Membership Magic Beyond

[havoc315]

So it's not for you. That's okay.

List the amenities of a dvc stay that you don't access yet included in your AF and buyin.

Do that with your park entry. Tick off all the attractions and interactions that you don't use, but did indeed pay for.

That may put it into perspective

Many do feel $99 is reasonable for the varying reasons that may fit them.

To each their own. You don't value the benefits. And that's okay

That’s the point. Designing a program like this, there should be a broad diverse set of benefits, where you’re not pulling out a calculator every year to determine whether it’s worth it.

I automatically renew Amazon prime each year, because I’m confident I get enough value of Prime TV, expedited prime delivery, etc.

 

[ShablamE]

Forgive me if I've missed the question/answer in the thread and I don't seem to see it within the MMB info. What is the validity for the discounted 5 day ticket? Clearly it's not 5 consecutive days as they will sell you one that begins on a Thursday.

Also am I the only one that wishes that within DVC terms a weekend meant the same thing. For bookings weekend rates apply to Friday and Saturday but looking at the terms on these tickets they appear to indicate weekends are Saturday and Sunday.

 

[havoc315]

Forgive me if I've missed the question/answer in the thread and I don't seem to see it within the MMB info. What is the validity for the discounted 5 day ticket? Clearly it's not 5 consecutive days as they will sell you one that begins on a Thursday.

Also am I the only one that wishes that within DVC terms a weekend meant the same thing. For bookings weekend rates apply to Friday and Saturday but looking at the terms on these tickets they appear to indicate weekends are Saturday and Sunday.

They do not need to be used on consecutive days but must be used over an 8 day window.

 

[ShablamE]

They do not need to be used on consecutive days but must be used over an 8 day window.

Yep thank you just found that in the T&C "expire eight (8) days from the start date selected"

 

[Cyberc1978]

The bottom line is pretty simple: Nothing Disney does is designed to reduce their profit. So, on average, most Members will not save money with this.

This reminds me of the Dining Plan. If you work all the angles, you can end up spending less than menu price on your food. But, almost no one eats that way if they just order what they want, when they want it. It is an upsell in disguise.

There are a very small handful of people for whom the Dining Plan genuinely saves them money. They are rare as hen's teeth. Many more people have convinced themselves that they are saving money--because of the menu price thing.

Yeah I think you may come out ahead if you buy the most expensive items on the menu. Who does that? No one except if you REALLY have to.

This new program will be a new income stream for DVC and if a lot of ppl buy it, price will go up and maybe more items will be added.

 

[WinterSolider]

Ahh, yes. But I’ve never had to buy one-time use points.

If you book at the 7 month window, you should always use one-time-use-points even if you don't "need" them, even before this offer. It's a huge value for members that amounts to roughly a 50% discount off of rack rate.

Priority:
1. Banked (or already-borrowed) points
2. One-time-use points
3. Current points
4. Borrow points

 

[MerlinandtheMouse]

This new program will be a new income stream for DVC and if a lot of ppl buy it, price will go up and maybe more items will be added.

Oh most assuredly the price will increase year over year, but hopefully there will be increased benefits to bring enough value.

They did say there might be more additions as the year goes on, and so far, they added extra lounge hours for those with MMB which wasn’t originally announced, so that’s nice. I’m hoping one or two more little additions to make it that bit more special, but I’m pretty content with the current offerings.

 

[havoc315]

If you book at the 7 month window, you should always use one-time-use-points even if you don't "need" them, even before this offer.

Why? That would just leave me with. Handful of points that would eventually expire. And not easy to rent out just a handful of points. Then again, I’ve rarely booked at 7 months. I do 11 months 90% of the time.
Am I missing something?

It's a huge value for members that amounts to roughly a 50% discount off of rack rate.

Priority:
1. Banked (or already-borrowed) points
2. One-time-use points
3. Current points
4. Borrow points

 

[WinterSolider]

The bottom line is pretty simple: Nothing Disney does is designed to reduce their profit. So, on average, most Members will not save money with this.

Objection: Conclusion does not follow from the premise.

"This program increases Disney's profit" and "most members save money by joining this program" can both be true.

Assume arguendo that every person who buys this gets more than $99 worth of benefit. Disney will still be happy with that if the program induces people to buy passes or OTUP or other things that they might otherwise not have. It's not necessarily the case that the average member has to get less than $99 worth of value from the program for the program to be profitable.

 

[Sandisw]

Ahh, yes. But I’ve never had to buy one-time use points.

So again, $0 benefit for me.

Do most members really buy extra points on a regular basis?

