Makes me crazy!!

[DMRick]

Living in poverty is not a walk in the park. It isn't a life style that anyone really wants. Welfare reform drastically reduced the number of people who receive cash assistance. Most of the money spent by Medicaid is for health coverage for the severely disabled or catastrophically ill and institutionalized senior citizens.

When we classify a whole group of people as lazy etc because they receive some level of government funds for reasons that an observer can't know for sure is a statement on the person making the assumption.

People who are poor have the same dreams and hopes that middle class people have. They want better for their children then they have in themselves.

My kids go/went to a state college which was subsidized by the state of PA. While they got decent grades and passed their classes sometimes they skipped class or didn't pay attention. That was a waste of tax payer funds. At our local casino there are tons of senior citizens who are spending social security money that could be spent on more important things. Some of them payed into the system, some of them are receiving benefits because a spouse worked as they never did. Those are government funds and I won't judge them. Corporations receive lots of entitlements. We tend to single out the poor but entitlements are all around us.

I have made mistakes and spent money that could have been better spent elsewhere, but I was fortunate that no one was looking over my shoulder. I am grateful every day that I don't have to consider McDonalds a place to go celebrate or consider the special outing for the month.

 

[Jewel1310]

TANF is cash assistance, or what many call welfare cash payments, had significant changes in 1996 when Welfare Reform passed. A Lifetime limit for payment to adults was created. in most instances it is 48 months in a small number of cases it can be extended to 60 months. No one can live on welfare for life or generations anymore. I can't post the links but if you search for TANF you can see the regulations.

 

[pat fan]

So just wondering with more and more people on living off the government and less and less paying taxes, who will be paying for all these entitlement programs?

That's when the system crashes. When the amount going out of the govt. is higher than the GDP it all falls apart and you are like Greece.

 

[Colleen27]

I work at Walmart and I see abuse of the bridge card (Michigan's food stamp/cash assistance card) EVERY DAY . Off the top of my head, I can think of about 10 families with 2 parents (unmarried & stay that way to maximize the benefits) and 2-3 children, who receive about $1800 a month in food assistance (I know this because the total prints on the receipt). Really???

The only way a family would receive that much is if they have 12+ people in their household and little/no income. The maximum benefit for a household size of 5 is $794.

 

[leahjade]

The Los Angeles Times reported in 2010 that twenty-four percent of new welfare applications in San Diego County contain some form of fraud

experts estimate as much as $300 billion a year is lost to health care fraud in the United States

- California Dept of Social Services

There are people who actually need help just as there are people who abuse the system. Those of you who think everyone on welfare is a victim or a saint is making just as much of a rash judgment as someone who thinks everyone on welfare is a cheat. If you work in the field, you see fraud every day so people really need to get their heads out of the sand before it's too late.
As parents our goal is to raise our children to be independent self-sufficient young adults. To keep people reliant on the government from cradle to grave is not doing anyone any favors.

 

[DMRick]

Quote one person on this thread that said they feel that everyone on welfare is a victim or saint...or even that most are.

We are just saying you are making a judgement on a person you don't even know. A conversation you overheard in McDonalds..a judgement because of the way they paid for their food. You have no way of telling if he was cheating the system. That's the only judging I saw.

Those of you who think everyone on welfare is a victim or a saint is making just as much of a rash judgment as someone who thinks everyone on welfare is a cheat..

 

[Patience]

I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them.- Thomas Jefferson.

While I agree the OP did not have enough information to know the true facts about the two men she encountered, anyone who has a job and pays taxes in this country has a right, perhaps even an obligation, to be concerned about the growing numbers of people in this country who receive long-term assistance/benefits from the government, the number of people who pay no taxes and about welfare/benefits fraud.

 

[DMRick]

I'd have to add, those retired as well, not just those with a job. My retirement is taxed, and even if it wasn't, I have children who I am concerned about and their futures.

I agree with the bolded below, but that has nothing to do with what the OP was about. I think most on this thread are concerned. But judging a person in McDonalds just shouldn't be part of it.

I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them.- Thomas Jefferson.

While I agree the OP did not have enough information to know the true facts about the two men she encountered, anyone who has a job and pays taxes in this country has a right, perhaps even an obligation, to be concerned about the growing numbers of people in this country who receive long-term assistance/benefits from the government, the number of people who pay no taxes and about welfare/benefits fraud.

 

[Leajess99]

So just wondering with more and more people on living off the government and less and less paying taxes, who will be paying for all these entitlement programs?
In our city, we actually have ads on the public bus system recruiting people for the Women, Infant and Children (WIC) plan. Because if the welfare rolls go down, the funding goes down as well which would mean less government jobs and less bureaucrats. It is a dependency cycle and I am very afraid for the future of our children.

