Marijuana

[ead79]

In general, my views tend to be quite conservative. That being said, I support legalized MEDICINAL marijuana that can only be obtained with a prescription through a pharmacy.

To me, it makes no sense that cancer patients, for example, can legally be prescribed morphine (which is addictive and has dangerous side effects), but these same patients cannot get medicinal marijuana instead.

That being said, I am only for the legalization of medicinal marijuana.

 

[Tiger926]

If I may quote my research on the subject...

Since I'm not a doctor or pharmacist, I can't speak to the medical usage of pot either, but hopefully if patients are taking it for medical reasons, they are regularly seeing doctors and minding their symptoms should a serious issue result from their usage.

Here is a related link from a medical marijuana dispensary that has been prohibited to open as Health Canada does not allow medical marijuana, or any marijuana. to be dispensed in storefronts. I feel badly for the medical users who may need it, as this was a way to help those ill people who need it, have better access, but that has been barred from happening.

http://www.nsnews.com/health/Medical+shop+fails+open/4947231/story.html

Tiger

 

[jiminyC_fan]

I voted no. I've seen the lasting affect of someone that smoked it for several years. Not a pretty sight. Let's just say he has a "fried brain" and it took only a few years to get there.

 

[goofy!]

Amsterdam - They are in the process of closing all pot cafes to tourists, due to high crime rates. And, you can only become a member of your local pot club, once you have been a resident for 1 year. Perhaps crime rates are lower than in the U.S. but really, the U.S. has very high crime rates overall, so for Amsterdam, they are not happy with their crime rates, so they are making major changes. You should check out the latest research from the past few weeks.

Sorry, but this has nothing to do with all of sudden deciding that marijuana is no longer safe to sell.

Talking to my Dutch cousins about this, the main reason for suggesting to close the coffee shops to tourists is because Great Britain has been offering dirt cheap flights and tour groups to Amsterdam for the sole purpose of pot smoking. Apparently, these British tourists mix pot and alcohol and become quite unruly.

So, the Dutch ministry wants to get back to the Coffee Shop's roots, and that is to supply the Dutch citizens with cannabis, just not huge tour groups of English.

Marijuana will continue to be legal in the Netherlands. You just have to be a Dutch citizen to buy it.
So, the Dutch have no problem with smoking pot, just supplying tourists who do not respect the culture of Amsterdam.

 

[goofy!]

That is a good point, but it would depend upon how their justice system works. If it is heavy handed against tourists, then that might be a deterrant, but not sure about the actual citizens? All of the articles I've read, said that people are very surprised by this, as Amsterdam is the most liberal in terms of pot smoking, yet they are going in a totally different direction now. Why is that? They must feel that they need to try something new, as perhaps the problems from tourists is now to a point that they don't want to deal with it any longer?

It would be interesting to see actual stats and such, but I can't find any as of yet.

Tiger

Again, this has nothing to do with the health risks of marijuana or that crime is increased by marijuana.

This is to curb massive amounts of cheap British flights into Amsterdam for the sole purpose of going to coffee shops. Massive amounts of tourists, no matter if they are smoking pot or not present problems to the natives. It is the large groups themselves that cause petty crimes, not the effects of the pot.

Again, pot smoking will remain perfectly legal for Dutch citizens.

Here a town in the Netherlands is actually proposing to keep their coffee shops open AND to build more.
http://www.dutchnews.nl/news/archives/2011/06/maastricht_council_wants_to_ke.php

 

[CaliforniaDreamin]

In general, my views tend to be quite conservative. That being said, I support legalized MEDICINAL marijuana that can only be obtained with a prescription through a pharmacy.

To me, it makes no sense that cancer patients, for example, can legally be prescribed morphine (which is addictive and has dangerous side effects), but these same patients cannot get medicinal marijuana instead.

That being said, I am only for the legalization of medicinal marijuana.

Thank you for sharing the fact that your views tend to be conservative. This is really the information I needed to see where the country's mindset is. I can assume, that the more liberal a person tends to be, the more likely they are to accept marijuana as a legitimate medical treatment. But as far as conservatives are concerned, I erroneously assumed that this group would be 100% against it for any purpose. Knowing that conservatives do see the medical benefits gives me hope that soon, it will be completely legal as a prescribed medication. It's kind of complicated until you start a poll like this. When I started it, I knew some would support medicinal marijuana, but I also felt like I would be flamed bigtime. This thread has proven that maybe we just assume that most people are still against the use of MJ in any situation, and until a dialogue, such as this one, is started, it's a surprise to see how much support comes from conservatives and liberals. It's almost like the subject America is afraid to talk about. This country needs to move forward with medicinal marijuana. I wouldn't mind seeing it legalized for those of age, but the most important thing to me is the medicinal usage.

