Marvel coming to WDW???!!!!

[eXo]

I have to say, I like to have the Marvel characters walking around the Universal Parks, WDW never allows unhandled character interactions.

That's definitely a good point.

When visiting Universal last fall I popped into one of the gift shops (the generic Universal one at the Port of Entry in IOA), and after getting past the 2 tons of potter scarves and the such I came around the corner and found myself face to face with Spider-man. He was hanging out by himself by the Spider-man shirts and as soon as he saw me he jumped into conversation. The guy really impressed me. He had a great voice for the character, he was sharp, he didn't feel rehearsed, and overall it turned the experience of walking into a gift shop into something as memorable as the attractions.

I stumbled across Green Goblin and Dr. Doom later on that day and they were both funny as hell too. If there is one thing they totally get right at Marvel Island, its the characters.

My personal thought is that I am glad the contract favors Universal in this case. I think the allure to most folks of Disney suddenly having Marvel is what they might do with it. But there is absolutely no way we would get anything as "thrilling" as what currently exists or what could potentially exist at IOA.

If a Marvel ride/land ever opened at Disney I think we could expect a fairly impressive queue that tells an in depth back story that leads up to a ride that we all feel like we've been on before. That sounds a bit more negative than I'd like it to, but even rides like Tower of Terror (which are notable for their story and theming) ultimately boils down to a simple drop ride at the end (no matter how 'random' it might be). I often get the impression that the imagineers spend a lot more time thinking about the story and presentation of a ride over the ride itself. Is that something the general public would honestly want for Marvel?

To the point of Disney being happy to sit back and collect a paycheck on licensing, I think it is important to note that Disney is a multi-faceted company, and what one part of the company is happy to do... another may not. I say this because there has been activity within Marvel to devalue comics/characters that they don't own the movie rights too. Wolverine has been killed. Marvel is not allowed to create any new "mutant" characters (as Fox auto gets rights to them). They put the Fantastic Four on hiatus. Some argue this does nothing to devalue the properties and others argue it doesn't matter because anyone can come back from the dead or get a rebooted comic anyways. But those arguments don't change the fact that they have chosen to make these moves in the first place. I think the ban on creating new mutant characters stands as the chief policy that shows Disney/Marvel is, at the least, not interested in creating any value for Fox.
And there are heavy rumors that marvel may be heading towards one of those giant universe splits that they do so often. Where the go back and change the complete foundation of characters within the universe. In this case, the rumor is in this split mutants never existed. Instead, a somewhat obscure band of super powered folks known as The Inhumans rise to take their place. If they do indeed follow through with this, then essentially Fox has to come up with their own way to market these characters as they won't be getting any help in the way of new characters, new storylines, merchandise, or anything else related to mutants.

Disney may be happy to sit back and collect a check for character rights on the theme park side, but they appear to be actively sabotaging value on the movie side (which happens to have quite a bit of overlap with characters in use at Universal). At one point I had found an article where a guy at Marvel confirmed he had been asked to devalue Fox owned characters. I apologize however, I can't find it now.

 

[Whatsthegoodword]

A lot of us don't want new e tickets constantly it's just the time since they have gotten new e tickets has been so long. Also if they did c and d tickets as well many would be happy. MK is fine right now epcot, AK, and DHS, all have limited attractions and could use expansion. WDW has the blessing of size where they can expand. CoP may be lame to you but to many it's a classic. It is one attraction that was a Walt creation for the worlds fair in 1964. At parks like Epcot and DHS they are coasting.

I know that. My point is that Disney can't touch the park without infuriating a section of its fan base. Look at the uproar over Maelstrom! ...and if they don't touch the park - well, that upsets other folks.

DHS & EPCOT are obviously going through an identity crisis right now. Disney has some hard decisions to make about both parks. Should they just DO SOMETHING NOW, like so many of you want? Or should they take a cautious, measured approach? As a fan, I hope for the latter. ...and if I was on the board, I would demand the latter. Money, however it is earned, doesn't grow on trees.

 

[Whatsthegoodword]

And the down stairs---- Isn't it funny to enter the imagination pavilion after the ride and find nothing? I guess they ran out of imagination. Kind of like if the living seas were dry and dead..... the red tide pavilion.....

I haven't been in that pavilion for years - for that very reason. I forget there's even a ride in there. Again, identity crisis at EPCOT.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

I haven't been in that pavilion for years - for that very reason. I forget there's even a ride in there. Again, identity crisis at EPCOT.