WIC is advertised to help prevent children in need from going hungry. I'm sorry you think that only those on Welfare qualify for WIC but do you know how many servicemembers qualify for WIC?? Yes, it is such a bad thing huh??

DO you know how many servicemembers qualify for foodstamps and daycare assistance?? Walk a day in THEIR shoes and then maybe you could judge. You are clueless on why anyone needs assistance. People like you are why those who have worked hard are embarrassed to ask for help.

Many kids on medicaid are on it because their parents' jobs don't offer insurance and they can qualify. Would you rather these kids go without healthcare??

YES, there is fraud and it sucks but many more people use assistance legitimately and you judging them does NOT help them. Not everyone on assistance wants to be there.

Oh and as far as the daycare assistance, you have to have a job or be going to school or both to get it. You don't just get it because you can. Some single parents have no choice and they never planned on their spouse walking out on them or dying on them. Too bad you think you are so great but remember one day you may end up on welfare because you can't control everything.

 

[torinsmom]

WIC is advertised to help prevent children in need from going hungry. I'm sorry you think that only those on Welfare qualify for WIC but do you know how many servicemembers qualify for WIC?? Yes, it is such a bad thing huh??

DO you know how many servicemembers qualify for foodstamps and daycare assistance?? Walk a day in THEIR shoes and then maybe you could judge. You are clueless on why anyone needs assistance. People like you are why those who have worked hard are embarrassed to ask for help.

Many kids on medicaid are on it because their parents' jobs don't offer insurance and they can qualify. Would you rather these kids go without healthcare??

YES, there is fraud and it sucks but many more people use assistance legitimately and you judging them does NOT help them. Not everyone on assistance wants to be there.

Oh and as far as the daycare assistance, you have to have a job or be going to school or both to get it. You don't just get it because you can. Some single parents have no choice and they never planned on their spouse walking out on them or dying on them. Too bad you think you are so great but remember one day you may end up on welfare because you can't control everything.

WIC is a great thing, because it tells you exactly what to buy. I was on WIC for a year when I was pregnant and my son was a baby. It would list what I could get---2 cans of fruit juice, 2 gallons of milk, one pound of cheese, one jar of peanut butter, etc. It is all healthy and can be the difference between a child getting a balanced diet or not. Like a PP, I wish that food stamps were more like that, with stipulations on what you could buy.

 

[cornflake]

It's so misguided to think you are helping these people live their entire lives on welfare. Now young women no longer need a husband or father for their children since they have the government, and everyone knows that the #! factor in determining who lives in poverty is a single mother household. You've taken away the families and churches who used to help people in need and replaced them with public assistance. You've taken away the self-esteem and pride that comes from working a job and providing for your family.

This is just a giant mess of assumption and confusion.

As btw, your original post referencing the Constitution said that it guarantees the pursuit of happiness. You then said you just meant to type the Declaration of Independence. However, that guarantees no one anything, it's a declaration, a statement. The Constitution guarantees.

Anyhoo.... when did women "need" husbands or fathers that have now apparently been replaced by the government? This suggests that women need men to work and make money.

The last sentence though, says that benefits "take[n] away the self-esteem and pride that comes from working a job and providing for your family." So... which is it? Should women have the self esteem and pride that comes from providing for their families, presumably from a job, or should they not, and get money from men?

I have no idea what you mean by the #1 factor in determining who lives in poverty is a single mother household, but pretty much any way you read it, no.

First, are you talking about the U.S. alone? Because there are a lot of poor people in the world and many of them live in areas with unstable social structure, food availbility, etc.

If you are talking about the U.S., there are a ton of factors that correlate to poverty - though you don't specify for whom, and you additionaly phrased it as if you're talking about causation, further complicating it.

However, correlation - single parent households are more likely to be in poverty, yes. Single households headed by women are more likely than those headed by men, yes. However, people with very little education are hugely likely to live in poverty. People born into poverty, hugely likely to live in poverty. People who are black or latino, younger, etc., etc., etc.

And, abutting all of this is the underlying false assumption that people receiving assistance are all unemployed (not true), living the high life (I'm not even), and doing this purposefully. As noted by someone above, many members of the military receive food stamps - as do airline pilots, other skilled workers and tons and tons of unskilled workers.

Of those women who head single-parent households? More than half of them are employed, and only a quarter of them receive cash welfare benefits.

 

[cyndik1111]

OH MY!
I can't believe this thread!
It's like watching a really bad car accident:
macabe, but you can't stop looking.
Maybe we should all stop looking and let it go away.
Agree to disagree?

 

[Lovin' Disney]

The only way a family would receive that much is if they have 12+ people in their household and little/no income. The maximum benefit for a household size of 5 is $794.

The food stamp totals, beginning and ending, prints right on their receipt. I know what I'm talking about. Whether they're scamming the system to get more $$, that's a different story. But I know how much they are spending because I am the one waiting on them. These are multiple families made up a man, woman, (unmarried) and 2-3 kids who are getting $1800+ a month in food stamps.

