Moms who don't vaccinate or selectively vaccinate, .........

[npmommie]

how do you handle a less than supportive doc?
my pediatrician gave me sooooo much grief today for declining the chickenpox booster shot.
both my kids did have 1 chickenpox vaccine, which I wish now that I didn't do.........and now they are recommending a second shot.
so i refused it. she put pressure on me,
we homeschool and she also gives off an attitude about that, really questioning me about it, what we are doing, are the kids in social situations, yada yada, that annoys me too, but thats another thread.

 

[livndisney]

how do you handle a less than supportive doc?
my pediatrician gave me sooooo much grief today for declining the chickenpox booster shot.
both my kids did have 1 chickenpox vaccine, which I wish now that I didn't do.........and now they are recommending a second shot.
so i refused it. she put pressure on me,
we homeschool and she also gives off an attitude about that, really questioning me about it, what we are doing, are the kids in social situations, yada yada, that annoys me too, but thats another thread.

Not to hijack the thread-but what IS with the second shot? I had a DR's office INSIST my child get the shot or they would not release medical records to me.

 

[peytonsmomie]

I can understand your doctor's concerns. Exposure to a child who hadn't been vaccinated led to an illness that nearly killed my youngest child. It's particularly troubling as science has debunked the anti-vaccine arguments time and time again. The only understandable reason to not vaccinate, in my opinion, is for religious beliefs.

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/Germs/wireStory?id=5626208

According to this article number of measles cases in the US is at its highest level since 1997 - with nearly half of those cases involving children whose parents rejected vaccinations.

Of 131 cases so far this year, “122 were unvaccinated or had unknown vaccination status.” In 63 of those unvaccinated cases, the patients or the parents refused vaccination.

The article also states that “childhood vaccination rates for measles continue to exceed 92 percent” in this country. So … the unvaccinated 8 percent of children caused at least 48% (63 “refusers” divided by 131 cases) … and possibly as high as 93% (121 unknown immunization status divided by 131 cases) of all the measles cases in the United States this year.

 

[lil mermaid]

OP, the only thing that you can do is get another pediatrician. Most pediatricians feel very strongly about protecting their patients against potentially deadly diseases, so it is unlikely that she will let up.

 

[Mouse House Mama]

I would change peds if I had to fight with them about everything. On that note why not get titers done to see if your child has an immunity?

 

[mjmoon]

They are asking for the booster now because they have found that just one dose doesn't always create complete immunity. The chicken pox is generally a mild illness in young children but can have serious complications. And even if it doesn't have complications for a healthy child, it can be deadly when exposed to immunodeficient children, adults and elderly people. The same goes for most of the other diseases children are vaccinated for.

I read a lot about this when I was pregnant with my first child and ultimately decided that I would definitely vaccinate my children. The risk to their health by not vaccinating, IMO, outweighed the astronomically low chance of them having a reaction to the vaccine.

It's also a matter of protecting those around us. Vaccines don't only protect the children that we vaccinate. They also protect our grandparents, our neighbor that may be going through chemotherapy, the child in the grocery store who is immunodeficient, and so on..

In the end I know we all do what is right for our children. But in this process I believe we need to have some community awareness. I believe that we need to see beyond our own life and consider those around us when making these decisions.

 

[princessmom29]

They are asking for the booster now because they have found that just one dose doesn't always create complete immunity. The chicken pox is generally a mild illness in young children but can have serious complications. And even if it doesn't have complications for a healthy child, it can be deadly when exposed to immunodeficient children, adults and elderly people. The same goes for most of the other diseases children are vaccinated for.

I read a lot about this when I was pregnant with my first child and ultimately decided that I would definitely vaccinate my children. The risk to their health by not vaccinating, IMO, outweighed the astronomically low chance of them having a reaction to the vaccine.

It's also a matter of protecting those around us. Vaccines don't only protect the children that we vaccinate. They also protect our grandparents, our neighbor that may be going through chemotherapy, the child in the grocery store who is immunodeficient, and so on..

In the end I know we all do what is right for our children. But in this process I believe we need to have some community awareness. I believe that we need to see beyond our own life and consider those around us when making these decisions.

This is exactly my argument. The socially responsible thing to do is get your kids vaccinated. It think that it irresponsible and potentally deadly to let a child go unvaccinated. I know others will argue that vaccines are dangerous and have side effects, but as a scientist when I look at the statistics I llike my chances much better with the vaccine.

