good retirement fund.

As a physician who has seen many young/middle age healthy people just pass away unexpectedly , I would say live your life. It does not mean you should burn money, but just do what you want, eat and drink what you want.
If Covid-19 taught us anything, it taught us that we should celebrate our present more and worry less about the future.

Funny you mention this; I just ordered the book "Taking Stock," which was written by a physician who worked in Hospice, i believe. I am hoping that it will help me refocus. In my OP, I think I wrote something about cutting back on things that don't bring us joy or something similar. I do not intend to cut back on vacations, for ex, which have always been our passion. I'm pretty good with credit card bonuses and such to help, but I definitely agree with you about living life to the fullest. We are, however, wasting money on things that add no value and some things, like crappy convenience food, are probably taking away from our lives! That's where I want to focus

Think small. Pick one area to focus on at a time - say, eliminating food waste. Even then, you can break it up into smaller chunks - like let's make it a point to eat any leftovers. Or if you sometimes throw out half a loaf of stale break (ah hem...not that I EVER do that LOL), start by freezing half of any loaf you buy.

Once you feel you've got that one thing well under control, pick another area to focus on.

If you try and do it all at once, you'll give up in just a few days.

Great point. Although I have not done an analysis of our spending (the mere thought exhausts me), I know we are wasting money here. And we need to get back on eating healthy anyway, so 2 birds here.

I agree with the start small suggestion. If you can find the motivation to track your spending again, even if only roughly (not every dollar), it may become self-reinforcing. Seeing where you are spending a lot can be eye-opening.

Both DH and I had parents live into their mid-90's, I want to be able to enjoy life and have enough to do it comfortably, plus help out our kids & grandkids.

Yes, I do not want to cut ourselves short at all. I suspect that at least one of our kids will be moving away, and i want the freedom to visit often or even buy another home to be closer to them. I want to take the whole family on vacations. We don't live extravagantly on the daily, but I want to do big things like this with grandkids and such.

Was the way that you used to track your spending too labor intensive and that’s why you’re dreading it? Does the method need to be modernized w/the help of an app or just simplified in some manner? I’m dealing w a similar situation in that I don’t have as much time as I used to to track my budget but since I know how important it is I modified the way that I track it. Moved away from manual excel spreadsheet method to a budgeting app that I LOVE. I still need to put more time into analyzing what’s on the app but the work has definitely been cut in half and even analyzing is way easier.

Second thought. Hire a bookkeeper and schedule a semi annual reviews with them. Look for a retired accountant that might need part time work for a reasonable price if you want to save $.

Yes, I spent a lot of time analyzing spending, using YNAB, etc. I've tried an app before but am always rushing out of stores and rarely went back to enter purchases. I probably need to go back to the ole cash envelope days, but I get so many credit card rewards I hate to do that. Once upon a time I was confident that we were not spending more because we were using cards, because I was tracking everything so carefully, but I doubt that's the case now. Maybe I will do a cash-January and see what happens.

Do you mind telling me which app you're using?

? New Years Resolutions ? … Top of my list …
Great thread Thanks for reminding me

Good luck!!!

You might not need to be "frugal." You might just need to budget. As others have mentioned here, there are many budgeting apps that make it so much easier than it was 24 years ago. We use Everydollar - but there are others. I find that budgeting lets me spend on what I need (sometimes on what I want/don't need) and more importantly, save each month. At first, it takes some trial/error to get the budget set and you need to invest some time, especially at the beginning fo the month. Once you get the hang of using the app, it takes only a few minutes a day to enter your spending.

There are so many frugal things I'm used to that I don't mind that in some areas, but I definitely do need to budget! Thanks for the app suggestion, I'll check it out!!

Thanks so much for the suggestions; I needed some sort of accountability, so this has helped!!

 

[robinb]

Let me get this straight ...

1. Your house is paid off
2. You do not have any debt
3. Your DH can retire in 5 years (I'm assuming that he has talked to a financial planner)
4. Your retirement fund is great, you have both savings and pensions coming
5. You are now working full time to bring in more money
6. You don't have many ongoing bills to pay

... and you're "horrified by the amount of money we spend"?

Girl. You don't need to turn ON your frugal brain. It's already on. You need to turn it OFF and enjoy the life that you and your husband have worked for so long to achieve.

 

[georgina]

Maybe, except for this part -

My husband can retire in 5 years, but he's reluctant to do so because his pension increases so much if he waits to retire in 10 years. He works shift work, though, so I'd rather that he retires in 5 for his health. If we would cut back on the wasteful spending that is not enriching our lives, then this would be an easy goal for us.

Perhaps if they could get a better idea of what they are spending and where, it would ease some of that concern.