That entire pavilion has been taken off the front lines (or mothballed...in many ways)

Since 2002...

When a ticket to EPCOT was $52...

Check your calendar.

As negative as I may be ( not really...but that's the mantle I've bedazzled)...there is honesty no argument to support this.

Or the closure of wonders of life.

Or ride tiering on fast pass +

It's all part of a bigger picture.

Renovations at downtown or bungalows at wilderness lodge do NOTHING to justify that.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

I know that. My point is that Disney can't touch the park without infuriating a section of its fan base. Look at the uproar over Maelstrom! ...and if they don't touch the park - well, that upsets other folks.

I submit that this is a unique/standalone instance that warrants a response.

And by "unique"...it violates alot of the principle that Disney parks have been built on in 5 spots since day one. It's unique cause they really haven't done it before.

"Soarin over California" in the land is the closest stretch I can think of...

You don't "abandon" the theme...you can change it and add to it...but "princess in the pavilion" gets almost no credit. Have to maintain some sort of a standard.

People bugnuts when they replaced mr toad and the adventures club...

But their replacements are not contrarian to their surroundings.


Lets see...

Chitzen Itza...Stave Church...Arrendale...Paifang Gate...Temple of Heavan...Bavarian Village...Doge's Palace...

...wait a minute...

 

[Josh Hendy]

Disney may be happy to sit back and collect a check

Bingo! Disney has fortunately for their shareholders gotten themselves into a position of being able to collect LOTS of checks for relatively little effort and capital outlay. And such capital as they need can be borrowed really cheaply.

They collect checks for Marvel and Star Wars without building any theme park steel. Universal takes care of the Marvel steel. Disney earns the Star Wars checks by having "weekends" on temporary stages.

DVC sales/operations and souvenir sales are vast check-cashing schemes which have been discussed at length.

The theme parks themselves are check-cashing machines in that they charge $100 for your first day at a Disney park and they offer you only 1 park that is worth $100. If you buy a multi-day pass you can get the per-day price down to around $75 ... but after the MK, you're getting only 1 park that's worth $75 based on size and number of attractions (Epcot - and not even worth $75 if you like thrill rides). Then you have 2 worth only around $50/day based on almost any yardstick of rides, shows and other diversions. So Disney is pocketing up to around $25/day of free money for the average guest who visits any non-MK park.

The poor saps at Universal, SeaWorld and Busch Gardens ... they have to keep building new rides every year or two ...

 

[bellyrunnersix]

Look at the uproar over Maelstrom! ...and if they don't touch the park - well, that upsets other folks.

The arguments have been ground to powder on this, but it really is a unique situation. They took a functioning attraction and pavilion (that may have needed a minor update here and there) and completely changed it. Meanwhile four major pavilions in Futureworld remain under- or unutilized and several locations in other parks, into which Frozen would fit better, sit empty or are falling apart.

The real kick in the butt is that they've all but confirmed it's just going to be a retelling of the movie. Had they redone Maelstrom with the cast of Frozen that would have been great, fantastic even. They're literally making Journey of the Little Mermaid (the most underwhelming ride in recent years) for Frozen in an inappropriate spot.

There certainly are a lot of people who whine to whine about everything and anything. Maelstrom is, I think, a case in which people are expressing their displeasure in WDW's lack of originality. It's always been a "money grab" I just wish it would be a little more of an imaginative one. And far from being a cautious, measured approach it feels like a slapdash, seat of the pants decision to capitalize on pop culture mania.

 

[ChrisFL]

I know that. My point is that Disney can't touch the park without infuriating a section of its fan base. Look at the uproar over Maelstrom! ...and if they don't touch the park - well, that upsets other folks.

DHS & EPCOT are obviously going through an identity crisis right now. Disney has some hard decisions to make about both parks. Should they just DO SOMETHING NOW, like so many of you want? Or should they take a cautious, measured approach? As a fan, I hope for the latter. ...and if I was on the board, I would demand the latter. Money, however it is earned, doesn't grow on trees.

It isn't just that Disney replaces attractions, as much as the ones they DO replace often end up less impressive or fun than the ones they replaced.