 

[RobinFabulous]

Well, apparently I'm in the minority here. I fully vaccinated my oldest, then along came my middle child who is Autistic. Do I believe vaccines caused his problems? No, but I think they aggravated them. With my youngest I selectively vaccinated. My peditrician is very supportive and willing to break the shots up or put them off due to illnes or whatnot. Again, I think everyone needs to make an informed choice, but this is what we've choosen.

 

[DisneyDreams4P&B]

To OP,

We have 2 sons who are on the autism spectrum (ASD), my sisters 2 children (boy & girl) are on the spectrum as well. We had same upbringing, OB/GYN, husbands in Marine Corp, peditrician, etc. so nothing to pinpoint why our children had ASD, we figured it might be something in our genetics that was being triggered. When our daughter was born, we took as much off the table as possible, delayed shots, organic food, DHA the works. We were lucky enough to find a doctor who was sympathic to our plight and he agreed to delay certain shots and to break up the "combo" shots. So far (praise God and knock on wood) at 17 months she is showing no signs of ASD (with the exception that she is not talking alot but they are attributing that to 3rd child syndrome - everyone talking for her). She has been tested from birth and has always been on or above target.

I have done a great deal of research about the amount of shots our children get and it's my personal conclusion, that it is way too many. I do however also see that it is my responsibility to keep not only my children safe, but others as well. We have not gone back to church since she did not receive her complete rounds of shots (MMR), we do not put her in Mothers Morning Out programs, nor do we take them to public playgrounds etc. I am almost insane about bleaching and disinfecting everything down. I share our daughters delayed shot information to everyone our children come in contact with (school, friends) and make sure that they know what could happen.

I would find a doctor who agrees with your decisions regarding your child but I would also hope that you take what means are necessary to protect others as well.

For the poster who said that they felt the only reason not to give shots was for religious reasons, I feel for your situation with your child, but ASD has ravaged our family and when we found ourselves unexpectantly pregnant with our 3rd child, we are/did everything we possibly can to see that our daughter does not share her brothers/cousins fate.

 

[Belle72]

I break up the shots- my pediatrician is OK with it. BUT I have had drug companies call to let me know I'm behind!

If you've always been happy with your ped before this I would just explain my reasons once, and leave it at that. If it becomes a problem look into switching.

 

[bumbershoot]

Find another.

In WA we can use an ND as our primary person, so we do. She did end up offering a few vaccines, b/c she was losing patients who wanted to go to her but also wanted a few vaxes, but all she ever did was ask if we were vaxing on that visit and when we said "no" she'd check off the box and move along.



For those who feel it's socially responsible, you might want to research the actual way vaccines work. Many of them do not prevent transmission. None of them are 100%.

Taking the pertussis one for example, it ONLY prevents the cough, b/c the cough is caused by a toxoid the bacteria makes (the vaccine has the toxoid in it)...you can still get the sickness, but you probably won't have the cough, so you won't be diagnosed, you'll think it's just a cold, and you will pass it along, b/c it doesn't prevent transmission. So it's absolutely useless. And then they like to give antibiotics, when abx have been proven to LENGTHEN the time you're sick with pertussis.

It's all nutty I tell you, nutty.

 

[debster812]

Find another.

In WA we can use an ND as our primary person, so we do. She did end up offering a few vaccines, b/c she was losing patients who wanted to go to her but also wanted a few vaxes, but all she ever did was ask if we were vaxing on that visit and when we said "no" she'd check off the box and move along.



For those who feel it's socially responsible, you might want to research the actual way vaccines work. Many of them do not prevent transmission. None of them are 100%.

Taking the pertussis one for example, it ONLY prevents the cough, b/c the cough is caused by a toxoid the bacteria makes (the vaccine has the toxoid in it)...you can still get the sickness, but you probably won't have the cough, so you won't be diagnosed, you'll think it's just a cold, and you will pass it along, b/c it doesn't prevent transmission. So it's absolutely useless. And then they like to give antibiotics, when abx have been proven to LENGTHEN the time you're sick with pertussis.

It's all nutty I tell you, nutty.

I really wish you'd stop insulting vaccines and those of us who choose to vaccinate. I do not agree with choosing to not have any vaccinations, but I would NEVER tell someone that they were nutty, or ridiculous (as you've done in other threads)

OP--My son is 11, and is fully vaccinated. In hindsight, I do wish I had broken up some of the big combination ones, but as they say, hindsight is 20/20. At his 11 year old checkup, he got his tetanus booster, and we were offered the meningitis vaccine as well. We had a nice, long conversation with the PNP and the doctor, and we all agreed to wait on that vaccine until he's 13 or so.