 

[goofy!]

If I may quote my research on the subject...

link to your 'research' please?

 

[136368]

link to your 'research' please?

See footers. Additional information was sourced from the Bedlam, Maudsley and Priory psychiatric hospitals.

 

[mamacatnv]

Legalize it, and regulate it....what's the huge difference between marijuana and tobacco? What's the difference between marijuana and alcohol? If it's legal and regulated (and taxed ) then how would marijuana be more dangerous than those other drugs which are legal for ADULTS?

One can be tested for under the influence with alcohol there is no such test for marijuana

I didn't answer the poll because there wasn't an "other". I mean come on - you know you always have to have an "other"....

Seriously though, I would agree to legalize it ONLY if they came out with some kind of device like the breathalyzer for alcohol. Thus having corresponding laws for legal driving limits, etc. etc.I personally don't care if people want to get high. Knock yourself out. Just don't ever put my family in danger by doing so. Can that happen already? Of course. But I would rather there be some sort of regulation in place along with it.

Besides, think about how much money our country could profit from by doing so... trillion dollar debt? What trillion dollar debt?

I didn't vote either there was no option for Other or even a well it depends.....IMO this is not a cut and dry yes or no issue. One cannot be tested for under the influence, one can be tested for the nanograms of HTC(I think that is what it is) but the nanogram reading does not reflect under the influence. One can have a very high nano count and not have smoked for a week or 2.

The other thing is a suitable marijuana test. You need to be able to tell if someone is on pot Right Now - much like a DUI. If you get high and drive into something it should be treated like drunk driving.
A pee test tells you someone smoked pot in the last week or so, but you need to know if they smoked two hours ago.I'm okay with legalizing it, with limits, just like alcohol.

As far as I know, there is still no definitive test

i think it should be legal, but i definitely think that DUI laws will need to be a little stricter because sometimes people aren't 100% sure when the effects have warn off and such.

Unlike with alcohol where one can calculate based on body size, food eaten and a blood alcohol level or breath test - nothing like this exists for marijuana

Legalize it, tax it and enforce DUIs.
Being the amount of debt we're in it seems like a money making option.

No way to enforce something that can't be tested for

I am not opposed to medical marijuana and I think those that are prescribed it should be given RX's that come with restrictions such as no driving. Can't have it both ways and there is no way to test under the influence so in exchange for legal through medical channels I think one would need to be willing to give up driving.

Personally, I would love it to be legal I'd buy it BUT I just don't see how that can happen until there is some way to accurately know the difference between someone who uses and someone who is truly under the influence.

 

[gottaluvPluto]

I don't have a problem with legalizing marijuana for medical use only (and you smoke it at a doctors office and you can't take it home). I will say this, I am a social worker and have had numerous training on marijuana use. Marijuana is addictive and does cause depression and other mental disorders - women are more prone to the disorders than men. Also, the marijuana today is not the same as it was in the 60's. It is a lot stronger and usually laced with something. Anyway, that is part of the training that I had on the subject.


If we do legalize it for general usage, I hope the government taxes it at 70% or more!

 

[rie'smom]

Hells bells people, it's easy to tell if someone is loaded, especially on pot. Just tell them something that would totally tick off someone sober. If the person is loaded, they'll say, "Cool" or 'Righteous" or they'll shrug their shoulders or just look at you with a blank stare.

 

[NEVERENOUGHWDW]

No way to enforce something that can't be tested for

I am not opposed to medical marijuana and I think those that are prescribed it should be given RX's that come with restrictions such as no driving. Can't have it both ways and there is no way to test under the influence so in exchange for legal through medical channels I think one would need to be willing to give up driving.

Personally, I would love it to be legal I'd buy it BUT I just don't see how that can happen until there is some way to accurately know the difference between someone who uses and someone who is truly under the influence.

Off to the hospital quick urine dip. Hey they fill ERs with drunks why not stoned folks?

 

[Heidict]

Thanks for sharing. As I mentioned, this is the world I live in...I have students with lots of mental illness in their families, so lots of genetic factors. All of them have been smoking up since they were 10 or 11, and several of them have had psychotic episodes, with serious violence or murder as the result. And not all of them are daily users either, some are just sporadic users for recreation, and they are still seeing the negative effects of it. I know terminally ill people (who have since passed), who refused medical marijuana due to the psychosis aspect of it, yet we have tons of Canadians and Americans using pot for fun. I don't get it...