As a long-time frugal couple, we have found ourselves spending much more freely in retirement as we now feel comfortable spending more on travel.

 

[DLgal]

Here's my take. Frugality is born of necessity. When it stops being necessary, it becomes a burden.

Budgeting is like dieting. It's hard to stick with because you feel deprived of SOMETHING. If you don't need to do it, why would you? It's a difficult mental hurdle to get over, and if you don't really NEED to, why stress about it?

I don't diet. I also don't budget. I set goals for savings that are realistic, but the thought of counting every dollar that leaves our account sounds like such a chore and it's overkill.

It really sounds like you guys are in good financial shape. You will adjust your spending when your income goes down, the same way you adjusted it upwards when your income went up. Don't worry about it.

 

[DaviVascaino]

Here's my take. Frugality is born of necessity. When it stops being necessary, it becomes a burden.

Budgeting is like dieting. It's hard to stick with because you feel deprived of SOMETHING. If you don't need to do it, why would you? It's a difficult mental hurdle to get over, and if you don't really NEED to, why stress about it?

I don't diet. I also don't budget. I set goals for savings that are realistic, but the thought of counting every dollar that leaves our account sounds like such a chore and it's overkill.

It really sounds like you guys are in good financial shape. You will adjust your spending when your income goes down, the same way you adjusted it upwards when your income went up. Don't worry about it.

that is the perfect way to put it.

 

[MomToOne]

It really sounds like you guys are in good financial shape. You will adjust your spending when your income goes down, the same way you adjusted it upwards when your income went up. Don't worry about it.

I don't agree. Part of knowing whether you have the assets to retire is knowing your budget in retirement, so you can run the calcs to see if you have enough money (accounting for things like inflation - I have a couple of retired family members who have been bitten hard by that this year). Ask any financial planner if you have enough to retire, and one of their first questions should be "what's your budget in retirement"? You can't even begin to know if you have enough if you don't know what you are going to be spending.

The OP also stated she would like her husband to retire earlier rather than later, but saving more is a part of reaching that goal. Waiting for the income to go down, then adjusting, just doesn't meet her goal. So some work has to be done somewhere to gather that extra savings - right now, the OP doesn't even know what their savings rate is (or isn't). Some sort of work will have to be done to figure out what their real savings rate is, and figure out how to increase it.

 

[DLgal]

I don't agree. Part of knowing whether you have the assets to retire is knowing your budget in retirement, so you can run the calcs to see if you have enough money (accounting for things like inflation - I have a couple of retired family members who have been bitten hard by that this year). Ask any financial planner if you have enough to retire, and one of their first questions should be "what's your budget in retirement"? You can't even begin to know if you have enough if you don't know what you are going to be spending.

The OP also stated she would like her husband to retire earlier rather than later, but saving more is a part of reaching that goal. Waiting for the income to go down, then adjusting, just doesn't meet her goal. So some work has to be done somewhere to gather that extra savings - right now, the OP doesn't even know what their savings rate is (or isn't). Some sort of work will have to be done to figure out what their real savings rate is, and figure out how to increase it.

Your budget in retirement should be based around your income, not the other way around. There is no way to predict every aspect of your post retirement life, to include your budget. You learn to adjust as you go. Figure out what your income will be and develop a budget that fits those parameters.

My parents retired and went from a 5 figure monthly income to less than $5000/month. They adapted. They had to. There have been a lot of unexpected expenses this year (medical related) that they also just worked into the budget by cutting back on traveling and other non essentials. They've also lost a bit of the value of their investment accounts, like everyone else did ths year, so they are being more careful over the next couple years in hopes of those accounts recovering somewhat. You figure it out.

When you are 10 years away from retirement, there is no way to predict inflation, health care costs, etc.

Pensions also help a lot. When you have guaranteed income streams for the rest of your life, you get to depend less on savings and investments for day to day living. Those accounts become fun money.

 

[Lumpy1106]

When the COVID shutdowns happened we ran the math - we were SAVING > $1000/MONTH (!). We had gotten stuck in the rut of running off to work ($ for commute), running back to get the kids from school to take them to their activities ($ for those), then having no time or energy to cook at home, meaning we'd go out instead ($$ money for that). We also had stopped going on vacations, going to the gym, the list goes on. The big expense was going out to eat - just don't do that. It's not good for you and it's only gotten more expensive.

TO the OP, list out your expenses (the hard part), then decide what's really important to you. Cutting back is easy once you've done that. Keeping from falling back in the same old habits is the (other) hard part.

 

[MomToOne]

Your budget in retirement should be based around your income, not the other way around. There is no way to predict every aspect of your post retirement life, to include your budget. You learn to adjust as you go. Figure out what your income will be and develop a budget that fits those parameters.