It sounds like your doctor is less than supportive of what you want to do, so I agree with other posters that you should probably start looking for a new caregiver, who will work with you, and what you feel is best for your child.

Good luck.

 

[dis-happy]

I selectively vaccinate and there is one ped. in my practice whom I LOVE and she is very understanding about my thoughts on the matter. As a result, I trust her too. When she suggested my baby get a certain vaccination last year (I let her pick one) she told me her reasons and we did it.

Anyway, I can add one thing (and this argument has helped me deal with less than understanding doctors): I've been having babies for 18 years now and I've seen things come and seen things go.

When my oldest was smaller I had to switch peds in order to have her get an injectible polio shot (and the ped I switched from actually yelled at me when I inquired if it wouldn't be safer, he went into a tirade about Diane Sawyer scaring everyone). Well, lo and behold, guess what the new and safer standard is for polio shots, just a few years later?

When my no. 2 child was younger, our state was about to make the rotovirus vaccine mandatory. Until a month later when it was pulled off the market abruptly due to kids being killed from--getting bowel obstructions. I discussed this with a good doctor I had a couple of years later and he said that for 3rd world countries it was a useful vaccine, but here in the states kids don't die from rotovirus (due to access to better medical care) and they really didn't need to have it on the schedule. I now notice a "new and improved" version has since made a comeback, but as far as I can tell it's not mandatory.

Needless to say, I take things with a grain of salt. Don't even get me going on the tale of the nurse who came into my room 12 hours after my firstborn was born, and yelled at me to NEVER place my baby on her back, she could spit up and aspirate and choke to death. I was a new mom and she scared me to death. Thankfully I'm now past the SIDS stage with my 16 month old.

 

[LittleMissMagic]

Pfff.... now don't attack me, but I think pediatricians recommend a lot of worthless vaccines. I've been having to take these cervical cancer vaccines (like the most painful shot), but imo there's really no proof that they work, considering that they "prevent" it. What if you weren't going to get cervical cancer, anyway? How do you know that it was the shot that made you not get it? I know, I know.... better safe than sorry. But I personally think it's a waste of my parents' money. They won't give in, though.... I'm a wimp when it comes to seemingly unnecessary shots.

However, we don't do flu shots, and she doesn't give us any grief about that. Like others have said, consider switching practices.

(I really don't blame you for not wanting the chicken pox vaccine if your kids are rather young... I mean, chicken pox is a one-time happening that most of us have gone through. However, chicken pox is supposedly worse once you get older, so once they hit middle school, you might want to consider following up..... if necessary.)

 

[peytonsmomie]

If your doctor isn't working with you (or is actively working against you) then obviously you need to find another provider.

That said, The Center For Disease Control has released scientific evidence that there is not a causal link between vaccines (even those containing themerisol) and autism.

I'm no expert, and I'm no doctor, but it seems as like junk science to cleave to consistently disproved information. For the poster who has several children who test on the spectrum and 1 who at present does not, you mentioned many changes to your family's lifestyle that could have affected your child's not developing austism. However, there's nothing conclusive that proves vaccines cause autism (or exacerbate it). Yet there's centuries of compelling historical and scientific documentation as to the horrible effects of many illnesses we are able to vaccine against modernly.

To me it seems as though until science and medicine can prove conclusively that there is a causal link between vaccines and autism, then it is irresponsible to refuse the primary vaccines (flu shots, chicken pox vaccines, gardasil etc excluded).

You say you keep your daughter out of social situations, what about disney? If your daughter is a carrier of measles, and my child comes along and rides the carousel after her, my child could become infected and possibly face dire consequences.

ETA, here's the link to the CDC where they refute any causal connection between vaccines and autism. http://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/concerns/thimerosal.htm

 

[ilandrazdsw]

To OP,

We have 2 sons who are on the autism spectrum (ASD), my sisters 2 children (boy & girl) are on the spectrum as well. We had same upbringing, OB/GYN, husbands in Marine Corp, peditrician, etc. so nothing to pinpoint why our children had ASD, we figured it might be something in our genetics that was being triggered. When our daughter was born, we took as much off the table as possible, delayed shots, organic food, DHA the works. We were lucky enough to find a doctor who was sympathic to our plight and he agreed to delay certain shots and to break up the "combo" shots. So far (praise God and knock on wood) at 17 months she is showing no signs of ASD (with the exception that she is not talking alot but they are attributing that to 3rd child syndrome - everyone talking for her). She has been tested from birth and has always been on or above target.

