More layoffs and cuts.....
- Thread starter Dznefreek
- Start date
Quality Disney staff will make the choice to look elsewhere. Is it any wonder competitors are catching up?
I can only believe Walt would be very disappointed in the selfishness and shortsightedness of current Disney top brass. They should be reinvesting in their people, not negotiating an extra zero in their comp packages.
Too bad--it will have consequences in the long run when your ideas are walking out the door.
I can only believe Walt would be very disappointed in the selfishness and shortsightedness of current Disney top brass. They should be reinvesting in their people, not negotiating an extra zero in their comp packages.
Too bad--it will have consequences in the long run when your ideas are walking out the door.
Another Voice
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Hmmm......
There are so many rumors about so many more interesting cuts that are rumored being planned.
And all at a time when Universal Studios Hollywood - widely regarded as the theme park most impacted by the drop-off in tourism - is actually expanding.
Gee, layoffs follow the same week it seems like ABC is going to wind up as America's fourth rated network again.... I wonder if there's a connection.
There are so many rumors about so many more interesting cuts that are rumored being planned.
And all at a time when Universal Studios Hollywood - widely regarded as the theme park most impacted by the drop-off in tourism - is actually expanding.
Gee, layoffs follow the same week it seems like ABC is going to wind up as America's fourth rated network again.... I wonder if there's a connection.
>>>And all at a time when Universal Studios Hollywood - widely regarded as the theme park most impacted by the drop-off in tourism - is actually expanding.<<<
It's about time. Universal Orlando was getting kind of lonesome in being at the forefront of growth and product quality in this industry.
It's about time. Universal Orlando was getting kind of lonesome in being at the forefront of growth and product quality in this industry.
>>>forgetting to add a single new attraction since opening sounds even worse than AK's growth chart...<<<
You know, maybe starting out with one of the greatest theme parks ever built is enough to carry you along. With IOA being the only park in Florida that is actually exhibiting growth these days (the easy comparisons that Disney could make against the 9/11 quarter are NOTHING. The gains that they posted in Florida are not even half as high as the losses in revenues they took on from that event alone, none the less the losses that have been piling on over the past few years), I'm sure that Tom Williams and Bob Gault will agree. Also, to clarify that, IOA did add two new minor (and I mean minor) attractions in 2000, Storm Force and the Flying Unicorn. They also had Halloween Horror Nights last year, which regardless of how you classify it (addition, relocation, or whatever) was a major event for the park, setting all time records for Universal's domestic parks.
In other news, 2005 is being widely regarded as the year that IOA will get it's due, but you didn't hear that from me.
>>>what is the source and details for UH's expansion<<<
Al Lutz's MiceAge column of all places actually hit the nail on the head according to what I have been hearing. A Premier LIM launcher is scheduled to replace ET with an opening scheduled for next year. Think Scorpion King for this one, and don't confuse this with the ride opening in Florida next year, as they are not even constructed by the same company according to the "rumors."
They've also got Shrek 4D opening this year, a carry over from the show being built in Florida right now.
No wonder so many Imagineers are jealous right now...
You know, maybe starting out with one of the greatest theme parks ever built is enough to carry you along. With IOA being the only park in Florida that is actually exhibiting growth these days (the easy comparisons that Disney could make against the 9/11 quarter are NOTHING. The gains that they posted in Florida are not even half as high as the losses in revenues they took on from that event alone, none the less the losses that have been piling on over the past few years), I'm sure that Tom Williams and Bob Gault will agree. Also, to clarify that, IOA did add two new minor (and I mean minor) attractions in 2000, Storm Force and the Flying Unicorn. They also had Halloween Horror Nights last year, which regardless of how you classify it (addition, relocation, or whatever) was a major event for the park, setting all time records for Universal's domestic parks.
In other news, 2005 is being widely regarded as the year that IOA will get it's due, but you didn't hear that from me.
>>>what is the source and details for UH's expansion<<<
Al Lutz's MiceAge column of all places actually hit the nail on the head according to what I have been hearing. A Premier LIM launcher is scheduled to replace ET with an opening scheduled for next year. Think Scorpion King for this one, and don't confuse this with the ride opening in Florida next year, as they are not even constructed by the same company according to the "rumors."
They've also got Shrek 4D opening this year, a carry over from the show being built in Florida right now.
No wonder so many Imagineers are jealous right now...