Since I'm not a doctor or pharmacist, I can't speak to the medical usage of pot either, but hopefully if patients are taking it for medical reasons, they are regularly seeing doctors and minding their symptoms should a serious issue result from their usage.

Here is a related link from a medical marijuana dispensary that has been prohibited to open as Health Canada does not allow medical marijuana, or any marijuana. to be dispensed in storefronts. I feel badly for the medical users who may need it, as this was a way to help those ill people who need it, have better access, but that has been barred from happening.

http://www.nsnews.com/health/Medical+shop+fails+open/4947231/story.html

Tiger

Tiger, do you have any statistics on what percentage experiences psychotic issues? Are there any other factors that causes a certain person to get it over another? Years of use, age of user, that sort of thing?

Sorry, but this has nothing to do with all of sudden deciding that marijuana is no longer safe to sell.

Talking to my Dutch cousins about this, the main reason for suggesting to close the coffee shops to tourists is because Great Britain has been offering dirt cheap flights and tour groups to Amsterdam for the sole purpose of pot smoking. Apparently, these British tourists mix pot and alcohol and become quite unruly.

So, the Dutch ministry wants to get back to the Coffee Shop's roots, and that is to supply the Dutch citizens with cannabis, just not huge tour groups of English.

Marijuana will continue to be legal in the Netherlands. You just have to be a Dutch citizen to buy it.
So, the Dutch have no problem with smoking pot, just supplying tourists who do not respect the culture of Amsterdam.

Thanks for the inside view of why this is happening.

 

[mamacatnv]

Off to the hospital quick urine dip. Hey they fill ERs with drunks why not stoned folks?

Its not that easy - a person can test "positive" who hasn't ingested or smoked in days or even weeks, someone who smoked a joint a week ago and none since has not been under the influence for a week BUT if you test them they could have nanograms in their system.

 

[Tiger926]

Sorry, but this has nothing to do with all of sudden deciding that marijuana is no longer safe to sell.

Talking to my Dutch cousins about this, the main reason for suggesting to close the coffee shops to tourists is because Great Britain has been offering dirt cheap flights and tour groups to Amsterdam for the sole purpose of pot smoking. Apparently, these British tourists mix pot and alcohol and become quite unruly.

So, the Dutch ministry wants to get back to the Coffee Shop's roots, and that is to supply the Dutch citizens with cannabis, just not huge tour groups of English.

Marijuana will continue to be legal in the Netherlands. You just have to be a Dutch citizen to buy it.
So, the Dutch have no problem with smoking pot, just supplying tourists who do not respect the culture of Amsterdam.

Again, this has nothing to do with the health risks of marijuana or that crime is increased by marijuana.

This is to curb massive amounts of cheap British flights into Amsterdam for the sole purpose of going to coffee shops. Massive amounts of tourists, no matter if they are smoking pot or not present problems to the natives. It is the large groups themselves that cause petty crimes, not the effects of the pot.

Again, pot smoking will remain perfectly legal for Dutch citizens.

Here a town in the Netherlands is actually proposing to keep their coffee shops open AND to build more.
http://www.dutchnews.nl/news/archives/2011/06/maastricht_council_wants_to_ke.php

Well, I only have the articles to go by for info. So, this is what the articles are saying. If that is not true, I would have no idea about that. And, just because your cousin lives there, it also doesn't make his/her info correct either, unless that is what Amsterdam papers are reporting. I have read a bunch of articles on this subject, and none of them just mention English tourists. I fail to see how that is not respecting the culture of Amsterdam - what does that refer to? Do the Dutch smoke up in a way that is different than other countries? I'm sure that's not it - it is probably exactly what the papers are reporting. Perhaps the Dutch respect their cities more because they live there, whereas tourists coming in just to smoke up, may not. If that is problematic for them as a country, then they have that right to change it to a way that works for them. Many cities have issues with tourists, but when you throw in drugs, I'm sure the problems magnify.

It is kind of silly for your cousin to suggest that only English tourists cause issues - I'm sure other tourists cause issues too. And, if you know anything about drugs, where there are drugs, there are crimes, as that is the nature of the beast.

By the way, I didn't say it wasn't going to be legal for Dutch citizens to smoke up. I said it's not going to be legal for tourists. The articles have all mentioned residency rules of 1 year in Amsterdam for the legality to use the cafes as citizens, so you also have to live there for 1 year. My posts clearly stated both of these facts.