 

[bz8bls]

What makes me crazy is the welfare the government gave banks and our taxes are paying for that also. So looks like a lot of rich executives got welfare too...just saying.

 

[AntePrincess]

What makes me crazy is the welfare the government gave banks and our taxes are paying for that also. So looks like a lot of rich executives got welfare too...just saying.

And if the bankers we bailed out aren't cheating the system, who is?? What about documented waste in the defense department, which is a much bigger chunk of change than our welfare programs?

I guess I can live with the fact that ANY system will get gamed to some percentage. The data on the US system isn't that disturbing, no matter how melodramatic the anecdotes. We can change it, we always do, even that costs something.

I get the idea that there are lots of people who would rather spend more money in the long run to stand on a principle, all in the name of financial responsibility.

 

[kandb]

I work as a health inspector in NJ and the government is sending out auditors to small business's to make sure they are claiming all their profits. OK, that's fine, I get it. But it doesn't seem like the government gives a sh*t who they give "free money" to. They said it is easier these days to collect welfare. So many workers in the restaurants are illegals, who are not even paying taxes (getting paid off the books). Why don't people on welfare, work in the kitchens? I will tell you why. Because they don't want to work. Period. And the government let's them not have to find a job. Shameful!!!

 

[Colleen27]

I work as a health inspector in NJ and the government is sending out auditors to small business's to make sure they are claiming all their profits. OK, that's fine, I get it. But it doesn't seem like the government gives a sh*t who they give "free money" to. They said it is easier these days to collect welfare. So many workers in the restaurants are illegals, who are not even paying taxes (getting paid off the books). Why don't people on welfare, work in the kitchens? I will tell you why. Because they don't want to work. Period. And the government let's them not have to find a job. Shameful!!!

That's only one facet of the story, though. Employers don't use illegal labor because Americans won't take the jobs, no matter how much they try to pretty-up the issue using that angle. They use illegal labor because they don't want to incur the costs of hiring legally, things like minimum wage, workman's comp, OSHA workplace rules, social security/medicare, unemployment, etc. There are often Americans interested in doing those jobs. But employers looking to save on those costs seldom want to risk hiring Americans under the table - an American who is hurt on the job or fired or otherwise upset with the employer can report the business to labor boards and other authorities. Illegal laborers won't, no matter how bad the conditions.

 

[bz8bls]

I hate to see this video representing the 'face' of welfare recipients. I find these interviewees attitudes disgusting and... above all, the one interviewee using his slavery heritage as an entitlement benefit at that is an insult! However, he is correct that slaves contributed to building this country, but, however, I wonder what has he done to build himself into a better man?

I am an African-American baby-boomer who is a college graduate and I just don't understand the mind-set of some of 'my' people. Education is key to lifting one's self up by the boot straps.

However, the mindset displayed on the video is generational. My cousin and her children and grandchildren have lived on welfare all of their lives, yet her oldest sister has a PhD from one of the Big Ten Colleges (going back to my education philosophy).

I see this mindset too often everyday in urban educational institutions and I am hoping to reach some of these students so they can make a plan for a better life....if I can just reach one, it's a start.

 

[*Seanaci*]

There are many that are taught to take advantage of the system at a young age. It is a way of life and a family tradition.

I totally agree.

Absolutely. It IS our money. But questioning government assistance, by reviewing the rules and the facts about how assistance is used, is not the same as making judgments about one particular person based on eavesdropping on them for two minutes in a fast food restaurant.

TOTALLY agree.

I think that we can all agree that welfare recipients generally fall into 2 categories...

1. Those who need it, including the elderly, the truly disabled, those with special needs, etc.

2. Those who feel entitled to it.

Somehow we need to find a way to take care of those that fall under #1, while putting some sort of time limit, restrictions, etc. on those who fall under #2.

I agree with you. However, finding a way to take care of those that fall under #1 and restricting/limiting those that fall under #2 will require more money and man power to be sure things are enforced...meaning more of our tax dollars being spent to fix the system (so to speak). And that won't happen unless our government can learn to work together.

Perhaps rather than banter back and forth on facts/opinions/right/wrong here, we should be proactive and putting together a petition to get our governments attention on this matter.


(not trying to get religious here, but I think this is a very appropriate quote for this thread)

"Judge not lest ye be judged."
-Matthew 7:1

 

[pintamino]

And if the bankers we bailed out aren't cheating the system, who is?? What about documented waste in the defense department, which is a much bigger chunk of change than our welfare programs?

Defense base budget request in FY11 was $708 billion. Global war on terror spending was about $159 billion. Entitlements spending (welfare, Medicare, Medicaid, etc) was $2.4 TRILLION. Would you like to try and make that point again? Numbers do not back it up.