Planogirl
I feel the nerd in me stirring
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Why should they be, when so many are working for Universal now.
My husband reminded me that Michael Eisner likely only had to meet certain objectives to earn his bonus and that we probably don't know everything that went on behind the scenes. That may be so but these objectives must have had nothing to do with growth or income or anything else that would help the parks.
Another Voice
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Eisner employment contract was modified several years ago to remove all performance conditions. His bonus is soley at the discretion of a sub committee of the Board of Directors. They can award as much as they want, as often as the want, without any link to the performance of the company or of the stock.
It pays to be the King.
It pays to be the King.
All Aboard
Por favor mantengan se alejado de las puertas
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Scoop, you knew it would happen...
In terms of attraction counts (at least the types of attractions folks in general care about - as evidenced by the folks rushing past the animal exhibits at AK's entrance and the sparse few folks venturing through the Trek and Trail) IOA opened with many more than AK. Excluding animal exhibits that are walk-through and kiddie play areas (IOA has 3 very elaborate ones, AK has one very elaborate one) IOA opened with 17 attractions (including two live shows), AK opened with 8 attractions (including three live shows.) AK has closed it's boat ride (so has IOA) and added 3 rides and one more show. IOA has added two rides and dropped one show and one attraction back to seasonal.
Forgive me I'm at home and don't have access to the Great Big Spreadsheet of Everything. But, I believe IOA and AK attendance figures are headed in opposite directions.
In terms of attraction counts (at least the types of attractions folks in general care about - as evidenced by the folks rushing past the animal exhibits at AK's entrance and the sparse few folks venturing through the Trek and Trail) IOA opened with many more than AK. Excluding animal exhibits that are walk-through and kiddie play areas (IOA has 3 very elaborate ones, AK has one very elaborate one) IOA opened with 17 attractions (including two live shows), AK opened with 8 attractions (including three live shows.) AK has closed it's boat ride (so has IOA) and added 3 rides and one more show. IOA has added two rides and dropped one show and one attraction back to seasonal.
Forgive me I'm at home and don't have access to the Great Big Spreadsheet of Everything. But, I believe IOA and AK attendance figures are headed in opposite directions.
WDSearcher
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But I think you also have to agree that they are two very different types of experiences. DAK never was, and was never meant to be, a thrill park. IOA was meant to be from Day One. The fact that Disney is looking for ways to increase the thrill level is proof that their idea didn't work, but that doesn't mean it's "better" or "worse" than IOA. It's different. And apparently there is less of a call for an "experience park" than for a thrill park. Should've guessed that one, but they didn't.
Also, DAK was never supposed to be a stand-alone experience. It was a fourth park among a group of parks at a single destination. It was designed to keep people on property a day longer or to make them consider a longer stay. And it has done that. IOA was built for the same reason, but the lion's share of UO's guests still build Universal / IOA into a Disney vacation. They're staying at Disney, but spending a couple of days at Universal. I would suspect that IOA is cutting into SeaWorld's attendance more than anyone else's, since SeaWorld used to be the "away from Disney" day on all the itineraries.
Universal's had their share of layoffs too, particularly in entertainment. It's hitting everyone. Right now, UO is having a good year. It's their turn. Next year it'll likely be someone else.
PS. I'd like a copy of that Great Big Spreadsheet of Everything. Is there a link to that somewhere??
>>>Also, DAK was never supposed to be a stand-alone experience.<<<
That's why the park is having such a struggle with getting people to visit. Which park would I rather visit, a park that was essentially a throw away designed to make stay another day, or a park that was built to stand among the very best in the world designed by the most talented people in the industry? Hmm...
>>>IOA was built for the same reason<<<
No it wasn't. IOA was built to be the centerpiece of the Universal Orlando resort, a very far cry from being a throwaway to keep people at Universal (although AK's original plans called for the park to be much more than that, and there is still a sign of that in the park now- Killiminjaro Safari). It was also built to help Universal stand on their own in the industry, to prove that Disney was no longer owned the theme park industry. IOA has been a stunning success in that regard, and like it or not, it is the crown jewel of the Universal theme park empire. Something tells me that Animal Kingdom will probably never be regarded as a GREAT theme park like Islands of Adventure, Disney Sea, and Disneyland Paris are.