It's interesting to see how they will handle this, Tiger

 

[Tiger926]

Tiger, do you have any statistics on what percentage experiences psychotic issues? Are there any other factors that causes a certain person to get it over another? Years of use, age of user, that sort of thing?

Age is important (teens), as well as onset of usuage, duration and family history of mental illness. These factors are huge in marijuana induced psychosis.

I have more detailed stuff at school, but not here at home. There have been lots of articles over the past year written about it, so I can link those general articles for you, as I have used all of these with my students:

http://www.webmd.com/mental-health/news/20110301/marijuana-use-linked-to-risk-of-psychotic-symptoms

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/Wellness/marijuana-precedes-psychosis/story?id=13031478

http://psychcentral.com/news/2010/0...osis-associated-with-marijuana-use/11769.html

http://www.usatoday.com/yourlife/health/2011-03-06-youth-use_N.htm (this is a Dutch study that was done, interesting findings since it's legal there to smoke up)

Its not that easy - a person can test "positive" who hasn't ingested or smoked in days or even weeks, someone who smoked a joint a week ago and none since has not been under the influence for a week BUT if you test them they could have nanograms in their system.

According to all of our training and my research, marijuana stays in the system for a long time (months). This may be beneficial for medical users, in respect to the pain aspct, but not for recreational users.

Tiger

 

[Kona65]

Don't think we have talked about this. And I think it's going to become more and more relevent as the years go by.

Currently, 13 states have decriminalized medicine. Conneticut is the latest, just this past week. This does not mean it has been legalized. From what I understand, decriminalization means if you are caught with an ounce or less, you will receive a civil infraction.

What I want to discuss is the Federal legalization of medicinal marijuana. Marijuana available only through a doctors prescription, only obtained at a pharmacy and grown and taxed by the federal government. As someone who may benefit from this, I wish we could go a forward a little faster. I read on a website (sorry, can't remember which one, so take it as you wish) that 46% of Americans are in favor of legalizing marijuana for medicinal purposes. Does this line up with your beliefs? Do people need to rethink their perception of this drug? Personally, I think alcohol is more dangerous to the body. You don't even have to smoke pot, it can be baked in brownies, cookies etc, so you aren't damaging your lungs, and possibly it could be available in pill form.

Your tread name, and this question go perfectly together.

 

[MiniGirl]

I will say that I have mixed feelings on this.

My mom died of cancer and was in a great deal of pain. She was taking some serious drugs for the pain, too. Drugs that were much worse than marijuana. I think it would've been great if this had been an option for her.

OTOH, marijuana is not like tobacco or alcohol in that that it does affect those who are not smoking it. I mean cigarette smoke can leave the non-smoker smelling of smoke and second-hand smoke is also dangerous. However, that takes a long time to build up. Just being around someone smoking pot once can cause problems for the non-smoker. For example, my dh is an airline pilot and subject to random drug tests. It could cost him his license and his livelihood if a drug test came up positive -- which it could if someone around him was smoking.

So, while I do understand it's benefits, I don't know if we are at a point yet where we can regulate it. Would smoking it in your own home be allowed? What if you have children? After smoking it at a doctor's office, are you allowed to drive home? Are the workers there protected from the smoke? It seems, to me, it would be more easily regulated as a pill, but I know that wouldn't appease those who want to smoke it.

 

[onelilspark]

I wouldn't necessarily benefit from it, in the sense that if it were legalized, I still wouldn't use it.

That being said, I think it should be legalized and treated like prescriptions or alcohol. I don't want to see someone get behind the wheel of the car after smoking it (you are impaired.) But other than that, what someone does behind closed doors, really doesn't affect my life and that's my general stance on things.

So I voted yes for all, but I don't really care about over crowded prisons (sorry if you're not comfortable, next time don't break the law, ok?) I just think we could tax it, which I'm all for because it could lower my tax bill, and living in New York State, I'm ALL for that!!!

 

[pansmermaidzlagoon]

absolutely for medical purposes!!!! The fact that it is of use to someone suffering, but can not be given because of some ridiculous stigma is just so wrong. The hypocrisy and double standard in this situation is just beyond belief.

My father was suffering from cancer - imagine my surprise when I came home from college and found a bag of marijuana in the vegetable crisper!!! My dad was a very strict 50's guy who would have never considered it had he not been suffering terribly.

as far as in general, I have mixed feelings. I think it is a sad state to HAVE to do it. Then again, there is also much hypocrisy and double standard at work. There is no reason for alcohol to be legal and marijuana not.