Marathon Weekend 2023

[Kerry1957]

My PT swears to the belief that anything over a 30 second walk is wasted time in terms of diminished recovery benefits.

I had a discussion with Jeff Galloway at a Disney expo a few years ago. He said that he used to recommend 60 second walk cycles but that his and others' research showed that there is decreasing marginal returns (my term as an economist) after 30 seconds. He thus now recommends 30 seconds, even if that means the run portion is also shorter. For example, he believes a :60/:30 run/walk is better than a 2:00/:60 run/walk even though they are the same 2:1 ratio.

It was tough for a few runs when I made the change from 60 second to 30 second walks, but I got used to it pretty quickly. I do 4:00/:30 splits for 10Ks, 3:00/:30 splits for HMs and marathons, and either 2:00/:30 or even 1:30/30 splits for easy/long runs.

He also believes your walk should be a stroll, but I tend to do a walk "with purpose". That works for me as I see my HR drop with a 30 second walk with purpose. My daughter has a much higher resting HR and she needs to do slow down to a bit more of a stroll to drop her HR.

Like most running issues, we all need to experiment and find out what works best for us. There is no one size fits all.

 

[garneska]

@Baloo in MI and @Kerry1957 ugh wow. I feel like if i am not walking at least a minute there is no point. Honestly i feel like if i did 30 seconds walking i would just not bother. Who knows maybe i will try it. It just seems daunting now. Until this year i really have not done intervals. It took a while to convince me to do it and i am still not sure i will stick with it. I want to see if my marathon performance gets better by doing the intervals.

 

[Naomeri]

I do 30/45 for my run/walk and it works really well for me. I used to do 30/30, back when I was basically racing all my training runs and burning myself out. I have trouble running slower, so in order to bring my pace under control, I needed to add more walking, and usually at a strolling pace during training. My heart rate while running also gets a bit high, so the extra walking balances me out some.

Run fast to walk slow is basically the name of the game for me

 

[lookingforsunshine]

Whose YouTube video were you watching? I’m curious and would like to see it.

Running in Makeup. She has a Dare to Dopey series. I generally enjoy them I just thought it was interesting based on our convo here.

Honestly i feel like if i did 30 seconds walking i would just not bother. Who knows maybe i will try it. It just seems daunting now.

I used to feel this way but do :30 now and it is okay!

 

[Kerry1957]

@Baloo in MI and @Kerry1957 ugh wow. I feel like if i am not walking at least a minute there is no point. Honestly i feel like if i did 30 seconds walking i would just not bother. Who knows maybe i will try it. It just seems daunting now. Until this year i really have not done intervals. It took a while to convince me to do it and i am still not sure i will stick with it. I want to see if my marathon performance gets better by doing the intervals.

My first few runs going from 60 to 30 seconds were almost disorientating. 30 seconds came in a blink of an eye and it initially really threw me off. It also seemed like I was constantly stopping and starting and I couldn't find my rhythm. But it only took about 6-8 runs and it began to seem almost normal. I joined a pacer in a HM earlier this summer and he did 4:00/1:00 for an average 12 minute a mile pace. After several years of 30 second walks, the minute walk seemed to go on forever; at least until the last few miles when I was getting tired.

So give the 30 second walk a try for a week or two, perhaps when you are not in a serious training cycle. You may adjust and love it, you may never adjust and hate it, returning to 60 seconds. Or you might even end up like @Naomeri with a 45 second walk.

 

[Baloo in MI]

@Baloo in MI and @Kerry1957 ugh wow. I feel like if i am not walking at least a minute there is no point. Honestly i feel like if i did 30 seconds walking i would just not bother. Who knows maybe i will try it. It just seems daunting now. Until this year i really have not done intervals. It took a while to convince me to do it and i am still not sure i will stick with it. I want to see if my marathon performance gets better by doing the intervals.

I used to do one minute walk intervals and honestly for a while dropping to 30 seconds did not feel like enough recovery time for me. But I adjusted and now it actually feels perfect. At 30 seconds I am ready to run. Maybe try 45 seconds for a bit as a middle ground.

Honestly, it took me time to get comfortable with R/W/R, but now it feels pretty natural. Most importantly to me though, no pain in my surgically repaired ankle at all over the past two years of steadily increased running. My PT really pushed the idea of R/W/R being my only real avenue to keep running into old age, so far he is right.

 

[kps7795]

@Baloo in MI and @Kerry1957 ugh wow. I feel like if i am not walking at least a minute there is no point. Honestly i feel like if i did 30 seconds walking i would just not bother. Who knows maybe i will try it. It just seems daunting now. Until this year i really have not done intervals. It took a while to convince me to do it and i am still not sure i will stick with it. I want to see if my marathon performance gets better by doing the intervals.