>>>the lion's share of UO's guests still build Universal / IOA into a Disney vacation<<<
Not really. Over a 1/3 of Universal's guests are staying on Universal property for the duration of their visit, and even more are leaving Disney out of their vacation in favor of parks like Sea World and the the tourist traps- er, attractions on I-Drive. BTW, Sea World had a near record year last year.
>>>Universal's had their share of layoffs too, particularly in entertainment.<<<
Entertainment is really kind of a wash. They've had layoffs, but they have been replaced by other acts in the park, only to have those acts canned to be replaced by different acts. The overall direction of entertainment at UO has been up though, as their budget had a substantial increase last year.
The one division that has seen major layoffs over their years has been marketing, although there is a fine line between being "laid off" and being fired. The latest round of "lay offs" in marketing was really more of a selective firing and overhaul of the staff so that they can create a good marketing campaign.
That's why the park is having such a struggle with getting people to visit. Which park would I rather visit, a park that was essentially a throw away designed to make stay another day, or a park that was built to stand among the very best in the world designed by the most talented people in the industry? Hmm...
>>>IOA was built for the same reason<<<
No it wasn't. IOA was built to be the centerpiece of the Universal Orlando resort, a very far cry from being a throwaway to keep people at Universal (although AK's original plans called for the park to be much more than that, and there is still a sign of that in the park now- Killiminjaro Safari). It was also built to help Universal stand on their own in the industry, to prove that Disney was no longer owned the theme park industry. IOA has been a stunning success in that regard, and like it or not, it is the crown jewel of the Universal theme park empire. Something tells me that Animal Kingdom will probably never be regarded as a GREAT theme park like Islands of Adventure, Disney Sea, and Disneyland Paris are.
>>>the lion's share of UO's guests still build Universal / IOA into a Disney vacation<<<
Not really. Over a 1/3 of Universal's guests are staying on Universal property for the duration of their visit, and even more are leaving Disney out of their vacation in favor of parks like Sea World and the the tourist traps- er, attractions on I-Drive. BTW, Sea World had a near record year last year.
>>>Universal's had their share of layoffs too, particularly in entertainment.<<<
Entertainment is really kind of a wash. They've had layoffs, but they have been replaced by other acts in the park, only to have those acts canned to be replaced by different acts. The overall direction of entertainment at UO has been up though, as their budget had a substantial increase last year.
The one division that has seen major layoffs over their years has been marketing, although there is a fine line between being "laid off" and being fired. The latest round of "lay offs" in marketing was really more of a selective firing and overhaul of the staff so that they can create a good marketing campaign.
doubletrouble_vb
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Why persist in defending Disney against Universal? Disney provides one type of experience and Universal provides another.
The problem...and there is a problem...is that Disney has cash-cowed the Orlando parks to death. On a personal level my plans used to call for me to go to Disney every year. They have now altered to be Disney every other year...maybe...regardless of whether or not I'm staying on site (most likely not staying on site). That's because Disney isn't putting in enough of an effort at new stuff to draw me to the parks.
I've done USF/IOA this year (2003) and will do another non-Disney year next year...probably Sea World/Busch Gardens/Daytona or Kennedy Center/Daytona/Vero Beach. If life is good I might crack and do the 2004 Food & Wine...but that will still be a 2 year layoff. The why is the lack of anything new done in Disney style...I don't need to go to Disney for thrill rides...I go there for the fantasy. The only new fantasy to be had is in the themed weeks (F&W, F&G, MNSSHP etc).
The problem...and there is a problem...is that Disney has cash-cowed the Orlando parks to death. On a personal level my plans used to call for me to go to Disney every year. They have now altered to be Disney every other year...maybe...regardless of whether or not I'm staying on site (most likely not staying on site). That's because Disney isn't putting in enough of an effort at new stuff to draw me to the parks.