Problem is in retirement, for many people at least a portion of their income is what they choose to draw from their investments. Pensions and/or social security provide only a portion of the income many people need - you can't just say investments are only "fun money". You have to have a budget to figure out that what you plan to draw from investments will not deplete them too fast. And the opposite is also true - you don't want to deny yourself things with a budget that is unnecessarily tight.

Also beware many pensions do not have cost of living increases, or do not give increases that actually keep up with inflation - what looks like a great pension today may not be so hot 15-20 years from now, causing people to also rely on their savings/investments to cover any shortfall in even day to day expenses.

There are ways to run numerous simulations that run different rates of inflation, medical costs, etc. to see your likelihood of outliving your assets at the rate you expect to deplete them (it's called a Monte Carlo Simulation). Even 10 years in advance.

 

[DLgal]

Problem is in retirement, for many people at least a portion of their income is what they choose to draw from their investments. You have to have a budget to figure out that what you plan to draw will not deplete it too fast. And the opposite is also true - you don't want to deny yourself things with a budget that is unnecessarily tight.

Also, there are ways to run numerous simulations that run different rates of inflation, medical costs, etc. to see your likelihood of outliving your assets at the rate you expect to deplete them (it's called a Monte Carlo Simulation). Even 10 years in advance.

Even the simulations won't account for every possibility. This is my point. At the end of the day, you live within your means, whatever that ends up being.

 

[robinb]

Problem is in retirement, for many people at least a portion of their income is what they choose to draw from their investments. You have to have a budget to figure out that what you plan to draw will not deplete it too fast. And the opposite is also true - you don't want to deny yourself things with a budget that is unnecessarily tight.

Also, there are ways to run numerous simulations that run different rates of inflation, medical costs, etc. to see your likelihood of outliving your assets at the rate you expect to deplete them (it's called a Monte Carlo Simulation). Even 10 years in advance.

In my post I said that I assumed the the OP met with a financial advisor who ran those simulations and they told her that her DH could retire in 5 years. If they have not yet met with a financial advisor then they should do that first and understand their true financial situation before she makes wholesale changes to their budgeting and spending.

 

[hopemax]

Do you have an idea of how much more per month / paycheck you would like to save? For us, since we are passed the needing to account for every dollar out of necessity, what works for us is to just transfer that money first. Increase the automatic deposits going to a savings account. Once it is in there we are loathe to take it out unless it's for an actual "savings account" purpose like travel, or something important needs replacing, vet bills, etc. The rest of our daily budget seems to adjust on it's own just knowing that the checking account is smaller. For example, for the last couple of years we had 2 $500 car payments or $1000 total a month. We added them, even before pandemic, and it affected our day-to-day very little. Which left us wondering how we were wasting the money before. Now the cars are paid off, and we finally did better this time to shift it to the mortgage (and unfortunately higher energy / water bills) instead of going back to whatever crap we were blowing it on before.

 

[rnorwo1]

Do you have an idea of how much more per month / paycheck you would like to save? For us, since we are passed the needing to account for every dollar out of necessity, what works for us is to just transfer that money first. Increase the automatic deposits going to a savings account. Once it is in there we are loathe to take it out unless it's for an actual "savings account" purpose like travel, or something important needs replacing, vet bills, etc. The rest of our daily budget seems to adjust on it's own just knowing that the checking account is smaller. For example, for the last couple of years we had 2 $500 car payments or $1000 total a month. We added them, even before pandemic, and it affected our day-to-day very little. Which left us wondering how we were wasting the money before. Now the cars are paid off, and we finally did better this time to shift it to the mortgage (and unfortunately higher energy / water bills) instead of going back to whatever crap we were blowing it on before.

I don't have any idea of what we can save. Once I stopped tracking expenses years ago, I was paranoid that we would overdraw a checking account, so we keep our emergency savings in our interest earning checking account. I think some months we are living off that savings, other months we are contributing to it. The balance seems to stay about the same. Our income is also very variable depending on my husband's overtime. (He is "forced" into the OT, and he's very tired of it; I feel especially guilty when he's worked a month of nights, makes so much extra money, and I don't have anything to show for it!!)

I like this idea of transferring first. I do not have any retirement other than the pension (and I have no idea how much it should be, but my colleagues seem to know that it won't be "enough" for them) so perhaps I should start there. I also downloaded everydollar app earlier today and will see if that helps me to track a bit better. I doubt I'll enter expenses manually, but I can sync it with bank accounts and credit cards.

For those who are saying to just enjoy life, I really feel like we are! I just think we can cut back on many of these things that aren't all that enjoyable to be able to do more of the good stuff when we retire. I know we will adjust our spending then, but if I can do it now, then that will give us more freedom in the future.