Examples:

Mr. Toad - Winnie the Pooh
Horizons - Mission Space
Wonders of Life - well, nothing
Original Journey into Imagination - Journey into YOUR Imagination - Journey into Imagination with Figment
El Rio Del Tiempo - Three Caballeros
Alien Encounter - Stitch's Great Escape

 

[DDLand]

It's not "leaving money on the table"...because you have to bring a big bag of money to the table to do it. It's more like a game of high stakes poker that public companies doesn't like.

Now...you notice - everything they do in Tokyo is fantastic...because they aren't betting with their money.

That shows what CAN be done.

But as we've been over more times than you can count - the customers are giving no reason.

But you can't discount what many of us...notable wallrock...has said about studios.

The infrastructure work necessary would be a MASSIVE bill. That money may never get recouped. They're not gonna double attendance and sales there.
It's really more of a "new park" construction type bill than a "retrofit" because the park is much smaller and the facilities were not designed to support a "full park" like The other 3.

Look at how much work is going Into animal kingdom and that is gonna result in less than "sweeping" changes. That's gonna total close to a B...don't doubt that.

Can't assume that studios is a "sure win" if they invest the GDP of a small country Into it.

One of the major appeals of upgrading DHS is there's already existing rides, attractions, and infrastructure. Because they're currently paying for a large part of the initial employees base and operations the additional guests would be higher margin. The only costs added would be in the form of new attractions operations and upkeep. Everything else would not need major new enhancements. New attendance margins would be significantly higher then a new park just getting off the ground.

Infrastructure upgrades come with the territory of total park transformation. If Disney is thinking of really doing a 1.3 Billion+ budget, that gives a lot of room to play with.

These are longterm investments. Risks are part of the game.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Infrastructure upgrades come with the territory of total park transformation. If Disney is thinking of really doing a 1.3 Billion+ budget, that gives a lot of room to play with.

These are longterm investments. Risks are part of the game.

Ok...

Roadwork to world drive and buena vista drive?
New entrance plazas?
Rearranged parking lots/parking garage construction?
Conversion of studios facilities to service buildings or destruction for new guest space?
New utility trunk lines?
Construction of new retention pounds and perhaps alterations to crescent lake?

All those things could be necessary...
Think good times, stock swinging Bob really is up for that?

 

[Lee Matthews]

Id only be happy with Marvel at WDW if it was a separate park and not mixed in with the existing ones but because of the money they'll be making off Universal, i don't ever see them bothering.

 

[7series]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Disney should remain Disney and not be watered down by including all this other stuff. As much as I love Star Wars, I don't want to see that either unless it's a completely separate world. It's just not right.

 

[Planogirl]

Like it or not, Star Wars is Disney now. Disney is evolving and will likely look quite a bit different in time.

 

[ChrisFL]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Disney should remain Disney and not be watered down by including all this other stuff. As much as I love Star Wars, I don't want to see that either unless it's a completely separate world. It's just not right.

Disney/MGM aka Hollywood Studios has always existed to use non-Disney properties, why would they change now...especially since Star Wars is now officially Disney? Honestly this isn't far off from Walt taking old fairy tale stories and making new movies based on them, they brought them under the Disney name, now Star Wars will do the same thing.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

I don't get the "no Star Wars" thought...

The place is being princessized...and a human is really Into that for roughly 7 years of their life if you're lucky...

Star Wars has a much broader draw...and has a 30 year working relationship with Disney...

Do you know where the Pixar computer came from?

I just don't want a cheap or stingy attempt at Star Wars...
It has to be a too notch land across the entertainment world...

Yes...you have to look at wizarding world there...not "new Fantayland"

When Disney invented the shop dumps (POTC 1973) and the "exclusive tours and events" (circa 90's)...it was Ingenious and I give them lots of credit.

Now it's pure tacky to try to use their IP to "trick us" Into them. As if I don't know that you want to build the minimum possible while you want me to pay the maximum.

That's how it be.

 

[Josh Hendy]

Now it's pure tacky to try to use their IP to "trick us" Into them. As if I don't know that you want to build the minimum possible while you want me to pay the maximum.

I don't think the word "tricked" is an exaggeration.