I've done USF/IOA this year (2003) and will do another non-Disney year next year...probably Sea World/Busch Gardens/Daytona or Kennedy Center/Daytona/Vero Beach. If life is good I might crack and do the 2004 Food & Wine...but that will still be a 2 year layoff. The why is the lack of anything new done in Disney style...I don't need to go to Disney for thrill rides...I go there for the fantasy. The only new fantasy to be had is in the themed weeks (F&W, F&G, MNSSHP etc).
freediverdude
Was very touched by the Tapestry of Dreams parade
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Since AK is beating both US and IOA in attendance figures (source: Amusement Business, 2002 park attendance figures), I would think Univeral fans would have a hard time saying that Disney is having a hard time getting people to visit. The Animal Kingdom was definitely NOT made as throwaway park. It took many years to build, and craftsmen were brought in from all over the world to make all the detail that's evident in everything in the park, from the sidewalks to the lanterns, to the buildings. The Animal Kingdom was originally planned to open in stages, as has happened. Disney is in the business of providing themed experiences, often partly educational, not just naked thrill rides, and I think the attendance figures show that more people enjoy that than they do just the plain roller coasters. The Universal parks are basically beefed up and elaborate versions of six flags type parks. Disney is on a completely different level. I don't think Disney has anything to worry about.
>>>I would think Univeral fans would have a hard time saying that Disney is having a hard time getting people to visit.<<<
Really? All of Universal's parks are now on the rise in attendance, even the Studios in Florida which has had a rough time of it's own since IOA opened. That is a sharp contrast to Disney's parks, which are only "up" because it is such an easy comparison to the 9/11 quarters last year. And even with that working for them it is expected that attendance will fall back into the red after Spring Break (resort bookings have already done so). It is also a given that USF will surpass Animal Kingdom in attendance this year. In fact, it was surprising to a great many people that AB did not put USF ahead of AK this year, myself included.
>>>The Animal Kingdom was definitely NOT made as throwaway park. It took many years to build, and craftsmen were brought in from all over the world to make all the detail that's evident in everything in the park, from the sidewalks to the lanterns, to the buildings.<<<
The same excuses are made about DCA. It doesn't change the fact that both parks failed to do what they set out to do, with DCA being a catastrophic failure in addition to not fulfilling it's purpose.
>>>The Animal Kingdom was originally planned to open in stages, as has happened.<<<
So, when is Beastly Kingdom opening?
>>>Disney is in the business of providing themed experiences, often partly educational, not just naked thrill rides<<<
To borrow a quote from AV, you obviously have not visited Disney's California Adventure.
>>>The Universal parks are basically beefed up and elaborate versions of six flags type parks.<<<
That is a flat out lie, and an insult to the people like Steven Spielberg, Tom Williams, and the rest of the good people at Universal Creative who helped these parks become a reality.
>>>I don't think Disney has anything to worry about.<<<
Really? They are losing more and more market share to Universal and Anheuser-Busch every day.
Really? All of Universal's parks are now on the rise in attendance, even the Studios in Florida which has had a rough time of it's own since IOA opened. That is a sharp contrast to Disney's parks, which are only "up" because it is such an easy comparison to the 9/11 quarters last year. And even with that working for them it is expected that attendance will fall back into the red after Spring Break (resort bookings have already done so). It is also a given that USF will surpass Animal Kingdom in attendance this year. In fact, it was surprising to a great many people that AB did not put USF ahead of AK this year, myself included.
>>>The Animal Kingdom was definitely NOT made as throwaway park. It took many years to build, and craftsmen were brought in from all over the world to make all the detail that's evident in everything in the park, from the sidewalks to the lanterns, to the buildings.<<<
The same excuses are made about DCA. It doesn't change the fact that both parks failed to do what they set out to do, with DCA being a catastrophic failure in addition to not fulfilling it's purpose.
>>>The Animal Kingdom was originally planned to open in stages, as has happened.<<<
So, when is Beastly Kingdom opening?
>>>Disney is in the business of providing themed experiences, often partly educational, not just naked thrill rides<<<
To borrow a quote from AV, you obviously have not visited Disney's California Adventure.
>>>The Universal parks are basically beefed up and elaborate versions of six flags type parks.<<<
That is a flat out lie, and an insult to the people like Steven Spielberg, Tom Williams, and the rest of the good people at Universal Creative who helped these parks become a reality.
>>>I don't think Disney has anything to worry about.<<<
Really? They are losing more and more market share to Universal and Anheuser-Busch every day.
freediverdude
Was very touched by the Tapestry of Dreams parade
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Well coming from someone who's jumping for joy that Disney's lowest attended theme park in Florida might fall slightly behind Universal's highest attended theme park this year, I think my statement still stands for itself- "Disney has nothing to worry about." When Universal can pull in 14-16 million visitors into one theme park in one year, instead of 7-8 million, then come back and we'll talk. In fact, the Sea World/Busch parks actually have more in common with Disney than Universal does, as they also focus some on education, taking care of the environment/wildlife, and fun for the whole family, instead of just thrill, wow, and glamour. Thrill, wow, and glamour are fine for the people who like that, but as shown by the attendance figures, I don't think as many people like that as the complete experience offered by Disney.