FWIW, I am not an expert by any means because I just started implementing run/walk to try to stave off my shin splints and help me build back my aerobic fitness. However, I find that my HR is at 138 after 1 1/2 minutes and goes down to 128/130 after only 30 second walk breaks. For the purposes of controlling your heart rate, it is definitely enough time. Keep in mind that this is for Easy runs. I haven’t tried a marathon pace workout yet.

 

[HangWithMerida]

I had a discussion with Jeff Galloway at a Disney expo a few years ago. He said that he used to recommend 60 second walk cycles but that his and others' research showed that there is decreasing marginal returns (my term as an economist) after 30 seconds. He thus now recommends 30 seconds, even if that means the run portion is also shorter. For example, he believes a :60/:30 run/walk is better than a 2:00/:60 run/walk even though they are the same 2:1 ratio.

On one of the episodes of the rise and run podcast with Chris Twiggs, this is basically what he said. Anything longer than 30 secs didn’t show the same rate of return on recovery for the walk breaks.
I have tried run-walk a couple of times and also found the constant stop-start annoying. Personally, I find a slower overall run pace less bothersome. The only caveat is Aid stations. If I’m not going for a PR, like at a Disney race, I walk the aid stations. That little bit of walking actually does make my legs feel fresher and gives me a chance to get my fuel/hydration in but isn’t so frequent that it interferes with getting into the groove of a pace. And it takes about 30 secs to walk a Disney aid station, so that works out.

 

[flav]

I am a continuous runner but all this talk about 30s walk breaks reminded me of an advice given by our guide when trekking at high altitude in Peru some twenty years ago. It was ok to take breaks during the hike but no longer than 30s, enough to recover but any longer than that we would be cooling down too much.

 

[jrsharp21]

On one of the episodes of the rise and run podcast with Chris Twiggs, this is basically what he said. Anything longer than 30 secs didn’t show the same rate of return on recovery for the walk breaks.
I have tried run-walk a couple of times and also found the constant stop-start annoying. Personally, I find a slower overall run pace less bothersome. The only caveat is Aid stations. If I’m not going for a PR, like at a Disney race, I walk the aid stations. That little bit of walking actually does make my legs feel fresher and gives me a chance to get my fuel/hydration in but isn’t so frequent that it interferes with getting into the groove of a pace. And it takes about 30 secs to walk a Disney aid station, so that works out.

I discovered last year during the full marathon that walking the aid station was a good strategy for me. For the first 1/3rd of the marathon I ran right through them, grabbing my drink, dumping half on me and choking the rest down, and kept right on. But when my IT band started hurting during the race, I started to walk the aid stations. Worked out well. Then once I started running again I would pick up the pace a little faster than normal to make up for the walk and then bring it down to cruising speed after a little bit. I will probably do the same strategy for 2023.

 

[RuntheMouse]

I had a discussion with Jeff Galloway at a Disney expo a few years ago. He said that he used to recommend 60 second walk cycles but that his and others' research showed that there is decreasing marginal returns (my term as an economist) after 30 seconds. He thus now recommends 30 seconds, even if that means the run portion is also shorter. For example, he believes a :60/:30 run/walk is better than a 2:00/:60 run/walk even though they are the same 2:1 ratio.

It was tough for a few runs when I made the change from 60 second to 30 second walks, but I got used to it pretty quickly. I do 4:00/:30 splits for 10Ks, 3:00/:30 splits for HMs and marathons, and either 2:00/:30 or even 1:30/30 splits for easy/long runs.

He also believes your walk should be a stroll, but I tend to do a walk "with purpose". That works for me as I see my HR drop with a 30 second walk with purpose. My daughter has a much higher resting HR and she needs to do slow down to a bit more of a stroll to drop her HR.

Like most running issues, we all need to experiment and find out what works best for us. There is no one size fits all.

I thought I’d give this a try on my run this morning. I usually run 3:00/1:00 but today I did 2:30/:30. Sure enough my HR drop was similar to my previous 1:00 walks. Who knew???

See I’m always learning from you guys!

 

[Goofed98]

On one of the episodes of the rise and run podcast with Chris Twiggs, this is basically what he said. Anything longer than 30 secs didn’t show the same rate of return on recovery for the walk breaks.
I have tried run-walk a couple of times and also found the constant stop-start annoying. Personally, I find a slower overall run pace less bothersome. The only caveat is Aid stations. If I’m not going for a PR, like at a Disney race, I walk the aid stations. That little bit of walking actually does make my legs feel fresher and gives me a chance to get my fuel/hydration in but isn’t so frequent that it interferes with getting into the groove of a pace. And it takes about 30 secs to walk a Disney aid station, so that works out.

I LIKE to stay running a constant pace, and I do so, in the half.

ON the full, I run my steady pace for the first 10 miles or so (usually until Bear Run Rd), and then I start my 5:1.

Having a location where I plan to start the run:walk is helpful for me, since I don't feel like I'm walking because I just can't go any farther. It absolutely has helped me feel fresher at the end of races, and during those last few miles. It may be worth playing around some on training runs.