The hodgepodge of benefits really makes it seem like you need to evaluate each year whether it will be a benefit that year. Planning a trip to Disneyland or WDW during time frames when you get a good ticket discount… a year where you need 24 OTUP… on those given years, a good value.

Travel during holidays… don’t need extra points… it’s nearly worthless.

It is certainly a program that will provide different value to different owners

For some, it isn’t worth it at all, But for others, the benefits make it worth it. I agree it will be a year to year decision because we know price goes up with everything.

But, I always buy the $99 memory maker with my AP…it does give me access for the year, but don’t really need it every trip. Now, I’ll get it for one or two trips when I am with family and friends and not solo. So, I’ll be spending the same $99 I always do.

However, I unlock the ability to use 65 points to renew my AP…since my travel to WDW in 2025 is going to be less than this year, plenty of points to trade…and I am fine with value I am getting per point to do this…because renting is not worth the extra few dollars per point I’d gain. This trade allows me to keep $1k of my mo eh which I ca. now use for food and drinks instead.

While I don’t normally buy OTU points, for $10/point it’s cheaper if something comes up and I decide to do it, especially if my kids decide they want an extra trip or something and it saves me from borrowing.

The 5 day ticket deal will work for next fall for my DH who won’t want to renew his AP…since that will be the only trip…while not a lot of savings, it’s some and I can use my discounted Disney GCi can get.

So, for me, it’s a great program and well worth the upfront $99 fee. Will it always be? Who knows but for 2025x I’ll take it.

I am happy that DVC is working at doing more for owners and while we could always find ways to say it should be more, I consider any option that can potentially save me money a good thing.

 

[WinterSolider]

Why? That would just leave me with. Handful of points that would eventually expire. And not easy to rent out just a handful of points. Then again, I’ve rarely booked at 7 months. I do 11 months 90% of the time.
Am I missing something?

Pretend you have 150 points and you typically use exactly 150 points. Adding OTUP will get you another whole trip every ~6 years for less than $3,000 (worth $6,000 rack rate).

Year 1: Spend 126 current points plus 24 OTUP, bank 24 points.
Year 2: Spend 24 banked points, 102 current points, 24 OTUP, bank 48 points.
Year 3: Spend 48 banked points, 78 current points, 24 OTUP, bank 72 points.

And so on.

But you're right that if you're a heavy 11-month user, this won't work.

 

[eticketplease]

Why? That would just leave me with. Handful of points that would eventually expire. And not easy to rent out just a handful of points. Then again, I’ve rarely booked at 7 months. I do 11 months 90% of the time.
Am I missing something?

If you are booking at 11 months out then the OTUP aren't going to do you much.

I really only book 11 months out for F&W but other trips are 7 months out as I like to stay at different resorts when I can knowing that I can always stay at one of my home resorts if I can't switch.

If I can grab something and use OTUP I can then bank the points that have the 11 month advantage to the next year for a longer stay or to upgrade from a 1 bedroom to a 2 bedroom without as much as a hit.

 

[havoc315]

The bottom line is pretty simple: Nothing Disney does is designed to reduce their profit. So, on average, most Members will not save money with this.

Yes, 100%. But there are sometimes things that actually are mutually beneficial.

DVC being an example — buying DVC can save people money on vacation (though not as much as often advertised), while also increasing profits for Disney.

The old TIW card was a good example of mutual benefit.

And certainly, there are things you can give at almost no cost, that have immense subjective value.

For example, used to be at parties — DVC members got earlier entry than regular party ticket holders.

One free thing they easily could have offered: room upgrades when available. Costs nothing, if there is availability.

There are plenty of low cost things you can do to create subjective value.

This reminds me of the Dining Plan. If you work all the angles, you can end up spending less than menu price on your food. But, almost no one eats that way if they just order what they want, when they want it. It is an upsell in disguise.

There are a very small handful of people for whom the Dining Plan genuinely saves them money. They are rare as hen's teeth. Many more people have convinced themselves that they are saving money--because of the menu price thing.

Go back 10-15 years… the dining plan was $30-40… The math didn’t come down to pennies. Most people would realize at least some savings.

 

[havoc315]

Pretend you have 150 points and you typically use exactly 150 points. Adding OTUP will get you another whole trip every ~6 years for less than $3,000 (worth $6,000 rack rate).

Year 1: Spend 126 current points plus 24 OTUP, bank 24 points.
Year 2: Spend 24 banked points, 102 current points, 24 OTUP, bank 48 points.
Year 3: Spend 48 banked points, 78 current points, 24 OTUP, bank 72 points.