>>>When Universal can pull in 14-16 million visitors into one theme park in one year, instead of 7-8 million, then come back and we'll talk.<<<
Well, considering that no Disney park in the world is pulling 16 million people a year anymore, that is not really an accurate comparison. BTW, Universal Studios Japan did pull 11 million people in it's first year (the 2002 numbers will be lower thanks to the traditional 2nd year slump and a load of scandals that hit the park, some based on reality and some created to cut down the reputation of the park), which was higher than any other non-Magic Kingdom park in the world. Obviously Tokyo Disney Sea has taken that spot, but that's not all that surprising. Hell, it's Disney Sea.
As far as Universal only pulling 7 to 8 million a year to their parks, well...
NEWSFLASH!!! All of Disney's parks that aren't variants on the Magic Kingdom theme (and by extention Disney Sea) are only getting 7 to 8 million a year and some of them getting far, far less than that.
>>>Thrill, wow, and glamour are fine for the people who like that, but as shown by the attendance figures<<<
You mean the same figures that have Disney's parks plummeting downward as Universal's parks increase?
Well, considering that no Disney park in the world is pulling 16 million people a year anymore, that is not really an accurate comparison. BTW, Universal Studios Japan did pull 11 million people in it's first year (the 2002 numbers will be lower thanks to the traditional 2nd year slump and a load of scandals that hit the park, some based on reality and some created to cut down the reputation of the park), which was higher than any other non-Magic Kingdom park in the world. Obviously Tokyo Disney Sea has taken that spot, but that's not all that surprising. Hell, it's Disney Sea.
As far as Universal only pulling 7 to 8 million a year to their parks, well...
NEWSFLASH!!! All of Disney's parks that aren't variants on the Magic Kingdom theme (and by extention Disney Sea) are only getting 7 to 8 million a year and some of them getting far, far less than that.
>>>Thrill, wow, and glamour are fine for the people who like that, but as shown by the attendance figures<<<
You mean the same figures that have Disney's parks plummeting downward as Universal's parks increase?
freediverdude
Was very touched by the Tapestry of Dreams parade
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I'm sorry, but some of your figures, or claims of comparison figures, are fictitious. Go back and recheck the facts. I think my only, and last, answer to a thread like this is what my interactive Stitch plush likes to say to me, "WHAT--ever!" Have a Disney day!
WDSearcher
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According to Amusement Business, which is the trade publication for amusement and theme parks, following are the estimated attendance figures for Disney and Universal parks for 2002. Note that all numbers are estimates, as neither Disney nor Universal releases exact attendance figures.
DISNEY
WDW Magic Kingdom -- 14,044,800
Tokyo Disneyland -- 13,000,000
Disneyland -- 12,720,500
Tokyo DisneySea -- 12,000,000
Disneyland Paris -- 10,300,000
Epcot -- 8,289,200
Disney-MGM Studios -- 8,031,360
Disney's Animal Kingdom -- 7,305,586
Disney's California Adventure -- 4,700,000
Disney Studios Paris (opened March 2002) -- 2,800,000
UNIVERSAL
Universal Studios Japan -- 8,010,000
Universal Studios at Universal Orlando -- 6,852,600
Islands of Adventure -- 6,072,000
Universal Studios Hollywood -- 5,200,000
So, as you can see, Magic Kingdom is doing more than twice the business IOA is bringing in, and even the lowly Animal Kingdom is racking up more guests than the Universal thrill park. Tokyo Disneyland is several thousand above USJ. Disneyland beats out USH by a mile. And even California Adventure isn't as far behind Universal Hollywood as you'd think, based on all the press about low attendance. Islands of Adventure didn't even beat out it's sister park, Universal Studios, in attendance last year.
The only Disney park getting "far, far less" than the 7 or 8 million attendance is DCA, which has been true since opening. And, of course, Disney Studios Paris, which has only a partial year to go by.
I'd love to know which Universal Japan scandals were "created to cut down the reputation of the park," and what evidence you have that that's true. Everything that I've seen reported -- fireworks problems, food problems, water irregularities -- seemed pretty well documented.
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