I have done a great deal of research about the amount of shots our children get and it's my personal conclusion, that it is way too many. I do however also see that it is my responsibility to keep not only my children safe, but others as well. We have not gone back to church since she did not receive her complete rounds of shots (MMR), we do not put her in Mothers Morning Out programs, nor do we take them to public playgrounds etc. I am almost insane about bleaching and disinfecting everything down. I share our daughters delayed shot information to everyone our children come in contact with (school, friends) and make sure that they know what could happen.

I would find a doctor who agrees with your decisions regarding your child but I would also hope that you take what means are necessary to protect others as well.

For the poster who said that they felt the only reason not to give shots was for religious reasons, I feel for your situation with your child, but ASD has ravaged our family and when we found ourselves unexpectantly pregnant with our 3rd child, we are/did everything we possibly can to see that our daughter does not share her brothers/cousins fate.

I find this interesting. Thank you for sharing you story.

OTish: I know 2 families who have children with autism. One family has 2 boys both autistic (disgnosed later than sooner) and the other has 3 boys, one austict. The families are related as second cousins. The mother of the one autistic child saw the signs very early and refused to accept other peoples' suggestions that it was because he was the third. Due to her feelings (and seeing signs of autism in other children) the child was diagnosed and able to begin therapy and is doing very well.
Has any new research come about in linking autism with genetics?

 

[MickeyMomOfThree]

Personally, all 3 of my kids get all their vaccines (including a flu shot every year. I can't imagine not giving them.

BUT, if I ever felt like my pedetrician was not on the same page as me, I'd fine a new one. Our pedetrician is wonderful, I respect him and trust him fully. The relationship we have with him is valued as one of the most important in our lives. We had a different doctor before and while he was a perfectly fine doctor, I did not have what I was looking for in him and I went in search of "it", when I found this doctor 12 years ago I knew he was the right one and have been happy with him since. It is so important to have someone you trust.

 

[DisneyDreams4P&B]

You say you keep your daughter out of social situations, what about disney? If your daughter is a carrier of measles, and my child comes along and rides the carousel after her, my child could become infected and possibly face dire consequences.

ETA, here's the link to the CDC where they refute any causal connection between vaccines and autism. http://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/concerns/thimerosal.htm

My daughter will be 2 then and as is our plan with the doctor, she will have her vaccines by then, as I said, we are on a delayed, not refusal.

BTW, I would not trust the CDC with anything... The test that they cling to as proof was done by a drug company..mmm. might they have an agenda for wanting to see results that are of a positive outcome to them?

I did not mention any changed to my families lifestyle. I noted that there were no differentials between my sister and myself. I am sure that if you had a special needs child, let alone 2, you would have a very different tune.

 

[Mouse House Mama]

My daughter will be 2 then and as is our plan with the doctor, she will have her vaccines by then, as I said, we are on a delayed, not refusal.

BTW, I would not trust the CDC with anything... The test that they cling to as proof was done by a drug company..mmm. might they have an agenda for wanting to see results that are of a positive outcome to them?

I did not mention any changed to my families lifestyle. I noted that there were no differentials between my sister and myself. I am sure that if you had a special needs child, let alone 2, you would have a very different tune.

One of our doctors used to work for the CDC. I too agree with you about those tests. They are funded by drug companies. There are many tests out there that the data is not really positive. They just put a postive spin on it like that Gardisil vaccine for instance. It really hasn't been thoroughly tested.

Disney Dreams, I did want to let you know that Merck is no longer making the mmr in separate components. So if you are looking to separate the shot (as I have tried to do) ask your doctor if they have any in stock because they will no longer be able to get it that way.

 

[peytonsmomie]

I did not say I don't have a special needs child. My youngest had many medical issues as a young child, as well as some delays which required speech therapy. Fortunately, the medical condition which affected him was resolved and the speech therapy was successful.

The lifestyle changes I meant were your inclusion of DHA, and the use of organic foods. Sorry that I wasn't clear.

I am totally on board with vaccine delays, and spacing them out. I think that's a very valid compromise that can easily put everyone on a solid middle ground. I hope you don't feel as though I was attacking your choices or parenting because that was totally not my intent.

There is a movement local to me to completely forgo vaccination, and as a parent of a child who has been medically fragile, and being currently in a high risk pregnancy, I get so nervous and frustrated. It's so scary to think that you may be exposed to death as you send your child to school, or pick up a toy in the toy aisle at target.