And so on.

But you're right that if you're a heavy 11-month user, this won't work.

Ok. That’s helpful explanation. But yeah… irrelevant to me. I only do a 7-month trip once every 3-5 years.
And I use fewer points than I own most years.

 

[Brian Noble]

When DDP was originally designed as part of Destination Disney (together with ME and the current MYW ticket structure) it was designed as a way to monopolize an Orlando visitor's time and money. That did not last very long at all.

 

[broncofan]

I am impressed with what Disney decided to do on the AP pricing. I expected them to go high where the value would be close to the annual dues cost - more like 95 per pass. 75 makes it a pretty decent value, and I think a better business decision for Disney.

At that level it may induce some members to consider adding on so they have enough points to consistently use points for AP (although that’s a risky proposition since there’s no guarantee about what happens to this perk in the future). It should also mean they have less need to buy back and hold contracts to sell pricey cash reservations for the resorts, as at 75 for a new pass and 65 for a renewal I think they’ll do a brisk business in passes for points…

All around I think this looks like a win win for Disney and their biggest fans. Hope there is more of that to come!

 

[Genie+]

Members who already spend on photopass, character meals, OTUP, etc are not really increasing their budget to add MMB at $99. It also responds to resentment some members have had about exploding ticket/AP pricing, as this offers some new options. It’s basically a reward program for members regularly buying extra sparkles and enchantments. I think it’s geared on reducing dissatisfaction and potholes for those who enjoy buying extras, because MMB will start them from a place of better value. If our Storybook Dining didn’t go as well as planned, but MMB had a few fun character meets, maybe I’ll have less regret about that ADR. If I spend $200 on photopass and a bunch of pictures were lost and we never found certain advertised special shots photographers, maybe it’s much less painful when it was included with my $99 MMB. That kind of thing. I think this is part of a a strategy to protect guest experience, especially where extra spending is concerned.

The payoff for DVC/Disney is people buying MMB are likely to engage even more. If the value proposition feels like it is improving, that can go a long way in adding that extra trip, or feeling more confident that extra spending will be worthwhile. Right now I imagine they are concerned that families will replace an entire WDW trip with UO/Epic. MMB could help reel some of those fish back so maybe they still do WDW even if they pop over to UO/Epic a few days.

 

[havoc315]

Objection: Conclusion does not follow from the premise.

"This program increases Disney's profit" and "most members save money by joining this program" can both be true.

At times. And often limited to just some people.

Where both sides benefit: because of a discount, you’re willing to give Disney a bit more business than you otherwise would have.
But you’re happy with the value you’re getting with that extra spending.

Basically — some perceived discount encourages me to splurge, but I’m quite happy with the splurge.

But in those cases, you didn’t actually save money — you may be happy, but you didn’t spend less than you otherwise would have.

People who were going to buy 24 OTUP no matter what, people who would automatically buy a 30 day memory maker anyway… They will “save.”

But for all these types of programs, they are designed to get more people to spend more money.
So it’s always a minority of people who actually “saved.” For most people, it’s getting extra at a supposed discount.

Assume arguendo that every person who buys this gets more than $99 worth of benefit. Disney will still be happy with that if the program induces people to buy passes or OTUP or other things that they might otherwise not have. It's not necessarily the case that the average member has to get less than $99 worth of value from the program for the program to be profitable.

It’s not that they got less than $99 value. It’s that they paid more than the real value they receive.

To get 24 OTUP, you still need to pay $240. If you wouldn’t have normally purchased OTUPs, then you’ve now given Disney $339 more revenue than they otherwise would have had.

If you would have purchased the points even at $480… then yes, you did save.
But the program is designed in the hope that you’re the minority. That most people are now buying points they wouldn’t have purchased before.
So the person who wouldn’t have paid $480 for OTUP? They just forked over an extra $339 to Disney.

 

[nalababybear]

That’s the point. Designing a program like this, there should be a broad diverse set of benefits, where you’re not pulling out a calculator every year to determine whether it’s worth it.

I automatically renew Amazon prime each year, because I’m confident I get enough value of Prime TV, expedited prime delivery, etc.

Just not broad enough for you. From the vast majority it seems there's something there that they will enjoy $99+ out of it.

Many do.voice the...what's next ane future pricing concern given the popularity and uptake of this new program

 

[thanxfornoticin]

So the Photopass perk that comes with MMB is only for a 30-day period beginning the first day of use during the calendar year of purchase? If we go back later in the same year (beyond 30 days), it would not be included?