When it comes to the presence in WDW (now or future) of Disney's Big Three IP acquisitions there is a lot of sizzle being sold. But other than a couple of minor rides and some meet-and-greets and hokey stage shows, there is not one ounce of real beef. And not a single thing in the hopper. But the more forgiving fans say stuff like, "Wait til the pedestrian bridge at Disney Springs is finished then I'm pretty sure you're going to see something big announced." LOL

Pretend you're a big Harry Potter fan. Imagine if Disney had acquired rights to Harry Potter and all they did was add wands and stuffed owls to an existing gift shop, re-dedicate some unused space to a Harry and Dobby meet-and-greet, and then build a 2nd-tier ride using old technology that heavily leans on video screens for excitement. And imagine that at the same time, Disney made extremely non-committal and carefully hedged, forward-looking statements about how, yeah, don't worry the future is looking huge, it's just that we want to see what J, K. Rowling might have in mind for the Wizarding Universe. Then, yeah, something really, um, fairly impressive will happen.

Doesn't this describe what Disney Corp has done with Pixar, Marvel and Star Wars at WDW? How can you own the world's largest theme park based resort, spend billions to acquire 3 of the worlds biggest children's entertainment franchises ... and then for the foreseeable future offer the public only a midway-style video game ride, a puppet show, a really lousy pizza restaurant, a 25-year-old spaceship simulator, plus meet-and-greets and occasional stage shows and parade appearances? To quote the noted screenwriter George Lucas ... that ... does ... not ... compute ... ? ... [blows up]

I stand to be corrected of course ... maybe a couple of years after the pedestrian bridge is finished and the boat ride in Avatar Land is operating ... ???

I'm not complaining ... just really surprised and kind of disappointed.

 

[Milla4Prez63]

I'm not sure why anyone would want Disney to get Marvel back for WDW. What would they really do with it? Probably just an Iron Man M&G in Tomorrowland and a Captain America one in Liberty Square. They have the rights to use Marvel at every other Disney park in the world (except maybe Tokyo, I'm not sure how the rights work with Universal Studios Japan having the Spider-Man ride) and have pretty much done nothing with it outside of announce a Star Tours clone for Iron Man in Hong Kong, which is still over a year away from opening.

I love me some Disney, but I don't trust the current theme park people to take this property and do it on the epic scale it deserves. Spider-Man is my favorite ride of all time, so I'd rather it remain at IOA. MSHI needs an overhaul though and there are rumors it is getting one. Starting with a big Hulk refurb as soon as this fall.

 

[rteetz]

I'm not sure why anyone would want Disney to get Marvel back for WDW. What would they really do with it? Probably just an Iron Man M&G in Tomorrowland and a Captain America one in Liberty Square. They have the rights to use Marvel at every other Disney park in the world (except maybe Tokyo, I'm not sure how the rights work with Universal Studios Japan having the Spider-Man ride) and have pretty much done nothing with it outside of announce a Star Tours clone for Iron Man in Hong Kong, which is still over a year away from opening.

I love me some Disney, but I don't trust the current theme park people to take this property and do it on the epic scale it deserves. Spider-Man is my favorite ride of all time, so I'd rather it remain at IOA. MSHI needs an overhaul though and there are rumors it is getting one. Starting with a big Hulk refurb as soon as this fall.

To the bolded. The Tokyo contract has an expiration date that is approaching which is somewhere around 2020 I believe. With OLC I could very well see universal losing the rights there and disney getting them for Tokyo. I agree that disney hasn't done much with the marvel franchise and they have the chance to do so. A marvel coaster is rumored for DCA. Also marvel execs have been quoted saying that they don't care what their presence is in the parks they care about the movies they put out.

 

[Milla4Prez63]

To the bolded. The Tokyo contract has an expiration date that is approaching which is somewhere around 2020 I believe. With OLC I could very well see universal losing the rights there and disney getting them for Tokyo. I agree that disney hasn't done much with the marvel franchise and they have the chance to do so. A marvel coaster is rumored for DCA. Also marvel execs have been quoted saying that they don't care what their presence is in the parks they care about the movies they put out.

Thanks for the info. I've heard a lot of conflicting info about Japan, like some people telling me Universal only has rights for Spider-Man there and not any of the other Marvel characters, etc. etc. I don't really get good info about things outside of Orlando and some for Cali.

 

[rteetz]

Thanks for the info. I've heard a lot of conflicting info about Japan, like some people telling me Universal only has rights for Spider-Man there and not any of the other Marvel characters, etc. etc. I don't really get good info about things outside of Orlando and some for Cali.

All I know for sure Is that's a separate contract and it has an expiration date that I approaching unlike the orlando contract.