 

[pluto377]

I've been doing 2/1 for a while and I really like it. I also wasn't a fan of the 30 second walks. But now you all have me thinking I should give it a try again...

 

[Let's Get Kronk]

Finally got myself to get up and do a morning run today - a 3-mile tempo run. I had been doing evening runs, but with work and it getting darker earlier and earlier, it was getting difficult to manage. I am NOT a morning person, so trying to switch to early morning runs is going to be a challenge. Lol. It was a crisp 57 degrees here in Dallas this morning at sunrise, and it was one of the more enjoyable runs I've had in a long time. Happy Thursday all!

 

[jpeterson]

Finally got myself to get up and do a morning run today - a 3-mile tempo run. I had been doing evening runs, but with work and it getting darker earlier and earlier, it was getting difficult to manage. I am NOT a morning person, so trying to switch to early morning runs is going to be a challenge. Lol. It was a crisp 57 degrees here in Dallas this morning at sunrise, and it was one of the more enjoyable runs I've had in a long time. Happy Thursday all!

It has been nice running weather here in Austin in the mornings. Still hot in the afternoon, but mornings are awesome.

 

[garneska]

You all have given me so much to think about. Basically i started the interval thing this year after my terrible injury laden MW. I had to take some time off and when i started the PT was like you will start with intervals. She tried to convince me to do the intervals training for MW but i was not having anything to do with it.

Starting back she had me run 4 min and walk 2 min. Of course that was after injury. I then progressed to 10 min run and 2 min walk. My problem is still that start up. I can stop and walk but getting myself to run after stopping is hard on me not mentally but it takes some time for me to get it up to speed. That is why I started my running again after 1:30 of walking. I felt like i have those 30 seconds to pick that pace up back to pace. Plus i am not going all my runs with intervals. I only do 2 runs with intervals and the other 3 easy days are at continuous run. I still think i prefer the continuous run but i want to test the intervals in a marathon to see which provides me with a better performance, continuous or intervals.

and continue to question my interval length. i have a step back week this week so I may change my interval for my long run Sat. Maybe go with 10 and 1 and see how that is. It might be too much to drop to 30 seconds for this week.

 

[Let's Get Kronk]

Got all the way to the "pay and switch" screen for Dopey just now and when I clicked it, it told me it was full again.

 

[PrincessV]

I started Next Level a few months and was getting a lot out of it. It was a library book, but I think may be worth purchasing. For anyone who isn't going through menopause, she also has a book called Roar that talks about working with your cycle.

I have a friend that feels the same way about not hearing of the changes that come with peri-menopause and menopause. I would love to hear about the experiences that back of the pack runners have and how their training changes. I love hearing about elite runners, but that's alien training to me.

Exactly - so much of what I’ve seen is geared toward elites and does not factor in other things, like chronic illness Or women who don’t fit neatly into their modeling. An awful lot of the advice for aging women had terrible results for me - there’s this assumption, for example, that all women are quad-dominant and need to strengthen their rear chain: hamstrings, calves, glutes. I’m the exact opposite: totally rear-chain dominant and it’s my quads that need attention. I also have pretty significant scoliosis, which is a huge part of my pain issues, and chronic tenonditis, and loss of cartilage… there’s a real limit to how much strength training and eating of soy will do to “fix” any of that lol!

For the experienced Dopey'ers: how do you approach the challenge during race weekend? Do you walk/go extra slow during certain races? Go "normal" and survive the marathon? I like to pre-plan things so I can get comfortable with an idea and make all of my contingency plans.

For my Dopeys, I always used the 5K and 1K as my fun runs, which meant a lot of walking, stopping for pics, and hanging out with friends. No pace goals at all, just finish. I trained for and ran the half and full at equal effort: enough to finish each comfortably (okay, the full gets uncomfortable no matter what) and still be able to walk back to my car and drive.

About walk ”breaks” (I hate that term, because run-walk intervals don’t really have “breaks” if you’re doing the intervals the whole time!): I generally stick with 30 seconds and change up my run intervals, but in the worst heat of FL summer, 45 second walks makes a big positive difference in how wiped out I feel.

 

[Jason Bryer]

Got all the way to the "pay and switch" screen for Dopey just now and when I clicked it, it told me it was full again.

It is so frustrating. I twice today had a 5k bib and when I click pay it says it is full. I really do think this is my last runDisney event for a long while.

 

[Let's Get Kronk]

It is so frustrating. I twice today had a 5k bib and when I click pay it says it is full. I really do think this is my last runDisney event for a long while.

It is beyond my comprehension as to why we cannot have a 5-minute checkout window after finding an open registration. That way, you know when you click to register whether you will get it or not. This whole "type at the speed of light with shaky fingers and a pounding heart with the small sliver of hope that you are fast enough" approach is just garbage and completely unnecessary. And runDisney's customer service to date has been equally awful. Walt would be appalled at the whole system.